It'll last maybe a day. I'll get a cab and leave much earlier for work.
Very sad day for NYC and a terrible move by the TWU.
If the TWU does not strike, then what incentive does the MTA have to meet their demands?
oohah
They cannot sacrifice the rest of the city to get their demands. Now, because of the strike, they will lose much more than they were demanding. The Taylor laws alone will cause the union and it's members severe hardship. The contempt of court penalties will be much, much worse. What the TWU has chosen is to cause the maximum damage possible to all of the city, including themselves. Their demands will not be met.
[Edited by - TemujinKnick on 12-20-2005 04:28 AM]
They cannot sacrifice the rest of the city to get their demands. Now, because of the strike, they will lose much more than they were demanding. The Taylor laws alone will cause the union and it's members severe hardship. The contempt of court penalties will be much, much worse. What the TWU has chosen is to cause the maximum damage possible to all of the city, including themselves. Their demands will not be met.
So the only choice is just to accept whatever the MTA offers them? What recourse do they have if they don't strike? Another way to look at it is the MTA is sacrificing the city.
oohah
[Edited by - oohah on 12-20-2005 04:32 AM]
They have the same recourse the rest of us have: vote for a different Governor so a better MTA Chair and Board is selected, or quit and find a job that offers them better terms. The MTA is not going on strike. The TWU is. The TWU is responsible for it's actions.
They have the same recourse the rest of us have: vote for a different Governor so a better MTA Chair and Board is selected,
Unrealistic.
or quit and find a job that offers them better terms.
Unsympathetic and unrealistic.
The MTA is not going on strike. The TWU is. The TWU is responsible for it's actions.
No, I am sorry, the dirty, corrupt, MTA is equally complicit. I am not saying that the MTA should do whatever the TWU wants, but the Taylor law provides the MTA with a "Hammer", that lends itself to unfair, one-sided labor negotiations. And lo and behold! The MTA has been screwing its workers ever since! Just ask the Metro North's union, who have been working without a contract for years.
The city will live, I remember the last strike.
The real villian here is the MTA.
oohah
[Edited by - oohah on 12-20-2005 05:21 AM]
Nonsense. In one sentence you say the MTA is equally complicit. Then you say the MTA is the real villian. If the MTA is equally complicit, then you believe the TWU is complicit and is a villian. It goes both ways.
No one likes the MTA, but what the TWU is doing is outrageous. It is costing the cityy over 400 million dollars a day. It is costing people their jobs. It is shutting down many small businesses. It is putting 7 million New Yorkers who usually take the subways and buses into cars and onto the streets, causing gridlock so bad that it will lead to DEATHS because of ambulances and firetrucks and other emergency services caught in traffic. The members of the TWU are not the only workers in this city and they are not the only ones that matter. This union has a history of being among the most militant, with roots in the 1930's communist affiliated radical movements. They get ZERO sympathy for screwing over NY from me, no matter how much I hate the MTA.
Nonsense. In one sentence you say the MTA is equally complicit. Then you say the MTA is the real villian. If the MTA is equally complicit, then you believe the TWU is complicit and is a villian. It goes both ways.
The MTA is equally complicit in these negotiations. Overall they are the villian. Just review their recent history.
No one likes the MTA, but what the TWU is doing is outrageous. It is costing the cityy over 400 million dollars a day. It is costing people their jobs. It is shutting down many small businesses. It is putting 7 million New Yorkers who usually take the subways and buses into cars and onto the streets, causing gridlock so bad that it will lead to DEATHS because of ambulances and firetrucks and other emergency services caught in traffic.
Of course the strike hurts the city, but I think you have bought into the propaganda a little too much.
The members of the TWU are not the only workers in this city and they are not the only ones that matter.
Something tells me if it was your union, and your contract, you might have a different feeling. You might feel that you should take the contract. But I bet you would feel that it was your RIGHT TO STRIKE. Just because the Taylor Laws are in existence does not make them correct.
This union has a history of being among the most militant, with roots in the 1930's communist affiliated radical movements.
So lets demonize the union by bringing up ancient history? Communist Radicals? What is this, nouveau McCarthyism? Come on.
They get ZERO sympathy for screwing over NY from me, no matter how much I hate the MTA.
The strike affects me too. I just happen to believe that any worker not DIRECTLY RELATED TO PUBLIC SAFETY should have the right to strike. That is as American as apple pie, hardly Communist or Radical. If the TWU was being ridiculous in their demands, I might feel they are in the wrong. They still have the right to strike. As you pointed out, they are taking their lumps because of the strike. So they are suffering for their convictions, not just you or I. I say: let them stand up for what they believe in.
oohah
[Edited by - oohah on 12-20-2005 05:13 AM]
Enyspree: Best of luck man, I hope everything works out.
The governor has shown once again he doesnt care about NYC. He should have stepped into this a long time ago. He's done nothing. And now it'll be up to the mayor to manage this mess. The MTA are a bunch of filthy bastards. They scream poverty and then spend millions on a new HQ downtown including 1.4 million on the bathrooms alone. The Straphangers Campaign and Comptroller are in their pockets as well. Notice how suddenly silent they got during the last crisis. They knew the MTA was hiding money, and called them out on it, demanded the MTA open their books to the public, until one day, they suddenly stopped.
This is a mess, and although I wish the TWU hadnt striked, I can understand. The people who will suffer most as usuall, are the average everyday working people.
Posted by LBeast:
The governor has shown once again he doesnt care about NYC. He should have stepped into this a long time ago. He's done nothing.
yeah i have a real hard time understanding why he wouldn't have stepped in a long time ago to mediate and help in the negotiations.
