Knicks · Carmelo's true NY legacy begins in the next game (page 2)
Andrew wrote:Is a bumb a cross between a bum and a bomb?
As a matter of fact yes. I meant to say bumb©
Uptown wrote:I though game 2 was a Melo moment? So, to be clear, are we saying he has to win, on the road against a team that his team has tremendous matchup problems against? What happens if he puts up a 30 and 50% and we still lose?
Hard to say. The 50% would be nice but if he's a superstar, he's gotta find a way to consistently contribute in some (or at least one!) areas of the game other than scoring.
tkf wrote:Knixkik wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:This is the most important game of his Knicks' career but the previous 2 years still count and are part of whatever legacy he leaves. You don't get a reset button every year.Game 6 against the Celtics was his most important game of his Knicks career. It was a must-win in Boston, Knicks fans would have gone over the ledge if they forced a game 7. He had help from Shump, Prig, and Felton, but when the Celtics made the late run, Melo scored 7 big points and overall he delivered. That game put us in the 2nd round which Knicks fans must be happy about (although they won't.) Melo was the reason we took that giant step by winning a playoff series. What he does today is huge, but his Knicks career has already accomplished more than we have seen in over a decade.
moreso than spree and Houston?
They were the last to really accomplish what Melo has, and they had each other to do it. Melo has had some help, but not from the expected sources. Again, he has gone thru the playoffs without another player performing like a star. JR and Chandler have been disappointing and Shumpert, Felton, and Prig have been great, but aren't stars. Can't expect much more from Melo than a 1st round win and competitive 2nd round and out unless he gets more help.
Bippity10 wrote:I'll say it again to all if you. Doesn't matter what you think of him. Doesn't matter if you think he has already proven that he is a superstar. Doesn't matter if you think he is a bumb. Doesn't matter if you think he is going to be treated unfairly. What matters is that SUPERSTARS step up in games like this. Superstars go for 36 and 19. Superstars go 22 and 20. Superstars don't wait for Chandler or JR. Superstars go all out on both ends of the floor and force the Pacers to steal the game from them. Win or lose, great support or no support. Fair or unfair. To be a SUPERSTAR you have to get it done.If you can't get it done. If you can't lift up your team, THEN YOU ARE NOT A SUPERSTAR. You may be a damn good player that we can all root for and support. No shame in that. But YOU ARE NOT A SUPERSTAR.
why is that up for debate?
These are the moments my friend. Instead of us crying about how our team can't stop Hibbard, Pacers fans should be crying about how they can't stop Melo
In your opinion, who are the superstars playing in todays game?
Uptown wrote:Bippity10 wrote:I'll say it again to all if you. Doesn't matter what you think of him. Doesn't matter if you think he has already proven that he is a superstar. Doesn't matter if you think he is a bumb. Doesn't matter if you think he is going to be treated unfairly. What matters is that SUPERSTARS step up in games like this. Superstars go for 36 and 19. Superstars go 22 and 20. Superstars don't wait for Chandler or JR. Superstars go all out on both ends of the floor and force the Pacers to steal the game from them. Win or lose, great support or no support. Fair or unfair. To be a SUPERSTAR you have to get it done.If you can't get it done. If you can't lift up your team, THEN YOU ARE NOT A SUPERSTAR. You may be a damn good player that we can all root for and support. No shame in that. But YOU ARE NOT A SUPERSTAR.
why is that up for debate?
These are the moments my friend. Instead of us crying about how our team can't stop Hibbard, Pacers fans should be crying about how they can't stop Melo
In your opinion, who are the superstars playing in todays game?
Without giving thought I would say Kevin Durante, Lebron and Kobe(may drop off this list and join the former superstars list). There are quite a few that can become "superstars" but they too will have to perform under similar circumstances as Melo someday. Off the top of my head I think of Chris Paul, Derrick Rose, Stephen Curry,etc.
Why do you ask?
