playa2 wrote:Reggie Bullock was picked right after we picked Tim Hardaway Jr, that speaks volumes to me with Doc Rivers as head coach. Will Woodson make Hardaway sit as a rookie if he doesn't fill a void that the team already have?I really don't know how this pick helps the knicks with scoring.
Knicks took Hardaway because he was a pre-made role player. They dont have to develop him.
He can come in as a shooter off the bench and they dont have to worry about him acting a fool.
Solid pick, not great but not terrible considering some of the others we liked (Mitchell, Wolters, Ledo, and Muscala) were all second round picks. We took the BPA, he fills a need as a solid shooter and 2-way player and can play the 2 and 3. Maybe we landed a afflalo type. But regardless we know we have a long term rotation guy so can't argue against that value at 24.
@Nix
Very good points about THJ in this thread. its funny how me and you are usually on the same page when it comes to the Knicks draft picks. I don't understand the complaints about the 24th pick in a weak draft. We got a gut who is a good shooter, has pretty good athleticism, played at a great program for an outstanding coach, excelled against top notch competition in perhaps the best conference in CB last year and has great genes. He's a very underrated athlete who fills the lane very well, has good length and and can handle the ball better than he's credited for. This is a very solid pick...@24
The draft pick of Tim Hardaway Jr is basically JR Smith insurance if he bolts.
He possesses all the characteristics of JR(Streaky shooter, good athleticism) without the baggage. Good team player, knows his role.
In that regard the Anti-JR.
I know it makes little difference from a skills standpoint that Tim Hardaway is his Dad, but there is some sort of kharmic redistribution that we got the son of the guy who killed us so often in the playoffs while on the Heat, in order to help us return the favor to that same team
I like the pick. Solid role player. Not much more we could do at #24. Hopefully he matures quickly. Having TH at Knicks games will be a hoot, and it's not like his Dad is going to be a disinterested bystander to THJ's development.
I always hated the Heat, but LOVED Hardaway. His game was inspiring. Having him goad his son to get better will definitely help the boy develop.
I think Hardaway was a safe pick.
Knicks can't afford to fail anymore. So why not go safe and fill a need at SG. Letting JR leave will get us closer to that championship. We needed a young mature player, who can shoot without holding the ball..... Thats what we got!
My problem with the pick is that it should have been to greatest need or a player with a high ceiling. Instead we got someone at a potentially crowded spot at a relatively easy to fill position, who may only marginally contribute with out a pg to get him the ball. Can't create his own shot and not a good pull up shooter so probably not going to be effective in the pnr. Likely we'll end up trading him along with something else to another team where he'll play better.
nykshaknbake wrote:My problem with the pick is that it should have been to greatest need or a player with a high ceiling. Instead we got someone at a potentially crowded spot at a relatively easy to fill position, who may only marginally contribute with out a pg to get him the ball. Can't create his own shot and not a good pull up shooter so probably not going to be effective in the pnr. Likely we'll end up trading him along with something else to another team where he'll play better.
If you are building a team around Melo, who would you rather have JR Smith or Hardaway Jr?
JR Smith couldn't last a full season without going back to his old ways on and off the court. Jr is just learning how to mature, plus he needs to over dribble to score. If JR was a catch and shoot player, with more maturity, I would say lets keep him. But what if you can find a younger more mature version of JR, at a cheaper rate? Tim Hardaway Jr......
blkexec wrote:nykshaknbake wrote:My problem with the pick is that it should have been to greatest need or a player with a high ceiling. Instead we got someone at a potentially crowded spot at a relatively easy to fill position, who may only marginally contribute with out a pg to get him the ball. Can't create his own shot and not a good pull up shooter so probably not going to be effective in the pnr. Likely we'll end up trading him along with something else to another team where he'll play better.
If you are building a team around Melo, who would you rather have JR Smith or Hardaway Jr?
JR Smith couldn't last a full season without going back to his old ways on and off the court. Jr is just learning how to mature, plus he needs to over dribble to score. If JR was a catch and shoot player, with more maturity, I would say lets keep him. But what if you can find a younger more mature version of JR, at a cheaper rate? Tim Hardaway Jr......
THJ has a ways to go before you can say he's of the same calibur as JR as much of a headcase that he is. Even tools wise he doesn't have near the handle or the strength of JR. Isn't projected to be an above average defender like JR is. THJ right now is close to JR as JR is to Lebron James.
nykshaknbake wrote:blkexec wrote:nykshaknbake wrote:My problem with the pick is that it should have been to greatest need or a player with a high ceiling. Instead we got someone at a potentially crowded spot at a relatively easy to fill position, who may only marginally contribute with out a pg to get him the ball. Can't create his own shot and not a good pull up shooter so probably not going to be effective in the pnr. Likely we'll end up trading him along with something else to another team where he'll play better.
If you are building a team around Melo, who would you rather have JR Smith or Hardaway Jr?
