NBA · Really impressed with Denver right now (page 7)

dk7th wrote:

NYKMentality wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

NYKMentality wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

Swishfm3 wrote:Don't let down NYKMentality!! Don't you dare give them that satisfaction!....You're like the anti-Dk7hgdhsg. We need you around to counter his somber posts

this is true. NYKM and TKF are Yin/yang

Please. Don't compare me to TKF. We are nothing alike. I believe in our team in which is 1st place of the Atlantic Division by 4.0 games, 2nd place of the entire Eastern Conference only behind Miami by 1 1/2 games, 5th most successful record of any team while being 1 1/2 games behind the #3 seed (overall), enjoying our greatest Knick since Ewing of his prime years, enjoying our greatest regular season dating back to 19 years ago (93-94) and don't watch each and every Denver Nuggets game. If I'm staying up to watch a Western Conference game? It'll have to be the Spurs. A basketball team who's always played damn near perfect basketball. Not staying up to watch Gallo, Randolph and Mozgov to say the least. To each his own, but do not compare me to TKF. Do I compare you to other posters? Nah son.

Ying & Yang means the 2 of you are polar opposites

Means opposites in the same way. That's how I take it. And I'm nothing like this man.

it means that the world is made up of dualities. "Yin and yang are actually complementary, not opposing, forces, interacting to form a whole greater than either separate part; in effect, a dynamic system." the quote is wiki.

CashMoney wrote:

NYKMentality wrote:

Swishfm3 wrote:Don't let down NYKMentality!! Don't you dare give them that satisfaction!....You're like the anti-Dk7hgdhsg. We need you around to counter his somber posts

Yeah, and then I'm the sucker at the end of the night. Banned. With no place to talk Knicks basketball. What a waste of a season in regards to fan enjoyment. You all don't think after RealGM I put time into searching which Knicks fan base to join? I did. And this was quality over quantity. And then I seen some of the same anti Melo posters from Real GM over here. TKF isn't the only one either. A small group to be exact of 4-6 posters (if that). When I seen these posters? I didn't think it would ever get this bad. But as the season has gone on? As we've continued to win while Melo has his greatest season ever? It's gotten even worse. It's now to the point where I've gotten warnings over here, which I respect. Not cut throat around here. No power trips. Warnings before a ban. But, it's not a good feeling when you're getting warnings due to being baited by the same anti Melo's posters in which surrounded our fan base since trading for Melo and/or losing Gallo. Just ask RealGM. No longer welcomed there. Stood up for our best team dating back to 1993-1994 (regular season wise) a little too much. All the time I spent explaining how our current Knicks were on the verge of our greatest season in quite some time during the entire offseason, posters such as TKF shut me down with this same anti-Melo driven agenda. That was months ago before we played a single game. I was wrong for stating, during the offseason, that Melo's on the verge of leading us to our first Atlantic Division title since 1993-1994. Melo couldn't do it. So they said. Nothing has changed. Couldn't stand that our own mod was feeding the trolls while enjoying it at the same time. Nothing against TKF the person, but as a fan and poster? It is what it is.

You may be the most positive member of this forum which says a lot as I consider myself the ultimate optimist. Don't let the haters rain on your parade. Some just like to make comments to rub us "homers" the wrong way. If a Knicks fan isn't enjoying this season then the person is simply not a Knicks fan.

Very true and some have disowned the team, they have made that clear.

When a poster can say they will not be happy with this team until certain players are gone, they are no longer a fan of the team.

Bonn1997 wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

holfresh wrote:Sorry to be the hater in all this but not really impressed yet...Jury is still out on who this team really is...After a rough road schedule to start the season, it was predictable they would go on this run...They played 15 of the last 18 games at home ...Along with home court advantage, they have the altitude advantage...Chicago was gasping for air last night in Denver...So it's hard to measure them in my opinion...Lets see them beat some tough teams on the road come the second half of the season...

I really think there is something to playing in altitude of Denver that is a massive home court advantage...Of all the teams that are highly ranked this year and are considered "good"..Denver is the only one with a losing record on the road and it's not even close...They are 10-15...So seeing this, I looked at their win/loss totals every year going back to 2006...They have always had some of the best home win/loss record in the entire NBA yet get bumped in the first round(except one year) all be it by some good Western Conference teams...My conclusion??..Their win/loss record over the years may have been inflated by their location and home court (altitude) advantage...

Maybe the change in altitude of being on the road works against Denver? There are two sides to every coin.

not really because athletes train in high altitude to simulate the same effects as blood doping. something to do with the blood cells

I don't get what you're saying. If they train in high altitude then going on the road in low altitude areas would be an even bigger shock to the body's of Denver's players, right?

Basically the theory is that training in high altitudes helps your body produce more red blood cells. The theory is that your body will still have the higher concentration of blood cells when they travel to lower levels which help their endurance. Like most things people argue the value of it. I might not explained it exactly but this is the gist of what I remember. Try looking it up.

A lot of Olympic sports dealing with endurance train in high altitudes they have a camp.

yellowboy90 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

holfresh wrote:Sorry to be the hater in all this but not really impressed yet...Jury is still out on who this team really is...After a rough road schedule to start the season, it was predictable they would go on this run...They played 15 of the last 18 games at home ...Along with home court advantage, they have the altitude advantage...Chicago was gasping for air last night in Denver...So it's hard to measure them in my opinion...Lets see them beat some tough teams on the road come the second half of the season...

I really think there is something to playing in altitude of Denver that is a massive home court advantage...Of all the teams that are highly ranked this year and are considered "good"..Denver is the only one with a losing record on the road and it's not even close...They are 10-15...So seeing this, I looked at their win/loss totals every year going back to 2006...They have always had some of the best home win/loss record in the entire NBA yet get bumped in the first round(except one year) all be it by some good Western Conference teams...My conclusion??..Their win/loss record over the years may have been inflated by their location and home court (altitude) advantage...

