Knicks · Incorporating Melo and Amare will be challenging (page 2)

It should work fine. Stat is at home playing with a real PG. Lin is a poor man's Nash right now. Melo plays his best basketball with a top PG (Billups/Miller.) He can focus on what he does best and score. He is a top finisher in this league. When lin drives to the basket and the PnR fails, Melo should be able to cut and get the ball within 10 ft of the basket. That is where he is most effective. He won't have to create, so it will make things easier. Obviously adjustments will need to be made, but it should definitely work just fine.

JCrusher wrote:

markvmc wrote:No problem incorporating Amare into a pg driven D'Antoni team.

Melo, on the other hand....

This is the type of pg Amare wants but like you said Melo we dont know

Melo played with Billups and Miller and that was when things were best. Not sure why it is an issue. His life should be much easier.

Hopefully Melo can play the same role that Joe Johnson did for the suns, post player/ secondary ball handler in the pnr.

mrKnickShot wrote:

nixluva wrote:There will be more than enough to go around with the way they rotate players. STAT usually gets some time without Melo and vice versa. So Lin will be able to make it work with whoever is on the floor with him. It's not like Melo has never played with a PG before. I don't think it's gonna be that hard. Once he gets some practices with Lin as the starter they can develop some chemistry and figure some things out. Every player wants to play with a real passer, no matter if it's CP3 or Lin.

Not everyone is that optimistic. I don't think Melo will appreciate being the 3rd or 4th option. But my opinion is speculative, you seem to sure of yours

Not sure where you are getting this from but Melo is totally fine allowing his teammates find their rhythm. In the playoffs PnR is just as hard to defend, jazz being the perfect example, even over MDA . He has has had his share of success too btw, behind the PnR. Off of a broken play, Melo can be deadly, I will be the first one to say it. 3es option, fine, but 4 th ? Behind who exactly?

ramtour420 wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

nixluva wrote:There will be more than enough to go around with the way they rotate players. STAT usually gets some time without Melo and vice versa. So Lin will be able to make it work with whoever is on the floor with him. It's not like Melo has never played with a PG before. I don't think it's gonna be that hard. Once he gets some practices with Lin as the starter they can develop some chemistry and figure some things out. Every player wants to play with a real passer, no matter if it's CP3 or Lin.

Not everyone is that optimistic. I don't think Melo will appreciate being the 3rd or 4th option. But my opinion is speculative, you seem to sure of yours

Not sure where you are getting this from but Melo is totally fine allowing his teammates find their rhythm. In the playoffs PnR. Is just as hard to defend, jazz being the perfect example, even over MDA , who has had his share of success. Off of a broken play, Melo can be deadly, I will be the first one to say it. 3es option, fine, but 4 th ? Behind who exactly?

Lin/Chandler, I believe, will be the main play. Which in turn make Lin and Chandler 1 and 2. I think Amare fits into the PNR offense a bit more so he is 3. Melo - 4. Can he be 3? possibly - we will see.

I think Melo can let the system come to him, but I am not totally sold. Karl and MDA both seemed to have issues with him slowing down the offense with 1 on 1 play. That will kill this offense.

I hope they win every game while Melo is out. Maybe that will get him to re-think his role on offense.

Knixkik wrote:It should work fine. Stat is at home playing with a real PG. Lin is a poor man's Nash right now. Melo plays his best basketball with a top PG (Billups/Miller.) He can focus on what he does best and score. He is a top finisher in this league. When lin drives to the basket and the PnR fails, Melo should be able to cut and get the ball within 10 ft of the basket. That is where he is most effective. He won't have to create, so it will make things easier. Obviously adjustments will need to be made, but it should definitely work just fine.

Well said and I do think Melo feels pressure to be more of a team player. If not, he is the odd one out and a great asset to have.

EMS

Trade Melo for Gallo, Chandler, The Moz and our 2014 pick.

Panos wrote:Trade Melo for Gallo, Chandler, The Moz and our 2014 pick.

What if Jimmy can trade Lin?

YOu guys are too much. STAT will love playing with Nash 2.0. Melo is going to fill up the stat sheet with wide open mid range jumpers...he's the best in the mid range business. Oh yeah MELO does pass the ball as well. This is going to be a beautiful thing when STAT and Melo are back as well as Josh returning in a few weeks.

SOunds like a nice problem to have. How to fit in 2 All-Stars into a working offense.

STAT is not an issue. He has played this before with Nash and Shaq.

