Knicks · If we can get the 5m MLE restored with the appeal (page 1)

I wonder if we can offer plays like

Ilyasova
Dragic

a player option for years 3 and 4 in which would give us early bird rights or bird rights.
If they would consider coming to New York, knowing we would extend them for the larger deal.
Not sure if they would become much more marketetable with endorsements and more international notice....
Think that would probably be our best chances in landing a player like those 2.
After these rumors hit, these players are UFA, since The Bucks and Houston are under the cap, we would be able to do sign and trade offers that do not have to match.
After a S&T deal, we would be in the luxury tax era, lose the MLE and LLE, but still have the Mini MLE to use, 3m to offer a FA.
This is the best possible scenario I can come up to improving our ball club as contenders.

I am not sure if this trick will work again on Felton, difference would be player options, so they get at least a 4 year deal.
Nicolas Batum is RFA but I think Portland would match that.

After that Beasley, if Wolves don't pick up his 8.2m QO.
But I would want a team option on his 3rd year, and player option on his 4th, because of his lack of motor.

Martin posted a great article on this. The short answer is their salary situation will probably make their exception 3 million.

RonRon wrote:I wonder if we can offer plays like

Ilyasova
Dragic

a player option for years 3 and 4 in which would give us early bird rights or bird rights.
If they would consider coming to New York, knowing we would extend them for the larger deal.
Not sure if they would become much more marketetable with endorsements and more international notice....
Think that would probably be our best chances in landing a player like those 2.
After these rumors hit, these players are UFA, since The Bucks and Houston are under the cap, we would be able to do sign and trade offers that do not have to match.
After a S&T deal, we would be in the luxury tax era, lose the MLE and LLE, but still have the Mini MLE to use, 3m to offer a FA.
This is the best possible scenario I can come up to improving our ball club as contenders.

I am not sure if this trick will work again on Felton, difference would be player options, so they get at least a 4 year deal.
Nicolas Batum is RFA but I think Portland would match that.

After that Beasley, if Wolves don't pick up his 8.2m QO.
But I would want a team option on his 3rd year, and player option on his 4th, because of his lack of motor.

Lin is our PG. Not Dragic. No matter the $$ situation.
Ilyasova should get a better deal than we can offer him.

Batum was given a QO from Portland so he is gonna be matched regardless of the offer. I was eyeing him for a minute too, but he's staying up in the wilderness.

Check out the explanation why it probably won't be 5 mil in the article Martin posted.
http://ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.as...

JohnStarksFan wrote:

RonRon wrote:I wonder if we can offer plays like

Ilyasova
Dragic

a player option for years 3 and 4 in which would give us early bird rights or bird rights.
If they would consider coming to New York, knowing we would extend them for the larger deal.
Not sure if they would become much more marketetable with endorsements and more international notice....
Think that would probably be our best chances in landing a player like those 2.
After these rumors hit, these players are UFA, since The Bucks and Houston are under the cap, we would be able to do sign and trade offers that do not have to match.
After a S&T deal, we would be in the luxury tax era, lose the MLE and LLE, but still have the Mini MLE to use, 3m to offer a FA.
This is the best possible scenario I can come up to improving our ball club as contenders.

I am not sure if this trick will work again on Felton, difference would be player options, so they get at least a 4 year deal.
Nicolas Batum is RFA but I think Portland would match that.

After that Beasley, if Wolves don't pick up his 8.2m QO.
But I would want a team option on his 3rd year, and player option on his 4th, because of his lack of motor.

Lin is our PG. Not Dragic. No matter the $$ situation.
Ilyasova should get a better deal than we can offer him.

Batum was given a QO from Portland so he is gonna be matched regardless of the offer. I was eyeing him for a minute too, but he's staying up in the wilderness.

I want Dragic to be our starting SG...

We will probably ,have to move TD, let Novak go, Fields*depends on his price* and possibly let JR Smith walk *which he might anyway, if he can get a multiyear deal at the MLE*
But it is possible, much more possible than trading Amare for bag of chips.
Again, I am assuming that marketing would help these guys in New York, as they would be offered a starting position, and with opts out that would allow them to make back up some of the $ they could make from another larger contract.

