Knicks · Completely against bringing in JR Smith now (page 4)

martin wrote:

smackeddog wrote:As someone said on the other thread, now that Billups is out, I think it's very likely he'll go to the Clippers- he'll get a starting role, get to play with CP3 to boost his value in the offseason, and is friends with Kenyon Martin.

I still think we need more scoring off the bench- Walker only plays well offensively every 5 or so games. TD is one of the worst players in the nba this season and is showing no signs of improvement. Shumpert shoots poorly and his dead legs have robbed him of the athletisism he needs to drive. Bibby is done, the two JJ's and Balkman can't score. Who else is there out there besides JR Smith?

good points

Larry Coon says Clips can only offer the Minimum.

LarryCoon Larry Coon
No, if Smith came to the Clips, it'd have to be for the minimum. RT @David_Eshak: JR Smith
5 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

Larry Coon
LarryCoon Larry Coon
No DPEs after 1/15. RT @AlexR44: Unless the Clip's receive a Disabled Player Exception, right?
2 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

»
Larry Coon
LarryCoon Larry Coon
They can't make a trade that gets them Smith. RT @David_Eshak: Clips can make a trade/dump..
2 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

From what I can tell I don't think LAC can sign JR Smith. I think they used their 2.5mil Exception on KMart! that limits the number of teams worth going to. Now JR can make more money going to some team like the Hawks, OKC, Philly, Orl or Cavs if they were interested. Knicks have to be at the top of the list in terms of desirable destinations, tho not if he is only looking for the most money. This list below was last updated on Jan. 16th.

Team            Bi-Annual       Mid-Level       Trade Exception
	
Atlanta 	$1,900,000 	$5,000,000
                              (non-taxpayer) 	    1 
Charlotte 	$1,900,000 	$2,500,000
                              (non-taxpayer) 	    2
Chicago 	$1,900,000 	
Cleveland 	$1,900,000 	$5,000,000
                              (non-taxpayer)
Dallas 	        $1,900,000 	         - 	    4
Denver 	        $1,900,000 	$5,000,000
                              (non-taxpayer) 	    4
Detroit 	- 	        $5,000,000
                              (non-taxpayer)
Golden State 	- 	        $2,500,000
                                (cap room) 
Indiana 	- 	        $2,500,000
                                (cap room)
L.A. Clippers 	- 	        $2,500,000 - Used on KMart
                                (cap room) 	    2
Memphis 	$900,000 	$2,450,000
                              (non-taxpayer)
Milwaukee 	- 	        $2,500,000
                                (cap room)
Minnesota 	- 	        $2,500,000
                                (cap room)
New Orleans 	- 	        $3,432,500
                              (non-taxpayer) 	    2
New York 	- 	        $2,500,000
                                (cap room)
Oklahoma City 	$1,900,000 	$4,525,000
                              (non-taxpayer) 	    1
Orlando 	$1,900,000 	$5,000,000
                              (non-taxpayer) 	    1
Philadelphia 	$1,900,000 	$5,000,000
                              (non-taxpayer) 	    1
Phoenix 	$1,900,000 	
Portland 	$1,900,000 	- 	            1
   
Sacramento 	- 	        $2,500,000
                                (cap room) 
San Antonio 	$1,900,000 	$5,000,000
                              (non-taxpayer) 	    1
Toronto 	$400,000 	$2,500,000
                              (non-taxpayer)
Utah 	        $1,900,000 	$550,000
                              (non-taxpayer) 	    2
Washington 	- 	        $2,500,000
                                (cap room) 

I would use the $2.5M on Lin.

NYKBocker wrote:I would use the $2.5M on Lin.

Now? Or wait another 10 games just to confirm that he is the real deal?

NYKBocker wrote:I would use the $2.5M on Lin.

+ 17

Was thinking the same thing. A class reward for what Lin has meant to the early season that was going nowhere fast.

mrKnickShot wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:I would use the $2.5M on Lin.

Now? Or wait another 10 games just to confirm that he is the real deal?

Now. Guy is confirmed.

Bums don't give the business in consecutive games, the second game against the 5th seed in the West.

