Knicks · What MJ did hardlining a traiter any different than what Melo did to NY or LeBron, Bosh,or greedy players They hurt the league (page 1)

I believe MJ is a sellout. But he is on the other side of the fence just like a Prosecutor attorney and a defense attorney. MJ should have stepped back and voted the way he wanted to. But to come out against the players even if he didn't agree with them he shouldn't have broadcast it. Now look what Melo did he could have waited and he still would have gotten his money but because of his selfish ways the Knicks have a shell of a team. With LeBron he made Cleveland wait for the season to end and had the Knicks hoping to land him and we really had no hope. We lost a lot of money and trade value trying to nail Lebron. The NBA is full of greed just like Wall Street. Wall Street and the Big Companies don't give a Damn about our country. Its all about greed.
I will always be a Knicks die hard fan because Dolan wanted to give the teams pretty much what they wanted. I will see the league in a different way. A different opinion. More of take it or leave it until the NBA shows me other wise.

ItalianStallion wrote:I find it interesting that almost all the ex stars that have spoken publicly think the players should take the 50-50 deal because things have changed. Barkley has been saying it from the start and Magic Johnson said the same thing on ESPN 1050 today.

You can't listen to the old players cuz they think some of the money these guys make now is ridiculous. They're somewhat jealous too. The players should take the deal cuz it's all about perspective! They're still gonna make good money. Just not as much as before. But let's not ignore the fact that yet again the players are getting squeezed on system issues and this isn't going to be a system that gives them more freedoms.

nixluva wrote:

ItalianStallion wrote:I find it interesting that almost all the ex stars that have spoken publicly think the players should take the 50-50 deal because things have changed. Barkley has been saying it from the start and Magic Johnson said the same thing on ESPN 1050 today.

You can't listen to the old players cuz they think some of the money these guys make now is ridiculous. They're somewhat jealous too. The players should take the deal cuz it's all about perspective! They're still gonna make good money. Just not as much as before. But let's not ignore the fact that yet again the players are getting squeezed on system issues and this isn't going to be a system that gives them more freedoms.

The bottom line is that everyone wants as much as they can get, but only one side is actually right. In this case it's the owners. The owners made a terrible deal last time and the league is losing its shirt as a result. So they need to roll back what they gave up and more to put the league on sound financial footing. Anyone that was asked to give something up like the players would be upset, but they have to rise above it and look at reality. A league that is losing money should not even exist. If any of the players was an owner they would be unwilling to lose millions also.

ItalianStallion wrote:

nixluva wrote:

ItalianStallion wrote:I find it interesting that almost all the ex stars that have spoken publicly think the players should take the 50-50 deal because things have changed. Barkley has been saying it from the start and Magic Johnson said the same thing on ESPN 1050 today.

You can't listen to the old players cuz they think some of the money these guys make now is ridiculous. They're somewhat jealous too. The players should take the deal cuz it's all about perspective! They're still gonna make good money. Just not as much as before. But let's not ignore the fact that yet again the players are getting squeezed on system issues and this isn't going to be a system that gives them more freedoms.

The bottom line is that everyone wants as much as they can get, but only one side is actually right. In this case it's the owners.

ItalianStallion wrote:I find it interesting that almost all the ex stars that have spoken publicly think the players should take the 50-50 deal because things have changed. Barkley has been saying it from the start and Magic Johnson said the same thing on ESPN 1050 today.

the players are delusional, even the so called smart ones like JJ reddick, who said the owners proposals have been draconian, yet out the other side of his mouth, he said even so, they will still be paid more than great... LOL... He also called the system restrictive..

I say this JJ reddick!! go to europe with your slow feet and average game and tell me if you would make what you are getting now? You will really find out what restrictive is.... every time a player opens his mouth about this lock it comes off as just plain stupid... He also accused the owners of trying to run up the score... LOl.. He said, it is like the owners being up 4 touchdowns and instead of running out the clock, they are running trick plays..

