personally i love Kazmir, but he tends to walk a lot of guys in comparison to the other 2. that means his pitch counts will get high & that leads to a lot of wear on that arm of his as time progresses. johan's control is impeccable & it's been that way his entire career. it's a tough call for me only cuz i know TB will want Hughes & another top prospect in all likelihood to give up Kazmir, & i don't know how long that arm will hold up throwing the way he does. his contract is a huge bonus for us tho since it frees up money to go after Texiera or Sabathia after next season. Decisions, decisions!
i would like ANY of them. but if i had to put them in order it be like this:
1.) johan santana- the best pitcher in the game. should help any team get over the hump. h a down year last year but no reason for him to do better this year.
2.) bedard- good stats on a struggling team, should fit nicely in a winning rotation.
3.) kasmir- proved to be a great pitcher in the league. though he is learning the game and could solidify a rotation for years to come, still has a lot to learn.
My no.1 option is not to trade any of our young arms. All 3 have had some success in the major leagues in addition to dominating the minors. And none is older than 23. This is the most exciting class of prospects the Yanks have had in quite some time. We're talking about being able to control these 3 for at least the next 5-6 years at a reasonable salary.
The best thing to happen would be that the Pettitte resigns. Then your rotation is very solid at the top with Wang and Pettitte- who as Yankees have won ball games at an astounding rate. Then you have Hughes, Joba and Kennedy fill the back end if possible, with a savvy vet like Moose there as insurance. Or maybe Moose is in the rotation and has the ability to get an extra day of rest when he needs it because one of the amazing 3 can spot him.
I'm not saying that the 3 guys you mention aren't great pitchers. Fact is each is tremndous. But we have the opportunity to produce 3 studs here and a bargain price and keeping all of our cards in the deck for the season, where if we need to patch a hole, we can.
The one issue that has been brought up RE: Santana is that after his 17 K game, he basically went into the shiiter with a >5.00 ERA. Maybe he's suffering from some Arm trouble.
His era went from 2.88 in late August to 3.33 by the end of the year. That's about 7 starts.
Any chance Minn would trade Santana for Cano AND Melky along with some of our minor league pitching prospects other than the big three (other than Hughes, Joba, Kennedy)?
[Edited by - bonn1997 on 11-29-2007 12:35 PM]
Yankees aren't trading Cano as it looks now... there's no way in hell we get Johan w/o giving up Hughes as part of the deal... if the Yankees don't wanna pony up, Johan likely goes to either BOS for a Bucholtz package, or to the LAD for Billingsley, Broxton + prospect package IMHO.
So they're choosing to keep a guy who's about a top 20 or 30 MLB hitter over a guy who's a top 2 or 3 MLB starting pitcher? That doesn't make sense. What was the context of the claim? We're they saying the Yankees wouldn't give up Cano under any circumstances or wouldn't give him up if Hughes or another top pitcher had to also be included?
what i've been reading is that the Yankees are holding onto Joba & Cano... the article didn't say anything about them choosing Cano over Johan... apparently they must feel they can get Johan w/o giving up Cano in the deal... like i said, they WILL have to trade Hughes to get Johan... if they don't, then don't bank on him being a Yankee next season.
http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/baseball/bal-sp.orioles30nov30,0,7480581.story
Contract extension talks between the Orioles and Erik Bedard stalled yesterday, increasing the likelihood that team officials will spend part of next week's winter meetings contemplating trade offers for the ace left-hander.
The New York Yankees, New York Mets, Seattle Mariners, Los Angeles Angels and Los Angeles Dodgers all have inquired about Bedard, who would be one of the most coveted pitchers available in a market that also includes two-time American League Cy Young Award winner Johan Santana.
According to several industry sources, the Mets' offer for Bedard, which was rejected, included 21-year-old outfield prospect Carlos Gomez, reliever Aaron Heilman, 29, and a third player, believed to be right-handed starter Philip Humber, 24. Gomez, ranked as the Mets' third-best prospect by Baseball America, is clearly the headliner.
When Gomez debuted with the Mets in May, he was the league's youngest player. The speedy center fielder batted .232 with two home runs, 12 RBIs and 12 steals, missing two months after breaking a bone in his left hand.
Heilman went 7-7 with a 3.03 ERA in 81 appearances last year for the Mets while serving as a setup man for Billy Wagner. Humber, the third overall pick in the 2004 draft, was 11-9 with a 4.27 ERA last season in 25 starts for Triple-A New Orleans. He pitched in three games, including one start for the Mets, compiling a 7.71 ERA.
The Orioles and Dodgers have also had discussions about Bedard. Center fielder Matt Kemp, reliever Jonathan Broxton and pitching prospect Clayton Kershaw are among the names discussed, sources say.
Johan has a no-trade clause and if he wants to be a Yankee (which are the whispers) they should stand firm and not offer Hughes.
There is no point in trading Cano when they are still asking for a top pitching prospect. Realistically Cano is a top 2-3 2nd baseman for the next several years- that wouldn't be easy to replace.
Posted by VDesai:
Johan has a no-trade clause and if he wants to be a Yankee (which are the whispers) they should stand firm and not offer Hughes.
There is no point in trading Cano when they are still asking for a top pitching prospect. Realistically Cano is a top 2-3 2nd baseman for the next several years- that wouldn't be easy to replace.