RonRon wrote:

JohnStarksFan wrote:

RonRon wrote:I wonder if we can offer plays like

Ilyasova
Dragic

a player option for years 3 and 4 in which would give us early bird rights or bird rights.
If they would consider coming to New York, knowing we would extend them for the larger deal.
Not sure if they would become much more marketetable with endorsements and more international notice....
Think that would probably be our best chances in landing a player like those 2.
After these rumors hit, these players are UFA, since The Bucks and Houston are under the cap, we would be able to do sign and trade offers that do not have to match.
After a S&T deal, we would be in the luxury tax era, lose the MLE and LLE, but still have the Mini MLE to use, 3m to offer a FA.
This is the best possible scenario I can come up to improving our ball club as contenders.

I am not sure if this trick will work again on Felton, difference would be player options, so they get at least a 4 year deal.
Nicolas Batum is RFA but I think Portland would match that.

After that Beasley, if Wolves don't pick up his 8.2m QO.
But I would want a team option on his 3rd year, and player option on his 4th, because of his lack of motor.

Lin is our PG. Not Dragic. No matter the $$ situation.
Ilyasova should get a better deal than we can offer him.

Batum was given a QO from Portland so he is gonna be matched regardless of the offer. I was eyeing him for a minute too, but he's staying up in the wilderness.

I want Dragic to be our starting SG...

We will probably ,have to move TD, let Novak go, Fields*depends on his price* and possibly let JR Smith walk *which he might anyway, if he can get a multiyear deal at the MLE*
But it is possible, much more possible than trading Amare for bag of chips.
Again, I am assuming that marketing would help these guys in New York, as they would be offered a starting position, and with opts out that would allow them to make back up some of the $ they could make from another larger contract.

I envy your ability to dream recklessly RonRon.

Here is the breakdown from the SI article Martin posted. Again, it looks like the knicks get 3 mil to use.

A win for the union, then, would appear to be a significant victory for the Knicks. And it is. But it is perhaps not as big as it would first appear.

Here’s why: Under the terms of the new CBA, any team that uses the full mid-level exception cannot end with a payroll more than $4 million higher than the luxury-tax line. Because the tax line is expected to stay around $70 million, that hard cap would kick in at $74 million. The rule is designed to discourage spending and equalize payrolls.

Let’s follow the math. The Knicks have $59.4 million committed to six players next season: Anthony, Stoudemire, Tyson Chandler, Toney Douglas, Renaldo Balkman and Iman Shumpert. Pretend the union’s victory in the Bird Rights case is upheld on appeal, and the Knicks offer Lin the maximum allowable $5 million starting salary. (No team is allowed to offer Lin a salary for next season larger than that, for reasons I won’t get into. If you’re interested, read this.)

That contract for Lin increases the payroll to $64.4 million. Tack on the full $5 million mid-level exception for Free Agent X, and the bill comes to $69.4 million for just eight players. As you can see, the math is getting tight. In this scenario, the Knicks have $4.6 million until they hit the new “hard cap” level, and they still have four roster spots to fill. And we haven’t even dealt with Novak or shooting guards J.R. Smith (who has a $2.5 million player option) and Landry Fields (a restricted free agent).

But wait! The CBA allows teams to disregard that hard cap $4 million above the tax line, provided they follow certain conditions. Among them: offering only a smaller version of the mid-level exception rather than the whole thing. Teams can offer that “mini” mid-level, worth about $3 million per year, and spend as much as they’d like.

This is a good news/bad news thing for the Knicks. The bad news, again, is that in practical terms, a favorable ruling in the Bird Rights case would really only open the “mini” mid-level and not the big one. The difference amounts to about $2 million per year in salary. That won’t matter to some free agents, but it will to others, especially if a team with access to the full mid-level (or just cap room) makes a competing offer.

