This will be the end of Obama--he has almost no chance imho to stop the avalanche started tonight. Watch the polls flip tomorrow and never look back. Im very surprised to not hear Obama slam George Bush over and over---and commenting that we were on the brink of system failure by a Republican candidate and it took 4 years just to get us into position to get back on track--do we want to go back there---nope he was defensive and looked frazzled--he got killed and this debate will create tremendous momentum for Romney that will be hard to stop in just 5 weeks.
I was shocked. Body language had a lot to do with it. Romney kept his eyes on Obama. Obama was looking down like a sad tired puppy. Kinda let Romney walk all over him. That said 3 more to go!
Romney did win this debate but his threshold was much lower than Obama...He just had to adsorb the onslaught and keep standing...It all depends on what voters are looking for...If it's about substance, well Romney couldn't spell out how his 8 trillion USD of proposals of added debt will be paid for...He couldn't really lay out the details that people has been accusing him of over the last 6 months...Question is, are voters really paying this close attention???..Obama was all over the place..Info overload and I'm quite surprised he didn't go after the 47% gaft...Obama and his team thought it was better to play rope a dope being ahead in the polls...Is this a game changer, I doubt it, but it did make Romney look on equal footing as the President, which is important going forward...He won't be dismissed...People will listen to what he has to say...But if people are really undecided and wanted to see who can take this economy out of this rut, can u really say that Romeny sold his case, No...He was selling the same stuff we have been listening to the last 32 yeas from the GOP...In this talented Country of really smart people, not one person has any new ideas???...Should our bottom line for a President be someone who can waddle through a debate and stay upright or someone we can have a beer with???..The best I saw one correspondent put it tonight was that Obama had a chance to close the race and he didn't...On that he lost...If that's the standards the Presidency are being judged these days, well, what can I say...That said, Romney should prepare for attacks in the next debate because they will be coming fast and furious, no pun intended for you political junkies...
holfresh wrote:Romney did win this debate but his threshold was much lower than Obama...He just had to adsorb the onslaught and keep standing...It all depends on what voters are looking for...If it's about substance, well Romney couldn't spell out how his 8 trillion USD of proposals of added debt will be paid for...He couldn't really lay out the details that people has been accusing him of over the last 6 months...Question is are voters really paying this close attention???..Obama was all over the place..Info overload and I'm quite surprised he didn't go after the 47% gaft...Obama and his team thought it was better to play rope a dope being ahead in the polls...Is this a game changer, I doubt it, but it did make Romney look an equal footing as the President, which is important going forward...He won't be dismissed...People will listen to what he has to say...But if people are really undecided and wanted to see who can take this economy out of this rut, can u really say that Romeny sold his case, No...He was selling the same stuff we have been listening to the last 32 yeas from the GOP...In this talented Country of really smart people, not one person has any new ideas???...Should our bottom line for a President be someone who can waddle through a debate and stay upright or someone we can have a beer with???..The best I saw one correspondent put it tonight was that Obama had a chance to close the race tonight and he didn't...One that he lost...If that's the standards the Presidency are being judged these days, well, what can I say...That said, Romney should prepare for attacks in the next debate because they will be coming fast and furious, no pun intended for you political junkies...
It will be hard for Obama. Anything he says he's going to do--Romney can simply say well youve had 4 years to do that--here is what I can do better. It also helps that Mass is a state he can point to for success(even though its a majority of Democrats)
Papabear Says
Who ever is advising Obama did a bad job. I think there will be a answer to this madness. The key is that he refuse to raise the taxes on the one percent. Romney may get a bounce or maybe he won't.
BRIGGS wrote:holfresh wrote:Romney did win this debate but his threshold was much lower than Obama...He just had to adsorb the onslaught and keep standing...It all depends on what voters are looking for...If it's about substance, well Romney couldn't spell out how his 8 trillion USD of proposals of added debt will be paid for...He couldn't really lay out the details that people has been accusing him of over the last 6 months...Question is are voters really paying this close attention???..Obama was all over the place..Info overload and I'm quite surprised he didn't go after the 47% gaft...Obama and his team thought it was better to play rope a dope being ahead in the polls...Is this a game changer, I doubt it, but it did make Romney look an equal footing as the President, which is important going forward...He won't be dismissed...People will listen to what he has to say...But if people are really undecided and wanted to see who can take this economy out of this rut, can u really say that Romeny sold his case, No...He was selling the same stuff we have been listening to the last 32 yeas from the GOP...In this talented Country of really smart people, not one person has any new ideas???...Should our bottom line for a President be someone who can waddle through a debate and stay upright or someone we can have a beer with???..The best I saw one correspondent put it tonight was that Obama had a chance to close the race tonight and he didn't...One that he lost...If that's the standards the Presidency are being judged these days, well, what can I say...That said, Romney should prepare for attacks in the next debate because they will be coming fast and furious, no pun intended for you political junkies...
