Knicks · Need to surround Melo with mobile skilled scorers with good charchater (page 3)
Knixkik wrote:What do you mean it didn't work? They went to the WCF in the difficult west. That team would have made the finals in the east. You act like 6 teams win the title every year or if you don't win it all it was an unsuccessful season. Melo led that team to a great season. Many many stars did not win nba championships in their careers. Are you going to discredit Malone stockton Barkley etc and say it never really worked for them?
If the Knicks end up with Carmelo for 7 seasons and get knocked out in the first round for 6 of them, is that success to you?
Dante cunningham
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BRIGGS wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Surround or replace?We'll they have to make that determination after the season. With 57mm going to the *big three*(and an additional 12 mm to Kidd Novak Felton) the only assets we have are one 20 something first rounder and 3mm$ --it certainly will be nearly impossible. We'll have to evaluate the team going down the stretch. I really thought our best chance at doing anything was this year. How does the oldest team in the league improve by getting older?
If we cant get to the ECF with or without Amare--tough decisions will need to be made. We sold our soul for Carmelo and our owner's main function is to sell a playoff team to fans who pay a LOT in ticket$$$. I really do believe that Isiah Thomas is in the ear of Dolan--the Carmelo trade --atleast to me stinks of IT's hands on it.
Really? I think Isiah would have preferred Deron Williams.
BRIGGS wrote:Each position must be a player who can score pass and handle. Melo is forced to take 20 shots because we dont have enough scoring. Denver and the Spurs are good examples of this--any given night--you can have a guy score 20 and there is no dependance on 1 player. We put complete focus on what someone from the Knicks organization believed would beat Miami and forgot that there are 30 teams. We have a great player in Melo--if you look back at the Olympics he was a top 3 player. But on a team where he needs to really score 30---it wont work hes not a Kobe type. As much as Im back and forth with JR Smith because we simply dont have the scorers --I think that he should be a s+t candidate or just let him go. His character is not good enough.
Interesting, so who needs to go and who needs to stay, taking into account character, skill and salary?
knickstorrents wrote:Knixkik wrote:What do you mean it didn't work? They went to the WCF in the difficult west. That team would have made the finals in the east. You act like 6 teams win the title every year or if you don't win it all it was an unsuccessful season. Melo led that team to a great season. Many many stars did not win nba championships in their careers. Are you going to discredit Malone stockton Barkley etc and say it never really worked for them?If the Knicks end up with Carmelo for 7 seasons and get knocked out in the first round for 6 of them, is that success to you?
The one year they really got Melo talent they went to the WCF. The rest of the years there just wasn't a great supporting cast which was what the argument is. Old iverson wasn't a good fit. They had a small window with Billups still in his prime and they were a contender. So to answer your question I would not be happy but I don't blame Melo if we fail to give him a good supporting cast.
Bonn1997 wrote:BRIGGS wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Surround or replace?We'll they have to make that determination after the season. With 57mm going to the *big three*(and an additional 12 mm to Kidd Novak Felton) the only assets we have are one 20 something first rounder and 3mm$ --it certainly will be nearly impossible. We'll have to evaluate the team going down the stretch. I really thought our best chance at doing anything was this year. How does the oldest team in the league improve by getting older?
If we cant get to the ECF with or without Amare--tough decisions will need to be made. We sold our soul for Carmelo and our owner's main function is to sell a playoff team to fans who pay a LOT in ticket$$$. I really do believe that Isiah Thomas is in the ear of Dolan--the Carmelo trade --atleast to me stinks of IT's hands on it.
Really? I think Isiah would have preferred Deron Williams.
Thankfully we got Melo instead of the declining D Williams.
Knixkik wrote:knickstorrents wrote:Knixkik wrote:What do you mean it didn't work? They went to the WCF in the difficult west. That team would have made the finals in the east. You act like 6 teams win the title every year or if you don't win it all it was an unsuccessful season. Melo led that team to a great season. Many many stars did not win nba championships in their careers. Are you going to discredit Malone stockton Barkley etc and say it never really worked for them?If the Knicks end up with Carmelo for 7 seasons and get knocked out in the first round for 6 of them, is that success to you?