Maybe the change in altitude of being on the road works against Denver? There are two sides to every coin.

not really because athletes train in high altitude to simulate the same effects as blood doping. something to do with the blood cells

I don't get what you're saying. If they train in high altitude then going on the road in low altitude areas would be an even bigger shock to the body's of Denver's players, right?

Basically the theory is that training in high altitudes helps your body produce more red blood cells. The theory is that your body will still have the higher concentration of blood cells when they travel to lower levels which help their endurance. Like most things people argue the value of it. I might not explained it exactly but this is the gist of what I remember. Try looking it up.

A lot of Olympic sports dealing with endurance train in high altitudes they have a camp.

CrushAlot wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

holfresh wrote:Sorry to be the hater in all this but not really impressed yet...Jury is still out on who this team really is...After a rough road schedule to start the season, it was predictable they would go on this run...They played 15 of the last 18 games at home ...Along with home court advantage, they have the altitude advantage...Chicago was gasping for air last night in Denver...So it's hard to measure them in my opinion...Lets see them beat some tough teams on the road come the second half of the season...

I really think there is something to playing in altitude of Denver that is a massive home court advantage...Of all the teams that are highly ranked this year and are considered "good"..Denver is the only one with a losing record on the road and it's not even close...They are 10-15...So seeing this, I looked at their win/loss totals every year going back to 2006...They have always had some of the best home win/loss record in the entire NBA yet get bumped in the first round(except one year) all be it by some good Western Conference teams...My conclusion??..Their win/loss record over the years may have been inflated by their location and home court (altitude) advantage...

Maybe the change in altitude of being on the road works against Denver? There are two sides to every coin.

not really because athletes train in high altitude to simulate the same effects as blood doping. something to do with the blood cells

I don't get what you're saying. If they train in high altitude then going on the road in low altitude areas would be an even bigger shock to the body's of Denver's players, right?

Basically the theory is that training in high altitudes helps your body produce more red blood cells. The theory is that your body will still have the higher concentration of blood cells when they travel to lower levels which help their endurance. Like most things people argue the value of it. I might not explained it exactly but this is the gist of what I remember. Try looking it up.

A lot of Olympic sports dealing with endurance train in high altitudes they have a camp.

Isn't there a football player that can't play in Mile High because of the risk of playing in the higher altitude?

Ryan Clark of the steelers. I think something to do with sick cell but I am not sure exactly.

Denver has stayed about the same and has assets and a youthier team.

Knicks got a marquee player and two years later was able to manage the roster to be veteran deep and build for the present.

So in a way both teams have accomplished what they set out to do.

Denver is impressive and so are the knicks.

FeltonandAmare wrote:The Nuggies will NEVER win a championship.

When will the Knicks win one?

IronWillGiroud wrote:

FeltonandAmare wrote:The Nuggies will NEVER win a championship.

When will the Knicks win one?

knickscity wrote:

CashMoney wrote:

NYKMentality wrote:

Swishfm3 wrote:Don't let down NYKMentality!! Don't you dare give them that satisfaction!....You're like the anti-Dk7hgdhsg. We need you around to counter his somber posts

Yeah, and then I'm the sucker at the end of the night. Banned. With no place to talk Knicks basketball. What a waste of a season in regards to fan enjoyment. You all don't think after RealGM I put time into searching which Knicks fan base to join? I did. And this was quality over quantity. And then I seen some of the same anti Melo posters from Real GM over here. TKF isn't the only one either. A small group to be exact of 4-6 posters (if that). When I seen these posters? I didn't think it would ever get this bad. But as the season has gone on? As we've continued to win while Melo has his greatest season ever? It's gotten even worse. It's now to the point where I've gotten warnings over here, which I respect. Not cut throat around here. No power trips. Warnings before a ban. But, it's not a good feeling when you're getting warnings due to being baited by the same anti Melo's posters in which surrounded our fan base since trading for Melo and/or losing Gallo. Just ask RealGM. No longer welcomed there. Stood up for our best team dating back to 1993-1994 (regular season wise) a little too much. All the time I spent explaining how our current Knicks were on the verge of our greatest season in quite some time during the entire offseason, posters such as TKF shut me down with this same anti-Melo driven agenda. That was months ago before we played a single game. I was wrong for stating, during the offseason, that Melo's on the verge of leading us to our first Atlantic Division title since 1993-1994. Melo couldn't do it. So they said. Nothing has changed. Couldn't stand that our own mod was feeding the trolls while enjoying it at the same time. Nothing against TKF the person, but as a fan and poster? It is what it is.

You may be the most positive member of this forum which says a lot as I consider myself the ultimate optimist. Don't let the haters rain on your parade. Some just like to make comments to rub us "homers" the wrong way. If a Knicks fan isn't enjoying this season then the person is simply not a Knicks fan.

Very true and some have disowned the team, they have made that clear.

When a poster can say they will not be happy with this team until certain players are gone, they are no longer a fan of the team.

I really don't get the focus some of you have with particular posters.... what is the need to constantly complain about other posters and their views? You guys spend more time talking about who is a fan.. I mean if you are a fan yourself then talk about the knicks, not about the poster...

tkf wrote:

knickscity wrote:

CashMoney wrote:

NYKMentality wrote:

Swishfm3 wrote:Don't let down NYKMentality!! Don't you dare give them that satisfaction!....You're like the anti-Dk7hgdhsg. We need you around to counter his somber posts

