Knicks · Knicks will be a very competitive team in the east (page 6)

We should just make an official "I hate the Knicks for trading or failing to re-sign Gallo/Wilson/Lin" thread. At this point you can't even discuss the current team without being forced to discuss Gallo/Lin/Chandler/etc. It's disgusting.

VCoug wrote:

tkf wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

tkf wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

3G4G wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

3G4G wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:Competitive basketball can be maintained for the next 6-7yrs.

We had that with the previous team except more flexibility

Not guranteed, but it could have been. Ironic you would be banking on the same PG and PF that you don't think will get it done today. The organization went in another direction so be it. You can cry over it or you can move on.

Im all for moving on from the past but you have to admit that we might have only 2-3 years to have very good seasons then its back to the drawing boards. also we havent exactly had a great history in the draft

Wasn't banking on Felton or Amar'e per say but was banking on maybe turning Felton/Amar'e and or picks/AR//Fields/Douglas/ into the missing/better pieces. We had a winning record despite all the injuries/trade rumors/unfamiliarity/new style of play. I also wanted the coach swapped out a long time ago not last year.

Don't even try and flip this either. It's the other way around. Most fans said the team was going nowhere which had Felton/Amar'e, therefore the team needed a facelift. It needed to STARFUDGE at all costs no matter what. I always begged to differ.

I was fine with the team going forward since they only played about 40gms together factoring injuries. I wanted more games played for an official data analysis and what the team looked like in the playoffs. Surely they could have accomplished getting swept by Boston 4-0. What do you think?

When Felton was traded he was being talked about something fierce. Matter of fact most fans were disgusted with Felton's point play because they felt he iced the kids out too much, playing patty cake with Amar'e in the PNR.

Amare was not going to be moved or turned into anything. Once he was signed he was a knick until his contract ran out so automatically there is a flaw in that plan. Gallo and Wilson were also going to be re-upped, Fields would look to be reupped the following yr. The team needed a superstar to put along side of Gallo, Wilson, Fields, Amare, Felton at eiher Center or SG as well as adding in more depth in order for it to be a championship calibre team. The odds of that superstar falling to the Knicks lap was slim to none. I'm guessing the Knicks org felt they can go for the superstar like Melo now and then look to find the Gallo, Wilson and Felton type pieces later on.

I'm guessing they felt it is a lot harder to land a guy like Melo then it is to land guys like Gallo and Chandler etc..

Denver basically has Gallo, Chandler, Mozgov, Lawson, our draft picks, added Iggy and Mcgee. Should I be expecting them to be chasing a championship?

true, superstars don't fall into anyone's lap at all.... so you have to be smart and patient on how you build your team... I keep hearing melo referred to as a superstar, well how is he any more of a star than amare? this is what I don't get.. we didn't get a superstar in amare, but a guy who at one time was playing near elite level ball, but not a superstar( and amare is one of my favorite players in the league)... we didn't get a superstar in melo either, but a guy who is a great streak scorer.... either way, the knicks gave up a lot and still didn't accomplish what dolan intended to do... I also keep hearing it is easy to replace gallo and chandler, but we have yet to find the young talent to replace these guys.... brewer, Jr smith, prigioni, and a host of 40 year old guys are not equal replacements.... we did get a mulligan with lin, but botched that one up....

Novak isn't a better shooter than Gallo and Shumpert isn't a potentially better all around player than Wilson Chandler?

Chuck I like Novak but you have to be fair Gallo is a much better player than Novak. Novak can shoot but once you defend his shot he cant do anything.

yea, chuck tried to pull one over on us.. he took the one trait novak has and tried to use it to prove his point.. for that matter, novak should be our starting SF, right, I mean he shoots better than carmelo hands down...

Novak should be in the starting lineup, but over Amare not Melo. That would balance our starting lineup and allow Amare to do what he does without Melo and/or Tyson getting in the way.

I tend to agree with that. I would pair Felton with Amare (attach em at the hips) and let Kidd co-exist with Melo, with Novak to spread the floor. I think that Kidd knows better how to play with guys that need the ball to be effective and yet still keep other players on the court involved. I just wish Novak wasn't such a defensive liability.

tkf wrote:

Knixkik wrote:The Knicks have proven its a lot easier to replace role players than add a star player. When we traded for Melo there was major concern that the cupboard was bare outside of Melo, Stoudemire, Billups, and Fields. Now the Knicks still have Melo and Stoudemire but have added Chandler, Camby, Felton, Kidd, Smith, Shumpert, Novak, and Brewer as major supporting players. I would say it is very easy to replace the role players and more important to build thru the stars first given this example. Smith, Shumpert, and Novak collectively bring more to the table than Gallo and Chandler did.

actually we have proven neither point.. we don't have the same quality role players we had and we still don't have a star player on this team... a legitimate star....