JohnStarksFan wrote:

RonRon wrote:

JohnStarksFan wrote:

RonRon wrote:I wonder if we can offer plays like

Ilyasova
Dragic

a player option for years 3 and 4 in which would give us early bird rights or bird rights.
If they would consider coming to New York, knowing we would extend them for the larger deal.
Not sure if they would become much more marketetable with endorsements and more international notice....
Think that would probably be our best chances in landing a player like those 2.
After these rumors hit, these players are UFA, since The Bucks and Houston are under the cap, we would be able to do sign and trade offers that do not have to match.
After a S&T deal, we would be in the luxury tax era, lose the MLE and LLE, but still have the Mini MLE to use, 3m to offer a FA.
This is the best possible scenario I can come up to improving our ball club as contenders.

I am not sure if this trick will work again on Felton, difference would be player options, so they get at least a 4 year deal.
Nicolas Batum is RFA but I think Portland would match that.

After that Beasley, if Wolves don't pick up his 8.2m QO.
But I would want a team option on his 3rd year, and player option on his 4th, because of his lack of motor.

Lin is our PG. Not Dragic. No matter the $$ situation.
Ilyasova should get a better deal than we can offer him.

Batum was given a QO from Portland so he is gonna be matched regardless of the offer. I was eyeing him for a minute too, but he's staying up in the wilderness.

I want Dragic to be our starting SG...

We will probably ,have to move TD, let Novak go, Fields*depends on his price* and possibly let JR Smith walk *which he might anyway, if he can get a multiyear deal at the MLE*
But it is possible, much more possible than trading Amare for bag of chips.
Again, I am assuming that marketing would help these guys in New York, as they would be offered a starting position, and with opts out that would allow them to make back up some of the $ they could make from another larger contract.

I envy your ability to dream recklessly RonRon.

Haha. Word.

Ron I know you bleed blue and orange as much as anyone else but Dragic ain't happening. We got a $3M MLE.

I hate the NBA salary cap because of the huge raises the players get. If the salary was just the first year salary times 4 years it wouldnt be so bad. Melo will want an extension at the end of this deal and what he will get 25 million a year. How are we going to build a team like that.

im with ronron...i would love to get dragic (shhhh i even prefer him over lin...i know thats BLASPHEMY)...but theres no WAY we can afford him...hes gonna ask for AT LEAST 7mil

Lost in the midst of the novels you write

The Knicks’ Salary Situation This Off-Season
Jun 24th, 2012 by Dan L.
Arbitrator Kenneth Dam’s recent decision to side with the NBAPA against the NBA in declining to reset the bird rights clock for players claimed off waivers was a coup for the Knicks. If it stands on appeal, the Knicks will be able to match any offer for Jeremy Lin, and likely Steve Novak too, while potentially still retaining the ability to use their full midlevel exception of $5,000,000 per season.
If the Knicks do use their full midlevel exception, the strictures of the new collective bargaining agreement will impose a hard cap at $74,000,000, which the team could not exceed this season under any circumstance. Alternatively, the Knicks can offer the “mini-midlevel” of $3,000,000, and exceed the salary cap to sign veteran minimum players, if necessary. Keep in mind that teams are required to have 12 players on their active roster, and 1 on their inactive roster.
With some help today from @JADubin5, @JonKnicksFan, and, previously, @bnr1986 and @sbs0311, I’ve fleshed out a couple of scenarios for your consideration:

Both of these scenarios contain a few assumptions, and here they are:
* Under scenario 2 there is no way the Knicks can keep Landry Fields because the minimum contract amount for 2 year veterans will not fit under the hard-cap. Instead the Knicks would have to fill their roster with undrafted rookies.
**This scenario assumes that J.R. Smith opts out and the Knicks do not bring him back. It also assumes that the Knicks find a team willing to take Toney Douglas (and probably cash) in return for a trade exception. Both of these assumptions are dicey but without them, it’s pretty much impossible for the Knicks to be able to utilize the full MLE.
***The salary figures for Carmelo Anthony (and the rest of the roster) come from Sham Sports. But it’s worth noting that HoopsHype lists Carmelo’s contract at about a $1,000,000 less than Sham Sports does.

How we can keep JR and sign a full MLE starting at 5m, with player options at year 3 and 4.
===============================================================================================

So look at scenario 2, JR Smith with a 20% raise is less than Novak's 3m. So just substitute Novak with JR Smith.
This article assumes that we have Novak's early bird rights but we don't because he signed a 1 year deal on his last deal.