Yeah, and then I'm the sucker at the end of the night. Banned. With no place to talk Knicks basketball. What a waste of a season in regards to fan enjoyment. You all don't think after RealGM I put time into searching which Knicks fan base to join? I did. And this was quality over quantity. And then I seen some of the same anti Melo posters from Real GM over here. TKF isn't the only one either. A small group to be exact of 4-6 posters (if that). When I seen these posters? I didn't think it would ever get this bad. But as the season has gone on? As we've continued to win while Melo has his greatest season ever? It's gotten even worse. It's now to the point where I've gotten warnings over here, which I respect. Not cut throat around here. No power trips. Warnings before a ban. But, it's not a good feeling when you're getting warnings due to being baited by the same anti Melo's posters in which surrounded our fan base since trading for Melo and/or losing Gallo. Just ask RealGM. No longer welcomed there. Stood up for our best team dating back to 1993-1994 (regular season wise) a little too much. All the time I spent explaining how our current Knicks were on the verge of our greatest season in quite some time during the entire offseason, posters such as TKF shut me down with this same anti-Melo driven agenda. That was months ago before we played a single game. I was wrong for stating, during the offseason, that Melo's on the verge of leading us to our first Atlantic Division title since 1993-1994. Melo couldn't do it. So they said. Nothing has changed. Couldn't stand that our own mod was feeding the trolls while enjoying it at the same time. Nothing against TKF the person, but as a fan and poster? It is what it is.

You may be the most positive member of this forum which says a lot as I consider myself the ultimate optimist. Don't let the haters rain on your parade. Some just like to make comments to rub us "homers" the wrong way. If a Knicks fan isn't enjoying this season then the person is simply not a Knicks fan.

Very true and some have disowned the team, they have made that clear.

When a poster can say they will not be happy with this team until certain players are gone, they are no longer a fan of the team.

I really don't get the focus some of you have with particular posters.... what is the need to constantly complain about other posters and their views? You guys spend more time talking about who is a fan.. I mean if you are a fan yourself then talk about the knicks, not about the poster...

tkf wrote: I really don't get the focus some of you have with particular posters.... what is the need to constantly complain about other posters and their views? You guys spend more time talking about who is a fan.. I mean if you are a fan yourself then talk about the knicks, not about the poster...

Because you spend more time trolling this forum with an agenda against our greatest Knick since Ewing and/or dropping one line fillers such as "Sprewell's years in Minny weren't bad at all" but then, when you're proven wrong as wrong can be? You hide under a rock until you pop up, out of nowhere, with yet another one line filler type of trollish post.

Once again TKF... I'm still waiting for you to backup your claims on how Sprewell's 6 years in Golden State weren't bad at all. Or, were you not here to actually talk basketball but instead drop a one line filler, with no insight what so ever as just another indiscrete Melo head shot? Praising Sprewell to knock Melo. I read you like a book.

tkf wrote: so again, why talk about his warrior days, which I would like to remind you were not bad at all

Would you care to explain and/or remind us (all) how during Spree's six seasons in Golden State, that those 6 years weren't bad at all? Please explain because when in reality, they were awful.

You'll completely ignore Golden States team success and/or lack thereof during 6 years under Sprewell, but then talk about and/or harp all over Melo's "inability" to lead during his postseason years in Denver despite the fact that Melo led Denver to the Western Conference Finals during the elite/golden years of the Western Conference. You'll harp all over the fact that Denver lost under Melo against the likes of dynasty era teams such as Lakers (x2) and San Antonio (x2) during first rounds, but completely ignore how much of an awful leader Sprewell was and/or how often his team(s) lost during his time in Golden State years. Hypocritical. (See below).

Sprewell's first 6 seasons:

92-93: 32-45 (losing season).
93-94: 50-32 (first round exit).
94-95: 23-46 (losing season).
95-96: 34-44 (losing season).
96-97: 29-51 (losing season).
97-98: 1-13 (losing season/suspension).

6 seasons with an overall losing record of 169-231. 62 games below .500 during his 6 years in Golden State. Failed to make the playoffs 5/6 seasons. 1st round exit. Suspended for 68 games for assaulting his head coach. Loser.

tkf wrote: so again, why talk about his warrior days, which I would like to remind you were not bad at all

Not bad at all TKF? Well then get to talking basketball. Explain with insight too TKF. I've been waiting for you to "remind us all" how those 6 years weren't anything but bad at all in regards to Sprewell himself. I'll be waiting. And after you reply? I'm going to compare Melo's first 6 seasons when compared to Sprewell's first 6 seasons in regards to both overall stats and team success (or in Spree's case, lack thereof).

Sprewell had a losing record of 169-231 with Golden State. That's 62 games below .500 to be exact. Sprewell led his teams to 5 losing seasons during his 6 years in Golden State. 5/6 years Sprewell completely failed to lead Golden State to the postseason. Suspended for 68 games due to attacking/choking/assaulting his own head coach and during Golden State's one year in which they made the playoffs under Sprewell; First round exit.

NYKMentality wrote:

tkf wrote: I really don't get the focus some of you have with particular posters.... what is the need to constantly complain about other posters and their views? You guys spend more time talking about who is a fan.. I mean if you are a fan yourself then talk about the knicks, not about the poster...

Because you spend more time trolling this forum with an agenda against our greatest Knick since Ewing and/or dropping one line fillers such as "Sprewell's years in Minny weren't bad at all" but then, when you're proven wrong as wrong can be? You hide under a rock until you pop up, out of nowhere, with yet another one line filler type of trollish post.

Once again TKF... I'm still waiting for you to backup your claims on how Sprewell's 6 years in Golden State weren't bad at all. Or, were you not here to actually talk basketball but instead drop a one line filler, with no insight what so ever as just another indiscrete Melo head shot? Praising Sprewell to knock Melo. I read you like a book.

tkf wrote: so again, why talk about his warrior days, which I would like to remind you were not bad at all

Would you care to explain and/or remind us (all) how during Spree's six seasons in Golden State, that those 6 years weren't bad at all? Please explain because when in reality, they were awful.

You'll completely ignore Golden States team success and/or lack thereof during 6 years under Sprewell, but then talk about and/or harp all over Melo's "inability" to lead during his postseason years in Denver despite the fact that Melo led Denver to the Western Conference Finals during the elite/golden years of the Western Conference. You'll harp all over the fact that Denver lost under Melo against the likes of dynasty era teams such as Lakers (x2) and San Antonio (x2) during first rounds, but completely ignore how much of an awful leader Sprewell was and/or how often his team(s) lost during his time in Golden State years. Hypocritical. (See below).