You can say whatever about Melo being not being a star, but only player we have had better in the past 30 years is Ewing. Melo is a top 15 player in the league. No he's not Lebron, Kobe, etc, but he's a star in this league and an elite talent. There was no way to get a better player nor will there be in the near future. If your 2nd and 3rd best players are Gallo and Chandler you just aren't winning anything. And Shumpert has proven to have better potential than those 2 already. If you draft well in the mid to late 1st round, you will get players as good or better than Gallo and Chandler. You won't get players as good as Melo. Shumpert will be better than Gallo and Chandler.

Knixkik wrote:

tkf wrote:

Knixkik wrote:The Knicks have proven its a lot easier to replace role players than add a star player. When we traded for Melo there was major concern that the cupboard was bare outside of Melo, Stoudemire, Billups, and Fields. Now the Knicks still have Melo and Stoudemire but have added Chandler, Camby, Felton, Kidd, Smith, Shumpert, Novak, and Brewer as major supporting players. I would say it is very easy to replace the role players and more important to build thru the stars first given this example. Smith, Shumpert, and Novak collectively bring more to the table than Gallo and Chandler did.

actually we have proven neither point.. we don't have the same quality role players we had and we still don't have a star player on this team... a legitimate star....

You can say whatever about Melo being not being a star, but only player we have had better in the past 30 years is Ewing. Melo is a top 15 player in the league. No he's not Lebron, Kobe, etc, but he's a star in this league and an elite talent. There was no way to get a better player nor will there be in the near future. If your 2nd and 3rd best players are Gallo and Chandler you just aren't winning anything. And Shumpert has proven to have better potential than those 2 already. If you draft well in the mid to late 1st round, you will get players as good or better than Gallo and Chandler. You won't get players as good as Melo. Shumpert will be better than Gallo and Chandler.

Great post.

tkf wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

3G4G wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

3G4G wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:Competitive basketball can be maintained for the next 6-7yrs.

We had that with the previous team except more flexibility

Not guranteed, but it could have been. Ironic you would be banking on the same PG and PF that you don't think will get it done today. The organization went in another direction so be it. You can cry over it or you can move on.

Im all for moving on from the past but you have to admit that we might have only 2-3 years to have very good seasons then its back to the drawing boards. also we havent exactly had a great history in the draft

Wasn't banking on Felton or Amar'e per say but was banking on maybe turning Felton/Amar'e and or picks/AR//Fields/Douglas/ into the missing/better pieces. We had a winning record despite all the injuries/trade rumors/unfamiliarity/new style of play. I also wanted the coach swapped out a long time ago not last year.

Don't even try and flip this either. It's the other way around. Most fans said the team was going nowhere which had Felton/Amar'e, therefore the team needed a facelift. It needed to STARFUDGE at all costs no matter what. I always begged to differ.

I was fine with the team going forward since they only played about 40gms together factoring injuries. I wanted more games played for an official data analysis and what the team looked like in the playoffs. Surely they could have accomplished getting swept by Boston 4-0. What do you think?

When Felton was traded he was being talked about something fierce. Matter of fact most fans were disgusted with Felton's point play because they felt he iced the kids out too much, playing patty cake with Amar'e in the PNR.

Amare was not going to be moved or turned into anything. Once he was signed he was a knick until his contract ran out so automatically there is a flaw in that plan. Gallo and Wilson were also going to be re-upped, Fields would look to be reupped the following yr. The team needed a superstar to put along side of Gallo, Wilson, Fields, Amare, Felton at eiher Center or SG as well as adding in more depth in order for it to be a championship calibre team. The odds of that superstar falling to the Knicks lap was slim to none. I'm guessing the Knicks org felt they can go for the superstar like Melo now and then look to find the Gallo, Wilson and Felton type pieces later on.

I'm guessing they felt it is a lot harder to land a guy like Melo then it is to land guys like Gallo and Chandler etc..