He's a top 2-3 *hitting* 2nd baseman but you can get that offensive production from other players by upgrading our hitting at CF, LF, DH, or 1st base. Of course, losing Cano would be a big loss and it would suck emotionally because he's one of our home-grown players, but his production is at least somewhat replaceable. If we're giving up Cano, we should not be giving up Hughes or Joba, though.
Olney reported this morning that we're close to signing Mark Loretta... curious move for the Yankees... maybe Cano's not untouchable afterall?
Posted by TMS:
Olney reported this morning that we're close to signing Mark Loretta... curious move for the Yankees... maybe Cano's not untouchable afterall?
I think the move could signal that Betemit is moving moreso than Cano. Loretta would be a UTIL replacement.
Posted by VDesai:
Posted by TMS:
Olney reported this morning that we're close to signing Mark Loretta... curious move for the Yankees... maybe Cano's not untouchable afterall?
I think the move could signal that Betemit is moving moreso than Cano. Loretta would be a UTIL replacement.
that's what i'm hoping... maybe Betemit goes in a deal to shore up the bullpen? would be ironic since we traded Proctor to get him to begin with.
Posted by TMS:
Posted by VDesai:
Posted by TMS:
Olney reported this morning that we're close to signing Mark Loretta... curious move for the Yankees... maybe Cano's not untouchable afterall?
I think the move could signal that Betemit is moving moreso than Cano. Loretta would be a UTIL replacement.
that's what i'm hoping... maybe Betemit goes in a deal to shore up the bullpen? would be ironic since we traded Proctor to get him to begin with.
No I think Betemit is a piece in a trade for Santana. Minnesota desperately needs a 3B.
i sincerely hope so, but i don't see why the Twins would be high on Betemit... he can't hit lefty pitching.
Posted by TMS:
i sincerely hope so, but i don't see why the Twins would be high on Betemit... he can't hit lefty pitching.
They started the worst regular player in the major leagues at 3b last year in Nick Punto.
http://web.yesnetwork.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20071126&content_id=1434248&oid=36019&vkey=6
11/30/2007 4:20 PM ET
Memo to Yankees: Keep Cano
If you get Loretta, great. But don't trade Robbie
Steven Goldman
HEATING UP? Rumors abound today that the Yankees will sign Mark Loretta. I'm not certain what this means, except perhaps that Wilson Betemit might be dangled to the Twins as part of a Santana deal. Minnesota needs a third baseman and a shortstop — Nick Punto batted .210/.291/.271 as the main third sacker last year, and they just dealt shortstop Jason Bartlett to the Rays. They received Brendan Harris in that deal, but he's not really a shortstop and probably won't hit enough to play third. Then again, he'll hit better than Punto. Anyway, Betemit should hit more than either, at least in a platoon role. Fielding remains a concept, but in this case, if the Twins want Betemit they'll get Betemit and the Yankees won't suffer too much.
Loretta, 36, is about three years past being important or interesting. Through 2004, when Loretta hit .335/.391/.495 for the Padres, he was a career .303/.366/.414 hitter, which is useful, especially when it's coming from a middle infielder. Since then, Loretta has slipped a notch, and over the last three years he's been pretty consistent as far as what he can do, hitting .284/.351/.360. That actually only does so much for you, especially when it starts showing up at the infield corners. Last year, Loretta played 49 games at second, 72 games at short (Adam Everett got hurt), 23 games at third, and 34 games at first. That kind of versatility is handy, and when you combine that with the bat you get something better than Miguel Cairo, albeit with less speed. You really don't want more than 200 at-bats of it if you can help it, though, because the bat will start to wound.
With Alex Rodriguez, Derek Jeter, and Robinson Cano in the house, the Yankees won't need him at three-fourths of the position he can play barring injury and the odd day off. Loretta's range at shortstop is lacking, so you wouldn't want to see him there every day if the Captain got hurt. If A-Rod were injured, the falloff to Loretta's bat would be like taking a wrong step in the Badlands, which I very nearly did one time. That leaves Loretta subbing for Robby Cano... Or would Cano be offered in a package for Johan Santana?
There are a whole bunch of reasons why that would be daft. Cano is the best young second baseman in baseball. He's still years away from his peak. You might not trade him for Santana straight up — as the Yankees should know better than anyone. With stars up the middle you can compete even if you have weaknesses at the corners. From the Twins' point of view, Cano is arbitration eligible and will cost them quite a few dimes to keep.
Loretta can't back up Jeter at SS really... so on those off games when Joe wants to give him a rest, who plays that position? Arod could i suppose... if Cashman can swing a Kennedy/Melky/Betemit/Horne trade for Johan, he's gotta do it obviously, but i don't see the Twins biting on that package... i think it's gonna take Hughes/Melky/Tabata to get it done.
Loretta played more than 70 games at SS last year so I think you could get away with playing him a handful of games there.
Not for nothing, giving the Twins that first package would get them 2 positional starters this year and 2 guys that probably could step right into the rotation. That'd really be a positive deal for them and the Yanks should probably hold out.
Remember Santana has a no trade clause so he can dictate where he wants to go. Torii Hunter has mentioned in a couple interviews that Santana had talked to him about going to the Yankees. So if Johan wants to be a Yankee, they've got to stand firm on what they give up.
I think the Sox are in it to drive the Yankees into giving up Hughes but they have no intention of giving up Ellsbury or Bucholz either.