Sprewell's first 6 seasons:

92-93: 32-45 (losing season).
93-94: 50-32 (first round exit).
94-95: 23-46 (losing season).
95-96: 34-44 (losing season).
96-97: 29-51 (losing season).
97-98: 1-13 (losing season/suspension).

6 seasons with an overall losing record of 169-231. 62 games below .500 during his 6 years in Golden State. Failed to make the playoffs 5/6 seasons. 1st round exit. Suspended for 68 games for assaulting his head coach. Loser.

tkf wrote: so again, why talk about his warrior days, which I would like to remind you were not bad at all

Not bad at all TKF? Well then get to talking basketball. Explain with insight too TKF. I've been waiting for you to "remind us all" how those 6 years weren't anything but bad at all in regards to Sprewell himself. I'll be waiting. And after you reply? I'm going to compare Melo's first 6 seasons when compared to Sprewell's first 6 seasons in regards to both overall stats and team success (or in Spree's case, lack thereof).

Sprewell had a losing record of 169-231 with Golden State. That's 62 games below .500 to be exact. Sprewell led his teams to 5 losing seasons during his 6 years in Golden State. 5/6 years Sprewell completely failed to lead Golden State to the postseason. Suspended for 68 games due to attacking/choking/assaulting his own head coach and during Golden State's one year in which they made the playoffs under Sprewell; First round exit.

simple.. spree was a very good player on some not too good teams...

But he brought excitement to NY, and he helped us get to the finals.... He talked trash and could take someone talking trash to him... he handles his business on the court and not by the side of a bus.....

the choice here is simple for me....

NYKMentality wrote:

3G4G wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:2012-13 Denver Nuggets 26-18 (.591) - -
2011-12 Denver Nuggets 38-28 (.576) 3-4 (.429) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2010-11 Denver Nuggets 50-32 (.610) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2009-10 Denver Nuggets 53-29 (.646) 2-4 (.333) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2008-09 Denver Nuggets 54-28 (.659) 10-6 (.625) Lost Western Conference Finals
2007-08 Denver Nuggets 50-32 (.610) 0-4 (.000) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2006-07 Denver Nuggets 45-37 (.549) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2005-06 Denver Nuggets 44-38 (.537) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2004-05 Denver Nuggets 49-33 (.598) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2003-04 Denver Nuggets 43-39 (.524) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2002-03 Denver Nuggets 17-65 (.207) - - DNQ
2001-02 Denver Nuggets 27-55 (.329) - - DNQ

Notice when we started to improve DRASTICALLY? Notice when Denver started to decline slightly?

Compare percentages, folks. It's really not that difficult.

That 09-10 year was the one with the most potential but Karl had his battle and the team feel apart. Oh well.

Weren't those declining yrs Melo era? So you're being technical over some low winning percentage pt differences? Here's what I gather from this data...The Nuggets post Melo era won as many playoff games in 2yrs than Melo led Nuggets won in 4yrs.

Let that sink a little bit

Right. As if losing 3-4 to the Lakers and 1-4 to the OKC Thunder during two first rounder's is some type of accomplishment under Gallo and/or knock on Melo. Try a little bit harder next time. One could argue that Gallo's current Nuggets are still enjoying success in which was created by Melo himself. If not for Melo becoming such an NBA star, no NBA front office would have ever gave up Gallo, Chandler, Anthony Randolph, Mozgov, Curry + draft picks for Melo himself. If anything Denver fans should be thankful (for Carmelo Anthony) that New York was willing to "sell the farm". Forget to include Felton during the trade as well. That's how great Melo was. One could also argue that Gallo's current Nuggets are still enjoying success in which was created by Carmelo Anthony himself. The uniform change and logo change during Melo's rookie season. The franchise/culture change dating back to Melo being drafted third overall. Etc, etc. This man completely changed the entire culture of Denver basketball while leading them to their first Western Conference Finals appearance dating back to 1984-1985.

But why are you using such a small sample size when trying to compare Denver before/after Melo? A handful of games? Come on, you're smarter than that. Agenda getting in the way, much? Lets actually talk before/after (Melo) when in regards to Denver as an NBA basketball franchise.

During the 8 seasons before Melo arrived for his rookie season in Denver, the Nuggets combined for 8 consecutive losing seasons while also missing 8 consecutive trips to the postseason, no Western Conference Finals appearance with a combined losing record of 200-424. That's 224 games below .500 during 8 years before the drafting of Melo third overall.

vs.

During the 8 seasons after Melo arrived for his rookie season in Denver, the Nuggets combined for 8 consecutive winning seasons while also landing 8 consecutive trips to the postseason, a Western Conference Finals appearance with a combined winning record of 388-268. That 120 games above .500 during 8 years after the drafting of Melo third overall.

That's a 344 game turnaround when comparing before/after Melo during an actual 8 year period. An average of +43 wins per season when comparing before/after Melo in regards to Denver's franchise.

Let that sink a little bit.

I don't need to let anything sink in but you do....I've already chronicled what happened during his time there and who actually deserves the real credit

When Melo arrived they had some success which coincided with the arrival of Andre Miller.

But Wait...

In the second year of Melo's tenure with the Nuggets the team was 17-25 under Jeff Bizdelik and this is with the arrival of their major free agent signing Kenyon Martin. Nuggets hire George Karl and they finish the season 32-8, their greatest stretch of play in yrs prior to Melo and after Melo's 1 and a half season with them.

They trade Melo yrs later after several post-season failures 2 of them being losses to the Clippers and Jazz in the playoffs. The Jazz is really notable because the Nuggets had home court advantage that series but let a Melo Butler tell you they struggled with the Jazz because "George Karl" was battling cancer.

