Knicks · How many Knicks fans would trade Carmelo for Gallinari, Chandler and Mosgov right now? (page 5)

mrKnickShot wrote:

tkf wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

tkf wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Gallo is 3-15 tonight, 1-7 from 3.

well lets update that... he finished 9-22 from the field.. not great, but finished with 22/7 and scored 5 points in the last 36 seconds to seal his team win.. funny thing.. that was the nuggs 4th win in a row..... team is coming on and faried is playing like a beast... that team is fun to watch and they are only going to get better...

Faried is a stud.

unbelievable..... he had like 18/16 last night, 18/17 the night before.. something in that area.. he is a stud.... if they can get more consistency out of mcgee, that front line is going to be nice.. gallo is also rebounding well, he is avg, right at 7 per game..... and I think he can do even better than that...

I am still pissed we did not draft him.

Alot of teams passed on him because they felt he'd be too small/light to play up front.

He's definitely proving people wrong though.

knickscity wrote:Ironically Harden's efficiency has taken a major dip early on.

Wonder why?

Bonn1997 wrote:

knickscity wrote:Ironically Harden's efficiency has taken a major dip early on.

Wonder why?

Dip from what? His TS% at .568 is pretty close to his career average .603 - I say pretty close because in a 5 game sample, that's probably just the difference of one or two misses going in. His FG% is actually only .001 off of his career average.

Why don't you compare it to last year? Isn't that a better barometer to judge how he is functioning with worse support?

Last year his TS was 66 pct. This season it is 56
Last year his FG was 49 pct. This season it is 44
Last year his eFG was 58 pct. This season it is 48

Stop spinning.

Edit: forgot to mention his 3pt shooting. Last season - 39%, this season 27.

I know ... small sample size. We'll see.

dk7th wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Nalod wrote:

ShellTopAdidas wrote:This is NOT the Melo we traded for. If This new Melo played like this for George Karl, they probably would of won a few championships and would have never been traded. Melo JUST starting to realise he doesn't know it all and Melo ball is only going to get u an all star invite and nothing else. Glad to see he's growing up. It's about time.

Is melo really playing so much better or is the team around him playing team ball with him included?
And a deep bench?
And a strong team resolve?

No doubt he is having a grand time and is healthy.

In this instance, this point in the season "On paper" is not as good as "on the court"!

Lots of games left. Enjoy!

His defense is better but otherwise he's still a .440 shooter with a 1 to 1 assist turnover ratio. It's mostly the team around him doing better.

partly true, but here is where numbers DO lie.

He is averaging 1.5 assists so far. Last season he averaged 3.6. He is averaging 21.0 shots a game and last year it was 18.6.

On paper, does it not look like he is playing a lot worse and far more selfish? Why is everyone saying that he is playing more "team ball"? The numbers are stating that this is not the case.

Its important to actually watch the game sometimes to understand what is happening.

When he moves the ball quickly out of a double team and the the ball swings to an open man and they score, where does that show up on the stat sheet?

Also, I see with Melo that around the basket, he puts up shots just to get his own rebound. This hurts his FG% but often ends up in a score. I am curious how many of his misses he actually ends up scoring on and where he ranks in the league at this. This has a flip side too and will reduce the value of some of his rebounds.

There are few in the league who are as good as Melo at getting his own rebound.

there is a good reason why the miami heat are starting to record hockey assists on their players since they are indicative of how well the ball is moving for the best open shot.

Thanks dk - I was not aware of that.

I always thought that it was unfair that Shaq, Malone and Hakeem who were good passers out of the post did not get credited for assists where it was clear that they created the shot.

Bonn1997 wrote:

knickscity wrote:Ironically Harden's efficiency has taken a major dip early on.

Wonder why?

Dip from what? His TS% at .568 is pretty close to his career average .603 - I say pretty close because in a 5 game sample, that's probably just the difference of one or two misses going in. His FG% is actually only .001 off of his career average.

smackeddog wrote:Hmm, this thread has me wondering- if it was Melo who had to have knee surgery, and Amar'e was fine and playing now, would we be better, worse or the same? I guess who gives this team more, a healthy STAT or a healthy Melo?

