MS wrote:You can absolutley say the magic would be under .500. We are a game above .500 with the guy. Tyson has zero offensive game to speak of and as medicore as Dwight is inside he averages 20 points a game and gets open shots for everyone on the floor. You switch out a top 4 NBA player for a top 20-25 guy it's what's going to happen. The second best player on the magic is ryan anderson the third is who exactly? They have no bench and terrible starter at nearly every position.
Send me your crytal ball. I could use one.
i can't believe anyone has ever doubted that the move to amnesty chauncey and sign tyson was anything other than brilliant.
tyson chandler is a top five center in this league, he is a championship core piece. the ability to sign him for 4 years at a relative bargain of $15M per year gives this team an actual chance to compete at an elite level, which not having an elite center did not.
??JLin??
Shump
Melo
??Amar'e??
Tyson
To me, Shump, Melo and Tyson are guy you see winning chips. They are all good enough to win it all. JLin might be. I question whether Amar'e will be healthy enough to be anything but a 6th man, so we might need a real good defensive PF who can hit a 15ft jumper and split 24min with Amar'e at some point, but just getting Tyson, Shump and Lin makes this team a real contender in my eyes, over the next few years. and it should lessen the pain a little for those who say we gave up too much in the Melo trade.
loweyecue wrote:MS wrote:You can absolutley say the magic would be under .500. We are a game above .500 with the guy. Tyson has zero offensive game to speak of and as medicore as Dwight is inside he averages 20 points a game and gets open shots for everyone on the floor. You switch out a top 4 NBA player for a top 20-25 guy it's what's going to happen. The second best player on the magic is ryan anderson the third is who exactly? They have no bench and terrible starter at nearly every position.
DH is fed the ball in at least 55% of ORL possessions ( guesstimate), Tyson gets about 10% of ours. How can you compare the PPG numbers. That doesn't take away from the need to for him develop some offensive moves.
It's not just some random occurrence that DH gets the ball so much more than Tyson. It's the result of Dwight having a much more developed offensive game.
Bonn1997 wrote:loweyecue wrote:MS wrote:You can absolutley say the magic would be under .500. We are a game above .500 with the guy. Tyson has zero offensive game to speak of and as medicore as Dwight is inside he averages 20 points a game and gets open shots for everyone on the floor. You switch out a top 4 NBA player for a top 20-25 guy it's what's going to happen. The second best player on the magic is ryan anderson the third is who exactly? They have no bench and terrible starter at nearly every position.
DH is fed the ball in at least 55% of ORL possessions ( guesstimate), Tyson gets about 10% of ours. How can you compare the PPG numbers. That doesn't take away from the need to for him develop some offensive moves.
It's not just some random occurrence that DH gets the ball so much more than Tyson. It's the result of Dwight having a much more developed offensive game.
I'll take Tyson's 70% FT in tight games, to the Hack-A-Dwight strategy that usually dooms the Magic in the playoffs.
MS wrote:You can absolutley say the magic would be under .500. We are a game above .500 with the guy. Tyson has zero offensive game to speak of and as medicore as Dwight is inside he averages 20 points a game and gets open shots for everyone on the floor. You switch out a top 4 NBA player for a top 20-25 guy it's what's going to happen. The second best player on the magic is ryan anderson the third is who exactly? They have no bench and terrible starter at nearly every position.
The point was not to compare him to D12, but simply to say we got a good player and essentially after D12, there really isn't another center out there that is giving his team what Tyson is giving to us. He runs the PR well, rebounds, hustles, plays D, shoots a decent FT%, great team mate, he is the "Glue Guy". Knick will need Amare, but looking at how the team played the game last night, I don't see us being a push over in the playoffs. He is that much of difference maker.
nyshakespeare wrote:http://www.nba.com/knicks/video/2012/03/...F*ck the stats. Tyson is man & Dwight is a spoiled brat who thinks he deserves things without having to earn it.