BRIGGS wrote:No need--we have three point shooters--we do NOT need a ball-hogging guy like that we need team players. We already have two ball dominant players who will need to taylor their games. If there is a player out there that can help this team--Im all for it but I think we can also go with what we have and be successful if everyone buys in. JR Smith now makes no sense for this team. We have Walker Novak Shumpert Douglas and Fields

Respectively Disagree
other than the reduced minutes M.Bibby there is NO ONE on the knicks
hitting shots 3 -pointer's much less 2 point jumpers with any consistency OR percentage worth the discussions.

You need some Jumpshot making guard you can trust at anytime in the game.

Lin is doing well
Fields improved

But none of Knicks guards can shoot a lick on roster based on hi # of attempt jumpshots

Think JR will have to merge his game to get minutes but its difficult to say others on Knicks roster are BETTER jump shooters
than the traveled J.R. 'Dyn-o-mite' Smith. Smith will help the knicks & be a guard whom others can trust

DJMUSIC wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:No need--we have three point shooters--we do NOT need a ball-hogging guy like that we need team players. We already have two ball dominant players who will need to taylor their games. If there is a player out there that can help this team--Im all for it but I think we can also go with what we have and be successful if everyone buys in. JR Smith now makes no sense for this team. We have Walker Novak Shumpert Douglas and Fields

Respectively Disagree
other than the reduced minutes M.Bibby there is NO ONE on the knicks
hitting shots 3 -pointer's much less 2 point jumpers with any consistency OR percentage worth the discussions.

You need some Jumpshot making guard you can trust at anytime in the game.

Lin is doing well
Fields improved

But none of Knicks guards can shoot a lick on roster based on hi # of attempt jumpshots

Think JR will have to merge his game to get minutes but its difficult to say others on Knicks roster are BETTER jump shooters
than the traveled J.R. 'Dyn-o-mite' Smith. Smith will help the knicks & be a guard whom others can trust

I agree that we do not have good enough shooters - Fields can throw the ball in the ocean right not from 15+. Shump - not good enough shooter. TD ... Walker - OK

Novak is the only pure shooter.

So, I agree that we need another shooter but not JR. He brings too much other crap that we don't need now.

NYKBocker wrote:I would use the $2.5M on Lin.

I doubt you can use your under the cap exception to extend someone.

mrKnickShot wrote:

DJMUSIC wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:No need--we have three point shooters--we do NOT need a ball-hogging guy like that we need team players. We already have two ball dominant players who will need to taylor their games. If there is a player out there that can help this team--Im all for it but I think we can also go with what we have and be successful if everyone buys in. JR Smith now makes no sense for this team. We have Walker Novak Shumpert Douglas and Fields

Respectively Disagree
other than the reduced minutes M.Bibby there is NO ONE on the knicks
hitting shots 3 -pointer's much less 2 point jumpers with any consistency OR percentage worth the discussions.

You need some Jumpshot making guard you can trust at anytime in the game.

Lin is doing well
Fields improved

But none of Knicks guards can shoot a lick on roster based on hi # of attempt jumpshots

Think JR will have to merge his game to get minutes but its difficult to say others on Knicks roster are BETTER jump shooters
than the traveled J.R. 'Dyn-o-mite' Smith. Smith will help the knicks & be a guard whom others can trust

I agree that we do not have good enough shooters - Fields can throw the ball in the ocean right not from 15+. Shump - not good enough shooter. TD ... Walker - OK

Novak is the only pure shooter.

So, I agree that we need another shooter but not JR. He brings too much other crap that we don't need now.

I hear ya on the crap
but I feel your/forum talking about the OLD Jr Smith of the once Hornets & teams such he played for

Think under George Karl he got most of his act together did not here too much troubles off court
but on court JR helped Nuggets with Melo/Nene to their 45-50 win records under Karl.

DJMUSIC wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

DJMUSIC wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:No need--we have three point shooters--we do NOT need a ball-hogging guy like that we need team players. We already have two ball dominant players who will need to taylor their games. If there is a player out there that can help this team--Im all for it but I think we can also go with what we have and be successful if everyone buys in. JR Smith now makes no sense for this team. We have Walker Novak Shumpert Douglas and Fields

Respectively Disagree
other than the reduced minutes M.Bibby there is NO ONE on the knicks
hitting shots 3 -pointer's much less 2 point jumpers with any consistency OR percentage worth the discussions.

You need some Jumpshot making guard you can trust at anytime in the game.