We certainly would be far better defensively.

smackeddog wrote:Hmm, this thread has me wondering- if it was Melo who had to have knee surgery, and Amar'e was fine and playing now, would we be better, worse or the same? I guess who gives this team more, a healthy STAT or a healthy Melo?

I'm not impressed at all with Melo's offensive game yet, outside of making quicker moves.

mrKnickShot wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

knickscity wrote:Ironically Harden's efficiency has taken a major dip early on.

Wonder why?

Dip from what? His TS% at .568 is pretty close to his career average .603 - I say pretty close because in a 5 game sample, that's probably just the difference of one or two misses going in. His FG% is actually only .001 off of his career average.

Why don't you compare it to last year? Isn't that a better barometer to judge how he is functioning with worse support?

Last year his TS was 66 pct. This season it is 56
Last year his FG was 49 pct. This season it is 44
Last year his eFG was 58 pct. This season it is 48

Stop spinning.

Edit: forgot to mention his 3pt shooting. Last season - 39%, this season 27.

I know ... small sample size. We'll see.

Bonn1997 wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

knickscity wrote:Ironically Harden's efficiency has taken a major dip early on.

Wonder why?

Dip from what? His TS% at .568 is pretty close to his career average .603 - I say pretty close because in a 5 game sample, that's probably just the difference of one or two misses going in. His FG% is actually only .001 off of his career average.

Why don't you compare it to last year? Isn't that a better barometer to judge how he is functioning with worse support?

Last year his TS was 66 pct. This season it is 56
Last year his FG was 49 pct. This season it is 44
Last year his eFG was 58 pct. This season it is 48

Stop spinning.

Edit: forgot to mention his 3pt shooting. Last season - 39%, this season 27.

I know ... small sample size. We'll see.

I wouldn't use one season instead of three. Before this season started, I predicted Harden's #s would regress towards his career averages.

so basically last year Harden's play was a fluke?

knickscity wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

tkf wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

tkf wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Gallo is 3-15 tonight, 1-7 from 3.

well lets update that... he finished 9-22 from the field.. not great, but finished with 22/7 and scored 5 points in the last 36 seconds to seal his team win.. funny thing.. that was the nuggs 4th win in a row..... team is coming on and faried is playing like a beast... that team is fun to watch and they are only going to get better...

Faried is a stud.

unbelievable..... he had like 18/16 last night, 18/17 the night before.. something in that area.. he is a stud.... if they can get more consistency out of mcgee, that front line is going to be nice.. gallo is also rebounding well, he is avg, right at 7 per game..... and I think he can do even better than that...

I am still pissed we did not draft him.

I like Faried, but I like Shumpert as well.

Alot of teams passed on him because they felt he'd be too small/light to play up front.

He's definitely proving people wrong though.

I like shumpert as well, my hopes in the near future was for a shumpert/lin backcourt.. not sure if shump can reach his full potential playing with carmelo, so I am hoping carmelo opts out or is gone somehow by time shump starts coming into his own.. right now shump has elite defense potential.... faried would have been good for us as an insurance policy for amare.. either way, I think we ended up with a good player.. faried is better right now for sure, but shump has the potential to be very good for us under the right circumstances....

tkf wrote:

knickscity wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

tkf wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

tkf wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Gallo is 3-15 tonight, 1-7 from 3.

well lets update that... he finished 9-22 from the field.. not great, but finished with 22/7 and scored 5 points in the last 36 seconds to seal his team win.. funny thing.. that was the nuggs 4th win in a row..... team is coming on and faried is playing like a beast... that team is fun to watch and they are only going to get better...

Faried is a stud.

unbelievable..... he had like 18/16 last night, 18/17 the night before.. something in that area.. he is a stud.... if they can get more consistency out of mcgee, that front line is going to be nice.. gallo is also rebounding well, he is avg, right at 7 per game..... and I think he can do even better than that...

I am still pissed we did not draft him.

I like Faried, but I like Shumpert as well.

Alot of teams passed on him because they felt he'd be too small/light to play up front.

He's definitely proving people wrong though.

