Knicks · ZERO LEADERSHIP ON THIS ROSTER (page 5)

knicks1248 wrote:I take Woodsons playoff record very serious. When I heard him say (on Stephnen A show) I didn't want to put that pressure on a guy like Copeland during the Indy series..I'm like really!! Why not just Burp him after he drinks his gatorade...Your a really good coach when you can make it past the 1st 2 rounds, and he has complete failed when it comes to doing that despite having 50+ win seasons.

Everyone knows that the playoffs is where stars are born, leaders are made, and coaches are ranked.
We fight all season long for Home court, for what? tell me...

Woodson claims that JR is a special project for him, how he's going to take him under his wing from Day 1, great job during the regular season, what the hell happen during the real season..

Well in regards to Cope he got the start in the first game of the Boston series and was shook. He didn't score a point in that series. Maybe as the coach that memory is in the back of your mind and you think twice before putting that guy back in. The flipside to saying he is rigid and locked into his guys would be to say that he played two guys that were undrafted league minimum rookie free agents and he played them a ton of minutes.

MAN FREAK THIS CRAP FROM LAST YEAR!!!! This is a new year with a fresh start. Yes we lost a lot of vet leaders but this isn't some green team with no experience. We have enough leadership to get the job done. PERIOD!!! This is just another self hating Knicks fan lame attempt to find something negative about the team.

This team is still a top offensive team in the league and should be able to defend at a high level as well this year. This is a good darn team and we should be proud of it. With a much improved East this is going to be one of the best seasons to watch in a while. Every night is gonna be a battle.

Lol, that made me chuckle.

So here comes Ray to the Rescue

GREENBURGH, N.Y. - Raymond Felton deferred to Jason Kidd in terms of leadership last season, he admitted Monday. Now Kidd is the coach of the Knicks' rivals in Brooklyn, so Felton is ready to take a step forward to replace the future Hall of Famer in the Madison Square Garden locker room.

"That's my job this year," Felton said. "I've got to step into that leadership role and so far, that's what I've been doing in training camp. I took a little step back last year to prove myself, to earn that respect from my teammates. Now this year, I can step into that role."

Felton is one of three Knicks who have been assured a starting spot by coach Mike Woodson; Carmelo Anthony and Tyson Chandler are the others. Felton will have the ball in his hands the majority of the time, and Woodson wants to see more from the 29-year-old point guard.

"Without a doubt," Woodson said after a lengthy video session and scrimmage. "Ray and I have had this conversation before we started camp. He's got to be more of a leader.

"Point guards catch a lot of crap on everybody's team because we expect so much from them. And Ray's no different. I thought Ray really performed great for us last season, but I think he's got to be more vocal and show more of a leadership role more than ever now that Kidd is gone."

In the first year of his second stint with the Knicks, Felton averaged 13.9 points, 5.5 assists and 2.3 turnovers in 68 regular-season games. His numbers were similar in the playoffs (14.1, 4.7, 2.2).

Felton came back to the Knicks after a disastrous season in Portland, one that he said left him with a chip on his shoulder that has not gone away.

"It's still there," he said. "I'm happy, for sure, because I'm happy to be here in New York and happy to be back here another season. But other than that, the chip is still there. I've got a bitter taste in my mouth -- I think we all have that taste in our mouths for the way the season ended last year -- so the chip is still there. If anything, it's another chip and it's on the other shoulder now."

Felton played alongside Kidd and Pablo Prigioni at times last season. This year, the Knicks have another third point guard in Beno Udrih who is expected to play. But Felton is going to be the main ballhandler.

"It did feel good to run up and down the court a couple times and not have the ball in my hand," he said. "It's going to be fun to do that again this year because me, Beno and Pablo, we can all play together."

