BigSm00th wrote:holfresh wrote:
MDA said Magic was one of the best players in the game and he never played defense...He said the Lakers gave up 104 pts per game and still won Championships..He said in PHX the point differential was 7/8 pts and was a good team...He says the Knicks are only have a 1 pt differential...We have to score more....
showtime lakers played in a different era.
how many hall of famers did they have? how many teams were there in the league?
i gotta hand it to MDA he is convinced his style can work. i hope he is right!
What's so surprising about needing Hall of Fame players to win a championship? Take a look at the rosters of the champions in prior years. This is not a new concept.
Its also like those who love the melo trade and hate moving AR.
I thought if he bought into the system or matured into it he could have been great in a year or so.
He was needed to facilitate the trade.
Great coaches are very stubborn and have a high conviction in what they do.
Lose battles to win the war.
As much change as we have had I don't think it warrants him going.
YOu don't go out and get Melo and Amare then change your posture to ball control and defense.
YOu don't build a sports car then complain it don't drive like a Sedan De Ville!
Nalod wrote:
Its also like those who love the melo trade and hate moving AR.I thought if he bought into the system or matured into it he could have been great in a year or so.
He was needed to facilitate the trade.
Great coaches are very stubborn and have a high conviction in what they do.
Lose battles to win the war.
As much change as we have had I don't think it warrants him going.
YOu don't go out and get Melo and Amare then change your posture to ball control and defense.
YOu don't build a sports car then complain it don't drive like a Sedan De Ville!
you don’t bang kim kardashian and then complain that she doesn't discuss world politics with you.
Bippity10 wrote:nyk4ever wrote:Marv wrote:wow. it's time for another holy revolt reaction from knick fans who live their lives as if they’re in the movie ground hog day - every day they wake up outraged at discovering mike d'antoni's coaching philosophy anew.
kinda like bip waking up everyday and realizing he's 20,000 posts behind everyone?
Jerk. Although I do agree with both statements.
Just a case of people searching for a reason to be outraged. We all know D'Antoni is an offensive coach. We all know his teams are not the best on the defensive end. We all know that he tries to outscore his opponents. We all are wondering if he is the right coach to win a title(Walsh is evaluating the same thing). Why get outraged everytime we get more evidence of the things we already know?
bip, the world awaits the first bippity-PLAYOFF get-together.
martin wrote:franco12 wrote:BigSm00th wrote:holfresh wrote:
MDA said Magic was one of the best players in the game and he never played defense...He said the Lakers gave up 104 pts per game and still won Championships..He said in PHX the point differential was 7/8 pts and was a good team...He says the Knicks are only have a 1 pt differential...We have to score more....
showtime lakers played in a different era.
how many hall of famers did they have? how many teams were there in the league?
i gotta hand it to MDA he is convinced his style can work. i hope he is right!
I'm not finding a season that Magic's Lakers gave up as few as 104 - it appears they were always around the average for points allowed, but well above average scoring.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/leag...
Now- D'Antoni's problem is we aren't an average defense & I bet if you adjusted the numbers for the Lakers for pace, they would be seen as above average defense.
just into the team to see their offensive/defensive ratings.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/team...
Seems to me LAL was always #1 or #2 offense and anywhere between #7-10 on the defensive side.
And if we were able to get to the same place with D'Antoni, I think all the MDA critics would be ecstatic.
But while we have a number one offense, we have a last place defense. Out west, we don't make the play offs and we're Golden State.
franco12 wrote:martin wrote:franco12 wrote:BigSm00th wrote:holfresh wrote:
MDA said Magic was one of the best players in the game and he never played defense...He said the Lakers gave up 104 pts per game and still won Championships..He said in PHX the point differential was 7/8 pts and was a good team...He says the Knicks are only have a 1 pt differential...We have to score more....
showtime lakers played in a different era.
how many hall of famers did they have? how many teams were there in the league?
i gotta hand it to MDA he is convinced his style can work. i hope he is right!
I'm not finding a season that Magic's Lakers gave up as few as 104 - it appears they were always around the average for points allowed, but well above average scoring.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/leag...
Now- D'Antoni's problem is we aren't an average defense & I bet if you adjusted the numbers for the Lakers for pace, they would be seen as above average defense.
just into the team to see their offensive/defensive ratings.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/team...
Seems to me LAL was always #1 or #2 offense and anywhere between #7-10 on the defensive side.
And if we were able to get to the same place with D'Antoni, I think all the MDA critics would be ecstatic.
But while we have a number one offense, we have a last place defense. Out west, we don't make the play offs and we're Golden State.
Yeah it's been posted here on quite a few occasions teams who have won chips over the past 25-30yrs had Top 10 defenses. I think there was only 1 team who didn't. For the record George Karl has produced some very successful offensive teams recently including this year. Consistently has got teams to win 50gms+ no matter where he's gone, has had one of the best defensive teams in NBA history, has been to the Finals and CF on several occasions and rarely if ever is he mentioned as a great coach or even elite coach. Throw a stone at D'AnToni for not focusing on defense enough after he's failed to address it front and center but rather sidestep it with trumping up offensive attention and a riot almost breaks out.
Very flawed logic by D'Antoni particularly using Magic as an example why the system can work.
Magic was a 6'9" freak who rebounded like a power forward and was the greatest fast-break point guard of ALL-TIME.
The Laker's shot lay-ups and free throws while the Knicks launch wild 3 pointers all over the place.
The Laker's also had 3-4 hall of famers on that roster at all times (Magic, Kareem, Worthy + guys like Wilkes, Nixon, McAdoo, Scott).
When the fast break stalled they dumped the ball into the single best post scorer of ALL-TIME to shoot the sky hook.
