Knicks · Game Thread Sunday 4/14 1pm (ABC): Knicks to douse Heat at the Garden. (page 28)
Clean wrote:Woody just saidh e should have stayed with Shump LOL. I think it was pretty obvious that he should have never gotten Fields back in the game. He took Shump out right after he was giving it to wade.
How about BD? That guy is the biggest disaster!
FoeDiddy wrote:nixluva wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:nixluva wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:nixluva wrote:You can't beat the better teams without some kind of efficient and smart offense. You can get stops and such, but the Heat, Bulls, Celtics will match us on D and we'll have to be much better at scoring the ball. ISO Melo can only get you so far against the playoff teams. I know some don't wanna hear this but it's the truth! You're not beating one of those teams in 7 games relying on ISO ball.We need a second scorer, that's why we lost.
You can't oversimplify it like that. All of those 4th qtr possessions, we ended up with poor spacing, no player or ball movement, no PnR!!! Meanwhile the Heat killed us with PnR, spread floor, Ball and Player movement.
James 29, Wade 28. Anthony 42. Pretty simple to me.
See that's the kind of thing that just gets overplayed. You think that they did it only going ISO like we did? They actually ran plays and used PnR, Spread the floor and made smart passes. I implore you to go back and look at the 4th qtr plays they ran and the ones we ran!!!!
They ran basic pick and rolls into ISO. didn't see much smart passing. Saw a lot of tough shots most humans wouldn't hit.
We panicked at end when we went down like 4 with those rushed 3s by Melo and JR. those weren't even ISO shots vs. rushed 3s early in shot clock. We might have scored more if we actually went ISO Melo on the block but I think he was tired by then.
Pretty much. It was quick 3's on our half trying to battle the clock. Didn't see many Iso's from us as the clock was running out.
FoeDiddy wrote:nixluva wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:nixluva wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:nixluva wrote:You can't beat the better teams without some kind of efficient and smart offense. You can get stops and such, but the Heat, Bulls, Celtics will match us on D and we'll have to be much better at scoring the ball. ISO Melo can only get you so far against the playoff teams. I know some don't wanna hear this but it's the truth! You're not beating one of those teams in 7 games relying on ISO ball.We need a second scorer, that's why we lost.
You can't oversimplify it like that. All of those 4th qtr possessions, we ended up with poor spacing, no player or ball movement, no PnR!!! Meanwhile the Heat killed us with PnR, spread floor, Ball and Player movement.
James 29, Wade 28. Anthony 42. Pretty simple to me.
See that's the kind of thing that just gets overplayed. You think that they did it only going ISO like we did? They actually ran plays and used PnR, Spread the floor and made smart passes. I implore you to go back and look at the 4th qtr plays they ran and the ones we ran!!!!
They ran basic pick and rolls into ISO. didn't see much smart passing. Saw a lot of tough shots most humans wouldn't hit.
We panicked at end when we went down like 4 with those rushed 3s by Melo and JR. those weren't even ISO shots vs. rushed 3s early in shot clock. We might have scored more if we actually went ISO Melo on the block but I think he was tired by then.
YES, If they used a Pick then the entire point is to create a one on one match up advantage or open lane! The point is to weaken the D by taking away the help defender. Of course the player has to make a one on one or ISO shot after that. That's the logical conclusion of every PnR. The point is that the Heat were poised in their offense and ran sets and the Knicks panicked and took bad shots.
Clean wrote:Woody just saidh e should have stayed with Shump LOL. I think it was pretty obvious that he should have never gotten Fields back in the game. He took Shump out right after he was giving it to wade.I'm still convinced that fields really cost us that game. i mean every time he was off the court we had momentum
mrKnickShot wrote:Davis is just as bad as fields i mean the guy cant move anymore or penetrateClean wrote:Woody just saidh e should have stayed with Shump LOL. I think it was pretty obvious that he should have never gotten Fields back in the game. He took Shump out right after he was giving it to wade.How about BD? That guy is the biggest disaster!
Clean wrote:Woody just saidh e should have stayed with Shump LOL. I think it was pretty obvious that he should have never gotten Fields back in the game. He took Shump out right after he was giving it to wade.
Yeah Fields absolutely killed us with that weak layup he put up against Bosh.