Well JJ reddick!! as one baseball manager sparky anderson I think it was said... "I will promise to stop scoring if you promise to stop trying to catch up!!!!!"

ItalianStallion wrote:I find it interesting that almost all the ex stars that have spoken publicly think the players should take the 50-50 deal because things have changed. Barkley has been saying it from the start and Magic Johnson said the same thing on ESPN 1050 today.

Real men figure out how to make it work.

Barkley never won a title but he never compromised to conspire (superfriends) nor ride anyones coat tails.

Players today are all buddy-buddy. Back in the day players did not hang out, they often did not like each other. I'll give Isiah some credit, he did not come to Knicks to try to win another and he was a true self centered prick. It cost him, but he was true.

Magic's sense of entitlement was not that huge. Bought it on the court and when struck down in his prime to a hideous virus he struggled a bit with coaching but then went out and BUILT A FUCKING EMPIRE!

Then you had Mike beocome the biggest name on the planet and was a true prick of a human. A true sociopath honeybadger type who took what he wanted and would rip the opponent, and his teams heart out to get it. MIke want some extramarital some-some, he don't care, he don't give a shit. Mike want another ring? Buddy up to mike but mike will take your soul and your ring! Mike don't care, he don't give a shit. Mike owns a team now.

COmpare to today where we got Lebrons inflated sense of entitlement, Bosh is the court jester, Wade is out for wade, Stat is cool, but running around nake't and on 7th ave fashion houses looking pretty (not that there is anything wrong with that) and Melo also just styling it big to build his brand.

Restrictive was when Earl the Pearl wanted out of Baltimore cuz he was making only $20,000 a year! In the new Knick book he laments having to leave and wonders if he stayed in Baltimore how good they could have been, and how big his name could have been as he was the star! He had to share it with Clyde. Im always greatful he come to knicks but he was poetry in motion in Baltimore!

Im glad the players and the game has grown so all could profit. My feeling is Lebron really pissed off Gilbert and some other owners are pretty steamed they cater to the players and they use their leverage to hold the teams hostage. Dwight Howard is doing it asking for lots of exensive help which can be gotten by taking on contracts and trading picks. A player leaves the franchise is screwed. Lebron gets Jamison others and then leaves.

Owners can say "NO" but letting a star player walk, or forcing a trade never quite equates. Denver got some nice pieces trading Melo but no replacement for his star/draw power in return. He had leverage. Dolan was generous (in retrospect his way of perhaps not rocking the boat given his natural advantage).

Players deserve to be paid and they will. Somewhere in the last few years the players tipped the balance of power in their favor away from the owners.

If you hate the owner you side with the player. If you own a business or manage perhaps you understand the employees can't run the business nor dictate profits. Not if you can help it!

And thats in my opinion is why the owners are being such dicks.

Nalod wrote:Barkley never won a title but he never compromised to conspire (superfriends) nor ride anyones coat tails.

what about when he joined the rockets?

If he took a big cut in pay I'd say he sold out. He was a big piece on that 96-97 team. Injury cut his time but was still avged 19 a game.

Nalod wrote:If you hate the owner you side with the player. If you own a business or manage perhaps you understand the employees can't run the business nor dictate profits. Not if you can help it!

And thats in my opinion is why the owners are being such dicks.

i have to make one correction to the lingo being used. i think people have to stop casting the players as "employees." the players are not employees in the classic sense of the term, rather, the players are "talent" (much like musicians and actors). if i side with any of the parties, i side with the talent because that is the position i most relate to (having been involved in numerous musical projects in my life). unlike normal employees who are, fungible, inherently replaceable pieces of the business, talent have special attributes that are unique and put them in their own classification. NBA players are talent, like musicians and actors, they are not employees like ticket checkers and concessions clerks.

eViL wrote:

Nalod wrote:If you hate the owner you side with the player. If you own a business or manage perhaps you understand the employees can't run the business nor dictate profits. Not if you can help it!