Actually, I do get the impression that Dwight relies on pure athleticism and doesn't work very hard to improve his game. I could be wrong but it seems that way.
crzymdups wrote:i can't believe anyone has ever doubted that the move to amnesty chauncey and sign tyson was anything other than brilliant.tyson chandler is a top five center in this league, he is a championship core piece. the ability to sign him for 4 years at a relative bargain of $15M per year gives this team an actual chance to compete at an elite level, which not having an elite center did not.
??JLin??
Shump
Melo
??Amar'e??
Tyson
To me, Shump, Melo and Tyson are guy you see winning chips. They are all good enough to win it all. JLin might be. I question whether Amar'e will be healthy enough to be anything but a 6th man, so we might need a real good defensive PF who can hit a 15ft jumper and split 24min with Amar'e at some point, but just getting Tyson, Shump and Lin makes this team a real contender in my eyes, over the next few years. and it should lessen the pain a little for those who say we gave up too much in the Melo trade.
I hope Stoudemire can return to form, but even without him, a core of Melo, Lin, Chandler, and Shumpert is good enough to build around if done properly. It would be nice to add a PF who can stretch the defense. Ryan Andersen isn't attainable, but someone to that effect.
Bonn1997 wrote:nyshakespeare wrote:http://www.nba.com/knicks/video/2012/03/...F*ck the stats. Tyson is man & Dwight is a spoiled brat who thinks he deserves things without having to earn it.
Actually, I do get the impression that Dwight relies on pure athleticism and doesn't work very hard to improve his game. I could be wrong but it seems that way.
I don't think that is true at all about him not working hard. Clearly, he worked hard to build his body up...to make him more of a factor. He also has more moves around the basket than he had years ago.
Knixkik wrote:crzymdups wrote:i can't believe anyone has ever doubted that the move to amnesty chauncey and sign tyson was anything other than brilliant.tyson chandler is a top five center in this league, he is a championship core piece. the ability to sign him for 4 years at a relative bargain of $15M per year gives this team an actual chance to compete at an elite level, which not having an elite center did not.
??JLin??
Shump
Melo
??Amar'e??
Tyson
To me, Shump, Melo and Tyson are guy you see winning chips. They are all good enough to win it all. JLin might be. I question whether Amar'e will be healthy enough to be anything but a 6th man, so we might need a real good defensive PF who can hit a 15ft jumper and split 24min with Amar'e at some point, but just getting Tyson, Shump and Lin makes this team a real contender in my eyes, over the next few years. and it should lessen the pain a little for those who say we gave up too much in the Melo trade.
I hope Stoudemire can return to form, but even without him, a core of Melo, Lin, Chandler, and Shumpert is good enough to build around if done properly. It would be nice to add a PF who can stretch the defense. Ryan Andersen isn't attainable, but someone to that effect.
Man - I used to dream of Kevin Love playing for the Knicks instead of Amare 
HugeKnick4 wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:nyshakespeare wrote:http://www.nba.com/knicks/video/2012/03/...F*ck the stats. Tyson is man & Dwight is a spoiled brat who thinks he deserves things without having to earn it.
Actually, I do get the impression that Dwight relies on pure athleticism and doesn't work very hard to improve his game. I could be wrong but it seems that way.
I don't think that is true at all about him not working hard. Clearly, he worked hard to build his body up...to make him more of a factor. He also has more moves around the basket than he had years ago.
Does he work hard in the gym or does he just have freakish genetics and do a little bit of work in the gym? Or maybe he does work hard in the gym but only because he enjoys it - much more so than doing something boring like practicing 500 free throws a day.
Bonn1997 wrote:HugeKnick4 wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:nyshakespeare wrote:http://www.nba.com/knicks/video/2012/03/...F*ck the stats. Tyson is man & Dwight is a spoiled brat who thinks he deserves things without having to earn it.
Actually, I do get the impression that Dwight relies on pure athleticism and doesn't work very hard to improve his game. I could be wrong but it seems that way.
I don't think that is true at all about him not working hard. Clearly, he worked hard to build his body up...to make him more of a factor. He also has more moves around the basket than he had years ago.