Lin is doing well
Fields improved

But none of Knicks guards can shoot a lick on roster based on hi # of attempt jumpshots

Think JR will have to merge his game to get minutes but its difficult to say others on Knicks roster are BETTER jump shooters
than the traveled J.R. 'Dyn-o-mite' Smith. Smith will help the knicks & be a guard whom others can trust

I agree that we do not have good enough shooters - Fields can throw the ball in the ocean right not from 15+. Shump - not good enough shooter. TD ... Walker - OK

Novak is the only pure shooter.

So, I agree that we need another shooter but not JR. He brings too much other crap that we don't need now.

I hear ya on the crap
but I feel your/forum talking about the OLD Jr Smith of the once Hornets & teams such he played for

Think under George Karl he got most of his act together did not here too much troubles off court
but on court JR helped Nuggets with Melo/Nene to their 45-50 win records under Karl.

Don't care about the trouble - just don't need another chucker. Would really just love a pure spot up shooter who can drive a bit. But not one who looks to create his own shot.

mrKnickShot wrote:

DJMUSIC wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

DJMUSIC wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:No need--we have three point shooters--we do NOT need a ball-hogging guy like that we need team players. We already have two ball dominant players who will need to taylor their games. If there is a player out there that can help this team--Im all for it but I think we can also go with what we have and be successful if everyone buys in. JR Smith now makes no sense for this team. We have Walker Novak Shumpert Douglas and Fields

Respectively Disagree
other than the reduced minutes M.Bibby there is NO ONE on the knicks
hitting shots 3 -pointer's much less 2 point jumpers with any consistency OR percentage worth the discussions.

You need some Jumpshot making guard you can trust at anytime in the game.

Lin is doing well
Fields improved

But none of Knicks guards can shoot a lick on roster based on hi # of attempt jumpshots

Think JR will have to merge his game to get minutes but its difficult to say others on Knicks roster are BETTER jump shooters
than the traveled J.R. 'Dyn-o-mite' Smith. Smith will help the knicks & be a guard whom others can trust

I agree that we do not have good enough shooters - Fields can throw the ball in the ocean right not from 15+. Shump - not good enough shooter. TD ... Walker - OK

Novak is the only pure shooter.

So, I agree that we need another shooter but not JR. He brings too much other crap that we don't need now.

I hear ya on the crap
but I feel your/forum talking about the OLD Jr Smith of the once Hornets & teams such he played for

Think under George Karl he got most of his act together did not here too much troubles off court
but on court JR helped Nuggets with Melo/Nene to their 45-50 win records under Karl.

Don't care about the trouble - just don't need another chucker. Would really just love a pure spot up shooter who can drive a bit. But not one who looks to create his own shot.

We all ready have one of those on the roster and his name is Toney Douglas. He's regressed this season but I think we can all chalk that up to the sudden desire to have him run the offense and try to facilitate, a role that he's completely worthless in. If his job is to come off the bench, be active, provide spot-up shots and some scoring, that's the guy.

BRIGGS wrote:No need--we have three point shooters--we do NOT need a ball-hogging guy like that we need team players. We already have two ball dominant players who will need to taylor their games. If there is a player out there that can help this team--Im all for it but I think we can also go with what we have and be successful if everyone buys in. JR Smith now makes no sense for this team. We have Walker Novak Shumpert Douglas and Fields

I disagree for a couple of reasons....

- we don't have enough talent or experience at the SG position (JR brings both)
- we are still desperate for points off the bench
- Lin has never played significant minutes for a long stretch - he will definitely wear or break down (don't want it to happen but it always does)
- While they are in the game --- both Baron and Lin should have the ball and minimize the iso opportunities for a guy like JR
- come playoff time -- you need people who can take people off the dribble and make shots under severe half-court pressure (JR can do that)

y2zipper wrote:We all ready have one of those on the roster and his name is Toney Douglas. He's regressed this season but I think we can all chalk that up to the sudden desire to have him run the offense and try to facilitate, a role that he's completely worthless in. If his job is to come off the bench, be active, provide spot-up shots and some scoring, that's the guy.

Disagree. Douglas comes from stubborn stock. He is one of the least productive players in the NBA and could be hiding a shoulder injury. His regression is hurting the Knicks more than helping, whether he plays off guard, or wherever. Last night he was trusted to play 3 minutes before D'Antoni yanked him and sat him.

Douglas is NOT an answer.