Posted by Marv:
Posted by LBeast:
The governor has shown once again he doesnt care about NYC. He should have stepped into this a long time ago. He's done nothing.
yeah i have a real hard time understanding why he wouldn't have stepped in a long time ago to mediate and help in the negotiations.
The Governor and the Mayor both have the power to stop all the nonsense that's going on. They don't care. The mayor has just been preaching find another way to get to work. The governor has just been threatening us like he is gonna beat us or something. They all could have stepped in and stopped this.
Lat night at mid-night I was on the job. You know all day no one knew what was going on. I got off around 1230am and the trains were running and no one seemed to know what was going on. Seems like work just as usual. I don't drive so I was lucky to get home on the train. Only when I woke up a few minutes ago do I find out what happened.
I was supposed to go to work today but I'll be out there somewhere picketing with my fellow union members. I'll be on bike.....that shit is just crazy.
Good luck to everyone and hopefully this only lasts a few days. I think the MTA was just calling our bluff. Now I just want everyone to watch and see what the goverment does about this.
Posted by EnySpree:
Lat night at mid-night I was on the job. You know all day no one knew what was going on. I got off around 1230am and the trains were running and no one seemed to know what was going on. Seems like work just as usual. I don't drive so I was lucky to get home on the train. Only when I woke up a few minutes ago do I find out what happened.
I was supposed to go to work today but I'll be out there somewhere picketing with my fellow union members. I'll be on bike.....that shit is just crazy.
Good luck to everyone and hopefully this only lasts a few days. I think the MTA was just calling our bluff. Now I just want everyone to watch and see what the goverment does about this.
Pay no attention to some of these anti-union management morons!You and your fellow workers do what is right for you and your families!You guys have my full support!From a TWU local 501 Union brother!
Posted by TemujinKnick:
quit and find a job that offers them better terms.
This is an extreamly insensitive statement. There are no good jobs out there. The MTA is one of the few
privately owned businesses
that the workers are at the very least making a decent living. That is what this fight is about.
This is about the future. This is for everyone else that can't find a job or are sick of their job or want a change and decide to take the Transit test. There are guys that I work with that used to work in the financial district or got laid off from Verizon, college grads that can't fine jobs, even some of the less fortunate. I met a handfull of people that were actually in a shelter before they got the letter to reprot to the MTA. In my case I was going to school and working full time and was about to quit my job without anything when the MTA contacted me. I took the test when I was 18 and I was 24 when I was hired!
This is a good fight. People are stranded. So am I. I live for a check too and the Taylor Laws will break me.......but this fight is bigger than simply placing blame the workers. Open your eyes and see it for what it is.......
This is probably the last Great Class stuggle we'll ever see. It's the ruling class trying to destroy the middle class.
With the view that we should quit and find another job and just except whatever the MTA wants is just scary to read. Frightening actually.
Posted by EnySpree:
Posted by TemujinKnick:
quit and find a job that offers them better terms.
This is an extreamly insensitive statement. There are no good jobs out there. The MTA is one of the few privately owned businesses that the workers are at the very least making a decent living. That is what this fight is about.
This is about the future. This is for everyone else that can't find a job or are sick of their job or want a change and decide to take the Transit test. There are guys that I work with that used to work in the financial district or got laid off from Verizon, college grads that can't fine jobs, even some of the less fortunate. I met a handfull of people that were actually in a shelter before they got the letter to reprot to the MTA. In my case I was going to school and working full time and was about to quit my job without anything when the MTA contacted me. I took the test when I was 18 and I was 24 when I was hired!
This is a good fight. People are stranded. So am I. I live for a check too and the Taylor Laws will break me.......but this fight is bigger than simply placing blame the workers. Open your eyes and see it for what it is.......
This is probably the last Great Class stuggle we'll ever see. It's the ruling class trying to destroy the middle class.
With the view that we should quit and find another job and just except whatever the MTA wants is just scary to read. Frightening actually.
Good luck to you and your family EnySpree. I hope it's a short strike and you reach a fair settlement soon.
On a side note, I didn't mind the walk to work at all. Lots of tail to check out even if it's bundled up.
Posted by islesfan:
Lots of tail to check out even if it's bundled up.
LMAO!
Posted by EnySpree:
Posted by islesfan:
Lots of tail to check out even if it's bundled up.
LMAO!
Funny. Isiah should keep an entourage of Knick City Dancers, it's the only way isles will cheer him on!
Good luck Eny.
unions and the labor force in general have been getting the shaft for a long time. at one point this country was built on it's blue collar work force, now it's a bunch of service industries. the twu is probably 50/50 service and blue collar, but I think it's a good thing that they are standing up for their rights. but knowing the attitude this country has towards its working class, I'm guessing they won't win. I hope they do.
I wish some local democrats would come out in support of the TWU more strongly and help explain why this is important and why unions like these are responsible for all of us having things like weekends.
I haven't spent a lot of time thinking about this particular problem, and frankly I don’t have enough info/details/history living outside the city, and having had worked in a services industry where there is no real union I do not have first hand experience, but I have got to think that companies or organizations that do deal with Unions have to sell the prospect of education and workforce transition to deal with automation/ outsourcing better. America cannot survive with an overly large blue-collar workforce, or a least one that is outdated. Our cost is too high - look at the car industry, Ford or whomever is paying some ungodly 15K per car (and I could be off about that number but not the magnitude) in pension redistribution against the 2K or so that Japan and others are paying. We just can't compete with that. BUT, management HAS to be aware of this and actively promote job training early and often and such in preparation for automatation/outsources so that it gives its Union members a chance to survive and move forward with them.
That's all that my MBA classes got me