Stop coming down the court and handed the ball to melo, thats the 1st step in leadership, getting everyone involved and not getting blown by on defense by every guard with speed

nixluva wrote:MAN FREAK THIS CRAP FROM LAST YEAR!!!! This is a new year with a fresh start. Yes we lost a lot of vet leaders but this isn't some green team with no experience. We have enough leadership to get the job done. PERIOD!!! This is just another self hating Knicks fan lame attempt to find something negative about the team.

This team is still a top offensive team in the league and should be able to defend at a high level as well this year. This is a good darn team and we should be proud of it. With a much improved East this is going to be one of the best seasons to watch in a while. Every night is gonna be a battle.

what about the stench emanating from the front office and its pre-occupation with re-signing carmelo anthony? don't you wonder what sort of psychological gas mask or oxygen tank players are going to need? we have a fairly toxic situation here. can you with a straight face convince yourself that the team can somehow create autonomous solidarity? i have a feeling this season is going to expose a lot truths and reveal a lot of weakness of character. i will be pleasantly surprised if the team can handle its shit and win 45-48 games.

dk7th wrote:

nixluva wrote:MAN FREAK THIS CRAP FROM LAST YEAR!!!! This is a new year with a fresh start. Yes we lost a lot of vet leaders but this isn't some green team with no experience. We have enough leadership to get the job done. PERIOD!!! This is just another self hating Knicks fan lame attempt to find something negative about the team.

This team is still a top offensive team in the league and should be able to defend at a high level as well this year. This is a good darn team and we should be proud of it. With a much improved East this is going to be one of the best seasons to watch in a while. Every night is gonna be a battle.

what about the stench emanating from the front office and its pre-occupation with re-signing carmelo anthony? don't you wonder what sort of psychological gas mask or oxygen tank players are going to need? we have a fairly toxic situation here. can you with a straight face convince yourself that the team can somehow create autonomous solidarity? i have a feeling this season is going to expose a lot truths and reveal a lot of weakness of character. i will be pleasantly surprised if the team can handle its shit and win 45-48 games.

Well I would say that you have a very cynical and negative take on the team without any basis for such an opinion. Why should we be concerned about some toxic situations? What toxic situations? The team seems pretty chummy and happy to me. They seems to like each other and support each other. No team is perfect but this team is looking pretty united and focused. We'd have to see a complete breakdown for key players on this team in order to have the kind of problems you're expecting. It's more likely that players will play about the same way they always play per their career avg's. If that happens then this will be a very good team. You're not taking into consideration the higher level of chemistry this team has after being together for a few years now. Most of the same players and coaches. It usually makes for good team chemistry.

Leaders Come In All Shapes and Sizes

But one NBA scout said that he believed World Peace, who will turn 34 on Nov. 13, is no longer the physical presence he once was, having lost a step on defense and unable to keep up with quicker, more athletic wing players. But he did return almost superhumanly quick from a torn meniscus last season, stepping onto the court just 12 days after knee surgery.

Ron Artest is a tone-setter.

He will influence the playing personality of the Knicks in a positive way. The same scout who thinks Artest is not a physical presence, probably never suited up and tried to box out against Artest in the paint.

misterearl wrote:Leaders Come In All Shapes and Sizes

But one NBA scout said that he believed World Peace, who will turn 34 on Nov. 13, is no longer the physical presence he once was, having lost a step on defense and unable to keep up with quicker, more athletic wing players. But he did return almost superhumanly quick from a torn meniscus last season, stepping onto the court just 12 days after knee surgery.

Ron Artest is a tone-setter.

He will influence the playing personality of the Knicks in a positive way. The same scout who thinks Artest is not a physical presence, probably never suited up and tried to box out against Artest in the paint.

agreed! "oh my bad ron"

The cool part about the return of Ron World Peace is that he defies typecasting or predictions. The reporters who claim to have "insider access" have no idea how players relate when the cameras are off. The tension that may appear on the sidelines, rarely reflects how players and coaches respect one another in private.