Denver basically has Gallo, Chandler, Mozgov, Lawson, our draft picks, added Iggy and Mcgee. Should I be expecting them to be chasing a championship?

true, superstars don't fall into anyone's lap at all.... so you have to be smart and patient on how you build your team... I keep hearing melo referred to as a superstar, well how is he any more of a star than amare? this is what I don't get.. we didn't get a superstar in amare, but a guy who at one time was playing near elite level ball, but not a superstar( and amare is one of my favorite players in the league)... we didn't get a superstar in melo either, but a guy who is a great streak scorer.... either way, the knicks gave up a lot and still didn't accomplish what dolan intended to do... I also keep hearing it is easy to replace gallo and chandler, but we have yet to find the young talent to replace these guys.... brewer, Jr smith, prigioni, and a host of 40 year old guys are not equal replacements.... we did get a mulligan with lin, but botched that one up....

Listen, im like you and the majority of sports fans across the world. We like to see players that we drafted ourself groomed and develop under our own eyes built into championship contenders. But I also know that neither way guarantees success or championships. Once Gallo, Chandler, Fields got new contracts the honey moon would be over and expectations would start to set in. Now the same cap situation you were looking at thinking you can add in all these star players and talent to build a great team is no longer there at the same time there is no guarantee that Gallo, Chandler, Fields, or Mozgov take the nessesary steps in growth.

As for Melo and Amare. I'm pretty sure Melo demonstrated that when he went 18-6 without Lin or Amare. Melo also 2 yrs younger and doesn't have any major injury concerns to worry about thus far. Amare has never shown to be as clutch as Melo has been thrugh out his career and Melo has a WAY more versitile offensive game then Amare from either the post or periemter. Melo may be slightly better defensively as well and a better passer though neither are great. With Melo we took a shot at a 26 yr old star talent in hopes that during his prime he elevate to another level. Its not like Melo was ran out of Denver or is coming off of major injury concerns. Or was 32 yrs old.

Melo hasn't consistently played like a superstar for us the last 2 seasons that we can all agree with. But at the same time I don't feel either he or MDA together were in a position to succeed together.

Jr Smith is a comparable player to Gallo and Chandler. Gallo and Chandler have a better feel for the game but Jr produces at a simular level with less mins and a lesser contract. Tyson Chandler was added through the Gallo-Melo trade and is arguably a better player then Gallo and Wilson. Felton has been brought back.

Melo, Jr Smith, Novak, Tyson is an upgrade over Gallo, Wilson, Mozgov, Douglas, the draft picks are yet to be determined.

Melo, Jr Smith, Novak, Tyson is an upgrade over Gallo, Wilson, Mozgov, Douglas, the draft picks are yet to be determined.

Believe it!

screw Gallo and co. We had Lin fall in our lap and let him go for nothing. Its not like we traded Lin for a guy like Melo. We just let a major asset walk for absolutely nothing

gunsnewing wrote:screw Gallo and co. We had Lin fall in our lap and let him go for nothing. Its not like we traded Lin for a guy like Melo. We just let a major asset walk for absolutely nothing

I loved Lin and what he brought to the Knicks. When the Knicks traded Hill and Jeffries to the Rockets I started going to Cluth City, a forum for Rocket fans that rivals UK in the posters passion and intelligence. I check in there now to see news about Royce White, Douglas and Lin. Douglas has had great reviews so far. This was from a poster there regarding Lin.

Originally Posted by tefunk
McHale on 790 said Lin is not at 100% yet.

To clarify, McHale said that Lin's knee had a "reaction" as a result of recent training sessions and that they are going to be careful going forward. I think they are just being careful with their newest face of the franchise

http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php...
I am not wishing Lin any ill will but I think the Rockets contract offer was over the top and I hate the new cba. After day 1 of their camp guys on Clutch City were complaining about Lin turnovers. Not trying to trash the guy but maybe soften the blow.

Wouldn't surprise me at all. I mean it is the Knicks doctors who worked on his knee after all. And people not just idiotic fans but people in the media who questioned his motives for not playing in a meaningless Heat series

Followed the thread farther and Lin looked really good in the latest scrimage footage they posted.

“@AlTrautwig: Hey @alanhahn…tell us the most impressive thing you’ve seen at Greenburgh.” Collective focus. Loose but businesslike approach.

CrushAlot wrote:

Melo, Jr Smith, Novak, Tyson is an upgrade over Gallo, Wilson, Mozgov, Douglas, the draft picks are yet to be determined.

Believe it!

Yes they are better However we still ahvent seen good results yet so hopefully that will change

IrishKnickFan wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Melo, Jr Smith, Novak, Tyson is an upgrade over Gallo, Wilson, Mozgov, Douglas, the draft picks are yet to be determined.

