The Giants reportedly had a deal worked out with the Lions that would have allowed them to move up to the 20th pick to select WR Jeremy Maclin. The details of the potential trade aren't known, but it likely involved the No. 29 pick and an addition early-round selection. The deal was contingent on Maclin being available at No. 20, and was foiled when the Eagles traded up one slot ahead to grab him.
Yeah, the Philly papers said that Andy got wind of what Jerry had in place and move up one spot ahead. It's funny how that happens. Parcells was ready to take Barden and the Giants moved up one spot to grab him before them. There must be spies in all these war rooms.
nyk4ever@ 4/29/2009 10:50 AM
Seriously Phar.. it's crazy how these things happen. My guess is the Lions used the Giants as leverage and then told the Eagles. Annoying.
VDesai@ 4/29/2009 11:21 AM
Giants had some times in 4.4 range on Stoney. Saw a note where he ran 4.35.
On Maclin, I think they had him rated slightly higher than Nicks because of the special teams factor. Once the WRs started coming off the board I think they were prepared to move up to get one (since they had several extra picks). Instead they waited and still were able to get Nicks who was only slightly below Maclin.
I think they made the right choice. Nicks is a true no.1 type, while Maclin, while talented- is a bit of a gimmicky WR who made his living on screens, reverses and the like. He does have deep speed, but I think they have that kind of WR in Moss and Hixon.
Pharzeone@ 4/29/2009 1:13 PM
Posted by VDesai:
Giants had some times in 4.4 range on Stoney. Saw a note where he ran 4.35.
On Maclin, I think they had him rated slightly higher than Nicks because of the special teams factor. Once the WRs started coming off the board I think they were prepared to move up to get one (since they had several extra picks). Instead they waited and still were able to get Nicks who was only slightly below Maclin.
I think they made the right choice. Nicks is a true no.1 type, while Maclin, while talented- is a bit of a gimmicky WR who made his living on screens, reverses and the like. He does have deep speed, but I think they have that kind of WR in Moss and Hixon.
I think it was a little more than that. All reports now say that there was a conditional deal in place meaning they tried to get him but he just went off the board. Sometimes the best deals are the ones that don't happen but it wasn't their decision to pick Nicks over Maclin. That's a little eye opener for me.
TMS@ 4/29/2009 3:15 PM
Posted by Pharzeone:
Posted by VDesai:
Giants had some times in 4.4 range on Stoney. Saw a note where he ran 4.35.
On Maclin, I think they had him rated slightly higher than Nicks because of the special teams factor. Once the WRs started coming off the board I think they were prepared to move up to get one (since they had several extra picks). Instead they waited and still were able to get Nicks who was only slightly below Maclin.
I think they made the right choice. Nicks is a true no.1 type, while Maclin, while talented- is a bit of a gimmicky WR who made his living on screens, reverses and the like. He does have deep speed, but I think they have that kind of WR in Moss and Hixon.
I think it was a little more than that. All reports now say that there was a conditional deal in place meaning they tried to get him but he just went off the board. Sometimes the best deals are the ones that don't happen but it wasn't their decision to pick Nicks over Maclin. That's a little eye opener for me.
i'd rather have Nicks than Maclin... we needed a bigger, more physical type WR, & Nicks fits the bill.
NYKBocker@ 4/29/2009 4:25 PM
Posted by VDesai:
Giants had some times in 4.4 range on Stoney. Saw a note where he ran 4.35.
On Maclin, I think they had him rated slightly higher than Nicks because of the special teams factor. Once the WRs started coming off the board I think they were prepared to move up to get one (since they had several extra picks). Instead they waited and still were able to get Nicks who was only slightly below Maclin.
I think they made the right choice. Nicks is a true no.1 type, while Maclin, while talented- is a bit of a gimmicky WR who made his living on screens, reverses and the like. He does have deep speed, but I think they have that kind of WR in Moss and Hixon.
Great point on the Nicks and Maclin comparison. Nicks looks like and every down type WR that can also help in the running game, well at least his size suggests that he should be a good blocker.
You think this kid can stretch the field a little bit? It seems that in his highlight film that he is more of a possession receiver.
Pharzeone@ 4/29/2009 10:46 PM
Posted by NYKBocker:
Posted by VDesai:
Giants had some times in 4.4 range on Stoney. Saw a note where he ran 4.35.