The most important thing is that the Knicks yoots gain a sense of pride in wearing the uniform to the point they are willing to run the extra sprint or lift the extra rep in the gym. It's all about the work men are willing to invest. The Knicks, apart from JR hitting the collie herb have had zero discipline issues over the past three seasons. Zero. and this is in a city where cameras are everywhere.

Leadership makes certain everyone shows up early.

The independently organized, pre camp player workouts, in Greenburgh were never mentioned. Why is that?

Did those early workouts require any leadership, or were they simply coincidence?

misterearl wrote:The cool part about the return of Ron World Peace is that he defies typecasting or predictions. The reporters who claim to have "insider access" have no idea how players relate when the cameras are off. The tension that may appear on the sidelines, rarely reflects how players and coaches respect one another in private.

The most important thing is that the Knicks yoots gain a sense of pride in wearing the uniform to the point they are willing to run the extra sprint or lift the extra rep in the gym. It's all about the work men are willing to invest. The Knicks, apart from JR hitting the collie herb have had zero discipline issues over the past three seasons. Zero. and this is in a city where cameras are everywhere.

Leadership makes certain everyone shows up early.

The independently organized, pre camp player workouts, in Greenburgh were never mentioned. Why is that?

Did those early workouts require any leadership, or were they simply coincidence?

they happened last year and the year before as well from what i understand.

Drew Brees helped organize New Orleans' workouts during the NFL strike and was a Saint.

Cartman718 - would you consider that pre training camp workouts are an indicator of player leadership?

misterearl wrote:Drew Brees helped organize New Orleans' workouts during the NFL strike and was a Saint.

Cartman718 - would you consider that pre training camp workouts are an indicator of player leadership?

anything that happens before the playoffs begin are not a true indicator of player leadership.

Cartman718 wrote:

misterearl wrote:Drew Brees helped organize New Orleans' workouts during the NFL strike and was a Saint.

Cartman718 - would you consider that pre training camp workouts are an indicator of player leadership?

anything that happens before the playoffs begin are not a true indicator of player leadership.

where did you get that philosophy? sounds ridiculous considering how important the regular season is in trying to earn a decent playoff position..while i don't disagree with you as a whole, i strongly believe leadership starts from the 1st day of camp until the last day of the season..

Leadership is all about teaching, coaching, and setting an example..

smackeddog wrote:

IronWillGiroud wrote:Ibite tongue all summer but now must tell you, brethren:

Ain't nobody on this team bout that life.

Be lucky with45 wins

I elaborated later but for now take my weird.

Take your weird?!

LOL take you weird. I dont like the sound of that

anrst wrote:

technomaster wrote:Remember, our boys Felton, Anthony, and Aldrich led their college teams to the promised land. Plus Chandler, Artest, and Udrih have rings. Prigioni has a ton of them.

We have 3-5 above average/borderline elite defenders who can anchor things on that end of the floor (chandler, kmart, artest, Shumpert, and Prigioni).

love this post ^^

those are all facts.

what's not a fact is that jason kidd was of real value to us. lotta good his leadership did us in round 1 and 2.

I would of traded his leadership for someone that could actually hit a shot

tkf wrote:

dk7th wrote:

nixluva wrote:

dk7th wrote:

nixluva wrote:

dk7th wrote:what little leadership we can expect from the players and the coaching staff is going to be mightily challenged with the front office shenanigans that have just gone down , with carmelo anthony's contract swirling like a black hole at the center of the knick galaxy.

there is no separation from the head of the fish and the rest of the body, it is one contiguous body. the fish rots from the head down. it is fruitless and vain to expect the players to not feel influenced and adversely affected.

Unless they make changes to the core of the roster I don't expect any of Dolan's crap will have an impact on the way this team plays this year. It's hard to make a case that switching in Mills for Grunwald has any effect on the day to day play of the team. There is in fact separation from Management and the Players on the court. Woodson has the greatest impact on what the players do.

the past is prelude to the present. few can recall how miserable the nuggets were the last time melo's contract was up because knick fans were all caught up in the rumor mill and the palace intrigue and what not. to expect a completely different set of behaviors when the scenario is pretty much the same shit, different year, is really naive.