I like shumpert as well, my hopes in the near future was for a shumpert/lin backcourt.. not sure if shump can reach his full potential playing with carmelo, so I am hoping carmelo opts out or is gone somehow by time shump starts coming into his own.. right now shump has elite defense potential.... faried would have been good for us as an insurance policy for amare.. either way, I think we ended up with a good player.. faried is better right now for sure, but shump has the potential to be very good for us under the right circumstances....

Not gonna address Lin, I'm not high on him.

dk7th wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Nalod wrote:

ShellTopAdidas wrote:This is NOT the Melo we traded for. If This new Melo played like this for George Karl, they probably would of won a few championships and would have never been traded. Melo JUST starting to realise he doesn't know it all and Melo ball is only going to get u an all star invite and nothing else. Glad to see he's growing up. It's about time.

Is melo really playing so much better or is the team around him playing team ball with him included?
And a deep bench?
And a strong team resolve?

No doubt he is having a grand time and is healthy.

In this instance, this point in the season "On paper" is not as good as "on the court"!

Lots of games left. Enjoy!

His defense is better but otherwise he's still a .440 shooter with a 1 to 1 assist turnover ratio. It's mostly the team around him doing better.

partly true, but here is where numbers DO lie.

He is averaging 1.5 assists so far. Last season he averaged 3.6. He is averaging 21.0 shots a game and last year it was 18.6.

On paper, does it not look like he is playing a lot worse and far more selfish? Why is everyone saying that he is playing more "team ball"? The numbers are stating that this is not the case.

Its important to actually watch the game sometimes to understand what is happening.

When he moves the ball quickly out of a double team and the the ball swings to an open man and they score, where does that show up on the stat sheet?

Also, I see with Melo that around the basket, he puts up shots just to get his own rebound. This hurts his FG% but often ends up in a score. I am curious how many of his misses he actually ends up scoring on and where he ranks in the league at this. This has a flip side too and will reduce the value of some of his rebounds.

There are few in the league who are as good as Melo at getting his own rebound.

there is a good reason why the miami heat are starting to record hockey assists on their players since they are indicative of how well the ball is moving for the best open shot.

kevin durant in an interview the other day specifically talked about hockey assists.. he said he takes pride in moving the ball as the team keeps ups with hockey assists.. so even guys like durant now are very well aware of the pass that leads to the pass that leads to the assist....

knickscity wrote:

tkf wrote:

knickscity wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

tkf wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

tkf wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Gallo is 3-15 tonight, 1-7 from 3.

well lets update that... he finished 9-22 from the field.. not great, but finished with 22/7 and scored 5 points in the last 36 seconds to seal his team win.. funny thing.. that was the nuggs 4th win in a row..... team is coming on and faried is playing like a beast... that team is fun to watch and they are only going to get better...

Faried is a stud.

unbelievable..... he had like 18/16 last night, 18/17 the night before.. something in that area.. he is a stud.... if they can get more consistency out of mcgee, that front line is going to be nice.. gallo is also rebounding well, he is avg, right at 7 per game..... and I think he can do even better than that...

I am still pissed we did not draft him.

I like Faried, but I like Shumpert as well.

Alot of teams passed on him because they felt he'd be too small/light to play up front.

He's definitely proving people wrong though.

I like shumpert as well, my hopes in the near future was for a shumpert/lin backcourt.. not sure if shump can reach his full potential playing with carmelo, so I am hoping carmelo opts out or is gone somehow by time shump starts coming into his own.. right now shump has elite defense potential.... faried would have been good for us as an insurance policy for amare.. either way, I think we ended up with a good player.. faried is better right now for sure, but shump has the potential to be very good for us under the right circumstances....

What potential do you see in Shumpert that Melo would hinder?

Not gonna address Lin, I'm not high on him.

Oh man!

Do you have to get this guy started on one of his miserable diatribes?

knickscity wrote:

tkf wrote:

knickscity wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

tkf wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

tkf wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Gallo is 3-15 tonight, 1-7 from 3.

well lets update that... he finished 9-22 from the field.. not great, but finished with 22/7 and scored 5 points in the last 36 seconds to seal his team win.. funny thing.. that was the nuggs 4th win in a row..... team is coming on and faried is playing like a beast... that team is fun to watch and they are only going to get better...