Also, at one point Michael was on the list of "prove it to me" players. He of course proved it
tkf wrote:Knixkik wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:This is the most important game of his Knicks' career but the previous 2 years still count and are part of whatever legacy he leaves. You don't get a reset button every year.Game 6 against the Celtics was his most important game of his Knicks career. It was a must-win in Boston, Knicks fans would have gone over the ledge if they forced a game 7. He had help from Shump, Prig, and Felton, but when the Celtics made the late run, Melo scored 7 big points and overall he delivered. That game put us in the 2nd round which Knicks fans must be happy about (although they won't.) Melo was the reason we took that giant step by winning a playoff series. What he does today is huge, but his Knicks career has already accomplished more than we have seen in over a decade.
moreso than spree and Houston?
Papabear Says
Never liked Spree (never changed) but loved Houston but he was a poor ball handler and not great at going to the basket but was a hell of a pure shooter
Bippity10 wrote:Uptown wrote:Bippity10 wrote:I'll say it again to all if you. Doesn't matter what you think of him. Doesn't matter if you think he has already proven that he is a superstar. Doesn't matter if you think he is a bumb. Doesn't matter if you think he is going to be treated unfairly. What matters is that SUPERSTARS step up in games like this. Superstars go for 36 and 19. Superstars go 22 and 20. Superstars don't wait for Chandler or JR. Superstars go all out on both ends of the floor and force the Pacers to steal the game from them. Win or lose, great support or no support. Fair or unfair. To be a SUPERSTAR you have to get it done.If you can't get it done. If you can't lift up your team, THEN YOU ARE NOT A SUPERSTAR. You may be a damn good player that we can all root for and support. No shame in that. But YOU ARE NOT A SUPERSTAR.
why is that up for debate?
These are the moments my friend. Instead of us crying about how our team can't stop Hibbard, Pacers fans should be crying about how they can't stop Melo
In your opinion, who are the superstars playing in todays game?
Without giving thought I would say Kevin Durante, Lebron and Kobe(may drop off this list and join the former superstars list). There are quite a few that can become "superstars" but they too will have to perform under similar circumstances as Melo someday. Off the top of my head I think of Chris Paul, Derrick Rose, Stephen Curry,etc.
Why do you ask?
Also, at one point Michael was on the list of "prove it to me" players. He of course proved it
I agree with your list, although I go back and forth on Chris Paul being superstar status....I only ask to see if your definition of a true superstar is similar to my own which it appears to be. Its always interesting to see who people believe are true superstars....
Bippity10 wrote:I'll say it again to all if you. Doesn't matter what you think of him. Doesn't matter if you think he has already proven that he is a superstar. Doesn't matter if you think he is a bumb. Doesn't matter if you think he is going to be treated unfairly. What matters is that SUPERSTARS step up in games like this. Superstars go for 36 and 19. Superstars go 22 and 20. Superstars don't wait for Chandler or JR. Superstars go all out on both ends of the floor and force the Pacers to steal the game from them. Win or lose, great support or no support. Fair or unfair. To be a SUPERSTAR you have to get it done.If you can't get it done. If you can't lift up your team, THEN YOU ARE NOT A SUPERSTAR. You may be a damn good player that we can all root for and support. No shame in that. But YOU ARE NOT A SUPERSTAR.
why is that up for debate?
These are the moments my friend. Instead of us crying about how our team can't stop Hibbard, Pacers fans should be crying about how they can't stop Melo
Papabear Says
You know I hear what you are saying but there is something you must understand. The Pacers have a better team than we do. They are bigger and stronger any much younger. We have but one shooter on this team. Now let me repeat this one shooter. The Pacers have a 7 foot 2 inch center who has a mean hook shot and a hell of a defender. If you had a choice between him or Chandler who would you pick? From what I've seen so far even if we had LeBron James on our team instead of Melo it would be a hell of a hill to climb. Now getting back to Melo if you think he can save the day by him self or it's up to him. Then all of you who think that way is full of sh%t. It will take this whole team playing 48 min and maybe then some to win the next game. Sure Melo must play a big part but he has no one he can depend on to make big shots. Coach Wooden now must bring a game plan and the whole team must enforce the plan. All of you are asking Melo to do something that LeBron James couldn't do. I believe that is one of the reasons LeBron didn't want no parts of New York because if this same team was built around LeBron Jame he would have to take more shots and he'd be getting bashed and people talking about his mama.
