Knicks · how do you build a successful playoff team around this? (page 1)
L 10-28 .357%
W 7-23 .304%
L 8-24 .333%
L 10-35 .286%
35-110 = 32% shooting over his last 4 game in the playoffs. 38% over all.
When I would talk about Carmelo's poor playoff shooting %s the most constructive retorts I would get would be things like hater and MDA apologist.
Well how do you deny this? How do you build a team thats supposed to contend around a guy who chucks like this? When you see the volumes off poor shots he's putting up in these playoffs you can see pretty easily how his career 41% shooting and terrible post season record do go hand in hand after all.
Maybe we could get away with this against the Nets with no Rondo and Pierce shooting worth of crap. This wont work against the Pacers.
Knicks should win a couple games but this has Pacers in 6 written all over it. Hoping Im wrong, but hard to see us advancing built like this.
VMart - we do not have superstars. We have two fatally flawed lead dogs who are unpredictable, petulant, stubborn and gifted. They have too much playground creativity to be properly harnessed. They will never shoot 50 per cent, except during solar flares.
Our hoodrats do not speak proper english. They are products of meaner streets than most of us have known. They offend the senses with their mere presence on a Broadway stage. What are they doing here? Neither was coveted. One caused us to break our piggy bank. The other left China on terrible terms. Too much trouble.
These are not great men. Nor will they ever be great men. They are simply basketball players who followed fortunate paths to pro careers. One never attended college. The other probably attended the minimal amount of easy courses. That is the path that was paved for them by people who understood their gifts could make money for someone else.
Carmelo Anthony and Earl Smith Jr are not great men. They are only put on display to sell something to someone else.
For better and worse, they are also ours.
DurzoBlint wrote:you guys do realize he is hurt (shoulder) right? Not that his percentage would skyrocket or anything if he wasn't but, I doubt he'd be this putrid if healthy. Dude just refuses to use injury as an excuse- which it isn't. You suit up to play then you can't use the injury hedge imo
That still doesn't excuse bad shot selection and poor shooting, if anything if he is hurt more reason to pass and use teammates the assist totals just aren't there. The thing is he isn't a bad passer, needs to trust his teammates more.
Vmart wrote:DurzoBlint wrote:you guys do realize he is hurt (shoulder) right? Not that his percentage would skyrocket or anything if he wasn't but, I doubt he'd be this putrid if healthy. Dude just refuses to use injury as an excuse- which it isn't. You suit up to play then you can't use the injury hedge imoThat still doesn't excuse bad shot selection and poor shooting, if anything if he is hurt more reason to pass and use teammates the assist totals just aren't there. The thing is he isn't a bad passer, needs to trust his teammates more.
oh, I totally agree with that. Dude is pissing me off by NOT passing out to the open man. He can have 3guys covering him and still won't pass the damn ball.
DurzoBlint wrote:you guys do realize he is hurt (shoulder) right? Not that his percentage would skyrocket or anything if he wasn't but, I doubt he'd be this putrid if healthy. Dude just refuses to use injury as an excuse- which it isn't. You suit up to play then you can't use the injury hedge imo
If he shot 4 for 11 and had 9 assists, no one would complain. The problem is that he can't shoot the ball into an ocean but is still taking 30 shots a game and is not interested in sharing the ball with teammates.
Edit: I see in your next reply that your on the same page as I am though.
Bonn1997 wrote:DurzoBlint wrote:you guys do realize he is hurt (shoulder) right? Not that his percentage would skyrocket or anything if he wasn't but, I doubt he'd be this putrid if healthy. Dude just refuses to use injury as an excuse- which it isn't. You suit up to play then you can't use the injury hedge imo
If he shot 4 for 11 and had 9 assists, no one would complain. The problem is that he can't shoot the ball into an ocean but is still taking 30 shots a game and is not interested in sharing the ball with teammates.
Edit: I see in your next reply that your on the same page as I am though.
so many times I'd see a wide open Prig, Shump, etc., but instead of passing out of the "TRIPLE TEAM" he tries to force a terrible shot. Woody needs to sit his as down, go over the tape and say...see your covered by 3guys in the post leaving at least two teammates open on the elbow and top of the key. If you make the shot, then gravy but, when you miss it you look like a chucker and a piss poor teammate.
