my expectations are he plays well enough early enough to package with Shumpert and Hardaway for Rondo or someone else
fishmike wrote:my expectations are he plays well enough early enough to package with Shumpert and Hardaway for Rondo or someone else
You might be onto something here. Bargnani really isn't a Woodson player. Especially when Woodson already has Amare and Melo on the team. Boston gets Shumpert who they love and a soon to be expiring with more value than Amare. We get another head case to pair with Melo JR and Artest. It's perfect!
Unless Woody just destroys any value Bargnani has left
I expect him to play as well as Novak did at his best here and to be able to play in all circumstances. I expect he'll play well with Melo. I expect he will match up well with teams like the Pacers.
gunsnewing wrote:fishmike wrote:my expectations are he plays well enough early enough to package with Shumpert and Hardaway for Rondo or someone else
You might be onto something here. Bargnani really isn't a Woodson player. Especially when Woodson already has Amare and Melo on the team. Boston gets Shumpert who they love and a soon to be expiring with more value than Amare. We get another head case to pair with Melo JR and Artest. It's perfect!
Unless Woody just destroys any value Bargnani has left
Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody!
Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.
ChuckBuck wrote:Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody! Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.
I think there is general consensus that Cope prob should have played a little more against Indy... but the others? You have a good case why they should have played more?
Im sure Woodson goes on lots of things we don't know about, and I think he has proper motivation to win.
Novak was hurting in the playoffs, KMart made Camby irrelavent and Copeland is really not a playoff difference maker.
Why we even talking about Lin and woodson in the same conversation?
martin wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody! Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.
I think there is general consensus that Cope prob should have played a little more against Indy... but the others? You have a good case why they should have played more?
Camby and Novak were under utilized by Woodson, is what it is.
Camby never got burn even though we got outboarded and manhandled inside. Could've easily trotted out Camby and Chandler out there against Indy. Just to stem the red carpet treatment West and Hibbert were shown in the paint.
Don't think Novak got one screen set up for him in the postseason. Sucky defense withstanding, could have used a few discount triple checks to energize the team and spark the offense.
Hopefully Woody learns from his past mistakes of favoring "his guys" instead of waiting for game 5 of a do or die playoff series to play guys deserving and utilizing his bench.
Popovich does it all the time.
Basically, making adjustments. Either you match up to the opponent size wise, or you make the opponent match up to your strengths.
Woodson's doghouse. It exists people.
ChuckBuck wrote:martin wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody! Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.
I think there is general consensus that Cope prob should have played a little more against Indy... but the others? You have a good case why they should have played more?
Camby and Novak were under utilized by Woodson, is what it is.
Camby never got burn even though we got outboarded and manhandled inside. Could've easily trotted out Camby and Chandler out there against Indy. Just to stem the red carpet treatment West and Hibbert were shown in the paint.
Don't think Novak got one screen set up for him in the postseason. Sucky defense withstanding, could have used a few discount triple checks to energize the team and spark the offense.
Hopefully Woody learns from his past mistakes of favoring "his guys" instead of waiting for game 5 of a do or die playoff series to play guys deserving and utilizing his bench.
Popovich does it all the time.
Basically, making adjustments. Either you match up to the opponent size wise, or you make the opponent match up to your strengths.
When did Novak play D? And he was also shut down by slow guards. You don't play guys like that. Pop cut Novak.
Any comment on KMart getting Camby minutes? Did Camby ever recover from Plantar?
martin wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:martin wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody! Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.
I think there is general consensus that Cope prob should have played a little more against Indy... but the others? You have a good case why they should have played more?
Camby and Novak were under utilized by Woodson, is what it is.
Camby never got burn even though we got outboarded and manhandled inside. Could've easily trotted out Camby and Chandler out there against Indy. Just to stem the red carpet treatment West and Hibbert were shown in the paint.
Don't think Novak got one screen set up for him in the postseason. Sucky defense withstanding, could have used a few discount triple checks to energize the team and spark the offense.
Hopefully Woody learns from his past mistakes of favoring "his guys" instead of waiting for game 5 of a do or die playoff series to play guys deserving and utilizing his bench.
Popovich does it all the time.
Basically, making adjustments. Either you match up to the opponent size wise, or you make the opponent match up to your strengths.
When did Novak play D? And he was also shut down by slow guards. You don't play guys like that. Pop cut Novak.