The one year they really got Melo talent they went to the WCF. The rest of the years there just wasn't a great supporting cast which was what the argument is. Old iverson wasn't a good fit. They had a small window with Billups still in his prime and they were a contender. So to answer your question I would not be happy but I don't blame Melo if we fail to give him a good supporting cast.
you have it backwards. melo doesn't make others better he makes them worse. so the notion of surrounding him with enough talent-- a good enough "supporting cast" LOL-- as though he is an elite team player... is a recipe for failure. what melo needs is an already very very strong playoff team to join, one with a great coach and with a culture of success.
dk7th wrote:Knixkik wrote:knickstorrents wrote:Knixkik wrote:What do you mean it didn't work? They went to the WCF in the difficult west. That team would have made the finals in the east. You act like 6 teams win the title every year or if you don't win it all it was an unsuccessful season. Melo led that team to a great season. Many many stars did not win nba championships in their careers. Are you going to discredit Malone stockton Barkley etc and say it never really worked for them?If the Knicks end up with Carmelo for 7 seasons and get knocked out in the first round for 6 of them, is that success to you?
The one year they really got Melo talent they went to the WCF. The rest of the years there just wasn't a great supporting cast which was what the argument is. Old iverson wasn't a good fit. They had a small window with Billups still in his prime and they were a contender. So to answer your question I would not be happy but I don't blame Melo if we fail to give him a good supporting cast.
you have it backwards. melo doesn't make others better he makes them worse. so the notion of surrounding him with enough talent-- a good enough "supporting cast" LOL-- as though he is an elite team player... is a recipe for failure. what melo needs is an already very very strong playoff team to join, one with a great coach and with a culture of success.
I agree, thats why im confused by the ppl who wish we signed lin
I hope im wrong but melo may not win a championship until he becomes a role player and he's thesupporting cast
knicks1248 wrote:dk7th wrote:Knixkik wrote:knickstorrents wrote:Knixkik wrote:What do you mean it didn't work? They went to the WCF in the difficult west. That team would have made the finals in the east. You act like 6 teams win the title every year or if you don't win it all it was an unsuccessful season. Melo led that team to a great season. Many many stars did not win nba championships in their careers. Are you going to discredit Malone stockton Barkley etc and say it never really worked for them?If the Knicks end up with Carmelo for 7 seasons and get knocked out in the first round for 6 of them, is that success to you?
The one year they really got Melo talent they went to the WCF. The rest of the years there just wasn't a great supporting cast which was what the argument is. Old iverson wasn't a good fit. They had a small window with Billups still in his prime and they were a contender. So to answer your question I would not be happy but I don't blame Melo if we fail to give him a good supporting cast.
you have it backwards. melo doesn't make others better he makes them worse. so the notion of surrounding him with enough talent-- a good enough "supporting cast" LOL-- as though he is an elite team player... is a recipe for failure. what melo needs is an already very very strong playoff team to join, one with a great coach and with a culture of success.
I agree, thats why im confused by the ppl who wish we signed lin
I hope im wrong but melo may not win a championship until he becomes a role player and he's thesupporting cast
you're not wrong.
GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:holfresh wrote:I like the 2 millions threads that pop up to say whats really wrong with the Knicks without stating the obvious...Amare hasn't been able to compete for what will be the three consecutive year in the playoffs...Such a big piece being constantly hurt just kills your franchise...He was just a bad signing by Donnie...Swap out Amare with Chris Paul and we would be battling the Heat to the Finals this year and every year...Good character guys or no good character guys...I was gonna say this but you beat me to it. If we have Amare on the books for max salary and he's not playing like an All Star there's no amount of trading for role players that's going to turn us into a title contender.
If anything this team is going to get worse next year with no JR Smith (as much as people moan about him, who else are you bringing in at that price?) and Felton, Camby, Kidd all a year older and slower.
JR Smith is the best contract on the team
dk7th wrote:knicks1248 wrote:dk7th wrote:Knixkik wrote:knickstorrents wrote:Knixkik wrote:What do you mean it didn't work? They went to the WCF in the difficult west. That team would have made the finals in the east. You act like 6 teams win the title every year or if you don't win it all it was an unsuccessful season. Melo led that team to a great season. Many many stars did not win nba championships in their careers. Are you going to discredit Malone stockton Barkley etc and say it never really worked for them?If the Knicks end up with Carmelo for 7 seasons and get knocked out in the first round for 6 of them, is that success to you?
The one year they really got Melo talent they went to the WCF. The rest of the years there just wasn't a great supporting cast which was what the argument is. Old iverson wasn't a good fit. They had a small window with Billups still in his prime and they were a contender. So to answer your question I would not be happy but I don't blame Melo if we fail to give him a good supporting cast.
you have it backwards. melo doesn't make others better he makes them worse. so the notion of surrounding him with enough talent-- a good enough "supporting cast" LOL-- as though he is an elite team player... is a recipe for failure. what melo needs is an already very very strong playoff team to join, one with a great coach and with a culture of success.
I agree, thats why im confused by the ppl who wish we signed lin
I hope im wrong but melo may not win a championship until he becomes a role player and he's thesupporting cast
you're not wrong.