Okay great then this supports what I've said for a long while now. Since trading him they maintain their high level of play, still a 45-55win team as they were during the Melo era and bound for post-season yet again. Reason...George Karl!!!!

tkf wrote:

NYKMentality wrote:

tkf wrote: I really don't get the focus some of you have with particular posters.... what is the need to constantly complain about other posters and their views? You guys spend more time talking about who is a fan.. I mean if you are a fan yourself then talk about the knicks, not about the poster...

Because you spend more time trolling this forum with an agenda against our greatest Knick since Ewing and/or dropping one line fillers such as "Sprewell's years in Minny weren't bad at all" but then, when you're proven wrong as wrong can be? You hide under a rock until you pop up, out of nowhere, with yet another one line filler type of trollish post.

Once again TKF... I'm still waiting for you to backup your claims on how Sprewell's 6 years in Golden State weren't bad at all. Or, were you not here to actually talk basketball but instead drop a one line filler, with no insight what so ever as just another indiscrete Melo head shot? Praising Sprewell to knock Melo. I read you like a book.

tkf wrote: so again, why talk about his warrior days, which I would like to remind you were not bad at all

Would you care to explain and/or remind us (all) how during Spree's six seasons in Golden State, that those 6 years weren't bad at all? Please explain because when in reality, they were awful.

You'll completely ignore Golden States team success and/or lack thereof during 6 years under Sprewell, but then talk about and/or harp all over Melo's "inability" to lead during his postseason years in Denver despite the fact that Melo led Denver to the Western Conference Finals during the elite/golden years of the Western Conference. You'll harp all over the fact that Denver lost under Melo against the likes of dynasty era teams such as Lakers (x2) and San Antonio (x2) during first rounds, but completely ignore how much of an awful leader Sprewell was and/or how often his team(s) lost during his time in Golden State years. Hypocritical. (See below).

Sprewell's first 6 seasons:

92-93: 32-45 (losing season).
93-94: 50-32 (first round exit).
94-95: 23-46 (losing season).
95-96: 34-44 (losing season).
96-97: 29-51 (losing season).
97-98: 1-13 (losing season/suspension).

6 seasons with an overall losing record of 169-231. 62 games below .500 during his 6 years in Golden State. Failed to make the playoffs 5/6 seasons. 1st round exit. Suspended for 68 games for assaulting his head coach. Loser.

tkf wrote: so again, why talk about his warrior days, which I would like to remind you were not bad at all

Not bad at all TKF? Well then get to talking basketball. Explain with insight too TKF. I've been waiting for you to "remind us all" how those 6 years weren't anything but bad at all in regards to Sprewell himself. I'll be waiting. And after you reply? I'm going to compare Melo's first 6 seasons when compared to Sprewell's first 6 seasons in regards to both overall stats and team success (or in Spree's case, lack thereof).

Sprewell had a losing record of 169-231 with Golden State. That's 62 games below .500 to be exact. Sprewell led his teams to 5 losing seasons during his 6 years in Golden State. 5/6 years Sprewell completely failed to lead Golden State to the postseason. Suspended for 68 games due to attacking/choking/assaulting his own head coach and during Golden State's one year in which they made the playoffs under Sprewell; First round exit.

simple.. spree was a very good player on some not too good teams...

But he brought excitement to NY, and he helped us get to the finals.... He talked trash and could take someone talking trash to him... he handles his business on the court and not by the side of a bus.....

the choice here is simple for me....

Yea. Right. And you completely failed to explain with actual insight how Spree's first 6 years in Golden State were anything other than bad. You simply stated "Spree was a very good player on some not too good teams". In other words, Sprewell never had the leadership ability to lead his teams to victories. He was a career loser, just like the rest of his team.

I could say the same for Carmelo Anthony in regards to his Denver teams when being up against Western Conference Dynasty teams such as Lakers (x2) and Spurs (x2). A great player on teams in which were overmatched due to Denver's talent (outside of Carmelo).

In regards to the bus incident? Carmelo Anthony stood up to K.G both on and off the court. Melo will not back down from a career punk such as K.G. No matter how frustrated Melo got due to his family being attacked through words, he still had the self control not to put his hands on K.G. You do know that Sprewell was a coward of a so called man and chocked out and/or assaulted his own head coach, right? What a coward.

How many games did Melo get suspended for waiting outside the bus? 1.
How many games did Spree get suspended for attacking his head coach? 68.

It's funny how hypocritical you are TKF.

It's also pathetic how you ignore what followed after the "bus incident". Melo was a big enough man to not only state (heading into the game) that there were no ill-feelings towards Kevin Garnett but was also man enough, humble enough and respectable enough to give K.G dap before tipoff at the center of the court. No mention of that TKF? Because it's against your little Melo drive agenda, isn't it?

No mention how during the "Melo vs. Garnett rematch" that our Knicks won as Melo led the way putting up 28 points, 9 boards, 3 assists, 2 steals and 2 turnovers when compared to K.G's 8 points, 12 boards, 2 assists, 1 steal and 1 turnover? Sounds like Melo got inside of K.G's head during our Knicks victory over Boston.

Sprewell was a very good player on some very bad teams? Nice to know. You do know why I've been waiting 3-4 days for you to respond to the post in which you just responded to, right? It's so I could hit you with this post below, while showing just how much of a hypocritical hypocrite you really are.

During games in which Carmelo played during his first 6 seasons:
03-04: 43-39 (winning season/playoffs).
04-05: 47-28 (winning season/playoffs).
05-06: 44-35 (winning season/playoffs).
06-07: 37-26 (winning season/playoffs).
07-08: 47-30 (winning season/playoffs).
08-09: 45-21 (Western Conference Finals).

Carmelo: 6 seasons with an overall winning record of 263-179. 84 games above .500 during his first 6 years in Golden State. Successfully made the playoffs 6/6 seasons including a Western Conference Finals appearance.