3G4G wrote:lol @ these threads.....wasn't an identical thread made last series and since he played like trash for the most part up pops another one of these threads.
When Bip talks, one must listen.
martin wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:martin wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:This is the most important game of his Knicks' career but the previous 2 years still count and are part of whatever legacy he leaves. You don't get a reset button every year.Holy gay robot moment. "His career will be made up by his career." Jesus, you add all the good stuff to threads.
You can't differentiate between the last 2 years and a second round series moment that may either send the team packing or build momentum towards ECF?
Holy rude moderator moment IMO.
Insulting gay people isn't cool either.
Every season can be differentiated from past seasons (and I did so in my post actually). Your question makes no sense.Nalod, please take over
Im on it......
Bonn1997 wrote:martin wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:This is the most important game of his Knicks' career but the previous 2 years still count and are part of whatever legacy he leaves. You don't get a reset button every year.Holy gay robot moment. "His career will be made up by his career." Jesus, you add all the good stuff to threads.
You can't differentiate between the last 2 years and a second round series moment that may either send the team packing or build momentum towards ECF?
Holy rude moderator moment IMO.
Insulting gay people isn't cool either.
Every season can be differentiated from past seasons (and I did so in my post actually). Your question makes no sense.
Bonnie, are you out?
Nalod wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:martin wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:This is the most important game of his Knicks' career but the previous 2 years still count and are part of whatever legacy he leaves. You don't get a reset button every year.Holy gay robot moment. "His career will be made up by his career." Jesus, you add all the good stuff to threads.
You can't differentiate between the last 2 years and a second round series moment that may either send the team packing or build momentum towards ECF?
Holy rude moderator moment IMO.
Insulting gay people isn't cool either.
Every season can be differentiated from past seasons (and I did so in my post actually). Your question makes no sense.
Bonnie, are you out?
I am heterosexual and have an attractive girlfriend.
I don't appreciate being called gay and don't think it's right to use the word gay as an insult though.
Papabear wrote:Bippity10 wrote:I'll say it again to all if you. Doesn't matter what you think of him. Doesn't matter if you think he has already proven that he is a superstar. Doesn't matter if you think he is a bumb. Doesn't matter if you think he is going to be treated unfairly. What matters is that SUPERSTARS step up in games like this. Superstars go for 36 and 19. Superstars go 22 and 20. Superstars don't wait for Chandler or JR. Superstars go all out on both ends of the floor and force the Pacers to steal the game from them. Win or lose, great support or no support. Fair or unfair. To be a SUPERSTAR you have to get it done.If you can't get it done. If you can't lift up your team, THEN YOU ARE NOT A SUPERSTAR. You may be a damn good player that we can all root for and support. No shame in that. But YOU ARE NOT A SUPERSTAR.
why is that up for debate?
These are the moments my friend. Instead of us crying about how our team can't stop Hibbard, Pacers fans should be crying about how they can't stop Melo
Papabear SaysYou know I hear what you are saying but there is something you must understand. The Pacers have a better team than we do. They are bigger and stronger any much younger. We have but one shooter on this team. Now let me repeat this one shooter. The Pacers have a 7 foot 2 inch center who has a mean hook shot and a hell of a defender. If you had a choice between him or Chandler who would you pick? From what I've seen so far even if we had LeBron James on our team instead of Melo it would be a hell of a hill to climb. Now getting back to Melo if you think he can save the day by him self or it's up to him. Then all of you who think that way is full of sh%t. It will take this whole team playing 48 min and maybe then some to win the next game. Sure Melo must play a big part but he has no one he can depend on to make big shots. Coach Wooden now must bring a game plan and the whole team must enforce the plan. All of you are asking Melo to do something that LeBron James couldn't do. I believe that is one of the reasons LeBron didn't want no parts of New York because if this same team was built around LeBron Jame he would have to take more shots and he'd be getting bashed and people talking about his mama.
Besides you, who said anything about him winning the game by himself? When did I even say he had to win the game?