Melo has no choice. If he doesn't the NY fans will ride him unmercifully. If he has half the brains of Lin, he will understand that the better the team does, the more open looks he will get. The more efficient he will be and the better he will look. When he buys in, he will realize that with a solid TEAM, they can win it all. That should motivate any player.

Simple math.

Last night, Bibby, Walker and Jeffries were a combined 3-22

Distribute those shot attempts between Carmelo and Stoudemire.

Rinse and repeat.

Bootleg POD

"Suns fan here.

Great plays can make average players good and good players great, and a great play is harder to guard for 48 minutes than a great player. In Jeremy Lin, I see some real potential for the Knicks to learn how to play as a team. If he can learn how to run the most crucial play in D’Antoni’s system - the high pick n roll, the Knicks will be tough to beat.

There seems to be a discussion about the need for this team to find a way to get the ball to both Melo and STAT, the teams “great players.” IMO, in D’Antoni’s system this discussion should only have bearing on the last 5 minutes of close games. That’s because for the rest of the game, it should be a play, not a player, that carries the team. In D’Antoni’s system, and with the personnel in NY, that play is the high pick n roll.

Jeremy Lin shows the instincts and intelligence required for a point guard to run this play successfully. Lin is no Nash, but if he and STAT can develop even a semblance of the chemistry that Nash and Amar’e had, then the Knicks will not have to worry about finding a way for Melo and Amar’e to share the ball: it will take care of itself.

The Pick And Roll in Phoenix, even though it was initiated by Nash and STAT, was not a play designed to get the ball to Amar’e, but it was an extremely efficient way to create an open shot for anybody. If the defense sunk in to help, Nash would find a shooter; if they went under screens, Nash would drain a three, if they played the passing lane, then he’d kick out and find an open shooter.

Steve Nash came to Phoenix as a good player, but this great play turned him into a superstar. Shawn Marion was a good player before, but this play turned him into an extremely efficient player (the Suns didn’t “run any plays” for him, but he still managed to score in bunches, without taking any shots).

Melo is a ball stopper. And while he is nice to have around in the fourth quarter (has he proven this yet, btw?) his demand for the ball is going to cost everyone around him. Maybe I’m pointing out the obvious – that the Knicks need a good pg- but I think its just as important for them to not have a ball-stopper.

Really, he’s got to go, or else this system cannot work. And I’d rather pin my hopes on a team oriented system than on one player."

- escapegoat

misterearl wrote:Simple math.

Last night, Bibby, Walker and Jeffries were a combined 3-22

Distribute those shot attempts between Carmelo and Stoudemire.

Rinse and repeat.

You know it doesn't work that way. Melo and Amare won't be taking shots away from only our three worst performers in each game.

file this under "good problems"

amare will be helped greatly if lin can keep this up. pretty sure he's lost a step whether due to age or the muscle he put on in the offseason but he's always been a beast around the basket and i'm pretty sure lin will be able to give him more opportunities closer to the basket.

melo is going to have to adjust his game most of all but you have to realize he's never really played with what you would call a pass first pg. iverson, billups, anthony carter etc.... when he's played with billups the offenses were always in the top 5 in offensive eff. i'm pretty sure he can adjust his game since even he can't stand losing. when the offense bogs down cause the pg can't create space i think he's shouldering all the creative responsibilities and what he knows to do best is shoot.

this team always needed a pg.. it's just that we were waiting for the wrong one apparently.

When was the last time a PNR PG/System had 3 stars to dish to? That is a good problem to have but a complicated problem to deal with?

Can we compare it to the Celtics running PNR with Rondo/Garnett and Pierce and Allen still have many value plays in the offense?

Amare wants a pg like lin just like he had in nash. ,elo has never got along great with a pg that runs the offense like lin is doing which is why so many of us are worried when he comes back

misterearl wrote:Bootleg POD

"Suns fan here.

Great plays can make average players good and good players great, and a great play is harder to guard for 48 minutes than a great player. In Jeremy Lin, I see some real potential for the Knicks to learn how to play as a team. If he can learn how to run the most crucial play in D’Antoni’s system - the high pick n roll, the Knicks will be tough to beat.

There seems to be a discussion about the need for this team to find a way to get the ball to both Melo and STAT, the teams “great players.” IMO, in D’Antoni’s system this discussion should only have bearing on the last 5 minutes of close games. That’s because for the rest of the game, it should be a play, not a player, that carries the team. In D’Antoni’s system, and with the personnel in NY, that play is the high pick n roll.