And thats in my opinion is why the owners are being such dicks.

i have to make one correction to the lingo being used. i think people have to stop casting the players as "employees." the players are not employees in the classic sense of the term, rather, the players are "talent" (much like musicians and actors). if i side with any of the parties, i side with the talent because that is the position i most relate to (having been involved in numerous musical projects in my life). unlike normal employees who are, fungible, inherently replaceable pieces of the business, talent have special attributes that are unique and put them in their own classification. NBA players are talent, like musicians and actors, they are not employees like ticket checkers and concessions clerks.

True, but when your going decertify leave the anti-trust execmptions your now falling into labor laws.

Conceptually your are correct. Without talent you have no event in which to promote.

Which leads to the question that if your not a traditional employee, then what are the players? INdependant contrators?

Nalod wrote:

eViL wrote:

Nalod wrote:If you hate the owner you side with the player. If you own a business or manage perhaps you understand the employees can't run the business nor dictate profits. Not if you can help it!

And thats in my opinion is why the owners are being such dicks.

i have to make one correction to the lingo being used. i think people have to stop casting the players as "employees." the players are not employees in the classic sense of the term, rather, the players are "talent" (much like musicians and actors). if i side with any of the parties, i side with the talent because that is the position i most relate to (having been involved in numerous musical projects in my life). unlike normal employees who are, fungible, inherently replaceable pieces of the business, talent have special attributes that are unique and put them in their own classification. NBA players are talent, like musicians and actors, they are not employees like ticket checkers and concessions clerks.

True, but when your going decertify leave the anti-trust execmptions your now falling into labor laws.

Conceptually your are correct. Without talent you have no event in which to promote.

Which leads to the question that if your not a traditional employee, then what are the players? INdependant contrators?

yeah, i would say independent contractor would be a better term than employee. what they have with the owners is closer to a partnership than a true employee-employer relationship. they are (or should be) closer to the owner's level than a traditional employee would be.

I say this JJ reddick!! go to europe with your slow feet and average game and tell me if you would make what you are getting now?

Bonn1997 wrote:

I say this JJ reddick!! go to europe with your slow feet and average game and tell me if you would make what you are getting now?

I say this, greedy billionaire corporate owners: Go get some NBDL and Euro replacement players and then you'll realize how unreplaceable your current players are.

Laughable statement. Others will come.

Vmart wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

I say this JJ reddick!! go to europe with your slow feet and average game and tell me if you would make what you are getting now?

I say this, greedy billionaire corporate owners: Go get some NBDL and Euro replacement players and then you'll realize how unreplaceable your current players are.

Laughable statement. Others will come.

how soon?

Vmart wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

I say this JJ reddick!! go to europe with your slow feet and average game and tell me if you would make what you are getting now?

I say this, greedy billionaire corporate owners: Go get some NBDL and Euro replacement players and then you'll realize how unreplaceable your current players are.

Laughable statement. Others will come.

eViL wrote:

Vmart wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

I say this JJ reddick!! go to europe with your slow feet and average game and tell me if you would make what you are getting now?

I say this, greedy billionaire corporate owners: Go get some NBDL and Euro replacement players and then you'll realize how unreplaceable your current players are.

Laughable statement. Others will come.

how soon?

Very.

Childs2Dudley wrote:

eViL wrote:

Vmart wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

I say this JJ reddick!! go to europe with your slow feet and average game and tell me if you would make what you are getting now?

I say this, greedy billionaire corporate owners: Go get some NBDL and Euro replacement players and then you'll realize how unreplaceable your current players are.

Laughable statement. Others will come.

how soon?

Very.

that's interesting. then why would the owners bother to negotiate with the current crop of players if they are so readily replaceable?

Bonn1997 wrote:

I say this JJ reddick!! go to europe with your slow feet and average game and tell me if you would make what you are getting now?

I say this, greedy billionaire corporate owners: Go get some NBDL and Euro replacement players and then you'll realize how unreplaceable your current players are.

Dude, nobody said a thing about replacement players. You can't get scabs to cross a picket line when there is none. cuz they are locked out, not "on Strike"!