We complain about guys standing around watching but, its human nature when you know he won't pass the ball
DurzoBlint wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:DurzoBlint wrote:you guys do realize he is hurt (shoulder) right? Not that his percentage would skyrocket or anything if he wasn't but, I doubt he'd be this putrid if healthy. Dude just refuses to use injury as an excuse- which it isn't. You suit up to play then you can't use the injury hedge imo
If he shot 4 for 11 and had 9 assists, no one would complain. The problem is that he can't shoot the ball into an ocean but is still taking 30 shots a game and is not interested in sharing the ball with teammates.
Edit: I see in your next reply that your on the same page as I am though.so many times I'd see a wide open Prig, Shump, etc., but instead of passing out of the "TRIPLE TEAM" he tries to force a terrible shot. Woody needs to sit his as down, go over the tape and say...see your covered by 3guys in the post leaving at least two teammates open on the elbow and top of the key. If you make the shot, then gravy but, when you miss it you look like a chucker and a piss poor teammate.
We complain about guys standing around watching but, its human nature when you know he won't pass the ball
I'd seriously take bets on that one, especially if we lose.
How about, if there's three guys covering Melo, wouldn't it make sense to cut to the basket? Maybe actually come into Mr. Chucker's field of view? It seemed to work for Stat and Kmart. We've already established Chuck's only looking at the rim area. Is having too many people open in the paint a problem we can't figure out how to overcome?
Sorry, I forgot, it's better and easier to blame our starphucqued ahole.
jrodmc wrote:DurzoBlint wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:DurzoBlint wrote:you guys do realize he is hurt (shoulder) right? Not that his percentage would skyrocket or anything if he wasn't but, I doubt he'd be this putrid if healthy. Dude just refuses to use injury as an excuse- which it isn't. You suit up to play then you can't use the injury hedge imo
If he shot 4 for 11 and had 9 assists, no one would complain. The problem is that he can't shoot the ball into an ocean but is still taking 30 shots a game and is not interested in sharing the ball with teammates.
Edit: I see in your next reply that your on the same page as I am though.so many times I'd see a wide open Prig, Shump, etc., but instead of passing out of the "TRIPLE TEAM" he tries to force a terrible shot. Woody needs to sit his as down, go over the tape and say...see your covered by 3guys in the post leaving at least two teammates open on the elbow and top of the key. If you make the shot, then gravy but, when you miss it you look like a chucker and a piss poor teammate.
We complain about guys standing around watching but, its human nature when you know he won't pass the ball
I'd seriously take bets on that one, especially if we lose.How about, if there's three guys covering Melo, wouldn't it make sense to cut to the basket? Maybe actually come into Mr. Chucker's field of view? It seemed to work for Stat and Kmart. We've already established Chuck's only looking at the rim area. Is having too many people open in the paint a problem we can't figure out how to overcome?
Sorry, I forgot, it's better and easier to blame our starphucqued ahole.
I agree with the bolded. I've said this before, its not so much that we dont move the ball, we dont have anough body movement. No back cuts, weakside flares or baselin flex cuts across the lane etc. I'm not excusing Melo, in fact I agree that 30 shots per is way too much. With that said, when Melo has the ball on the strong side, everyone hovers around the 3 point line and waits on the weakside. We need to get more basket cuts similar to what Bradley and Green would do when Pierce was isolated....
Uptown wrote:jrodmc wrote:DurzoBlint wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:DurzoBlint wrote:you guys do realize he is hurt (shoulder) right? Not that his percentage would skyrocket or anything if he wasn't but, I doubt he'd be this putrid if healthy. Dude just refuses to use injury as an excuse- which it isn't. You suit up to play then you can't use the injury hedge imo
If he shot 4 for 11 and had 9 assists, no one would complain. The problem is that he can't shoot the ball into an ocean but is still taking 30 shots a game and is not interested in sharing the ball with teammates.
Edit: I see in your next reply that your on the same page as I am though.so many times I'd see a wide open Prig, Shump, etc., but instead of passing out of the "TRIPLE TEAM" he tries to force a terrible shot. Woody needs to sit his as down, go over the tape and say...see your covered by 3guys in the post leaving at least two teammates open on the elbow and top of the key. If you make the shot, then gravy but, when you miss it you look like a chucker and a piss poor teammate.