Does he work hard in the gym or does he just have freakish genetics and do a little bit of work in the gym? Or maybe he does work hard in the gym but only because he enjoys it - much more so than doing something boring like practicing 500 free throws a day.
Its hard to make that conclusion/assumption without it being substantiated. Shaq could not hit free throws. Ben Walace? Hardest worker I've ever seen. Wilt?
Howard is all world defense and has worked excessively hard at improving his offensive game.
It is quite frustrating being on a team with a weak supporting cast (as JVG alluded to numerous times last night)
The guy is a beast!
mrKnickShot wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:HugeKnick4 wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:nyshakespeare wrote:http://www.nba.com/knicks/video/2012/03/...F*ck the stats. Tyson is man & Dwight is a spoiled brat who thinks he deserves things without having to earn it.
Actually, I do get the impression that Dwight relies on pure athleticism and doesn't work very hard to improve his game. I could be wrong but it seems that way.
I don't think that is true at all about him not working hard. Clearly, he worked hard to build his body up...to make him more of a factor. He also has more moves around the basket than he had years ago.
Does he work hard in the gym or does he just have freakish genetics and do a little bit of work in the gym? Or maybe he does work hard in the gym but only because he enjoys it - much more so than doing something boring like practicing 500 free throws a day.
Its hard to make that conclusion/assumption without it being substantiated. Shaq could not hit free throws. Ben Walace? Hardest worker I've ever seen. Wilt?
Howard is all world defense and has worked excessively hard at improving his offensive game.
It is quite frustrating being on a team with a weak supporting cast (as JVG alluded to numerous times last night)
The guy is a beast!
Yeah, I'm giving the impression I get based on how much he seems to just enjoy getting attention and being a celebrity and that he seems to be perfectly content staying with a poorly functioning organization. I said earlier that I could be completely wrong though. I'm not sure he's made any improvements to his offensive game in the last five years though.
Bonn1997 wrote:nyshakespeare wrote:http://www.nba.com/knicks/video/2012/03/...F*ck the stats. Tyson is man & Dwight is a spoiled brat who thinks he deserves things without having to earn it.
Actually, I do get the impression that Dwight relies on pure athleticism and doesn't work very hard to improve his game. I could be wrong but it seems that way.
Well, let's just say I was EXTREMELY surprised when Tyson Chandler made a post move against the Bucks.
Fact is that Chandler is among the tallest players in the league, and probably one of the top 5 most athletic centers in the league. Great hands, runs the floor like a deer. With his tools, I can't quite figure out why his career scoring has peaked at ~12ppg, when as an athlete he's not far off from Dwight Howard or just about any big man in the league.
Bonn1997 wrote:mrKnickShot wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:HugeKnick4 wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:nyshakespeare wrote:http://www.nba.com/knicks/video/2012/03/...F*ck the stats. Tyson is man & Dwight is a spoiled brat who thinks he deserves things without having to earn it.
Actually, I do get the impression that Dwight relies on pure athleticism and doesn't work very hard to improve his game. I could be wrong but it seems that way.
I don't think that is true at all about him not working hard. Clearly, he worked hard to build his body up...to make him more of a factor. He also has more moves around the basket than he had years ago.
Does he work hard in the gym or does he just have freakish genetics and do a little bit of work in the gym? Or maybe he does work hard in the gym but only because he enjoys it - much more so than doing something boring like practicing 500 free throws a day.
Its hard to make that conclusion/assumption without it being substantiated. Shaq could not hit free throws. Ben Walace? Hardest worker I've ever seen. Wilt?
Howard is all world defense and has worked excessively hard at improving his offensive game.
It is quite frustrating being on a team with a weak supporting cast (as JVG alluded to numerous times last night)
The guy is a beast!
Yeah, I'm giving the impression I get based on how much he seems to just enjoy getting attention and being a celebrity and that he seems to be perfectly content staying with a poorly functioning organization. I said earlier that I could be completely wrong though. I'm not sure he's made any improvements to his offensive game in the last five years though.