That Novak shot that didn't count cause of James Jones flop was a big Momentum killer too. which started with a Shump fumble on fast break.
nixluva wrote:FoeDiddy wrote:nixluva wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:nixluva wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:nixluva wrote:You can't beat the better teams without some kind of efficient and smart offense. You can get stops and such, but the Heat, Bulls, Celtics will match us on D and we'll have to be much better at scoring the ball. ISO Melo can only get you so far against the playoff teams. I know some don't wanna hear this but it's the truth! You're not beating one of those teams in 7 games relying on ISO ball.We need a second scorer, that's why we lost.
You can't oversimplify it like that. All of those 4th qtr possessions, we ended up with poor spacing, no player or ball movement, no PnR!!! Meanwhile the Heat killed us with PnR, spread floor, Ball and Player movement.
James 29, Wade 28. Anthony 42. Pretty simple to me.
See that's the kind of thing that just gets overplayed. You think that they did it only going ISO like we did? They actually ran plays and used PnR, Spread the floor and made smart passes. I implore you to go back and look at the 4th qtr plays they ran and the ones we ran!!!!
They ran basic pick and rolls into ISO. didn't see much smart passing. Saw a lot of tough shots most humans wouldn't hit.
We panicked at end when we went down like 4 with those rushed 3s by Melo and JR. those weren't even ISO shots vs. rushed 3s early in shot clock. We might have scored more if we actually went ISO Melo on the block but I think he was tired by then.
YES, If they used a Pick then the entire point is to create a one on one match up advantage or open lane! The point is to weaken the D by taking away the help defender. Of course the player has to make a one on one or ISO shot after that. That's the logical conclusion of every PnR. The point is that the Heat were poised in their offense and ran sets and the Knicks panicked and took bad shots.
Most of the time they ran the PnR, the Heat trapped LIKED THEY DID WITH LIN and our effed up PG's were stuck!
nixluva wrote:FoeDiddy wrote:nixluva wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:nixluva wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:nixluva wrote:You can't beat the better teams without some kind of efficient and smart offense. You can get stops and such, but the Heat, Bulls, Celtics will match us on D and we'll have to be much better at scoring the ball. ISO Melo can only get you so far against the playoff teams. I know some don't wanna hear this but it's the truth! You're not beating one of those teams in 7 games relying on ISO ball.We need a second scorer, that's why we lost.
You can't oversimplify it like that. All of those 4th qtr possessions, we ended up with poor spacing, no player or ball movement, no PnR!!! Meanwhile the Heat killed us with PnR, spread floor, Ball and Player movement.
James 29, Wade 28. Anthony 42. Pretty simple to me.
See that's the kind of thing that just gets overplayed. You think that they did it only going ISO like we did? They actually ran plays and used PnR, Spread the floor and made smart passes. I implore you to go back and look at the 4th qtr plays they ran and the ones we ran!!!!
They ran basic pick and rolls into ISO. didn't see much smart passing. Saw a lot of tough shots most humans wouldn't hit.
We panicked at end when we went down like 4 with those rushed 3s by Melo and JR. those weren't even ISO shots vs. rushed 3s early in shot clock. We might have scored more if we actually went ISO Melo on the block but I think he was tired by then.
YES, If they used a Pick then the entire point is to create a one on one match up advantage or open lane! The point is to weaken the D by taking away the help defender. Of course the player has to make a one on one or ISO shot after that. That's the logical conclusion of every PnR. The point is that the Heat were poised in their offense and ran sets and the Knicks panicked and took bad shots.
Like I said in a previous post, of course the Heat were poised they were up 8. Their objective was to milk clock. We panicked a little and rushed some three's in hopes of getting the ball back. Those quick shots by us was not from ISo....
Uptown wrote:FoeDiddy wrote:nixluva wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:nixluva wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:nixluva wrote:You can't beat the better teams without some kind of efficient and smart offense. You can get stops and such, but the Heat, Bulls, Celtics will match us on D and we'll have to be much better at scoring the ball. ISO Melo can only get you so far against the playoff teams. I know some don't wanna hear this but it's the truth! You're not beating one of those teams in 7 games relying on ISO ball.We need a second scorer, that's why we lost.
You can't oversimplify it like that. All of those 4th qtr possessions, we ended up with poor spacing, no player or ball movement, no PnR!!! Meanwhile the Heat killed us with PnR, spread floor, Ball and Player movement.
James 29, Wade 28. Anthony 42. Pretty simple to me.
See that's the kind of thing that just gets overplayed. You think that they did it only going ISO like we did? They actually ran plays and used PnR, Spread the floor and made smart passes. I implore you to go back and look at the 4th qtr plays they ran and the ones we ran!!!!