Jeremy Lin shows the instincts and intelligence required for a point guard to run this play successfully. Lin is no Nash, but if he and STAT can develop even a semblance of the chemistry that Nash and Amar’e had, then the Knicks will not have to worry about finding a way for Melo and Amar’e to share the ball: it will take care of itself.

The Pick And Roll in Phoenix, even though it was initiated by Nash and STAT, was not a play designed to get the ball to Amar’e, but it was an extremely efficient way to create an open shot for anybody. If the defense sunk in to help, Nash would find a shooter; if they went under screens, Nash would drain a three, if they played the passing lane, then he’d kick out and find an open shooter.

Steve Nash came to Phoenix as a good player, but this great play turned him into a superstar. Shawn Marion was a good player before, but this play turned him into an extremely efficient player (the Suns didn’t “run any plays” for him, but he still managed to score in bunches, without taking any shots).

Melo is a ball stopper. And while he is nice to have around in the fourth quarter (has he proven this yet, btw?) his demand for the ball is going to cost everyone around him. Maybe I’m pointing out the obvious – that the Knicks need a good pg- but I think its just as important for them to not have a ball-stopper.

Really, he’s got to go, or else this system cannot work. And I’d rather pin my hopes on a team oriented system than on one player."

- escapegoat

Anyone think Melo, his agent, the coach, the GM were all together on what needs to happen over time for Melo to be about winning?

Last season was too small a sample and installing new players on the fly is not really doable.

I see Melo playing in spurts in the team concept and is a better passer than I thought he would be.

If Lin is 2/3 nash we are better than the Heat.

Nalod wrote:

misterearl wrote:Bootleg POD

"Suns fan here.

Great plays can make average players good and good players great, and a great play is harder to guard for 48 minutes than a great player. In Jeremy Lin, I see some real potential for the Knicks to learn how to play as a team. If he can learn how to run the most crucial play in D’Antoni’s system - the high pick n roll, the Knicks will be tough to beat.

There seems to be a discussion about the need for this team to find a way to get the ball to both Melo and STAT, the teams “great players.” IMO, in D’Antoni’s system this discussion should only have bearing on the last 5 minutes of close games. That’s because for the rest of the game, it should be a play, not a player, that carries the team. In D’Antoni’s system, and with the personnel in NY, that play is the high pick n roll.

Jeremy Lin shows the instincts and intelligence required for a point guard to run this play successfully. Lin is no Nash, but if he and STAT can develop even a semblance of the chemistry that Nash and Amar’e had, then the Knicks will not have to worry about finding a way for Melo and Amar’e to share the ball: it will take care of itself.

The Pick And Roll in Phoenix, even though it was initiated by Nash and STAT, was not a play designed to get the ball to Amar’e, but it was an extremely efficient way to create an open shot for anybody. If the defense sunk in to help, Nash would find a shooter; if they went under screens, Nash would drain a three, if they played the passing lane, then he’d kick out and find an open shooter.

Steve Nash came to Phoenix as a good player, but this great play turned him into a superstar. Shawn Marion was a good player before, but this play turned him into an extremely efficient player (the Suns didn’t “run any plays” for him, but he still managed to score in bunches, without taking any shots).

Melo is a ball stopper. And while he is nice to have around in the fourth quarter (has he proven this yet, btw?) his demand for the ball is going to cost everyone around him. Maybe I’m pointing out the obvious – that the Knicks need a good pg- but I think its just as important for them to not have a ball-stopper.

Really, he’s got to go, or else this system cannot work. And I’d rather pin my hopes on a team oriented system than on one player."

- escapegoat

Anyone think Melo, his agent, the coach, the GM were all together on what needs to happen over time for Melo to be about winning?

Last season was too small a sample and installing new players on the fly is not really doable.

I see Melo playing in spurts in the team concept and is a better passer than I thought he would be.

If Lin is 2/3 nash we are better than the Heat.

Wow, hold your horses. The Heat have two of the top five players in the league. In their first year together, they came within two games of a championship. They're a bunch of divas who are hard to rout for but they're way ahead of us on the court.

You will see Melo assimilate into the flow that Lin and Chandler has been very succesful with. I see Melo doing his thing as Point Forward when Lin is out. We really looked bad when Lin was out last night. Jacking up 3s again.

When Melo and Stat are back I see this happening...

Starters: Tyson, STAT, Melo, Fields, Lin

First Sub: Shump for Lin, Fishlips for STAT, Walker for Fields

2nd SUB: Novak for Melo, STAT for Tyson, Lin for Walker

3rd SUB: Fields for Shump, Tyson for Fishlips.

Rinse, Cycle, Repeat.