His offensive game bares no comparison to 5 years ago. Take a look! His post moves have drastically evolved.
mrKnickShot wrote:Knixkik wrote:crzymdups wrote:i can't believe anyone has ever doubted that the move to amnesty chauncey and sign tyson was anything other than brilliant.tyson chandler is a top five center in this league, he is a championship core piece. the ability to sign him for 4 years at a relative bargain of $15M per year gives this team an actual chance to compete at an elite level, which not having an elite center did not.
??JLin??
Shump
Melo
??Amar'e??
Tyson
To me, Shump, Melo and Tyson are guy you see winning chips. They are all good enough to win it all. JLin might be. I question whether Amar'e will be healthy enough to be anything but a 6th man, so we might need a real good defensive PF who can hit a 15ft jumper and split 24min with Amar'e at some point, but just getting Tyson, Shump and Lin makes this team a real contender in my eyes, over the next few years. and it should lessen the pain a little for those who say we gave up too much in the Melo trade.
I hope Stoudemire can return to form, but even without him, a core of Melo, Lin, Chandler, and Shumpert is good enough to build around if done properly. It would be nice to add a PF who can stretch the defense. Ryan Andersen isn't attainable, but someone to that effect.
Man - I used to dream of Kevin Love playing for the Knicks instead of Amare
That would be a dream come true. The most perfect player in the world to play PF here.
C Chandler
PF Love
SF Anthony
SG Shumpert
PG Lin
One can dream.
Knixkik wrote:mrKnickShot wrote:Knixkik wrote:crzymdups wrote:i can't believe anyone has ever doubted that the move to amnesty chauncey and sign tyson was anything other than brilliant.tyson chandler is a top five center in this league, he is a championship core piece. the ability to sign him for 4 years at a relative bargain of $15M per year gives this team an actual chance to compete at an elite level, which not having an elite center did not.
??JLin??
Shump
Melo
??Amar'e??
Tyson
To me, Shump, Melo and Tyson are guy you see winning chips. They are all good enough to win it all. JLin might be. I question whether Amar'e will be healthy enough to be anything but a 6th man, so we might need a real good defensive PF who can hit a 15ft jumper and split 24min with Amar'e at some point, but just getting Tyson, Shump and Lin makes this team a real contender in my eyes, over the next few years. and it should lessen the pain a little for those who say we gave up too much in the Melo trade.
I hope Stoudemire can return to form, but even without him, a core of Melo, Lin, Chandler, and Shumpert is good enough to build around if done properly. It would be nice to add a PF who can stretch the defense. Ryan Andersen isn't attainable, but someone to that effect.
Man - I used to dream of Kevin Love playing for the Knicks instead of Amare
That would be a dream come true. The most perfect player in the world to play PF here.
C Chandler
PF Love
SF Anthony
SG Shumpert
PG Lin
One can dream.
And how well he would blend with Melo since he does not clog the same post positions.
mrKnickShot wrote:Knixkik wrote:mrKnickShot wrote:Knixkik wrote:crzymdups wrote:i can't believe anyone has ever doubted that the move to amnesty chauncey and sign tyson was anything other than brilliant.tyson chandler is a top five center in this league, he is a championship core piece. the ability to sign him for 4 years at a relative bargain of $15M per year gives this team an actual chance to compete at an elite level, which not having an elite center did not.
??JLin??
Shump
Melo
??Amar'e??
Tyson
To me, Shump, Melo and Tyson are guy you see winning chips. They are all good enough to win it all. JLin might be. I question whether Amar'e will be healthy enough to be anything but a 6th man, so we might need a real good defensive PF who can hit a 15ft jumper and split 24min with Amar'e at some point, but just getting Tyson, Shump and Lin makes this team a real contender in my eyes, over the next few years. and it should lessen the pain a little for those who say we gave up too much in the Melo trade.
I hope Stoudemire can return to form, but even without him, a core of Melo, Lin, Chandler, and Shumpert is good enough to build around if done properly. It would be nice to add a PF who can stretch the defense. Ryan Andersen isn't attainable, but someone to that effect.
Man - I used to dream of Kevin Love playing for the Knicks instead of Amare
That would be a dream come true. The most perfect player in the world to play PF here.