What really burns me up about melo, he has the ability to play unselfish, efficient, defend ferociously, and make guys better. You see it from time to time and you just wonder why doesn't he play that way on most nights.
There's nothing worse then someone who's inconsistent, because you nvr know what to expect.
Thats in all walks of life. No one wants to deal with someone or somthing thats somtimish
dk7th wrote:knicks1248 wrote:dk7th wrote:Knixkik wrote:knickstorrents wrote:Knixkik wrote:What do you mean it didn't work? They went to the WCF in the difficult west. That team would have made the finals in the east. You act like 6 teams win the title every year or if you don't win it all it was an unsuccessful season. Melo led that team to a great season. Many many stars did not win nba championships in their careers. Are you going to discredit Malone stockton Barkley etc and say it never really worked for them?If the Knicks end up with Carmelo for 7 seasons and get knocked out in the first round for 6 of them, is that success to you?
The one year they really got Melo talent they went to the WCF. The rest of the years there just wasn't a great supporting cast which was what the argument is. Old iverson wasn't a good fit. They had a small window with Billups still in his prime and they were a contender. So to answer your question I would not be happy but I don't blame Melo if we fail to give him a good supporting cast.
you have it backwards. melo doesn't make others better he makes them worse. so the notion of surrounding him with enough talent-- a good enough "supporting cast" LOL-- as though he is an elite team player... is a recipe for failure. what melo needs is an already very very strong playoff team to join, one with a great coach and with a culture of success.
I agree, thats why im confused by the ppl who wish we signed lin
I hope im wrong but melo may not win a championship until he becomes a role player and he's thesupporting cast
you're not wrong.
Sorry but this reads as just hater talk. I'm sure Gallo and Lin were the answers to all our perceived problems. Melo is in the same spot as most other star players over the years.
YOu are the same fans who probably thought Ewing wasn't a superstar either. Appreciate your best players as a fan. Only Knicks fans.
Knixkik wrote:Sorry but this reads as just hater talk. I'm sure Gallo and Lin were the answers to all our perceived problems. Melo is in the same spot as most other star players over the years.YOu are the same fans who probably thought Ewing wasn't a superstar either. Appreciate your best players as a fan. Only Knicks fans.
Hes speaking from hate but hes kind of right. Melo doesnt consistently do the things that make this team better. We saw in the beginning of the season him moving the ball, playing hard nosed defense, doing the dirty work (diving on the floor, diving in the stands, etc.) and hes stopped doing those things recently. The problem I have is that DK is speaking as if hes not capable of doing it which he is.
TeamBall wrote:Knixkik wrote:Sorry but this reads as just hater talk. I'm sure Gallo and Lin were the answers to all our perceived problems. Melo is in the same spot as most other star players over the years.YOu are the same fans who probably thought Ewing wasn't a superstar either. Appreciate your best players as a fan. Only Knicks fans.
Hes speaking from hate but hes kind of right. Melo doesnt consistently do the things that make this team better. We saw in the beginning of the season him moving the ball, playing hard nosed defense, doing the dirty work (diving on the floor, diving in the stands, etc.) and hes stopped doing those things recently. The problem I have is that DK is speaking as if hes not capable of doing it which he is.
hey listen i agree he is capable and the fact that he doesn't play the right way all season every game is annoying. we all saw the first 10 games this year. but as has been mentioned he is brilliant but flawed. part of his flawed game is his selfishness and laziness. that doesn't speak to lack of talent but lack of character. so while i can see where so many are goo-goo over carmelo anthony and thought it was a good trade for the knicks, it's becoming ever clearer that his lack of character is catching up with him. just look at his post-season track record. you can expect the same this season and likely next as well. it is what it is.
knicks1248 wrote:dk7th wrote:Knixkik wrote:knickstorrents wrote:Knixkik wrote:What do you mean it didn't work? They went to the WCF in the difficult west. That team would have made the finals in the east. You act like 6 teams win the title every year or if you don't win it all it was an unsuccessful season. Melo led that team to a great season. Many many stars did not win nba championships in their careers. Are you going to discredit Malone stockton Barkley etc and say it never really worked for them?If the Knicks end up with Carmelo for 7 seasons and get knocked out in the first round for 6 of them, is that success to you?
The one year they really got Melo talent they went to the WCF. The rest of the years there just wasn't a great supporting cast which was what the argument is. Old iverson wasn't a good fit. They had a small window with Billups still in his prime and they were a contender. So to answer your question I would not be happy but I don't blame Melo if we fail to give him a good supporting cast.
you have it backwards. melo doesn't make others better he makes them worse. so the notion of surrounding him with enough talent-- a good enough "supporting cast" LOL-- as though he is an elite team player... is a recipe for failure. what melo needs is an already very very strong playoff team to join, one with a great coach and with a culture of success.