Knicks can survive without JR, but IMO would be improved with him. Having a deep bench is a plus in the playoffs. We don't have a lot of players that can score the ball from the perimeter and take it strong to the basket. With the spread offense this team will be VERY difficult to beat if those perimeter players can reliably knock down shots. We've lost games due to poor shooting and it would be a shame to lose a playoff game cuz we didn't make enough open shots.

I think it's worth the risk.

I still do not see how this is a discussion but everyone has a right to their opinion. I just do not see how walker,Douglas, Fields, and Shump can be thought as better players and you can throw in Bibby. Smith is not that bad. People are acting like he is void of the team concept.

yellowboy90 wrote:I still do not see how this is a discussion but everyone has a right to their opinion. I just do not see how walker,Douglas, Fields, and Shump can be thought as better players and you can throw in Bibby. Smith is not that bad. People are acting like he is void of the team concept.

Yep, it's not even a discussion. Nearly every contender is pursuing him despite his overblow reputation. Lakers, Clippers, Bulls (former team), Spurs, etc.

If you think our "shooters" are hitting now, the postseason is a different animal. It separates the real shooters from the streaky ones that lack confidence (as we saw from Landry last year with his disappearing act). Novak can't be the only shooter on the roster, especially when he isn't compatible with Melo defensively.

What happens when a team like Chicago stops Lin's penetration and we have to rely on iso? I'll tell you what. Lin, although far better than a Shumpert or Douglas, does not excel as an off-ball player. Fields's jumpshot will go for broke. Our offense will revert to Melo iso without shooters, and Melo will settle for contested looks when teammates can't capitalize on the open looks he gives them.

What kind of personality flaws does he have again? Wiki says he is basically a horrible wreckless driver and he had one altercation in a club(who hasn't lol) . Anything that I missed? His shot selection is a whole another issue, in MDA offense he will probably take all the shots, I mean like ALL of them.

DJMUSIC wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:No need--we have three point shooters--we do NOT need a ball-hogging guy like that we need team players. We already have two ball dominant players who will need to taylor their games. If there is a player out there that can help this team--Im all for it but I think we can also go with what we have and be successful if everyone buys in. JR Smith now makes no sense for this team. We have Walker Novak Shumpert Douglas and Fields

Respectively Disagree
other than the reduced minutes M.Bibby there is NO ONE on the knicks
hitting shots 3 -pointer's much less 2 point jumpers with any consistency OR percentage worth the discussions.

You need some Jumpshot making guard you can trust at anytime in the game.

Lin is doing well
Fields improved

But none of Knicks guards can shoot a lick on roster based on hi # of attempt jumpshots

Think JR will have to merge his game to get minutes but its difficult to say others on Knicks roster are BETTER jump shooters
than the traveled J.R. 'Dyn-o-mite' Smith. Smith will help the knicks & be a guard whom others can trust

I agree and also agree that JR might bring some crap but that is a chance you take.
JR is the only guy off the bench for us that can give us what we need - instant scoring.

It boils down to this:
We can always sign a D leaguer.
We only have this chance to sign JR and if it doesn't work you cut him and go to the Dleague. I mean if he has a bad influence, you cut him. I take this chance and anyway, I think from what I've read, he is not anywhere as bad as people say.

EMS

ramtour420 wrote:What kind of personality flaws does he have again? Wiki says he is basically a horrible wreckless driver and he had one altercation in a club(who hasn't lol) . Anything that I missed? His shot selection is a whole another issue, in MDA offense he will probably take all the shots, I mean like ALL of them.

JR is a strange dude. He just marches to his own beat. I don't think he's a real trouble maker overall. Sometimes you have these young guys that are kind of out of touch with society and how to fit in. He wants to do things his way like many young guys of his generation. I think this team has enough strong personalities to be able to handle JR.

The way this offense flows I don't really see too much of a problem. JR will be getting shots when the ball swings out to him, but initially it's all PnR and attack the basket stuff. In MDA's offense the plays are mostly draw to go to the hole and the 3 is the outlet when the D stops the inside play. I see nothing wrong with JR firing away if the shots are wide open as they should be. Let's remember that there's a reason this offense has been high powered. You want a guy that isn't afraid to take the shot when it's open and the ball comes to him.

More and more you look at this team now--you realize that JR Smith would be a poor move. We have what we need from the perimeter--we dont need to take more threes than we do--we have two specialists in Novak and Walker and STILL have to get Amare and Melo to join in. We dont need more FGA's. I think if anything we should go with what we have for now.