Sprewell: 6 seasons with an overall losing record of 169-231. 62 games below .500 during his 6 years in Golden State. Failed to make the playoffs 5/6 seasons. 1st round exit. Suspended for 68 games for assaulting his head coach. Loser.

______________________________________________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________________________________________

Melo:: Winning record of 263-179. 84 games above .500. Made the postseason 6/6 seasons.
Spree: Losing recordd of 169-231. 62 games below .500. Missed the playoffs 5/6 seasons.

Melo's first 6 seasons:: 24.1 points, 6.1 boards, 3.0 assists, 1.1 steals and 3.0 turnovers per game. Field Goal percentages of .426%, .431%, .443%, .476%, .481% & .492%.

Spree's first 6 seasons: 20.0 points, 4.3 boards, 4.6 assists, 1.7 steals and 3.1 turnovers per game. Field goal percentages of .397%, .418%, .428%, .433%, .449% and .464%.

Melo was the much better player. A much stronger leader during the golden years of the Western Conference. Sprewell was nothing more than a chucker with low field goal percentages. There is no question which player was a much greater franchise leader. And it wasn't Sprewell. Say what you say about Melo's first round exits but at least Melo, unlike Sprewell, could lead his team into postseason births (during the elite/golden years of the Western Conference) including a trip to the Western Conference Finals.

______________________________________________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________________________________________

You also stated how Sprewell was an All-NBA First Team when trying to "prove" how Sprewell was a "better player". Would you still like to talk about Career highlights, awards and/or accolades when comparing Carmelo/Sprewell? Or, would that not (once again) fit your little agenda TKF?

Carmelo:: 9 years.. NBA All-Rookie 1st Team. 6x NBA All-Star. 1x All-NBA Second Team. 4x All-NBA third Team. NCAA Champion (2003). NCAA Tournament Most Outstanding Player (2003). Big East Rookie of the Year (2003). Consensus NCAA All-American First Team (2003). NBA Rookie Challenge MVP (2005). FIBA World Championship All-Tournament Team (2006). 2x American Gold Medalist Olympian.

Sprewell: 13 years. NBA All-Rookie 2nd Team. 4x NBA All-Star. 1x NBA All-Defensive Second Team. 1x All-NBA First Team.

Only a completely clueless sports fan and/or person with a sick agenda would ever state that Sprewell was a better player when compared to Carmelo Anthony.

VCoug wrote:

Caseloads wrote:Is anyone else equally impressed with Denver right now? They are rolling.

We could use a Wilson Chandler over here.

Isiah was a great evaluator of talent.

Like drafting Channing Frye over Bynum? Or Renaldo Balkman ahead of Rajon Rondo? In five years of running drafts for us the only notable players were David Lee, Nate Robinson, Wilson Chandler, Channing Frye, and Trevor Ariza. That's one allstar and four role players, not exactly the stuff of legends there.

stop it. isiah deserves criticism of course, but he did do well with the draft compared to most gm's. everyone makes some mistakes there.

3G4G wrote:

NYKMentality wrote:

3G4G wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:2012-13 Denver Nuggets 26-18 (.591) - -
2011-12 Denver Nuggets 38-28 (.576) 3-4 (.429) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2010-11 Denver Nuggets 50-32 (.610) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2009-10 Denver Nuggets 53-29 (.646) 2-4 (.333) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2008-09 Denver Nuggets 54-28 (.659) 10-6 (.625) Lost Western Conference Finals
2007-08 Denver Nuggets 50-32 (.610) 0-4 (.000) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2006-07 Denver Nuggets 45-37 (.549) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2005-06 Denver Nuggets 44-38 (.537) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2004-05 Denver Nuggets 49-33 (.598) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2003-04 Denver Nuggets 43-39 (.524) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2002-03 Denver Nuggets 17-65 (.207) - - DNQ
2001-02 Denver Nuggets 27-55 (.329) - - DNQ

Notice when we started to improve DRASTICALLY? Notice when Denver started to decline slightly?

Compare percentages, folks. It's really not that difficult.

That 09-10 year was the one with the most potential but Karl had his battle and the team feel apart. Oh well.

Weren't those declining yrs Melo era? So you're being technical over some low winning percentage pt differences? Here's what I gather from this data...The Nuggets post Melo era won as many playoff games in 2yrs than Melo led Nuggets won in 4yrs.

Let that sink a little bit

Right. As if losing 3-4 to the Lakers and 1-4 to the OKC Thunder during two first rounder's is some type of accomplishment under Gallo and/or knock on Melo. Try a little bit harder next time. One could argue that Gallo's current Nuggets are still enjoying success in which was created by Melo himself. If not for Melo becoming such an NBA star, no NBA front office would have ever gave up Gallo, Chandler, Anthony Randolph, Mozgov, Curry + draft picks for Melo himself. If anything Denver fans should be thankful (for Carmelo Anthony) that New York was willing to "sell the farm". Forget to include Felton during the trade as well. That's how great Melo was. One could also argue that Gallo's current Nuggets are still enjoying success in which was created by Carmelo Anthony himself. The uniform change and logo change during Melo's rookie season. The franchise/culture change dating back to Melo being drafted third overall. Etc, etc. This man completely changed the entire culture of Denver basketball while leading them to their first Western Conference Finals appearance dating back to 1984-1985.

But why are you using such a small sample size when trying to compare Denver before/after Melo? A handful of games? Come on, you're smarter than that. Agenda getting in the way, much? Lets actually talk before/after (Melo) when in regards to Denver as an NBA basketball franchise.

During the 8 seasons before Melo arrived for his rookie season in Denver, the Nuggets combined for 8 consecutive losing seasons while also missing 8 consecutive trips to the postseason, no Western Conference Finals appearance with a combined losing record of 200-424. That's 224 games below .500 during 8 years before the drafting of Melo third overall.

vs.