Fields would have to be traded for a 2nd round pick or for cash considerations
and
If we trade TD's contract like we did with Turiaf would be the key.

I don't know if we would have what is left from the salary cap, to use as our LLE so we can sign a player for 2 years.
We could probably sign 2 players that go undrafted if part of the LLE we can still use what is left from the LLE, for 2 years to get early bird rights for them.
We can still sign veteran minimum deals AFTER the MLE signin and LLE for undrafted players for 2 years.

We should have never cut Balkman, and trade him along with TD, this summer.
That way we can still trade his salary like we did for Turiaf.
For instance for Dragic, we could have traded, Balkman, TD, Jordan, Jorts, and future picks/cash, if he forced his way out by signing for the MLE with us.
That way, we would still have the lower MLE at 3m to use, after acquiring Ilyasova or Dragic.

The NY Post has reported that sources, presumably the Knicks, have informed it that economic projections say that the NBA salary cap will grow to about $60-$61 million for the 2012-13 season. The salary cap for 2011-12 was set at $58,044,000 in negotiations over the collective bargaining agreement. Remember that the exact number of the cap relies upon a projection of basketball related income and is not set until July before each season. I’ll use the $60M in this post as a nice square number. [↩]

http://passporthoops.com/2012/02/23/2012...

I am not sure if this affects the luxury tax payroll to go up as well.
Just showing that adding full MLE at 5m, is possible, if Stern does not screw us over.

If we can't find a MLE worthy person to use on one person, maybe sign 2 players with it.
If we don't use all of it, we can use some of that money to use on the BAE as well, I think we are about 500k short.

so in a nutshell....???

i just wanna know if we can add:

MLE: foye (3mil)
LLE: Odom (3mil)
minivet: camby (1-2mil)

add keep JR (2.8mil), novak and lin

-im sure that assumes trading/dumping fields and/or TD which im ok with

callmened wrote:so in a nutshell....???

i just wanna know if we can add:

MLE: foye (3mil)
LLE: Odom (3mil)
minivet: camby (1-2mil)

add keep JR (2.8mil), novak and lin

-im sure that assumes trading/dumping fields and/or TD which im ok with

no, read the chart and figure it out, its really not complicated.
I don't know where you get 2 3mill exemptions from.
You can divide the 5m exemption in to 2 but you can't add a million on top of it.

callmened wrote:so in a nutshell....???

i just wanna know if we can add:

MLE: foye (3mil)
LLE: Odom (3mil)
minivet: camby (1-2mil)

add keep JR (2.8mil), novak and lin

-im sure that assumes trading/dumping fields and/or TD which im ok with

you don't get both the mle and lle. you get the full $5mil mle if under the cap. $3mil lle if over

gotcha...numbers and math frighten me so i tend to stay away from those...lol...thanks for the breakdown!

RonRon wrote:The NY Post has reported that sources, presumably the Knicks, have informed it that economic projections say that the NBA salary cap will grow to about $60-$61 million for the 2012-13 season. The salary cap for 2011-12 was set at $58,044,000 in negotiations over the collective bargaining agreement. Remember that the exact number of the cap relies upon a projection of basketball related income and is not set until July before each season. I’ll use the $60M in this post as a nice square number. [↩]

http://passporthoops.com/2012/02/23/2012...

I am not sure if this affects the luxury tax payroll to go up as well.
Just showing that adding full MLE at 5m, is possible, if Stern does not screw us over.

If we can't find a MLE worthy person to use on one person, maybe sign 2 players with it.
If we don't use all of it, we can use some of that money to use on the LLE as well, I think we are about 500k short.

being able to split the full $5m MLE between 2 players would be huge if true. Would prob be enough for kidd, foye & odom. There is no one worth the full MLE other than Nash and we need a lot of role players not just 1 as evident by what the Heat did to us

when I said LLE, I thought it was the BAE...

whats the BAE? is that what we can offer Jr @ $2.8mil

Bi Annual Exemption, at 1.6 -1.8m, 2 year deal.

What Matt Barnes signed to go to the Lakers 2 years ago.

Think it is actually closer to 1.9m now....