It's so easy to say we need to score more but in trying to do that you force shots early and take bad shots in general. Plus the edge you may create in forcing tempo is almost always off-set by fact the other team takes easier shots than the Knicks because our transition defense sucks and our defense as a whole sucks --- not to mention zero shot blocking around the tin.
Magic is just a bad example --- I saw Magic play Chauncey & Toney are no Magic Johnsons.
In either carnations of this season pre and post melo this team is not anywhere close to knocking on the championship door.
If MDA can't take us there with a roster worthy then we move on.
LivingLegend wrote:Very flawed logic by D'Antoni particularly using Magic as an example why the system can work.Magic was a 6'9" freak who rebounded like a power forward and was the greatest fast-break point guard of ALL-TIME.
The Laker's shot lay-ups and free throws while the Knicks launch wild 3 pointers all over the place.
The Laker's also had 3-4 hall of famers on that roster at all times (Magic, Kareem, Worthy + guys like Wilkes, Nixon, McAdoo, Scott).
When the fast break stalled they dumped the ball into the single best post scorer of ALL-TIME to shoot the sky hook.
It's so easy to say we need to score more but in trying to do that you force shots early and take bad shots in general. Plus the edge you may create in forcing tempo is almost always off-set by fact the other team takes easier shots than the Knicks because our transition defense sucks and our defense as a whole sucks --- not to mention zero shot blocking around the tin.
Magic is just a bad example --- I saw Magic play Chauncey & Toney are no Magic Johnsons.
Lest he forget Cooper/Worthy/Kareem were good defenders and committed to playing it. The rest of their roster was average to above average defenders. They held each other accountable and no doubt you can credit Slick Back because of this.
Marv wrote:Nalod wrote:
Its also like those who love the melo trade and hate moving AR.I thought if he bought into the system or matured into it he could have been great in a year or so.
He was needed to facilitate the trade.
Great coaches are very stubborn and have a high conviction in what they do.
Lose battles to win the war.
As much change as we have had I don't think it warrants him going.
YOu don't go out and get Melo and Amare then change your posture to ball control and defense.
YOu don't build a sports car then complain it don't drive like a Sedan De Ville!
you don’t bang kim kardashian and then complain that she doesn't discuss world politics with you.
Best analogy of the year.
Hands down.
I said this when we made the trade for Melo, but in what way did we enhance the team defensively with that trade? We doubled down on the offense by getting Melo. That was the upshot of the trade. There's only so much we can do to improve defensively. CB and AC aren't getting any quicker against quick guards and we're not getting any bigger against big front lines. All we can do is fight hard on D and excel on offense.
Thibs defense is helped tremendously by having a talented and devoted defender like Noah in the middle of it. All great defensive teams need a great defensive player or 2 to make that happen. You also need the right balance in your roster. We have very poor size and except for TD we are slow at PG. So basically we're not really setup to dominate on D and even Thibs wouldn't be as successful here with this group. I'm sure he'd be better on D, but possibly less so on offense, so it still might not work to our benefit. We are what we are right now. I guarantee that if you put a serious defensive Big on this team it would immediately help this team on D, even with Mike coaching it.
Yes, we have no defenders
Our centers are either too shrimpy or too weak. We got nobody over 6'10 of any significant value. Nobody. Jared Jeffries, does not count. You love him because he is ours, but he does not a difference make.
Our slender four is built like a three and our newly acquired three is learning to imitate World B Free
Our starting two is a rookie trying to get his second wind and our Mister Big Shot is 47 years old.
We are a jump shooting squad. We attempt 25 three's a game. They fall, we win.
Damn the defense and the torpedoes, full speed (SSOL) ahead. Outscore the bastards!
Here we go again with this defensive over kill...
Someones explain this to me...when the kobes, jordans, hakeems, AI's of the nba drops 40 pts on the opposing teams best defensive player..do you walk away saying that guy was a ridiculously weak defender or are people more likely to say that player was just unstoppable..
Great defense but just a better shot..how many times have you heard that line.
When we crack the bull ass in november TT was quoted saying..there offense was just too mucch for us, he said there whole defensive plan was to stop the 3 ball...yet we made 15 treys..there's no defense on the face of the earth that can stop ball movement and spacing..and we have all wittness this...
I like fish post..makes a lot of sense....
MDA said it was about pt diff. Ours is 1. Lakes were 8.
Nobody said our team was talented like them. He was talking about ball control and offensive rhythm.
So anyone think if MDA went into the Hot Tub Time Machine and coached Showtime he'd tell them not to bother defending? Tell Magic to slow the ball down?
You think if the other team was hot and we had no breaks the lakes never took outside shots? Otherwise teams would pack the middle up and take out Kareem. That team was stacked with multiple weapons.
Remember when MDA had Gallo taking less 3's and taking it to the hoop?
I don't expect any miracles on defense but I don't want to see situations where the smallest guy on the floor is looking around at his teammates after their big man dunks on him. Happened too often this season.
Well now I know not to expect any changes or adjustments made by the coach for the playoffs.
The coach is holding the team back from reaching their full potential and you have people here blindly supporting him. It's sad, really. The man has shown nothing here and his philosophy has never been successful yet he is consistently given a free pass.
Well there you have it. Our defensive plan is shrug well they got in a rhythm. Oh well. That does explain why after loses atrrburable to horrid d the explanation is shots not falling. The problem is when the other team gets in a rhythm with dunks and pathos and we get into ours with 3s' who is going to start getting cold 1st?
Funny thing is that some have contended that Mda is a decent defensive coach and it's our lazy uncoachable players(all 120 or so he's coached) who won't give defensive effort. Now Mda tells us no really I don't worry much about d, part of the plan. And those same posters now say D really isn't important after all. High comedy