During the 8 seasons after Melo arrived for his rookie season in Denver, the Nuggets combined for 8 consecutive winning seasons while also landing 8 consecutive trips to the postseason, a Western Conference Finals appearance with a combined winning record of 388-268. That 120 games above .500 during 8 years after the drafting of Melo third overall.

That's a 344 game turnaround when comparing before/after Melo during an actual 8 year period. An average of +43 wins per season when comparing before/after Melo in regards to Denver's franchise.

Let that sink a little bit.

I don't need to let anything sink in but you do....I've already chronicled what happened during his time there and who actually deserves the real credit

When Melo arrived they had some success which coincided with the arrival of Andre Miller.

But Wait...

In the second year of Melo's tenure with the Nuggets the team was 17-25 under Jeff Bizdelik and this is with the arrival of their major free agent signing Kenyon Martin. Nuggets hire George Karl and they finish the season 32-8, their greatest stretch of play in yrs prior to Melo and after Melo's 1 and a half season with them.

They trade Melo yrs later after several post-season failures 2 of them being losses to the Clippers and Jazz in the playoffs. The Jazz is really notable because the Nuggets had home court advantage that series but let a Melo Butler tell you they struggled with the Jazz because "George Karl" was battling cancer.

Okay great then this supports what I've said for a long while now. Since trading him they maintain their high level of play, still a 45-55win team as they were during the Melo era and bound for post-season yet again. Reason...George Karl!!!!

George Karl? He's been a head coach for 25 years now. How many championships?

You wanna talk about playoff failure/success? Talk about George Karl. A career postseason losing record of 78-101.

Thank god for Melo himself, that Melo escaped this head coach. A head coach in which doesn't have what it takes to win come postseason basketball.

NYKMentality wrote:

3G4G wrote:

NYKMentality wrote:

3G4G wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:2012-13 Denver Nuggets 26-18 (.591) - -
2011-12 Denver Nuggets 38-28 (.576) 3-4 (.429) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2010-11 Denver Nuggets 50-32 (.610) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2009-10 Denver Nuggets 53-29 (.646) 2-4 (.333) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2008-09 Denver Nuggets 54-28 (.659) 10-6 (.625) Lost Western Conference Finals
2007-08 Denver Nuggets 50-32 (.610) 0-4 (.000) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2006-07 Denver Nuggets 45-37 (.549) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2005-06 Denver Nuggets 44-38 (.537) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2004-05 Denver Nuggets 49-33 (.598) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2003-04 Denver Nuggets 43-39 (.524) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2002-03 Denver Nuggets 17-65 (.207) - - DNQ
2001-02 Denver Nuggets 27-55 (.329) - - DNQ

Notice when we started to improve DRASTICALLY? Notice when Denver started to decline slightly?

Compare percentages, folks. It's really not that difficult.

That 09-10 year was the one with the most potential but Karl had his battle and the team feel apart. Oh well.

Weren't those declining yrs Melo era? So you're being technical over some low winning percentage pt differences? Here's what I gather from this data...The Nuggets post Melo era won as many playoff games in 2yrs than Melo led Nuggets won in 4yrs.

Let that sink a little bit

Right. As if losing 3-4 to the Lakers and 1-4 to the OKC Thunder during two first rounder's is some type of accomplishment under Gallo and/or knock on Melo. Try a little bit harder next time. One could argue that Gallo's current Nuggets are still enjoying success in which was created by Melo himself. If not for Melo becoming such an NBA star, no NBA front office would have ever gave up Gallo, Chandler, Anthony Randolph, Mozgov, Curry + draft picks for Melo himself. If anything Denver fans should be thankful (for Carmelo Anthony) that New York was willing to "sell the farm". Forget to include Felton during the trade as well. That's how great Melo was. One could also argue that Gallo's current Nuggets are still enjoying success in which was created by Carmelo Anthony himself. The uniform change and logo change during Melo's rookie season. The franchise/culture change dating back to Melo being drafted third overall. Etc, etc. This man completely changed the entire culture of Denver basketball while leading them to their first Western Conference Finals appearance dating back to 1984-1985.

But why are you using such a small sample size when trying to compare Denver before/after Melo? A handful of games? Come on, you're smarter than that. Agenda getting in the way, much? Lets actually talk before/after (Melo) when in regards to Denver as an NBA basketball franchise.

During the 8 seasons before Melo arrived for his rookie season in Denver, the Nuggets combined for 8 consecutive losing seasons while also missing 8 consecutive trips to the postseason, no Western Conference Finals appearance with a combined losing record of 200-424. That's 224 games below .500 during 8 years before the drafting of Melo third overall.

vs.

During the 8 seasons after Melo arrived for his rookie season in Denver, the Nuggets combined for 8 consecutive winning seasons while also landing 8 consecutive trips to the postseason, a Western Conference Finals appearance with a combined winning record of 388-268. That 120 games above .500 during 8 years after the drafting of Melo third overall.

That's a 344 game turnaround when comparing before/after Melo during an actual 8 year period. An average of +43 wins per season when comparing before/after Melo in regards to Denver's franchise.

Let that sink a little bit.

I don't need to let anything sink in but you do....I've already chronicled what happened during his time there and who actually deserves the real credit

When Melo arrived they had some success which coincided with the arrival of Andre Miller.

But Wait...

In the second year of Melo's tenure with the Nuggets the team was 17-25 under Jeff Bizdelik and this is with the arrival of their major free agent signing Kenyon Martin. Nuggets hire George Karl and they finish the season 32-8, their greatest stretch of play in yrs prior to Melo and after Melo's 1 and a half season with them.

They trade Melo yrs later after several post-season failures 2 of them being losses to the Clippers and Jazz in the playoffs. The Jazz is really notable because the Nuggets had home court advantage that series but let a Melo Butler tell you they struggled with the Jazz because "George Karl" was battling cancer.