On Maclin, I think they had him rated slightly higher than Nicks because of the special teams factor. Once the WRs started coming off the board I think they were prepared to move up to get one (since they had several extra picks). Instead they waited and still were able to get Nicks who was only slightly below Maclin.
I think they made the right choice. Nicks is a true no.1 type, while Maclin, while talented- is a bit of a gimmicky WR who made his living on screens, reverses and the like. He does have deep speed, but I think they have that kind of WR in Moss and Hixon.
Great point on the Nicks and Maclin comparison. Nicks looks like and every down type WR that can also help in the running game, well at least his size suggests that he should be a good blocker.
You think this kid can stretch the field a little bit? It seems that in his highlight film that he is more of a possession receiver.
He has average speed and is view by many as more like a possession receiver. Hixon will still be counted on to stretch the field. I hope he found some stickums for his hands.
TMS@ 4/29/2009 11:00 PM
i like these highlights for the TE we drafted, Beckhum... kid's got some nice hands & not afraid to go over the middle & take a hit while still holding onto the ball... he should fit in nicely into a 2 TE set & help give the offense some more options & make them less predictable than just always running the ball.
VDesai@ 4/29/2009 11:32 PM
Beckum is a very similar player to the Jets Dustin Keller. He will play H-Back primarily
Allanfan20@ 4/30/2009 11:18 AM
Posted by SupremeCommander:
Don't know why this hasn't been posted yet, but this is why Hakeem Nicks is better than anyone else they could've taken:
SupremeCommander, a year and a half ago, I would have said that there's no way, but then this catch was made in the superbowl:
Pharzeone@ 4/30/2009 11:32 AM
Posted by VDesai:
Beckum is a very similar player to the Jets Dustin Keller. He will play H-Back primarily
Man, the Giants can play the field late in the season and control the clock. I am very excited about this kid and the other picks. I love what we did in free agency. Any word on Blackburn and Goff. It is time that these guys push Pierce. Blackburn is a better tackler than Pierce and makes the plays. I hope TC has an open competition for MLB. Pierce can read defenses extremely well but has been slowed seriously. Not to make a big deal out of it but the Eagles abused him.
SupremeCommander@ 4/30/2009 3:18 PM
Posted by Allanfan20:
Posted by SupremeCommander:
Don't know why this hasn't been posted yet, but this is why Hakeem Nicks is better than anyone else they could've taken:
SupremeCommander, a year and a half ago, I would have said that there's no way, but then this catch was made in the superbowl:
Don't get me wrong, the Tyree catch was the single greatest in football history... I'm not comparing it (same year, different seasons) but the Nicks catch was the without question the best catch in NCAAF. The dude has hands.
I like that if Eli can actually hit his targets, and not throw the ball 20' higher than it should, both he and Smith should be able to catch everything thrown their way, and Manningham should be a nice third option. He was great in college a few years back and got good understudy service
the receivers don't have a dominant speed/height game changer, nor do I think they have a legit number one (yet) but I think they have a whole slew of number 2s, which should allow the Giants to spread the field and space out the box... which hopefully (re)opens the running attack
TMS@ 4/30/2009 8:38 PM
The Giants' rookie-pool allotment to sign their nine draft picks was set at $4,867,462... is that gonna be enough to sign all those guys?
GKFv2@ 4/30/2009 9:14 PM
Those 6th and 7th rounders will probably not be signed.
VDesai@ 4/30/2009 9:42 PM
It'll be enough, but I don't see all the players making the team.
SupremeCommander@ 5/3/2009 2:28 PM
My buddy who is a big Raiders fan and i going to school at UMD had this to say about Hakeem Nicks and Howard-Bey, and I don't necessarily disagree. He thought the Giants messed up by not moving up, not necessarily for Howard-Bey, but a similar type player. Nicks and Smith are similar players and the Giants still don't have a target that stretches the field... and I agree. There's not enough downfield speed on the team.
SupremeCommander@ 5/3/2009 2:33 PM
I thought this Post article was great
NEW DC SHERIDAN RUNS SIMILAR SCHEME IN OWN STYLE
By PAUL SCHWARTZ
May 3, 2009 --
It is altogether telling and in some ways fascinating that when it came time for Bill Sheridan to sell himself for the job of defensive coordinator, he stressed one specific attribute to coach Tom Coughlin.
"I told him the most important thing for a coordinator is competence; that you know scheme and that you can give players that," Sheridan said.