They ran basic pick and rolls into ISO. didn't see much smart passing. Saw a lot of tough shots most humans wouldn't hit.
We panicked at end when we went down like 4 with those rushed 3s by Melo and JR. those weren't even ISO shots vs. rushed 3s early in shot clock. We might have scored more if we actually went ISO Melo on the block but I think he was tired by then.
Pretty much. It was quick 3's on our half trying to battle the clock. Didn't see many Iso's from us as the clock was running out.
This isn't just about the final minutes, but even if you are talking about us being down 7 with not much time on the clock, it doesn't take long to run a play where you give your scorer help with some kind of Pick. Rushing the shot doesn't really save you much and it's a panic move. The Knicks needed to play with poise. Run a good quick BB play.
Miami is beatable, but you have to play the whole 48 minutes and have a reliable 2nd scoring option. Thats why we need Lin/Stat. Miami can be all the greatness you want to believe, but truth is, they are beatable and NY had the premium oportunity today. Unfortunately they missed, but they have only themselves to blame.
Clean wrote:Thinking after the fact I think this game can be put on Woody. He took out Shump when shump was hot on D. Brought in Fields who was having a bad game. brough in BD who was having a bad game. Had novak in to long without running a play for him in the 4th. Novak in the game without plays being run is a waste. Teams will not leave him open off of rotations to much times a game and even if we do our PGs stink and won't find him.I still didnt get that. Shump just owned Wade twice in a row and then he takes him out for the momentum killer. Woody needs to call fields out maybe that will light a fire under his ass
nixluva wrote:FoeDiddy wrote:nixluva wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:nixluva wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:nixluva wrote:You can't beat the better teams without some kind of efficient and smart offense. You can get stops and such, but the Heat, Bulls, Celtics will match us on D and we'll have to be much better at scoring the ball. ISO Melo can only get you so far against the playoff teams. I know some don't wanna hear this but it's the truth! You're not beating one of those teams in 7 games relying on ISO ball.We need a second scorer, that's why we lost.
You can't oversimplify it like that. All of those 4th qtr possessions, we ended up with poor spacing, no player or ball movement, no PnR!!! Meanwhile the Heat killed us with PnR, spread floor, Ball and Player movement.
James 29, Wade 28. Anthony 42. Pretty simple to me.
See that's the kind of thing that just gets overplayed. You think that they did it only going ISO like we did? They actually ran plays and used PnR, Spread the floor and made smart passes. I implore you to go back and look at the 4th qtr plays they ran and the ones we ran!!!!
They ran basic pick and rolls into ISO. didn't see much smart passing. Saw a lot of tough shots most humans wouldn't hit.
We panicked at end when we went down like 4 with those rushed 3s by Melo and JR. those weren't even ISO shots vs. rushed 3s early in shot clock. We might have scored more if we actually went ISO Melo on the block but I think he was tired by then.
YES, If they used a Pick then the entire point is to create a one on one match up advantage or open lane! The point is to weaken the D by taking away the help defender. Of course the player has to make a one on one or ISO shot after that. That's the logical conclusion of every PnR. The point is that the Heat were poised in their offense and ran sets and the Knicks panicked and took bad shots.
easy to be poised when you're up. Remember how horrible Heat looked against Mavs last year when they would go down in the 4th quarter. Panic of losing late in 4th causes bad rushed shots.
If we would have hit our FTs and made our open shots then offense would have been much different in late 4th. Jeffries bad defense on Bosh as Chandler sat hurt us too.
yellowboy90 wrote:I also saw we ran PnR with Davis and Chandler which lead to turnovers and bad shots at the end of the 24.
No, no, no, See our pick and rolls don't count because they ended with Iso and their Iso's do count as ball movement because they started with pick and rolls.
SHUT UP MEG!!!!!!!!!
nixluva wrote:Uptown wrote:FoeDiddy wrote:nixluva wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:nixluva wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:nixluva wrote:You can't beat the better teams without some kind of efficient and smart offense. You can get stops and such, but the Heat, Bulls, Celtics will match us on D and we'll have to be much better at scoring the ball. ISO Melo can only get you so far against the playoff teams. I know some don't wanna hear this but it's the truth! You're not beating one of those teams in 7 games relying on ISO ball.We need a second scorer, that's why we lost.
You can't oversimplify it like that. All of those 4th qtr possessions, we ended up with poor spacing, no player or ball movement, no PnR!!! Meanwhile the Heat killed us with PnR, spread floor, Ball and Player movement.
James 29, Wade 28. Anthony 42. Pretty simple to me.