It will be hard for Obama. Anything he says he's going to do--Romney can simply say well youve had 4 years to do that--here is what I can do better. It also helps that Mass is a state he can point to for success(even though its a majority of Democrats)
Briggs, you also said (4 years ago) that Obama was in major trouble once Sarah Palin came in and stole the show for a week. So, I was glad to see you post this 
I think Papabear got it right...I think a huge point tonight that went unnoticed by the pundits was when Romney waffled on compromise on revenues...For me that's huge...I think the same for independents...He toe the GOP line of no revenues which is a mathematical impossibility if we are to do anything on the deficit...At least that's what polls are saying independents are looking at..Who knows...
holfresh wrote:Romney did win this debate but his threshold was much lower than Obama...He just had to adsorb the onslaught and keep standing...It all depends on what voters are looking for...If it's about substance, well Romney couldn't spell out how his 8 trillion USD of proposals of added debt will be paid for...He couldn't really lay out the details that people has been accusing him of over the last 6 months...Question is, are voters really paying this close attention???..Obama was all over the place..Info overload and I'm quite surprised he didn't go after the 47% gaft...Obama and his team thought it was better to play rope a dope being ahead in the polls...Is this a game changer, I doubt it, but it did make Romney look an equal footing as the President, which is important going forward...He won't be dismissed...People will listen to what he has to say...But if people are really undecided and wanted to see who can take this economy out of this rut, can u really say that Romeny sold his case, No...He was selling the same stuff we have been listening to the last 32 yeas from the GOP...In this talented Country of really smart people, not one person has any new ideas???...Should our bottom line for a President be someone who can waddle through a debate and stay upright or someone we can have a beer with???..The best I saw one correspondent put it tonight was that Obama had a chance to close the race and he didn't...On that he lost...If that's the standards the Presidency are being judged these days, well, what can I say...That said, Romney should prepare for attacks in the next debate because they will be coming fast and furious, no pun intended for you political junkies...
Great post holfresh. We live in a country of fox news and honey boo boo; they're not exactly knowledge seekers.
Romney was more aggressive but he wasn't being truthful and that's gonna come back to hurt him. He basically lied as usual about his tax plan. He really won't change the dynamics of the race in the key swing states enough to win. Romney is trying to run away from everything he's said he stood for. Now all of a sudden he doesn't have a 20% across the board tax cut that will cost 5 Trillion? He suddenly is for pretty much all the good things in Obamacare and he loves teachers now. Dude was saying he was gonna repeal all of Obamacare and that we didn't need more teachers. Now he's changing up when he's on national TV. FAKE ASS LIAR!!!
over the next few weeks and the next debate he's gonna pay for that as well as the 47% comments. Once fact checkers go thru all the stuff he said, which contradicts what he's been saying all year, it's gonna show how fake Romney is.
TheloniusMonk wrote:BRIGGS wrote:holfresh wrote:Romney did win this debate but his threshold was much lower than Obama...He just had to adsorb the onslaught and keep standing...It all depends on what voters are looking for...If it's about substance, well Romney couldn't spell out how his 8 trillion USD of proposals of added debt will be paid for...He couldn't really lay out the details that people has been accusing him of over the last 6 months...Question is are voters really paying this close attention???..Obama was all over the place..Info overload and I'm quite surprised he didn't go after the 47% gaft...Obama and his team thought it was better to play rope a dope being ahead in the polls...Is this a game changer, I doubt it, but it did make Romney look an equal footing as the President, which is important going forward...He won't be dismissed...People will listen to what he has to say...But if people are really undecided and wanted to see who can take this economy out of this rut, can u really say that Romeny sold his case, No...He was selling the same stuff we have been listening to the last 32 yeas from the GOP...In this talented Country of really smart people, not one person has any new ideas???...Should our bottom line for a President be someone who can waddle through a debate and stay upright or someone we can have a beer with???..The best I saw one correspondent put it tonight was that Obama had a chance to close the race tonight and he didn't...One that he lost...If that's the standards the Presidency are being judged these days, well, what can I say...That said, Romney should prepare for attacks in the next debate because they will be coming fast and furious, no pun intended for you political junkies...