Any comment on KMart getting Camby minutes? Did Camby ever recover from Plantar?
he didn't play good man defense but he was not totally useless. but when the book on him is that you have to crowd him then that should make it easy for other players to penetrate and dish to him if his man decides to sag off and help-- unless you don't have such players who can penetrate and dish to him. i guess the knicks don't have such players and if they did woodson was too stupid and narrowminded to use them with novak. quite wasteful but that's what mediocre coaches do.
martin wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:martin wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody! Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.
I think there is general consensus that Cope prob should have played a little more against Indy... but the others? You have a good case why they should have played more?
Camby and Novak were under utilized by Woodson, is what it is.
Camby never got burn even though we got outboarded and manhandled inside. Could've easily trotted out Camby and Chandler out there against Indy. Just to stem the red carpet treatment West and Hibbert were shown in the paint.
Don't think Novak got one screen set up for him in the postseason. Sucky defense withstanding, could have used a few discount triple checks to energize the team and spark the offense.
Hopefully Woody learns from his past mistakes of favoring "his guys" instead of waiting for game 5 of a do or die playoff series to play guys deserving and utilizing his bench.
Popovich does it all the time.
Basically, making adjustments. Either you match up to the opponent size wise, or you make the opponent match up to your strengths.
When did Novak play D? And he was also shut down by slow guards. You don't play guys like that. Pop cut Novak.
Any comment on KMart getting Camby minutes? Did Camby ever recover from Plantar?
What is the point of having the best 3 point shooter in the league, if you're not going to use him. We all know Novak sucks on D, but why have a 3 pt specialist in the game then, if you won't run screens for him. What good is a decoy or floor spacer, if you won't run plays for him?
Obviously, the Houston Rockets thought Camby recovered from plantar fasciitis. 'Nuff said on that.
Look, I like Woodson as a coach. I like him alot.
Don't like his doghouse tendencies though.
The funny thing is the rockets give Camby 1yr we gave him 3. New York has become the place to end your career while making a decent buck instead of the vet min. Same with Kidd. Not too bad. You may not win a ring but you get paid. Instead of going to a normal team and only getting the one yr you deserve at 40
dk7th wrote:martin wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:martin wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody! Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.
I think there is general consensus that Cope prob should have played a little more against Indy... but the others? You have a good case why they should have played more?
Camby and Novak were under utilized by Woodson, is what it is.
Camby never got burn even though we got outboarded and manhandled inside. Could've easily trotted out Camby and Chandler out there against Indy. Just to stem the red carpet treatment West and Hibbert were shown in the paint.
Don't think Novak got one screen set up for him in the postseason. Sucky defense withstanding, could have used a few discount triple checks to energize the team and spark the offense.
Hopefully Woody learns from his past mistakes of favoring "his guys" instead of waiting for game 5 of a do or die playoff series to play guys deserving and utilizing his bench.
Popovich does it all the time.
Basically, making adjustments. Either you match up to the opponent size wise, or you make the opponent match up to your strengths.
When did Novak play D? And he was also shut down by slow guards. You don't play guys like that. Pop cut Novak.
Any comment on KMart getting Camby minutes? Did Camby ever recover from Plantar?
he didn't play good man defense but he was not totally useless. but when the book on him is that you have to crowd him then that should make it easy for other players to penetrate and dish to him if his man decides to sag off and help-- unless you don't have such players who can penetrate and dish to him. i guess the knicks don't have such players and if they did woodson was too stupid and narrowminded to use them with novak. quite wasteful but that's what mediocre coaches do.
and a superstar coach would bench Melo to make the line up less dysfunctional. Seriously do you do anything besides spew?
ChuckBuck wrote:martin wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:martin wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody! Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.
I think there is general consensus that Cope prob should have played a little more against Indy... but the others? You have a good case why they should have played more?
Camby and Novak were under utilized by Woodson, is what it is.
Camby never got burn even though we got outboarded and manhandled inside. Could've easily trotted out Camby and Chandler out there against Indy. Just to stem the red carpet treatment West and Hibbert were shown in the paint.
Don't think Novak got one screen set up for him in the postseason. Sucky defense withstanding, could have used a few discount triple checks to energize the team and spark the offense.
Hopefully Woody learns from his past mistakes of favoring "his guys" instead of waiting for game 5 of a do or die playoff series to play guys deserving and utilizing his bench.
Popovich does it all the time.