JR Smith couldn't last a full season without going back to his old ways on and off the court. Jr is just learning how to mature, plus he needs to over dribble to score. If JR was a catch and shoot player, with more maturity, I would say lets keep him. But what if you can find a younger more mature version of JR, at a cheaper rate? Tim Hardaway Jr......
THJ has a ways to go before you can say he's of the same calibur as JR as much of a headcase that he is. Even tools wise he doesn't have near the handle or the strength of JR. Isn't projected to be an above average defender like JR is. THJ right now is close to JR as JR is to Lebron James.
I'm not comparing just talent. I'm looking at the entire JR package. And JR's off the court issues over his career, inconsistent performance, and other stuff are the negatives. Factor in his negatives and positives, and you will see JR can actually hurt more than help.
THJ is starting from a clean plate, without the perceived baggage. So yes, I would rather take a young SG with potential to be a scorer like JR, but without the off the court maturity issues. To me, it's a wash. Especially when you also factor in how much you have to pay JR Smith compared to THJ.
JR Smith vs THJ
JR is a gunner
is a black hole on offense
undersized SF
hit's a 3...then fouls someone behind the 3 on the other end
JR should not be a second option.
JR's stock is high, so he will command more dollars.
JR takes more bad shots than good.
THJ is a rookie, just happy to be drafted.
THJ is already more mature than JR.
THJ is cheap
Doesn't need to hold the ball to score.
He's a system guy vs JR smith is a pickup street ball guy
THJ takes more good shots than bad.
THJ is not affraid of the spot light or taking big shots.
I know THJ is just a rookie, and worst case, he may not even make the team. JR is a proven talent. I know....I know. I'm a fan just like everybody else. But as far as building a team, with a certain culture in mind, JR is not a good fit.
With all that, I rather have THJ right now, than JR Smith.....Pickup a volume scorer from either free agency or the D league, if we need more veteran scoring.
There are plenty of players that know how to put the ball in the basket. They are easy to find. It's the players to do both offense and defense, while not dominating the ball is hard to find.
Use the JR money to help pay for Copeland, THJ,Leslie and another 1 yr contract Free Agent....
Haven't seen much of Hardaway jr. Guess this pick shows that JR isn't a lock to get a new deal in NY. I would rather take my chances with Hardaway, just don't trust Smith to keep it together. Looking forward to seeing what Hardaway can do in the preseason and beyond.
Welcome Tim!
OK....lets make this easy. Forget the JR and THJ comparisons.
How about James White vs THJ
We can now cut the end of the bench 30+ yr old scrubs for young potential athletes.
blkexec wrote:OK....lets make this easy. Forget the JR and THJ comparisons.How about James White vs THJ
We can now cut the end of the bench 30+ yr old scrubs for young potential athletes.
Haha spot on!
If anything, THJ should make us forget about how useless James White and Ronnie Brewer ended up being.
Ronnie Brewer was good for about a month, and James White couldn't even win a dunk contest that is his specialty.
JR Smith > Tim Hardaway by a long shot.
Knicks drafting like we got a championship team here or something. I can other stand the Clippers going with Reggie Bullock they got Griffin and Paul. We got Melo. Hasnt the Melo Point Forward experiment failed already.
blkexec wrote:JR Smith vs THJJR is a gunner
is a black hole on offense
undersized SF
hit's a 3...then fouls someone behind the 3 on the other end
JR should not be a second option.
JR's stock is high, so he will command more dollars.
JR takes more bad shots than good.
THJ is a rookie, just happy to be drafted.
THJ is already more mature than JR.
THJ is cheap
Doesn't need to hold the ball to score.
He's a system guy vs JR smith is a pickup street ball guy
THJ takes more good shots than bad.
THJ is not affraid of the spot light or taking big shots.
I know THJ is just a rookie, and worst case, he may not even make the team. JR is a proven talent. I know....I know. I'm a fan just like everybody else. But as far as building a team, with a certain culture in mind, JR is not a good fit.
With all that, I rather have THJ right now, than JR Smith.....Pickup a volume scorer from either free agency or the D league, if we need more veteran scoring.
There are plenty of players that know how to put the ball in the basket. They are easy to find. It's the players to do both offense and defense, while not dominating the ball is hard to find.
Use the JR money to help pay for Copeland, THJ,Leslie and another 1 yr contract Free Agent....
Bottom line is the team is worse with Hardaway Jr instead of JR by a large margin.
AnubisADL wrote:JR Smith > Tim Hardaway by a long shot.Knicks drafting like we got a championship team here or something. I can other stand the Clippers going with Reggie Bullock they got Griffin and Paul. We got Melo. Hasnt the Melo Point Forward experiment failed already.
True in the regular season however when it comes to playoffs basketball Manute Bol would probably outplay JR Smith lol
Jmpasq wrote:blkexec wrote:JR Smith vs THJJR is a gunner
is a black hole on offense
undersized SF
hit's a 3...then fouls someone behind the 3 on the other end
JR should not be a second option.