I agree, thats why im confused by the ppl who wish we signed lin
I hope im wrong but melo may not win a championship until he becomes a role player and he's thesupporting cast
bingo!
dk7th wrote:TeamBall wrote:Knixkik wrote:Sorry but this reads as just hater talk. I'm sure Gallo and Lin were the answers to all our perceived problems. Melo is in the same spot as most other star players over the years.YOu are the same fans who probably thought Ewing wasn't a superstar either. Appreciate your best players as a fan. Only Knicks fans.
Hes speaking from hate but hes kind of right. Melo doesnt consistently do the things that make this team better. We saw in the beginning of the season him moving the ball, playing hard nosed defense, doing the dirty work (diving on the floor, diving in the stands, etc.) and hes stopped doing those things recently. The problem I have is that DK is speaking as if hes not capable of doing it which he is.hey listen i agree he is capable and the fact that he doesn't play the right way all season every game is annoying. we all saw the first 10 games this year. but as has been mentioned he is brilliant but flawed. part of his flawed game is his selfishness and laziness. that doesn't speak to lack of talent but lack of character. so while i can see where so many are goo-goo over carmelo anthony and thought it was a good trade for the knicks, it's becoming ever clearer that his lack of character is catching up with him. just look at his post-season track record. you can expect the same this season and likely next as well. it is what it is.
It might just be me but I really cant write him off until I see him in the post season with a healthy team. I dont really count the Boston series cause the team was pretty depleted to begin with (ironically due to Melo himself) but last season was bad the way players were breaking down. Playoff wise, im reserving judgement until hes with a reasonably healthy Knicks squad.
TeamBall wrote:dk7th wrote:TeamBall wrote:Knixkik wrote:Sorry but this reads as just hater talk. I'm sure Gallo and Lin were the answers to all our perceived problems. Melo is in the same spot as most other star players over the years.YOu are the same fans who probably thought Ewing wasn't a superstar either. Appreciate your best players as a fan. Only Knicks fans.
Hes speaking from hate but hes kind of right. Melo doesnt consistently do the things that make this team better. We saw in the beginning of the season him moving the ball, playing hard nosed defense, doing the dirty work (diving on the floor, diving in the stands, etc.) and hes stopped doing those things recently. The problem I have is that DK is speaking as if hes not capable of doing it which he is.hey listen i agree he is capable and the fact that he doesn't play the right way all season every game is annoying. we all saw the first 10 games this year. but as has been mentioned he is brilliant but flawed. part of his flawed game is his selfishness and laziness. that doesn't speak to lack of talent but lack of character. so while i can see where so many are goo-goo over carmelo anthony and thought it was a good trade for the knicks, it's becoming ever clearer that his lack of character is catching up with him. just look at his post-season track record. you can expect the same this season and likely next as well. it is what it is.
It might just be me but I really cant write him off until I see him in the post season with a healthy team. I dont really count the Boston series cause the team was pretty depleted to begin with (ironically due to Melo himself) but last season was bad the way players were breaking down. Playoff wise, im reserving judgement until hes with a reasonably healthy Knicks squad.
Exactly right, he has been on some very poor playoff teams the past 2 years.
tkf wrote:knicks1248 wrote:dk7th wrote:Knixkik wrote:knickstorrents wrote:Knixkik wrote:What do you mean it didn't work? They went to the WCF in the difficult west. That team would have made the finals in the east. You act like 6 teams win the title every year or if you don't win it all it was an unsuccessful season. Melo led that team to a great season. Many many stars did not win nba championships in their careers. Are you going to discredit Malone stockton Barkley etc and say it never really worked for them?If the Knicks end up with Carmelo for 7 seasons and get knocked out in the first round for 6 of them, is that success to you?
The one year they really got Melo talent they went to the WCF. The rest of the years there just wasn't a great supporting cast which was what the argument is. Old iverson wasn't a good fit. They had a small window with Billups still in his prime and they were a contender. So to answer your question I would not be happy but I don't blame Melo if we fail to give him a good supporting cast.
you have it backwards. melo doesn't make others better he makes them worse. so the notion of surrounding him with enough talent-- a good enough "supporting cast" LOL-- as though he is an elite team player... is a recipe for failure. what melo needs is an already very very strong playoff team to join, one with a great coach and with a culture of success.
I agree, thats why im confused by the ppl who wish we signed lin
I hope im wrong but melo may not win a championship until he becomes a role player and he's thesupporting cast
bingo!
If you think thats the case then its fine. But trading him isn't the answer. Try to build a team like the Celtics did with Pierce or the Mavs did with Dirk. You are more likely to win a title that way then the rebuild method.