Believe it!

Yes they are better However we still ahvent seen good results yet so hopefully that will change

I have to disagree. 18-6 was the start of the new regime. Injuries were horrific but the Knicks also were eliminated by the world champs.

CrushAlot wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Melo, Jr Smith, Novak, Tyson is an upgrade over Gallo, Wilson, Mozgov, Douglas, the draft picks are yet to be determined.

Believe it!

Yes they are better However we still ahvent seen good results yet so hopefully that will change

I have to disagree. 18-6 was the start of the new regime. Injuries were horrific but the Knicks also were eliminated by the world champs.

Once agian you jump to conclusions. I menat PAST results. I hva e said many times i think this team this year will be the best since 2000

IrishKnickFan wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Melo, Jr Smith, Novak, Tyson is an upgrade over Gallo, Wilson, Mozgov, Douglas, the draft picks are yet to be determined.

Believe it!

Yes they are better However we still ahvent seen good results yet so hopefully that will change

I have to disagree. 18-6 was the start of the new regime. Injuries were horrific but the Knicks also were eliminated by the world champs.

Once agian you jump to conclusions. I menat PAST results. I hva e said many times i think this team this year will be the best since 2000

Um, I think I am getting it. Are you saying we saw good results now because your initial post said that we haven't seen good results.

CrushAlot wrote:Followed the thread farther and Lin looked really good in the latest scrimage footage they posted.

shocker. He will average close to 20 & 10 and Knicks fans will morn after being eliminated in the 2nd round by not Miami but Boston

CrushAlot wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Melo, Jr Smith, Novak, Tyson is an upgrade over Gallo, Wilson, Mozgov, Douglas, the draft picks are yet to be determined.

Believe it!

Yes they are better However we still ahvent seen good results yet so hopefully that will change

I have to disagree. 18-6 was the start of the new regime. Injuries were horrific but the Knicks also were eliminated by the world champs.

Once agian you jump to conclusions. I menat PAST results. I hva e said many times i think this team this year will be the best since 2000

Um, I think I am getting it. Are you saying we saw good results now because your initial post said that we haven't seen good results.

I think we are gonna have a great season. I think melo will have a MVP type year

CrushAlot wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Melo, Jr Smith, Novak, Tyson is an upgrade over Gallo, Wilson, Mozgov, Douglas, the draft picks are yet to be determined.

Believe it!

Yes they are better However we still ahvent seen good results yet so hopefully that will change

I have to disagree. 18-6 was the start of the new regime. Injuries were horrific but the Knicks also were eliminated by the world champs.

Once agian you jump to conclusions. I menat PAST results. I hva e said many times i think this team this year will be the best since 2000

Um, I think I am getting it. Are you saying we saw good results now because your initial post said that we haven't seen good results.

perhaps the entire season+post season is the type of return he wants to see given 2000 ended in a ecf run?

sidsanders wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

IrishKnickFan wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Melo, Jr Smith, Novak, Tyson is an upgrade over Gallo, Wilson, Mozgov, Douglas, the draft picks are yet to be determined.

Believe it!

Yes they are better However we still ahvent seen good results yet so hopefully that will change

I have to disagree. 18-6 was the start of the new regime. Injuries were horrific but the Knicks also were eliminated by the world champs.

Once agian you jump to conclusions. I menat PAST results. I hva e said many times i think this team this year will be the best since 2000

Um, I think I am getting it. Are you saying we saw good results now because your initial post said that we haven't seen good results.

perhaps the entire season+post season is the type of return he wants to see given 2000 ended in a ecf run?

Exactly. Also i was referring to 2010-2011 results which ended badly. I think Crush just misinterpreted me which happens to us all so no big deal

gunsnewing wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Followed the thread farther and Lin looked really good in the latest scrimage footage they posted.

shocker. He will average close to 20 & 10 and Knicks fans will morn after being eliminated in the 2nd round by not Miami but Boston

Scrimmage lol against a sh*tty Rockets bench r u kidding me.

Mray20 wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Followed the thread farther and Lin looked really good in the latest scrimage footage they posted.

shocker. He will average close to 20 & 10 and Knicks fans will morn after being eliminated in the 2nd round by not Miami but Boston

Scrimmage lol against a sh*tty Rockets bench r u kidding me.

No. They are as passionate as UK posters. An earlier post on that thread cited an interview where McHale talked about Lin's knee not being 100%. He had a great scrimmage the next day.