Faried is a stud.

unbelievable..... he had like 18/16 last night, 18/17 the night before.. something in that area.. he is a stud.... if they can get more consistency out of mcgee, that front line is going to be nice.. gallo is also rebounding well, he is avg, right at 7 per game..... and I think he can do even better than that...

I am still pissed we did not draft him.

I like Faried, but I like Shumpert as well.

Alot of teams passed on him because they felt he'd be too small/light to play up front.

He's definitely proving people wrong though.

I like shumpert as well, my hopes in the near future was for a shumpert/lin backcourt.. not sure if shump can reach his full potential playing with carmelo, so I am hoping carmelo opts out or is gone somehow by time shump starts coming into his own.. right now shump has elite defense potential.... faried would have been good for us as an insurance policy for amare.. either way, I think we ended up with a good player.. faried is better right now for sure, but shump has the potential to be very good for us under the right circumstances....

What potential do you see in Shumpert that Melo would hinder?

Not gonna address Lin, I'm not high on him.

the potential to grow offensively, I think shump is somewhat of a combo guard, he is going to need to have more touches and more of a chance to control the ball and explore his offense.. we know that is not allowed in carmelo land...

tkf wrote:

knickscity wrote:

tkf wrote:

knickscity wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

tkf wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

tkf wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Gallo is 3-15 tonight, 1-7 from 3.

well lets update that... he finished 9-22 from the field.. not great, but finished with 22/7 and scored 5 points in the last 36 seconds to seal his team win.. funny thing.. that was the nuggs 4th win in a row..... team is coming on and faried is playing like a beast... that team is fun to watch and they are only going to get better...

Faried is a stud.

unbelievable..... he had like 18/16 last night, 18/17 the night before.. something in that area.. he is a stud.... if they can get more consistency out of mcgee, that front line is going to be nice.. gallo is also rebounding well, he is avg, right at 7 per game..... and I think he can do even better than that...

I am still pissed we did not draft him.

I like Faried, but I like Shumpert as well.

Alot of teams passed on him because they felt he'd be too small/light to play up front.

He's definitely proving people wrong though.

I like shumpert as well, my hopes in the near future was for a shumpert/lin backcourt.. not sure if shump can reach his full potential playing with carmelo, so I am hoping carmelo opts out or is gone somehow by time shump starts coming into his own.. right now shump has elite defense potential.... faried would have been good for us as an insurance policy for amare.. either way, I think we ended up with a good player.. faried is better right now for sure, but shump has the potential to be very good for us under the right circumstances....

What potential do you see in Shumpert that Melo would hinder?

Not gonna address Lin, I'm not high on him.

the potential to grow offensively, I think shump is somewhat of a combo guard, he is going to need to have more touches and more of a chance to control the ball and explore his offense.. we know that is not allowed in carmelo land...

IQ not good enough, and you can't teach that.

Look at the advanced stats. pretty awful.

knickscity wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

knickscity wrote:Ironically Harden's efficiency has taken a major dip early on.

Wonder why?

Dip from what? His TS% at .568 is pretty close to his career average .603 - I say pretty close because in a 5 game sample, that's probably just the difference of one or two misses going in. His FG% is actually only .001 off of his career average.

Why don't you compare it to last year? Isn't that a better barometer to judge how he is functioning with worse support?

Last year his TS was 66 pct. This season it is 56
Last year his FG was 49 pct. This season it is 44
Last year his eFG was 58 pct. This season it is 48

Stop spinning.

Edit: forgot to mention his 3pt shooting. Last season - 39%, this season 27.

I know ... small sample size. We'll see.

I wouldn't use one season instead of three. Before this season started, I predicted Harden's #s would regress towards his career averages.

Anyone could, he doesn't have the attention of playing with two top 10 players now, it was supposed to dip.

so basically last year Harden's play was a fluke?

knickscity wrote:

tkf wrote:

knickscity wrote:

tkf wrote:

knickscity wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

tkf wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

tkf wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Gallo is 3-15 tonight, 1-7 from 3.

well lets update that... he finished 9-22 from the field.. not great, but finished with 22/7 and scored 5 points in the last 36 seconds to seal his team win.. funny thing.. that was the nuggs 4th win in a row..... team is coming on and faried is playing like a beast... that team is fun to watch and they are only going to get better...