It will be hard for Obama. Anything he says he's going to do--Romney can simply say well youve had 4 years to do that--here is what I can do better. It also helps that Mass is a state he can point to for success(even though its a majority of Democrats)
Briggs, you also said (4 years ago) that Obama was in major trouble once Sarah Palin came in and stole the show for a week. So, I was glad to see you post this
Excellent memory--I absolutely said that. I based it on a couple of points--probably the best piece I ever witnessed of Sarah Palin before she was chosen on C Span in an Alaskan caucus where she was impressive(remember Alaska is a state where you pay no taxes and actually get state surplus back) and the fact that she was a female. What followed was getting to understand that Palin was no where near ready--nor likely ever be ready--to hold such a high position in the government and we'd all be in trouble if she was indeed there and something happened to John Mccain. On the other hand tonight we found out just how smart Romney is--and I think his smug personality(which makes him not likeable) was not there. It's actually 100% opposite. I cringed when listening to Sarah Palin--I was impressed tonight. In all fairness he made good points--especially why didnt Obama go after job creation with the same vigor he did with Obamacare? The economy is not as bad as some suggest and give Obama all the credit from really dragging us out of oblivion(which he should always use as a reminder--no references to Ford GM the stock market doubling mortgage help etc..list goes on) Obama has atleast done a reasonable job. But you cant walk away from unemployment and Romney was strategically perfect in attacking this and other points. He looked much more like a President than Obama did. Lets wait and see--I'm an open voter myself but I submit that this debate have a massive snowball effect with little time left.
No snowball. Only undecided voters left and it's a small %. Most alrady made up mind. How anyone can still be unclear is beyond me. You think a return to Tax cutting, trickle down eco is the way? REALLY? That crap doesn't work. More jobs have been created under Democratic presidents. Obama has created more jobs than Bush in one term than Bush in 2 terms. Obama had to clean up Bush's mess while dragging the whole Republican party who were resisting the entire time. Just unreal that informed voters wouldn't know this stuff already and have made up their minds.
Debates are all bullshit thats why I dont watch, I look at how things were 4 years ago and then 8 years ago and say to myself have they gotten better or has their been a foundation set to make things better
Obama needs 4 more years to continue to lay the foundation and whoever, hopefully a Democrat, comes after him will finish the process
nixluva wrote:Romney was more aggressive but he wasn't being truthful and that's gonna come back to hurt him. He basically lied as usual about his tax plan. He really won't change the dynamics of the race in the key swing states enough to win. Romney is trying to run away from everything he's said he stood for. Now all of a sudden he doesn't have a 20% across the board tax cut that will cost 5 Trillion? He suddenly is for pretty much all the good things in Obamacare and he loves teachers now. Dude was saying he was gonna repeal all of Obamacare and that we didn't need more teachers. Now he's changing up when he's on national TV. FAKE ASS LIAR!!!over the next few weeks and the next debate he's gonna pay for that as well as the 47% comments. Once fact checkers go thru all the stuff he said, which contradicts what he's been saying all year, it's gonna show how fake Romney is.
I agree with you about Romney. For the voters that watch tv on mute, they will select Romney easy. But watching the debate (granted I fell asleep), it was clear that both candidates said things that voters wanted to hear, and not something they really believe in. I think each President should sign a form, backing up their strategies mentioned in these debates. And if they renig on those debate promises, then they should be fined or something. There no accountability among any President. If you're a good liar and debater, with confident body language, you are ready to become the next President of the US.
Also, in Romney's case, how many times are you allowed to run? Hasn't Romney ran in the past during several debates and lost? But now that he's up against Obama, he's the favorite to win? I don't understand....Romney couldn't beat out the last two Republican candidates. Plus, his plans and strategies are also similar to those Republicans that lost. But of course, Romney and Obama will say anything to get votes.
Obama might not be the answer to our Presidency, but at least he provides details to those questions. Romney on the other hand, danced around the details, is also not the ready to be the President. I Referencing Clinton and how Obama plans on using some of his strategies for job growth was huge. Everybody knows how close Clinton and Obama is. So you know there's some truth in that statement. And for the voters that like Clinton, they will also vote for Obama.
Obama had to tread water last nite. Romney was excellent and was very much in command. Obama was not his smooth self.
Its like a ball game, the winner is the one with the lead in the end. Long month ahead.
TheloniusMonk wrote:BRIGGS wrote:holfresh wrote:Romney did win this debate but his threshold was much lower than Obama...He just had to adsorb the onslaught and keep standing...It all depends on what voters are looking for...If it's about substance, well Romney couldn't spell out how his 8 trillion USD of proposals of added debt will be paid for...He couldn't really lay out the details that people has been accusing him of over the last 6 months...Question is are voters really paying this close attention???..Obama was all over the place..Info overload and I'm quite surprised he didn't go after the 47% gaft...Obama and his team thought it was better to play rope a dope being ahead in the polls...Is this a game changer, I doubt it, but it did make Romney look an equal footing as the President, which is important going forward...He won't be dismissed...People will listen to what he has to say...But if people are really undecided and wanted to see who can take this economy out of this rut, can u really say that Romeny sold his case, No...He was selling the same stuff we have been listening to the last 32 yeas from the GOP...In this talented Country of really smart people, not one person has any new ideas???...Should our bottom line for a President be someone who can waddle through a debate and stay upright or someone we can have a beer with???..The best I saw one correspondent put it tonight was that Obama had a chance to close the race tonight and he didn't...One that he lost...If that's the standards the Presidency are being judged these days, well, what can I say...That said, Romney should prepare for attacks in the next debate because they will be coming fast and furious, no pun intended for you political junkies...