Basically, making adjustments. Either you match up to the opponent size wise, or you make the opponent match up to your strengths.
When did Novak play D? And he was also shut down by slow guards. You don't play guys like that. Pop cut Novak.
Any comment on KMart getting Camby minutes? Did Camby ever recover from Plantar?
What is the point of having the best 3 point shooter in the league, if you're not going to use him. We all know Novak sucks on D, but why have a 3 pt specialist in the game then, if you won't run screens for him. What good is a decoy or floor spacer, if you won't run plays for him?
Obviously, the Houston Rockets thought Camby recovered from plantar fasciitis. 'Nuff said on that.
Look, I like Woodson as a coach. I like him alot.
Don't like his doghouse tendencies though.
Not sure if your point on Camby makes sense, ie... how Houston picking him up for the 13/14 season has anything to do with his plantar fasciitis limiting his play during 12/13.
You brought Lin up earlier. How was Lin in Woodson's doghouse?
Novak proved two years in a row that as a specialist 3 point shooter on offense.....he is nullified in the playoffs by more agressive perimeter D.
gunsnewing wrote:The funny thing is the rockets give Camby 1yr we gave him 3. New York has become the place to end your career while making a decent buck instead of the vet min. Same with Kidd. Not too bad. You may not win a ring but you get paid. Instead of going to a normal team and only getting the one yr you deserve at 40
The minimum deal in a sign and trade is 3yrs, that's why we gave him 3yrs- actually only 2 were really fully guaranteed.
fishmike wrote:dk7th wrote:martin wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:martin wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody! Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.
I think there is general consensus that Cope prob should have played a little more against Indy... but the others? You have a good case why they should have played more?
Camby and Novak were under utilized by Woodson, is what it is.
Camby never got burn even though we got outboarded and manhandled inside. Could've easily trotted out Camby and Chandler out there against Indy. Just to stem the red carpet treatment West and Hibbert were shown in the paint.
Don't think Novak got one screen set up for him in the postseason. Sucky defense withstanding, could have used a few discount triple checks to energize the team and spark the offense.
Hopefully Woody learns from his past mistakes of favoring "his guys" instead of waiting for game 5 of a do or die playoff series to play guys deserving and utilizing his bench.
Popovich does it all the time.
Basically, making adjustments. Either you match up to the opponent size wise, or you make the opponent match up to your strengths.
When did Novak play D? And he was also shut down by slow guards. You don't play guys like that. Pop cut Novak.
Any comment on KMart getting Camby minutes? Did Camby ever recover from Plantar?
he didn't play good man defense but he was not totally useless. but when the book on him is that you have to crowd him then that should make it easy for other players to penetrate and dish to him if his man decides to sag off and help-- unless you don't have such players who can penetrate and dish to him. i guess the knicks don't have such players and if they did woodson was too stupid and narrowminded to use them with novak. quite wasteful but that's what mediocre coaches do.
and a superstar coach would bench Melo to make the line up less dysfunctional. Seriously do you do anything besides spew?
Agreed. Although I don't post as much as many.....I love coming to this site every day for Knick news and banter. Getting more tiresome lately though because of this guy constantly spewing insults in almost every thread.
smackeddog wrote:gunsnewing wrote:The funny thing is the rockets give Camby 1yr we gave him 3. New York has become the place to end your career while making a decent buck instead of the vet min. Same with Kidd. Not too bad. You may not win a ring but you get paid. Instead of going to a normal team and only getting the one yr you deserve at 40
The minimum deal in a sign and trade is 3yrs, that's why we gave him 3yrs- actually only 2 were really fully guaranteed.
I didn't know that thanks. I guess this is why teams don't trade for 40yr olds. They sign them to 1yr vet min deals
foosballnick wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:martin wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:martin wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody! Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.
I think there is general consensus that Cope prob should have played a little more against Indy... but the others? You have a good case why they should have played more?
Camby and Novak were under utilized by Woodson, is what it is.
Camby never got burn even though we got outboarded and manhandled inside. Could've easily trotted out Camby and Chandler out there against Indy. Just to stem the red carpet treatment West and Hibbert were shown in the paint.
Don't think Novak got one screen set up for him in the postseason. Sucky defense withstanding, could have used a few discount triple checks to energize the team and spark the offense.
Hopefully Woody learns from his past mistakes of favoring "his guys" instead of waiting for game 5 of a do or die playoff series to play guys deserving and utilizing his bench.