We complain about guys standing around watching but, its human nature when you know he won't pass the ball
I'd seriously take bets on that one, especially if we lose.How about, if there's three guys covering Melo, wouldn't it make sense to cut to the basket? Maybe actually come into Mr. Chucker's field of view? It seemed to work for Stat and Kmart. We've already established Chuck's only looking at the rim area. Is having too many people open in the paint a problem we can't figure out how to overcome?
Sorry, I forgot, it's better and easier to blame our starphucqued ahole.
I agree with the bolded. I've said this before, its not so much that we dont move the ball, we dont have anough body movement. No back cuts, weakside flares or baselin flex cuts across the lane etc. I'm not excusing Melo, in fact I agree that 30 shots per is way too much. With that said, when Melo has the ball on the strong side, everyone hovers around the 3 point line and waits on the weakside. We need to get more basket cuts similar to what Bradley and Green would do when Pierce was isolated....
You have to ask what came first - Melo never passing or the teammates standing around. None of these guys has a history of being lazy on other teams. So it's not a hard question to answer.
Vmart wrote:I agree with you Fishmike, for me superstars shoot 50% or better. That's why I find Bernard King references to Melo' s game laughable. Look LeBron shoots way above 50%, Durant does it too so does Wade. Having purpose with shots is of utmost importance. THAT TO ME DETERMINES GREATNESS. I like Melo I will continue he to root for him to get better. I not going to put this all on him. I believe you win as a team and lose as a team. With that said Woody has to make Melo understand that quality shots is what he is looking for. As for JR I have not faith in him to bring his A game.
And so do I... Bernard was a special player... too bad his time here was cut short..
I not going to put this all on him. I believe you win as a team and lose as a team. With that said Woody has to make Melo understand that quality shots is what he is looking for. As for JR I have not faith in him to bring his A game.
true and false.. the problem also falls on the GM's and owners that think he is the guy to build around... you end up changing your team to suit him and that is the mistake.. a huge mistake.. take for instance.. I am not really a felton fan, but honestly, the ball should be in his hands more right now... His play, and carmelo's horrible shooting pretty much justifies that.. yet that will never happen.. woodson will not risk getting fired because he took the ball out of carmelo's hands and carmelo will sabotage the team if that happens.. He has done it before.. you are almost trapped when you get this guy and decide to build a team around him... it is a mistake... so yes and no.. it isn't all on him, but to some degree it is....
With that said Woody has to make Melo understand that quality shots is what he is looking for.
again, how does woody accomplish that?.. carmelo has spent the past 10 seasons playing this way, and people continue to call him the best pure scorer... it is fools gold.. there is nothing woodson can do really.. i saw this same thing happen in Atlanta with Joe johnson... until woodson is ready to bench his azz every time he jacks up ridiculous shots.. he will never change... I was sitting next to this older man in the bar.. he was not a knick fan, nor a hater.. and he said.. "the problem with carmelo Anthony is that he is a legend in his own mind".. to me, that sums it all up.. this dude is not going to change.... and as you said.. JR smith, is who he is..good luck changing that fool.. LOL....
just look around at Kidd and tyson chandler, they almost look defeated at times, they are having to tell carmelo to stop complaining, to play ball, to focus.. I mean really? i am looking at jason kidd and he looks like he is just tired... collect the check and move on.. only so much babysitting he can do..
Bonn1997 wrote:Uptown wrote:jrodmc wrote:DurzoBlint wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:DurzoBlint wrote:you guys do realize he is hurt (shoulder) right? Not that his percentage would skyrocket or anything if he wasn't but, I doubt he'd be this putrid if healthy. Dude just refuses to use injury as an excuse- which it isn't. You suit up to play then you can't use the injury hedge imo
If he shot 4 for 11 and had 9 assists, no one would complain. The problem is that he can't shoot the ball into an ocean but is still taking 30 shots a game and is not interested in sharing the ball with teammates.
Edit: I see in your next reply that your on the same page as I am though.so many times I'd see a wide open Prig, Shump, etc., but instead of passing out of the "TRIPLE TEAM" he tries to force a terrible shot. Woody needs to sit his as down, go over the tape and say...see your covered by 3guys in the post leaving at least two teammates open on the elbow and top of the key. If you make the shot, then gravy but, when you miss it you look like a chucker and a piss poor teammate.