It will be hard for Obama. Anything he says he's going to do--Romney can simply say well youve had 4 years to do that--here is what I can do better. It also helps that Mass is a state he can point to for success(even though its a majority of Democrats)
Briggs, you also said (4 years ago) that Obama was in major trouble once Sarah Palin came in and stole the show for a week. So, I was glad to see you post this
Thel Monk - you should get an award for remembering from 4 years ago what Briggs said. Very impressive.
But Obama was not very impressive. His mind just wasn't clear. I shut it off after awhile. Couldn't watch him put on such a poor performance. Romney was smooth, good-looking, confident but lots of BS.
Obama's tired of being POTUS. He sounds like it, the pundits say he looks like it. "Bored" was how one talking head put it.
As for slamming Bush, he tried that and it sounded weak because Mitt Mormon went right back at him. That got Obama elected; it sounds tired and old now.
We've had the hope for 4 years, it's obviously time for the change.
All that said, I still don't see how Romney wins this.
Maybe he goes out between debates and hands out $100's and free Iphone7's to the Occupy Wall Street crowd...?
American pubic does not care about facts and figures. They want to be told what they want to hear.
THis is how we are in this country. Sports figures do it all the time. Politicians do it to get elected. Salesman do it all the time.
Style over substance.
Organized religion has done it for centuries.
We write the ending first then back it up from their. Romney says anything to get elected. Obama gave too many details and "Facts" and the public cannot digest that.
Romney could have sold me a used car last nite. OBama was explaining how electronic fuel injections have improved over the years and the new CVT transmissions save gas. Nobody cares.
Was this deliberate? Does it bring to the forefront the issue of fuzzy facts and while we all know Mitt is handsome and speaks well he did not bring details? Was it the Set up for the next debate where the media drives the lack of substance forcing Mitt to do some "s'plaining"?
Tune in and find out!
Who are these people giving advice to the President? Barack Ali lost the debate in the first round with a tepid opening statement. How can President Obama let Romney slide away like that?
You cannot Rope-A-Dope a desperate opponent. You hit him early and often so he cannot gain a false confidence that he can win. Romney connected and the President may need his jaw wired shut for a few weeks. I bet Michelle threw her shoes at the television.
misterearl wrote:Who are these people giving advice to the President? Barack Ali lost the debate in the first round with a tepid opening statement. How can President Obama let Romney slide away like that? You cannot Rope-A-Dope a desperate opponent. You hit him early and often so he cannot gain a false confidence that he can win. Romney connected and the President may need his jaw wired shut for a few weeks. I bet Michelle threw her shoes at the television.
Um Michele was there in the audience so no need to throw shoes. Besides u miss the point. There are so few persuadable voters left this one debate won't change much. Voters in Ohio know Romney is a liar. He can't win without Ohio!!! I don't know why people don't realize popular vote isn't as important as Electoral. Romney can't change his Medicare stance and AARP already back Obama. People are already voting.
Nalod wrote:American pubic does not care about facts and figures. They want to be told what they want to hear.THis is how we are in this country. Sports figures do it all the time. Politicians do it to get elected. Salesman do it all the time.
We write the ending first then back it up from their. Romney says anything to get elected. Obama gave too many details and "Facts" and the public cannot digest that.
Romney could have sold me a used car last nite. OBama was explaining how electronic fuel injections have improved over the years and the new CVT transmissions save gas. Nobody cares.
Was this deliberate? Does it bring to the forefront the issue of fuzzy facts and while we all know Mitt is handsome and speaks well he did not bring details? Was it the Set up for the next debate where the media drives the lack of substance forcing Mitt to do some "s'plaining"?
And please tell me you are applying everything above to how Obama got elected 4 years ago, right? Right?
The funny thing is, your "factual" auto engineer POTUS who's trying so valiantly to "'splain" everything to the dumb American Idle public, never actually "engineered" anything, and honestly couldn't tell you what a fuel injector even looks like.
Style over substance.
That sounds more applicable than hope and change, don't it?
Ain't it just a big fat smelly beeyatch when you have to run against (and with) your own track record, and not just someone elses'?
That was a disaster. I could only bear to watch about 25 minutes.