C Chandler
PF Love
SF Anthony
SG Shumpert
PG Lin
One can dream.
And how well he would blend with Melo since he does not clog the same post positions.
Yeah i think this is why we really need a strong stretch-4. Novak is great, but is more suited off the bench. I love watching him, Melo, and Chandler playing in the frontcourt together though. I'd like to find someone else like him just a little better defensively. Channing Frye, anyone? Haha.
mrKnickShot wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:mrKnickShot wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:HugeKnick4 wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:nyshakespeare wrote:http://www.nba.com/knicks/video/2012/03/...F*ck the stats. Tyson is man & Dwight is a spoiled brat who thinks he deserves things without having to earn it.
Actually, I do get the impression that Dwight relies on pure athleticism and doesn't work very hard to improve his game. I could be wrong but it seems that way.
I don't think that is true at all about him not working hard. Clearly, he worked hard to build his body up...to make him more of a factor. He also has more moves around the basket than he had years ago.
Does he work hard in the gym or does he just have freakish genetics and do a little bit of work in the gym? Or maybe he does work hard in the gym but only because he enjoys it - much more so than doing something boring like practicing 500 free throws a day.
Its hard to make that conclusion/assumption without it being substantiated. Shaq could not hit free throws. Ben Walace? Hardest worker I've ever seen. Wilt?
Howard is all world defense and has worked excessively hard at improving his offensive game.
It is quite frustrating being on a team with a weak supporting cast (as JVG alluded to numerous times last night)
The guy is a beast!
Yeah, I'm giving the impression I get based on how much he seems to just enjoy getting attention and being a celebrity and that he seems to be perfectly content staying with a poorly functioning organization. I said earlier that I could be completely wrong though. I'm not sure he's made any improvements to his offensive game in the last five years though.
His offensive game bares no comparison to 5 years ago. Take a look! His post moves have drastically evolved.
Then why are his stats almost identical (if not a little worse now)? Is he getting better at post moves and worse at everything else?
Bonn1997 wrote:mrKnickShot wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:mrKnickShot wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:HugeKnick4 wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:nyshakespeare wrote:http://www.nba.com/knicks/video/2012/03/...F*ck the stats. Tyson is man & Dwight is a spoiled brat who thinks he deserves things without having to earn it.
Actually, I do get the impression that Dwight relies on pure athleticism and doesn't work very hard to improve his game. I could be wrong but it seems that way.
I don't think that is true at all about him not working hard. Clearly, he worked hard to build his body up...to make him more of a factor. He also has more moves around the basket than he had years ago.
Does he work hard in the gym or does he just have freakish genetics and do a little bit of work in the gym? Or maybe he does work hard in the gym but only because he enjoys it - much more so than doing something boring like practicing 500 free throws a day.
Its hard to make that conclusion/assumption without it being substantiated. Shaq could not hit free throws. Ben Walace? Hardest worker I've ever seen. Wilt?
Howard is all world defense and has worked excessively hard at improving his offensive game.
It is quite frustrating being on a team with a weak supporting cast (as JVG alluded to numerous times last night)
The guy is a beast!
Yeah, I'm giving the impression I get based on how much he seems to just enjoy getting attention and being a celebrity and that he seems to be perfectly content staying with a poorly functioning organization. I said earlier that I could be completely wrong though. I'm not sure he's made any improvements to his offensive game in the last five years though.
His offensive game bares no comparison to 5 years ago. Take a look! His post moves have drastically evolved.
Then why are his stats almost identical (if not a little worse now)? Is he getting better at post moves and worse at everything else?
He is taking more shots a game becoming the full focal point of the offense. I have watched over 100 Orlando games over the last few years. While he started out as a high flying dunkster with no real post game, he now has a wide variety of really nice post moves. He still does not have a jumper - he is very similar to shaq in type of offensive game and how they built a formidable post game.
Shaq was Miles better though and more dominant.
Edit: Last night he made a beautiful post / drop step move that completely fooled Tyson and JVG could not stop talking about how far he has come in the post.