Popovich does it all the time.
Basically, making adjustments. Either you match up to the opponent size wise, or you make the opponent match up to your strengths.
When did Novak play D? And he was also shut down by slow guards. You don't play guys like that. Pop cut Novak.
Any comment on KMart getting Camby minutes? Did Camby ever recover from Plantar?
What is the point of having the best 3 point shooter in the league, if you're not going to use him. We all know Novak sucks on D, but why have a 3 pt specialist in the game then, if you won't run screens for him. What good is a decoy or floor spacer, if you won't run plays for him?
Obviously, the Houston Rockets thought Camby recovered from plantar fasciitis. 'Nuff said on that.
Look, I like Woodson as a coach. I like him alot.
Don't like his doghouse tendencies though.
Not sure if your point on Camby makes sense, ie... how Houston picking him up for the 13/14 season has anything to do with his plantar fasciitis limiting his play during 12/13.
You brought Lin up earlier. How was Lin in Woodson's doghouse?
Novak proved two years in a row that as a specialist 3 point shooter on offense.....he is nullified in the playoffs by more agressive perimeter D.
Lin didn't put up the same numbers or have the free rein that he had under D'Antoni before getting injured.
Without a D'Antoni style offense centered around drive and kick guard play, Novak needed plays designed for him. Instead he was relegated to a $4million decoy/floor spacer.
Defense wasn't the issue so much, as it was predictable, stagnant ISO after ISO sets. No motion, no backcuts, backdoors, curls....nothing.
It's either High Pick and Roll or ISO...that's the whole playbook.
I like Woody, but he needs an Offensive Coordinator, as much as, D'Antoni needs a Defensive Coordinator.
ChuckBuck wrote:foosballnick wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:martin wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:martin wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:Destruction! Leave 'em in the doghouse Woody! Lin. Camby. Novak. Copeland. That's just how Woodson rolls.
I think there is general consensus that Cope prob should have played a little more against Indy... but the others? You have a good case why they should have played more?
Camby and Novak were under utilized by Woodson, is what it is.
Camby never got burn even though we got outboarded and manhandled inside. Could've easily trotted out Camby and Chandler out there against Indy. Just to stem the red carpet treatment West and Hibbert were shown in the paint.
Don't think Novak got one screen set up for him in the postseason. Sucky defense withstanding, could have used a few discount triple checks to energize the team and spark the offense.
Hopefully Woody learns from his past mistakes of favoring "his guys" instead of waiting for game 5 of a do or die playoff series to play guys deserving and utilizing his bench.
Popovich does it all the time.
Basically, making adjustments. Either you match up to the opponent size wise, or you make the opponent match up to your strengths.
When did Novak play D? And he was also shut down by slow guards. You don't play guys like that. Pop cut Novak.
Any comment on KMart getting Camby minutes? Did Camby ever recover from Plantar?
What is the point of having the best 3 point shooter in the league, if you're not going to use him. We all know Novak sucks on D, but why have a 3 pt specialist in the game then, if you won't run screens for him. What good is a decoy or floor spacer, if you won't run plays for him?
Obviously, the Houston Rockets thought Camby recovered from plantar fasciitis. 'Nuff said on that.
Look, I like Woodson as a coach. I like him alot.
Don't like his doghouse tendencies though.
Not sure if your point on Camby makes sense, ie... how Houston picking him up for the 13/14 season has anything to do with his plantar fasciitis limiting his play during 12/13.
You brought Lin up earlier. How was Lin in Woodson's doghouse?
Novak proved two years in a row that as a specialist 3 point shooter on offense.....he is nullified in the playoffs by more agressive perimeter D.
Lin didn't put up the same numbers or have the free rein that he had under D'Antoni before getting injured.
Without a D'Antoni style offense centered around drive and kick guard play, Novak needed plays designed for him. Instead he was relegated to a $4million decoy/floor spacer.
Defense wasn't the issue so much, as it was predictable, stagnant ISO after ISO sets. No motion, no backcuts, backdoors, curls....nothing.
It's either High Pick and Roll or ISO...that's the whole playbook.
I like Woody, but he needs an Offensive Coordinator, as much as, D'Antoni needs a Defensive Coordinator.
agreed, + 100000 good post ChuckBuck, would enjoy reading such posts like this instead of pure bashing
Yup very good post nailed my problems with Woodson. Then again my problems are with the entire Knicks organization from top to bottom.