JR's stock is high, so he will command more dollars.
JR takes more bad shots than good.
THJ is a rookie, just happy to be drafted.
THJ is already more mature than JR.
THJ is cheap
Doesn't need to hold the ball to score.
He's a system guy vs JR smith is a pickup street ball guy
THJ takes more good shots than bad.
THJ is not affraid of the spot light or taking big shots.
I know THJ is just a rookie, and worst case, he may not even make the team. JR is a proven talent. I know....I know. I'm a fan just like everybody else. But as far as building a team, with a certain culture in mind, JR is not a good fit.
With all that, I rather have THJ right now, than JR Smith.....Pickup a volume scorer from either free agency or the D league, if we need more veteran scoring.
There are plenty of players that know how to put the ball in the basket. They are easy to find. It's the players to do both offense and defense, while not dominating the ball is hard to find.
Use the JR money to help pay for Copeland, THJ,Leslie and another 1 yr contract Free Agent....
Bottom line is the team is worse with Hardaway Jr instead of JR by a large margin.
Could be addition by subtraction...
Shumpert will get the lion's share at the off guard now.
AnubisADL wrote:JR Smith > Tim Hardaway by a long shot.Knicks drafting like we got a championship team here or something. I can other stand the Clippers going with Reggie Bullock they got Griffin and Paul. We got Melo. Hasnt the Melo Point Forward experiment failed already.
The Clips were the purest definition of perpetual lottery teams for 25 years the Knicks can't be compared to them. All those years of high draft picks and Griffin is all they really have to show for it. They built their core through FA and Trades. The Knicks never had the high draft picks that the Clips have had! Considering that history I would not put any worth in who the Clips draft!
Jmpasq wrote:blkexec wrote:JR Smith vs THJJR is a gunner
is a black hole on offense
undersized SF
hit's a 3...then fouls someone behind the 3 on the other end
JR should not be a second option.
JR's stock is high, so he will command more dollars.
JR takes more bad shots than good.
THJ is a rookie, just happy to be drafted.
THJ is already more mature than JR.
THJ is cheap
Doesn't need to hold the ball to score.
He's a system guy vs JR smith is a pickup street ball guy
THJ takes more good shots than bad.
THJ is not affraid of the spot light or taking big shots.
I know THJ is just a rookie, and worst case, he may not even make the team. JR is a proven talent. I know....I know. I'm a fan just like everybody else. But as far as building a team, with a certain culture in mind, JR is not a good fit.
With all that, I rather have THJ right now, than JR Smith.....Pickup a volume scorer from either free agency or the D league, if we need more veteran scoring.
There are plenty of players that know how to put the ball in the basket. They are easy to find. It's the players to do both offense and defense, while not dominating the ball is hard to find.
Use the JR money to help pay for Copeland, THJ,Leslie and another 1 yr contract Free Agent....
Bottom line is the team is worse with Hardaway Jr instead of JR by a large margin.
Tim is replacing JKid not JR! If the Knicks resign JR,he still comes off the bench! Three da Hardaway will start.
Osiris wrote:Jmpasq wrote:blkexec wrote:JR Smith vs THJJR is a gunner
is a black hole on offense
undersized SF
hit's a 3...then fouls someone behind the 3 on the other end
JR should not be a second option.
JR's stock is high, so he will command more dollars.
JR takes more bad shots than good.
THJ is a rookie, just happy to be drafted.
THJ is already more mature than JR.
THJ is cheap
Doesn't need to hold the ball to score.
He's a system guy vs JR smith is a pickup street ball guy
THJ takes more good shots than bad.
THJ is not affraid of the spot light or taking big shots.
I know THJ is just a rookie, and worst case, he may not even make the team. JR is a proven talent. I know....I know. I'm a fan just like everybody else. But as far as building a team, with a certain culture in mind, JR is not a good fit.
With all that, I rather have THJ right now, than JR Smith.....Pickup a volume scorer from either free agency or the D league, if we need more veteran scoring.
There are plenty of players that know how to put the ball in the basket. They are easy to find. It's the players to do both offense and defense, while not dominating the ball is hard to find.
Use the JR money to help pay for Copeland, THJ,Leslie and another 1 yr contract Free Agent....
Bottom line is the team is worse with Hardaway Jr instead of JR by a large margin.
Tim is replacing JKid not JR! If the Knicks resign JR,he still comes off the bench! Three da Hardaway will start.
The only way THJ is replacing J Kidd is a body for a body. The jury is still out on the new kid. He has to be able to rebound, advance the ball and dish it to be in the same league with Kidd. His steals and defense would have to be stellar also. These are all the things Kidd brought with him when he came into the league. His shot wasn't there, but he could drive to the hole and hit the shot or dish for the assist. If THJ's early years are ANYTHING like Kidd's, I would be ecstatic.