We complain about guys standing around watching but, its human nature when you know he won't pass the ball
I'd seriously take bets on that one, especially if we lose.How about, if there's three guys covering Melo, wouldn't it make sense to cut to the basket? Maybe actually come into Mr. Chucker's field of view? It seemed to work for Stat and Kmart. We've already established Chuck's only looking at the rim area. Is having too many people open in the paint a problem we can't figure out how to overcome?
Sorry, I forgot, it's better and easier to blame our starphucqued ahole.
I agree with the bolded. I've said this before, its not so much that we dont move the ball, we dont have anough body movement. No back cuts, weakside flares or baselin flex cuts across the lane etc. I'm not excusing Melo, in fact I agree that 30 shots per is way too much. With that said, when Melo has the ball on the strong side, everyone hovers around the 3 point line and waits on the weakside. We need to get more basket cuts similar to what Bradley and Green would do when Pierce was isolated....
You have to ask what came first - Melo never passing or the teammates standing around. None of these guys has a history of being lazy on other teams. So it's not a hard question to answer.
If you watched Game 6 of the Celts game, we actaully saw plenty of body movement and cuts. I remember specifically, Priggs cut baseline when Melo had the ball at the top of the key and fed Priggs for a layup. He passed to Priggs on another occasion when he cut but he missed the shot. I think if you cut into his vision, he'll give the ball up. JR and Shump are our best athletes and should be slicing to the basket on the regular, but they both would rather launch 3's.....Woodson has to put these sets in and force guys to basket-cut....
Clearly they also need to hit the friggin boards too but I have more faith in guys like Chandler, KMart, and SHumpert hitting the boards than I do Melo and JR to share when they're pressed up against the wall and guys like Kidd making crisp bounce passes than lazy half court lobs.
I am thoroughly disappointed but I'd rather root for the best that this team has than not. I have seen them perform at a high level and they're prideful. Hopefully they prove the people booing at the end of the game wrong instead of crying about it, like they did all game to the refs
Chris Paul is a beast and he didnt make it out of the first round.
Stars need help. Melo is playing with castaways.
AnubisADL wrote:Melo is a beast.Chris Paul is a beast and he didnt make it out of the first round.
Stars need help. Melo is playing with castaways.
Melo and JR's supporting cast shot .553 from the field yesterday. That's not good enough?!
Vmart wrote:I agree with you Fishmike, for me superstars shoot 50% or better. That's why I find Bernard King references to Melo' s game laughable. Look LeBron shoots way above 50%, Durant does it too so does Wade. Having purpose with shots is of utmost importance. THAT TO ME DETERMINES GREATNESS. I like Melo I will continue he to root for him to get better. I not going to put this all on him. I believe you win as a team and lose as a team. With that said Woody has to make Melo understand that quality shots is what he is looking for. As for JR I have not faith in him to bring his A game.
Kobe isnt a superstar then?
nyk4ever wrote:the thing about carmelo's shooting is that he's not taking a ton of awful shots.. he's missing mid-range j's, shots at the rim and obviously his 3-shooting has been way off. there hasn't been alot of times he shoots the ball and im screaming at the tv because he shot it with 4 guys on him, he's just not making anything, wide open or not. it's 4 games though, so you do start to wonder, why can't he hit the broad side of a barn? dude has to get it together and quick.
True. I think he knows that and yesterday he tried to take it to the hole a bunch of times and came up emtpty. I thought he got hit several times and the Refs swallowed their whistles on some plays.
dimicech wrote:Vmart wrote:I agree with you Fishmike, for me superstars shoot 50% or better. That's why I find Bernard King references to Melo' s game laughable. Look LeBron shoots way above 50%, Durant does it too so does Wade. Having purpose with shots is of utmost importance. THAT TO ME DETERMINES GREATNESS. I like Melo I will continue he to root for him to get better. I not going to put this all on him. I believe you win as a team and lose as a team. With that said Woody has to make Melo understand that quality shots is what he is looking for. As for JR I have not faith in him to bring his A game.
Kobe isnt a superstar then?
Evidently not.