I even complemented the man. I never even alluded to whether he could or could not step up. My point passes no judgement. I cant tell the future he very well could put up 80 tomorrow. Why the need to defend him? I said he was a "star". I said he was great to watch and deserved our praise and support. But Melo wants to be considered a superstar. To be in that category you don't get to use teammates as an excuse for you yourself being mediocre. You can't go 6-16, complaining to refs(now I'm passing judgement) not getting back on d and doing very little to raise the energy level and play of your team. You can be an all-star and get away with that but not a true superstar. Superstars are legendary for a reason. Nights like tomorrow
I agree that much of the way we criticize our stars is unfair. This is not a thread intended to criticize. I'm just wondering is he a superstar or just another in a long line of very good players who will not be discussed for very long after he retires
3G4G wrote:lol @ these threads.....wasn't an identical thread made last series and since he played like trash for the most part up pops another one of these threads.
Next person to Lol at a thread that the Bip starts will be banned forever and quite possibly thrown in jail for treason. Go ahead and try me
Bippity10 wrote:Papabear wrote:Bippity10 wrote:I'll say it again to all if you. Doesn't matter what you think of him. Doesn't matter if you think he has already proven that he is a superstar. Doesn't matter if you think he is a bumb. Doesn't matter if you think he is going to be treated unfairly. What matters is that SUPERSTARS step up in games like this. Superstars go for 36 and 19. Superstars go 22 and 20. Superstars don't wait for Chandler or JR. Superstars go all out on both ends of the floor and force the Pacers to steal the game from them. Win or lose, great support or no support. Fair or unfair. To be a SUPERSTAR you have to get it done.If you can't get it done. If you can't lift up your team, THEN YOU ARE NOT A SUPERSTAR. You may be a damn good player that we can all root for and support. No shame in that. But YOU ARE NOT A SUPERSTAR.
why is that up for debate?
These are the moments my friend. Instead of us crying about how our team can't stop Hibbard, Pacers fans should be crying about how they can't stop Melo
Papabear SaysYou know I hear what you are saying but there is something you must understand. The Pacers have a better team than we do. They are bigger and stronger any much younger. We have but one shooter on this team. Now let me repeat this one shooter. The Pacers have a 7 foot 2 inch center who has a mean hook shot and a hell of a defender. If you had a choice between him or Chandler who would you pick? From what I've seen so far even if we had LeBron James on our team instead of Melo it would be a hell of a hill to climb. Now getting back to Melo if you think he can save the day by him self or it's up to him. Then all of you who think that way is full of sh%t. It will take this whole team playing 48 min and maybe then some to win the next game. Sure Melo must play a big part but he has no one he can depend on to make big shots. Coach Wooden now must bring a game plan and the whole team must enforce the plan. All of you are asking Melo to do something that LeBron James couldn't do. I believe that is one of the reasons LeBron didn't want no parts of New York because if this same team was built around LeBron Jame he would have to take more shots and he'd be getting bashed and people talking about his mama.
Besides you, who said anything about him winning the game by himself? When did I even say he had to win the game?
I even complemented the man. I never even alluded to whether he could or could not step up. My point passes no judgement. I cant tell the future he very well could put up 80 tomorrow. Why the need to defend him? I said he was a "star". I said he was great to watch and deserved our praise and support. But Melo wants to be considered a superstar. To be in that category you don't get to use teammates as an excuse for you yourself being mediocre. You can't go 6-16, complaining to refs(now I'm passing judgement) not getting back on d and doing very little to raise the energy level and play of your team. You can be an all-star and get away with that but not a true superstar. Superstars are legendary for a reason. Nights like tomorrow
I agree that much of the way we criticize our stars is unfair. This is not a thread intended to criticize. I'm just wondering is he a superstar or just another in a long line of very good players who will not be discussed for very long after he retires
his career trajectory sure likes it's heading in this direction.
Andrew wrote:Is a bumb a cross between a bum and a bomb?
a bumb= a bum waiting to explode! that's our man! Let's see how he blows up Game 4!
Go Knicks! Headband not included.
Bippity10 wrote:3G4G wrote:lol @ these threads.....wasn't an identical thread made last series and since he played like trash for the most part up pops another one of these threads.Next person to Lol at a thread that the Bip starts will be banned forever and quite possibly thrown in jail for treason. Go ahead and try me
3g4g this thread has nothing to do with last series or last game or something someone else wrote. This is about Melo and the "opportunity" to separate himself from the pack according to my opinion. There is no criticism in the original point
Now since you came to this thread you must have an opinion. Care to share?