See that's the kind of thing that just gets overplayed. You think that they did it only going ISO like we did? They actually ran plays and used PnR, Spread the floor and made smart passes. I implore you to go back and look at the 4th qtr plays they ran and the ones we ran!!!!
They ran basic pick and rolls into ISO. didn't see much smart passing. Saw a lot of tough shots most humans wouldn't hit.
We panicked at end when we went down like 4 with those rushed 3s by Melo and JR. those weren't even ISO shots vs. rushed 3s early in shot clock. We might have scored more if we actually went ISO Melo on the block but I think he was tired by then.
Pretty much. It was quick 3's on our half trying to battle the clock. Didn't see many Iso's from us as the clock was running out.
This isn't just about the final minutes, but even if you are talking about us being down 7 with not much time on the clock, it doesn't take long to run a play where you give your scorer help with some kind of Pick. Rushing the shot doesn't really save you much and it's a panic move. The Knicks needed to play with poise. Run a good quick BB play.
Not arguing what they needed to do, I'm telling you they didn't run ISO, down the stretch. Melo rushed the ball up and fired up a 3 ala last Sunday. Smith did the same thing. Also, their was one play when we did try to go Iso but James did a good job of pushing Melo off the block and forced him into a tough baseline jumper. Its easy to play with poise when your up 8 than when you are down 8 with just over a minute to go. We've seen this from numerous teams as they fight the clock and the opponent.
Knicksfan wrote:Foe, go kiss Heat's lower back all you wan't, but I tell you that Miami won't win the championship because of the same reason they haven't been winning much, especially against good defensive teams, in the last month. The Heat feed off their defense to get them enough possessions for easy ISO plays. They get many of those because of their D. But when facing good defensive teams, they cut their easy transition or iso baskets and make them beat them from the outside. Thats how Chicago and Boston beat them lately. We were doing just that until we stopped playing basketball in the 4th and could only throw prayers while playing matador defense. Once the Heat got the 7pt lead, they were confident enough to shoot killer jumpers, but had we kept the game close, those jumpers don't fall and we get a chance to win.Miami is beatable, but you have to play the whole 48 minutes and have a reliable 2nd scoring option. Thats why we need Lin/Stat. Miami can be all the greatness you want to believe, but truth is, they are beatable and NY had the premium oportunity today. Unfortunately they missed, but they have only themselves to blame.
+1000000000000000000 * 1000000000000000000
We cannot with though without (at least) a RELIABLE 2nd option. Right now, our most reliable second option is JR PHUCKIN Smith!
IrishKnickFan wrote:mrKnickShot wrote:Davis is just as bad as fields i mean the guy cant move anymore or penetrateClean wrote:Woody just saidh e should have stayed with Shump LOL. I think it was pretty obvious that he should have never gotten Fields back in the game. He took Shump out right after he was giving it to wade.How about BD? That guy is the biggest disaster!
Davis didn't play that bad. That charge was a bad call..he got clobbered before he even ran guy over. Add to that he is only playing out of necessity being injured. He seems to start the game playing at a good level and as minutes mount gets worse and worse. Injury effect.
FoeDiddy wrote:IrishKnickFan wrote:mrKnickShot wrote:Davis is just as bad as fields i mean the guy cant move anymore or penetrateClean wrote:Woody just saidh e should have stayed with Shump LOL. I think it was pretty obvious that he should have never gotten Fields back in the game. He took Shump out right after he was giving it to wade.How about BD? That guy is the biggest disaster!
Davis didn't play that bad. That charge was a bad call..he got clobbered before he even ran guy over. Add to that he is only playing out of necessity being injured. He seems to start the game playing at a good level and as minutes mount gets worse and worse. Injury effect.
1-6 FG 4 assists and 5 AWFUL turnovers! Very solid game - REALLY?????????????????
FoeDiddy wrote:IrishKnickFan wrote:mrKnickShot wrote:Davis is just as bad as fields i mean the guy cant move anymore or penetrateClean wrote:Woody just saidh e should have stayed with Shump LOL. I think it was pretty obvious that he should have never gotten Fields back in the game. He took Shump out right after he was giving it to wade.How about BD? That guy is the biggest disaster!
Davis didn't play that bad. That charge was a bad call..he got clobbered before he even ran guy over. Add to that he is only playing out of necessity being injured. He seems to start the game playing at a good level and as minutes mount gets worse and worse. Injury effect.
BD was really bad how many times a game does he throw the ball into the defenders hands.