Interesting choice. Sheridan could have said leadership or charisma or style. Or even personality. So many of the marquee engineers of great defenses in the NFL are instantly recognizable for whom they are and what they're about. Sheridan, 50, never has been a coordinator at any level and takes over for the highly successful Steve Spagnuolo, who in just two years with the Giants went from nondescript assistant to first-time coordinator to hot prospect to head coach of the St. Louis Rams.
That's the fast-track side of the position, a ride John Fox took before Spagnuolo. It's a ride that dumped Tim Lewis, who, brought in when Coughlin arrived, was ineffective and discarded.
Now comes Sheridan, who before 2005 had never coached a minute in the NFL but during 20 years developed a strong college resume. He had been the Giants' linebackers coach for four years, and when Coughlin needed a replacement for Spagnuolo, he decided to stay in-house and picked Sheridan over defensive backs coach Peter Giunta.
Continuity is the key here, as Coughlin surmised there's a good thing going on defense and why rip it up and start over again? Sheridan says he will keep the system Spagnuolo imported from Philadelphia and make minor adjustments, mainly making the schemes less multiple -- be more effective with less -- and asking his pass rushers to drop in coverage less frequently than the past.
The real change will be Sheridan himself. The diminutive, intense Spagnuolo was no self-promoter, but his honesty quickly won over his players and they followed him with a real zeal. He called the game from the sideline; interpersonal interaction was his strong suit.
Sheridan is soft-spoken, intelligent, thoughtful and, according to those around him, incredibly well prepared. But he's not going to emote a great deal.
"I think you can get up in front of the players and you can be a big rah-rah motivational guy, but the bottom line is, your scheme and your game plan has to be put together each week because the players will know whether or not it is legitimate or not, or it is going to work," Sheridan said. "And so they may love or dislike your personality -- that is irrelevant. If you give them a plan each week to go into the game where they feel they are going to have a chance, they will be motivated and they will respond to you."
Sheridan's main student, middle linebacker Antonio Pierce, has reserved judgment on the promotion for his former position coach, as Pierce is emotional and got what he needed from Spagnuolo. It is fitting that Sheridan, unlike the majority of NFL defensive coordinators, has decided to call the game from on high, up in the press box, meaning no TV face-time clenching his fists or exhorting his troops from the sideline.
"Because you want to make logical, calculated decisions on your play-calling," Sheridan explained. "And really that is not as complicated as you think, either. I think up in the box you have a little calmer atmosphere. You are not down on the sidelines where there can be a lot of mayhem."
Sheridan inherits a loaded deck. The Giants were ranked No. 5 in defense last season and that was without injured Pro Bowler Osi Umenyiora and free-agent additions Chris Canty, Michael Boley, Rocky Bernard and C.C. Brown. The new man in charge is excited, even if he doesn't always show it.
"Oh, it is just huge," he said. "I'm sure there are few exceptions, but everybody aspires to be either a coordinator or eventually become a head coach. It is all fun, it is all good, it is all great."
paul.schwartz@nypost.com
TMS@ 5/3/2009 5:13 PM
Posted by SupremeCommander:
My buddy who is a big Raiders fan and i going to school at UMD had this to say about Hakeem Nicks and Howard-Bey, and I don't necessarily disagree. He thought the Giants messed up by not moving up, not necessarily for Howard-Bey, but a similar type player. Nicks and Smith are similar players and the Giants still don't have a target that stretches the field... and I agree. There's not enough downfield speed on the team.
Hixon's a good enough downfield threat, he just needs to hold on to the ball... the Giants run a more possession style offense anyway... i think this team needed a bigger, more physical type WR that could go over the middle w/great hands than they did a smaller speed burner guy... i'm actually more excited about what Barden can possibly bring to the table than i am Nicks at this point... 6'6" w/huge hands who can catch the ball away from his body will be a matchup nightmare no matter who's trying to cover him.
VDesai@ 5/3/2009 5:15 PM
Heyward-Bey has really shitty hands. He drops a lot of balls. I'm happy we didn't move up to take that guy. He moved up more on triangle numbers than pure production.
Giants needed a new no.1 reciever, not any specific type of player. They made the right choice.
TMS@ 5/3/2009 6:16 PM
w/Eli's penchant for throwing high balls, i disagree... we needed a tall, physical WR... obviously getting a #1 goes w/o saying.
JohnWallace44@ 5/6/2009 12:28 AM
TMS, have you seen the Ramses Barden clips? Dude is money. I think we did well especially considering our position.