Bippity10 wrote:Papabear wrote:Bippity10 wrote:I'll say it again to all if you. Doesn't matter what you think of him. Doesn't matter if you think he has already proven that he is a superstar. Doesn't matter if you think he is a bumb. Doesn't matter if you think he is going to be treated unfairly. What matters is that SUPERSTARS step up in games like this. Superstars go for 36 and 19. Superstars go 22 and 20. Superstars don't wait for Chandler or JR. Superstars go all out on both ends of the floor and force the Pacers to steal the game from them. Win or lose, great support or no support. Fair or unfair. To be a SUPERSTAR you have to get it done.If you can't get it done. If you can't lift up your team, THEN YOU ARE NOT A SUPERSTAR. You may be a damn good player that we can all root for and support. No shame in that. But YOU ARE NOT A SUPERSTAR.
why is that up for debate?
These are the moments my friend. Instead of us crying about how our team can't stop Hibbard, Pacers fans should be crying about how they can't stop Melo
Papabear SaysYou know I hear what you are saying but there is something you must understand. The Pacers have a better team than we do. They are bigger and stronger any much younger. We have but one shooter on this team. Now let me repeat this one shooter. The Pacers have a 7 foot 2 inch center who has a mean hook shot and a hell of a defender. If you had a choice between him or Chandler who would you pick? From what I've seen so far even if we had LeBron James on our team instead of Melo it would be a hell of a hill to climb. Now getting back to Melo if you think he can save the day by him self or it's up to him. Then all of you who think that way is full of sh%t. It will take this whole team playing 48 min and maybe then some to win the next game. Sure Melo must play a big part but he has no one he can depend on to make big shots. Coach Wooden now must bring a game plan and the whole team must enforce the plan. All of you are asking Melo to do something that LeBron James couldn't do. I believe that is one of the reasons LeBron didn't want no parts of New York because if this same team was built around LeBron Jame he would have to take more shots and he'd be getting bashed and people talking about his mama.
Besides you, who said anything about him winning the game by himself? When did I even say he had to win the game?
I even complemented the man. I never even alluded to whether he could or could not step up. My point passes no judgement. I cant tell the future he very well could put up 80 tomorrow. Why the need to defend him? I said he was a "star". I said he was great to watch and deserved our praise and support. But Melo wants to be considered a superstar. To be in that category you don't get to use teammates as an excuse for you yourself being mediocre. You can't go 6-16, complaining to refs(now I'm passing judgement) not getting back on d and doing very little to raise the energy level and play of your team. You can be an all-star and get away with that but not a true superstar. Superstars are legendary for a reason. Nights like tomorrow
I agree that much of the way we criticize our stars is unfair. This is not a thread intended to criticize. I'm just wondering is he a superstar or just another in a long line of very good players who will not be discussed for very long after he retires
Papabear Says
I'm not singling you out but is LeBron a Superstar?? Well why did he leave Cleveland? He had a better supporting cast than Melo have in New York. I'm not defending Melo I'm only trying to look at it in a fair way. If we had Wade and Bosh and the rest of the Heat cast I believe Melo would be doing just fine. People are saying this is it for Melo to get it done. Get it done with what?? What does he have to work with? That's all I am saying. Hey Melo wanted to come to New York he also new what would happen to the team if he didn't wait till the season was over. He didn't wait so he is part to blame also. But he would have been giving up a lot of money. Maybe everyone over at the Knicks camp is to blame. But here we are. This team will have to play the game of thier life to win tomorrow. It's not impossible if everyone steps up and Woodson brings a great game plan.