Faried is a stud.

unbelievable..... he had like 18/16 last night, 18/17 the night before.. something in that area.. he is a stud.... if they can get more consistency out of mcgee, that front line is going to be nice.. gallo is also rebounding well, he is avg, right at 7 per game..... and I think he can do even better than that...

I am still pissed we did not draft him.

I like Faried, but I like Shumpert as well.

Alot of teams passed on him because they felt he'd be too small/light to play up front.

He's definitely proving people wrong though.

I like shumpert as well, my hopes in the near future was for a shumpert/lin backcourt.. not sure if shump can reach his full potential playing with carmelo, so I am hoping carmelo opts out or is gone somehow by time shump starts coming into his own.. right now shump has elite defense potential.... faried would have been good for us as an insurance policy for amare.. either way, I think we ended up with a good player.. faried is better right now for sure, but shump has the potential to be very good for us under the right circumstances....

What potential do you see in Shumpert that Melo would hinder?

Not gonna address Lin, I'm not high on him.

the potential to grow offensively, I think shump is somewhat of a combo guard, he is going to need to have more touches and more of a chance to control the ball and explore his offense.. we know that is not allowed in carmelo land...

If anything Shump is a two or maybe a three, he should never consider playing the point.

IQ not good enough, and you can't teach that.

shumpert is not a 3 at all.. he played PG in college so he can play minutes there, ala westbrook, I don't think westbrook is really anymore of a PG than a guy like shumpert..... shump doesn't really think like a PG all of the time, but he can handle the ball and make plays, so he can play spot minutes there, I would like to see him with the ball more, he can make plays somewhat like a mini wade.... needs that time to grow tho....

tkf wrote:

knickscity wrote:

tkf wrote:

knickscity wrote:

tkf wrote:

knickscity wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

tkf wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

tkf wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Gallo is 3-15 tonight, 1-7 from 3.

well lets update that... he finished 9-22 from the field.. not great, but finished with 22/7 and scored 5 points in the last 36 seconds to seal his team win.. funny thing.. that was the nuggs 4th win in a row..... team is coming on and faried is playing like a beast... that team is fun to watch and they are only going to get better...

Faried is a stud.

unbelievable..... he had like 18/16 last night, 18/17 the night before.. something in that area.. he is a stud.... if they can get more consistency out of mcgee, that front line is going to be nice.. gallo is also rebounding well, he is avg, right at 7 per game..... and I think he can do even better than that...

I am still pissed we did not draft him.

I like Faried, but I like Shumpert as well.

Alot of teams passed on him because they felt he'd be too small/light to play up front.

He's definitely proving people wrong though.

I like shumpert as well, my hopes in the near future was for a shumpert/lin backcourt.. not sure if shump can reach his full potential playing with carmelo, so I am hoping carmelo opts out or is gone somehow by time shump starts coming into his own.. right now shump has elite defense potential.... faried would have been good for us as an insurance policy for amare.. either way, I think we ended up with a good player.. faried is better right now for sure, but shump has the potential to be very good for us under the right circumstances....

What potential do you see in Shumpert that Melo would hinder?

Not gonna address Lin, I'm not high on him.

the potential to grow offensively, I think shump is somewhat of a combo guard, he is going to need to have more touches and more of a chance to control the ball and explore his offense.. we know that is not allowed in carmelo land...

If anything Shump is a two or maybe a three, he should never consider playing the point.

IQ not good enough, and you can't teach that.

shumpert is not a 3 at all.. he played PG in college so he can play minutes there, ala westbrook, I don't think westbrook is really anymore of a PG than a guy like shumpert..... shump doesn't really think like a PG all of the time, but he can handle the ball and make plays, so he can play spot minutes there, I would like to see him with the ball more, he can make plays somewhat like a mini wade.... needs that time to grow tho....

Handling the ball and making plays isn't the definition of a pg. even Blake Griffin did that prior to Chris Paul.

Shumpert would have to change his entire game offensively to even sniff Wade, and his playmaking has zero similarity.