Okay great then this supports what I've said for a long while now. Since trading him they maintain their high level of play, still a 45-55win team as they were during the Melo era and bound for post-season yet again. Reason...George Karl!!!!

George Karl? He's been a head coach for 25 years now. How many championships?

You wanna talk about playoff failure/success? Talk about George Karl. A career postseason losing record of 78-101.

Thank god for Melo himself, that Melo escaped this head coach. A head coach in which doesn't have what it takes to win come postseason basketball.

So there is pure correlation with Melo playing but not for a Karl coached team?

Way I see it, teams sucked before Melo so they get higher draft picks which they used to draft better players or trade for players with the picks. The Nick Van Excel era was awful.

They Draft twice in one year using "Skita" and "Nene" before Amare.

They do get Melo, along with other assets including a coach and improve.

If you really want to break down each have at it but your argument has holes in it.

Any post that you begin with "yeah, right" I pass over.

I don't know why you argue, Its clear Melo helped imrprove the team.

NYKMentality wrote:

3G4G wrote:

NYKMentality wrote:

3G4G wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:2012-13 Denver Nuggets 26-18 (.591) - -
2011-12 Denver Nuggets 38-28 (.576) 3-4 (.429) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2010-11 Denver Nuggets 50-32 (.610) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2009-10 Denver Nuggets 53-29 (.646) 2-4 (.333) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2008-09 Denver Nuggets 54-28 (.659) 10-6 (.625) Lost Western Conference Finals
2007-08 Denver Nuggets 50-32 (.610) 0-4 (.000) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2006-07 Denver Nuggets 45-37 (.549) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2005-06 Denver Nuggets 44-38 (.537) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2004-05 Denver Nuggets 49-33 (.598) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2003-04 Denver Nuggets 43-39 (.524) 1-4 (.200) Lost Western Conference 1st Rd
2002-03 Denver Nuggets 17-65 (.207) - - DNQ
2001-02 Denver Nuggets 27-55 (.329) - - DNQ

Notice when we started to improve DRASTICALLY? Notice when Denver started to decline slightly?

Compare percentages, folks. It's really not that difficult.

That 09-10 year was the one with the most potential but Karl had his battle and the team feel apart. Oh well.

Weren't those declining yrs Melo era? So you're being technical over some low winning percentage pt differences? Here's what I gather from this data...The Nuggets post Melo era won as many playoff games in 2yrs than Melo led Nuggets won in 4yrs.

Let that sink a little bit

Right. As if losing 3-4 to the Lakers and 1-4 to the OKC Thunder during two first rounder's is some type of accomplishment under Gallo and/or knock on Melo. Try a little bit harder next time. One could argue that Gallo's current Nuggets are still enjoying success in which was created by Melo himself. If not for Melo becoming such an NBA star, no NBA front office would have ever gave up Gallo, Chandler, Anthony Randolph, Mozgov, Curry + draft picks for Melo himself. If anything Denver fans should be thankful (for Carmelo Anthony) that New York was willing to "sell the farm". Forget to include Felton during the trade as well. That's how great Melo was. One could also argue that Gallo's current Nuggets are still enjoying success in which was created by Carmelo Anthony himself. The uniform change and logo change during Melo's rookie season. The franchise/culture change dating back to Melo being drafted third overall. Etc, etc. This man completely changed the entire culture of Denver basketball while leading them to their first Western Conference Finals appearance dating back to 1984-1985.

But why are you using such a small sample size when trying to compare Denver before/after Melo? A handful of games? Come on, you're smarter than that. Agenda getting in the way, much? Lets actually talk before/after (Melo) when in regards to Denver as an NBA basketball franchise.

During the 8 seasons before Melo arrived for his rookie season in Denver, the Nuggets combined for 8 consecutive losing seasons while also missing 8 consecutive trips to the postseason, no Western Conference Finals appearance with a combined losing record of 200-424. That's 224 games below .500 during 8 years before the drafting of Melo third overall.

vs.

During the 8 seasons after Melo arrived for his rookie season in Denver, the Nuggets combined for 8 consecutive winning seasons while also landing 8 consecutive trips to the postseason, a Western Conference Finals appearance with a combined winning record of 388-268. That 120 games above .500 during 8 years after the drafting of Melo third overall.

That's a 344 game turnaround when comparing before/after Melo during an actual 8 year period. An average of +43 wins per season when comparing before/after Melo in regards to Denver's franchise.

Let that sink a little bit.

I don't need to let anything sink in but you do....I've already chronicled what happened during his time there and who actually deserves the real credit

When Melo arrived they had some success which coincided with the arrival of Andre Miller.

But Wait...

In the second year of Melo's tenure with the Nuggets the team was 17-25 under Jeff Bizdelik and this is with the arrival of their major free agent signing Kenyon Martin. Nuggets hire George Karl and they finish the season 32-8, their greatest stretch of play in yrs prior to Melo and after Melo's 1 and a half season with them.

They trade Melo yrs later after several post-season failures 2 of them being losses to the Clippers and Jazz in the playoffs. The Jazz is really notable because the Nuggets had home court advantage that series but let a Melo Butler tell you they struggled with the Jazz because "George Karl" was battling cancer.

Okay great then this supports what I've said for a long while now. Since trading him they maintain their high level of play, still a 45-55win team as they were during the Melo era and bound for post-season yet again. Reason...George Karl!!!!

George Karl? He's been a head coach for 25 years now. How many championships?

You wanna talk about playoff failure/success? Talk about George Karl. A career postseason losing record of 78-101.

Thank god for Melo himself, that Melo escaped this head coach. A head coach in which doesn't have what it takes to win come postseason basketball.

What is woody's postseason record ?

tkf wrote:

simple.. spree was a very good player on some not too good teams...

But he brought excitement to NY, and he helped us get to the finals.... He talked trash and could take someone talking trash to him... he handles his business on the court and not by the side of a bus.....

the choice here is simple for me....

PJ Carlisimo says otherwise!