Papabear wrote:Bippity10 wrote:Papabear wrote:Bippity10 wrote:I'll say it again to all if you. Doesn't matter what you think of him. Doesn't matter if you think he has already proven that he is a superstar. Doesn't matter if you think he is a bumb. Doesn't matter if you think he is going to be treated unfairly. What matters is that SUPERSTARS step up in games like this. Superstars go for 36 and 19. Superstars go 22 and 20. Superstars don't wait for Chandler or JR. Superstars go all out on both ends of the floor and force the Pacers to steal the game from them. Win or lose, great support or no support. Fair or unfair. To be a SUPERSTAR you have to get it done.If you can't get it done. If you can't lift up your team, THEN YOU ARE NOT A SUPERSTAR. You may be a damn good player that we can all root for and support. No shame in that. But YOU ARE NOT A SUPERSTAR.
why is that up for debate?
These are the moments my friend. Instead of us crying about how our team can't stop Hibbard, Pacers fans should be crying about how they can't stop Melo
Papabear SaysYou know I hear what you are saying but there is something you must understand. The Pacers have a better team than we do. They are bigger and stronger any much younger. We have but one shooter on this team. Now let me repeat this one shooter. The Pacers have a 7 foot 2 inch center who has a mean hook shot and a hell of a defender. If you had a choice between him or Chandler who would you pick? From what I've seen so far even if we had LeBron James on our team instead of Melo it would be a hell of a hill to climb. Now getting back to Melo if you think he can save the day by him self or it's up to him. Then all of you who think that way is full of sh%t. It will take this whole team playing 48 min and maybe then some to win the next game. Sure Melo must play a big part but he has no one he can depend on to make big shots. Coach Wooden now must bring a game plan and the whole team must enforce the plan. All of you are asking Melo to do something that LeBron James couldn't do. I believe that is one of the reasons LeBron didn't want no parts of New York because if this same team was built around LeBron Jame he would have to take more shots and he'd be getting bashed and people talking about his mama.
Besides you, who said anything about him winning the game by himself? When did I even say he had to win the game?
I even complemented the man. I never even alluded to whether he could or could not step up. My point passes no judgement. I cant tell the future he very well could put up 80 tomorrow. Why the need to defend him? I said he was a "star". I said he was great to watch and deserved our praise and support. But Melo wants to be considered a superstar. To be in that category you don't get to use teammates as an excuse for you yourself being mediocre. You can't go 6-16, complaining to refs(now I'm passing judgement) not getting back on d and doing very little to raise the energy level and play of your team. You can be an all-star and get away with that but not a true superstar. Superstars are legendary for a reason. Nights like tomorrow
I agree that much of the way we criticize our stars is unfair. This is not a thread intended to criticize. I'm just wondering is he a superstar or just another in a long line of very good players who will not be discussed for very long after he retires
Papabear SaysI'm not singling you out but is LeBron a Superstar?? Well why did he leave Cleveland? He had a better supporting cast than Melo have in New York. I'm not defending Melo I'm only trying to look at it in a fair way. If we had Wade and Bosh and the rest of the Heat cast I believe Melo would be doing just fine. People are saying this is it for Melo to get it done. Get it done with what?? What does he have to work with? That's all I am saying. Hey Melo wanted to come to New York he also new what would happen to the team if he didn't wait till the season was over. He didn't wait so he is part to blame also. But he would have been giving up a lot of money. Maybe everyone over at the Knicks camp is to blame. But here we are. This team will have to play the game of thier life to win tomorrow. It's not impossible if everyone steps up and Woodson brings a great game plan.
That Cleveland team was garbage outside of Lebron. Garbage. And he dragged them to at least on Conference Finals and an NBA Finals.
On offense they had a plan to HELP MELO have a good game. They got the plays started earlier and they spread the floor much more than they did in game 3. They ran sets where Melo could get his shot off without a Pacer Help defender being able to prevent him from going baseline. We spread them out in a way that opened up the floor for Melo to get off. It's about the speed of the ball movement, player movement and spacing.
Another example of the same kind of set.
More plays where we put the Pacers in a tough spot having to give help which will open up the game for our shooters to get open looks with good ball movement. Also gives them an angle to attack the basket. Our sets were sloppy in game 3. They were bunched up or just not run well enough to work. IN that case they need to move the ball and start the play over and get a better look. This will HELP Melo to succeed at his role as a leader for this team. Woody has to make sure his guards get the team going with good sets and not just settle for bad offense. If they do this then Melo will have a real chance to be the star for this team. He can't just force it to happen. It starts with good Team BB.