I think your off base on this one. The situation isn't the same. Melo isn't voicing that he wants to go anywhere else. He's happy here. They've given him everything he wants so why would there be any drama?

This is a good team with a chance to go deep into the playoffs. There's almost nothing similar between the 2 situations. This team is going to be focused on this season.

when it comes down to it, staying here is one thing but staying here while demanding far more money than he is actually worth-- if the knicks have any hope of winning anything, that is-- is going to create the same swirling and noxious miasma in the garden this season.

once he resigns here, I am taking a knick break.. for real man. My only hope is that this dope goes somewhere else. I am begging for kobe to be the prick he is and talk carmelo into coming there... both those guys deserve one another... As long as it gets him away from here.... I will tell you this.. the contract issue is just the beginning my friend. He will hold this season hostage, simply because he could care less... then when things fall apart he can use the excuse of the contract, lacking focus and of course no help.. then he and the knicks mgt will sell this bullshyt that they finally got this fool locked up and can focus on winning.. but he will be nearing 30 with over 13 years in the league... no doubt his best years behind him.. but it doesn't matter, he will be paid, knicks fans can continue to fantasize about carmelo and his volume shooting, and dolan can keep selling dreams..and false hope.. this is how this MSG machine rolls... I am tired of it bro... once he extends this ride for me is taking a pit stop.. a long one..

I will be riding shotgun. If they give Melo the max extension its over. My hope is we somehow get a team that wants him and he forces a sign and trade so he can get his money. We pick up a couple picks plus expiring contracts.We have are 2015 draft pick so if we are terrible its not the end of the world. In 2016 we start fresh

Quite Possibly The Most Ridiculous Thing The Answer Man Has Ever Read

Cartman718 wrote:anything that happens before the playoffs begin are not a true indicator of player leadership.

Really?

Anything that happens before the playoffs is invalid. Really?

Really?

C'mon Cartman, read that again and think about it with more care.

Leadership is not a part time job. It is 24, 7, 365. Bulledat.

misterearl wrote:Quite Possibly The Most Ridiculous Thing The Answer Man Has Ever Read

Cartman718 wrote:anything that happens before the playoffs begin are not a true indicator of player leadership.

Really?

Anything that happens before the playoffs is invalid. Really?

Really?

C'mon Cartman, read that again and think about it with more care.

Leadership is not a part time job. It is 24, 7, 365. Bulledat.

exactly. which is why i am saying that there's no point in talking about it now... let's talk about it when the postseason is here before we crown anyone LEADERS of this team.

4

Cartman - leadership begins before the ball racks are rolled out.

Somebody must put the ball through the hoop. The Knicks have a leader (in his tenth season) on the court who is willing to assume the role of scoring leader, every night of the week.

As far as heart and soul leader, 14th year veteran Ron World Peace is the man. He is the new traffic cop in the locker room. Backing him up is Honorary Captain, Tyson Chandler, in his 12th season, who has a ring to validate his experience under playoff pressure. Besides, he owes Roy Hibbert one.

Last but not least, Pablo Prigioni (too many years to count), with an NBA year added to his outstanding international resume, is the leader who has been there and done that around the world. His humble voice is respected and his passing makes others better.

Those are four valid leaders who can be trusted to set the playing personality every night of the season.

Jmpasq wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

IronWillGiroud wrote:Ibite tongue all summer but now must tell you, brethren:

Ain't nobody on this team bout that life.

Be lucky with45 wins

I elaborated later but for now take my weird.

Take your weird?!

LOL take you weird. I dont like the sound of that

oh yea take all this weird

“the time is now.”

“I had a heart-to-heart with (JR), we had a talk that two men should have. It seemed like he took what I was saying. We shall see.”

- Carmelo Anthony