Knicks · Reality ---Carmelo could abandon ship (page 13)
Rookie wrote:tkf wrote:Rookie wrote:You know...the more I think about it, Melo to the Clippers for Griffin might be more realistic. They want to win now and Melo and CP3 can build their big 3 with Jordan.realistic to who? I doubt the clippers do that.. you do realize blake is averaging 21/11 on 54% shooting along with 3 dimes( more than carmelo) and he takes 7 less shots than carmelo.. blake doesn't have many plays run for him, he is a good facilitator, and is a natural PF.....
why would the clippers even consider this? plus Blakes best years are ahead of him..
Doc is a coach who could handle Melo. Right now, they are the 2nd, 3rd or 4th best team in the West. Melo could change that for them.
yes he could, they could be 6th or 7th best if they make such a trade.. what makes you think the clippers would be remotely interested.. Blake is younger, better, and is a natural PF... what carmelo brings, the clippers already have and can get from a number of players.... That is why we call it a TEAM game..
if they are 2nd best team in the west, adding carmelo does not make them better than the spurs or thunder... How is that so when carmelo can't make the knicks better than the sixers?
Knixkik wrote:Rookie wrote:tkf wrote:Rookie wrote:You know...the more I think about it, Melo to the Clippers for Griffin might be more realistic. They want to win now and Melo and CP3 can build their big 3 with Jordan.realistic to who? I doubt the clippers do that.. you do realize blake is averaging 21/11 on 54% shooting along with 3 dimes( more than carmelo) and he takes 7 less shots than carmelo.. blake doesn't have many plays run for him, he is a good facilitator, and is a natural PF.....
why would the clippers even consider this? plus Blakes best years are ahead of him..
Doc is a coach who could handle Melo. Right now, they are the 2nd, 3rd or 4th best team in the West. Melo could change that for them.
Melo would have an opportunity to take that team to the next level if all goes well, i agree with that. If we had to part ways with him, this would be our best oppportunity to get the highest value in return. But i still see Melo as a much better player than Griffin and obviously hope we can retool around him with the right players. These streaky, terrible shooting, no-defense guys we have couldn't even make Lebron look good.
how about this, how about melo taking the knicks to the next level.. which would be horrible right now, from absolutely horrible?
the delusion with this guy is unprecedented in pro sports..
NYKBocker wrote:Blow this shit up! Offer Melo to Houston for Asik, Lin, Montiejunas, Chandler Parsons, Greg Smith and a 1st Round Pick. This will build us up really quick. This will give Houston the last piece for this Big 3. Harden, Dwight and Melo would contend with anybody.
houston would laugh at carmelo for Parsons straight up to be honest.... he is the glue to that team...
BRIGGS wrote:NYKBocker wrote:Blow this shit up! Offer Melo to Houston for Asik, Lin, Montiejunas, Chandler Parsons, Greg Smith and a 1st Round Pick. This will build us up really quick. This will give Houston the last piece for this Big 3. Harden, Dwight and Melo would contend with anybody.I wouldnt trade Parsons for Melo straight--forget anything else.
exactly!!!
BRIGGS wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:BRIGGS wrote:nehemiah wrote:The problem with jrod's post above is that while he has written "Melo sucks" three times, he doesn't really (like REALLY) comprehend that Melo actually sucks.Melo doesnt stink hes a great player who does not play team basketball the right way. If Melo made it his goal of having 4-5 assists per game and was part of a team that limited ISO play he'd be much better for the team. He needs a coach to say either play this way--or we'll facilitate you not being here. You cant have such a large asset playing bad team basketball on top of which he can just leave with no Knick compensation. He either needs to comply to a better brand of team basketball and agree to a reduced contract i.e 5 years 100mm(so we can fill out the roster the right way) or I would trad e him to the best offer. Dolan has to understand that Melo is not on Lebron or Durants level of play. He keeps grouping him in there--but hes not them. He *could* be a part of a great team but he needs to play the right way and he cant take 30mm per.
How can someone be a great player but not play the right way or play team basketball? Maybe you mean he has a great range of skills and is very flashy - he's good for highlight films. That doesn't make you a great player though.Hes got tremendous NBA talent--but hes not the best team player.
When I hear a phrase like "tremendous NBA talent," I think of someone who is a great scorer, passer, rebounder, defender, etc. I would call Melo a flashy, versatile volume scorer rather than great talent.
tkf wrote:BRIGGS wrote:NYKBocker wrote:Blow this shit up! Offer Melo to Houston for Asik, Lin, Montiejunas, Chandler Parsons, Greg Smith and a 1st Round Pick. This will build us up really quick. This will give Houston the last piece for this Big 3. Harden, Dwight and Melo would contend with anybody.I wouldnt trade Parsons for Melo straight--forget anything else.
exactly!!!
Is he saying he would or wouldn't? I don't think Morey would be interested in Melo though.
Bonn1997 wrote:tkf wrote:BRIGGS wrote:NYKBocker wrote:Blow this shit up! Offer Melo to Houston for Asik, Lin, Montiejunas, Chandler Parsons, Greg Smith and a 1st Round Pick. This will build us up really quick. This will give Houston the last piece for this Big 3. Harden, Dwight and Melo would contend with anybody.I wouldnt trade Parsons for Melo straight--forget anything else.
exactly!!!
Is he saying he would or wouldn't? I don't think Morey would be interested in Melo though.
I wouldnt trade Parsons period unless I was getting Durant or Lebron.
tkf wrote:Knixkik wrote:Rookie wrote:tkf wrote:Rookie wrote:You know...the more I think about it, Melo to the Clippers for Griffin might be more realistic. They want to win now and Melo and CP3 can build their big 3 with Jordan.realistic to who? I doubt the clippers do that.. you do realize blake is averaging 21/11 on 54% shooting along with 3 dimes( more than carmelo) and he takes 7 less shots than carmelo.. blake doesn't have many plays run for him, he is a good facilitator, and is a natural PF.....
why would the clippers even consider this? plus Blakes best years are ahead of him..
Doc is a coach who could handle Melo. Right now, they are the 2nd, 3rd or 4th best team in the West. Melo could change that for them.
Melo would have an opportunity to take that team to the next level if all goes well, i agree with that. If we had to part ways with him, this would be our best oppportunity to get the highest value in return. But i still see Melo as a much better player than Griffin and obviously hope we can retool around him with the right players. These streaky, terrible shooting, no-defense guys we have couldn't even make Lebron look good.
how about this, how about melo taking the knicks to the next level.. which would be horrible right now, from absolutely horrible?
the delusion with this guy is unprecedented in pro sports..
You spend way too much effort trying to convince people of your views about this guy. I think most people know what you think about him.
BRIGGS wrote:NYKBocker wrote:Blow this shit up! Offer Melo to Houston for Asik, Lin, Montiejunas, Chandler Parsons, Greg Smith and a 1st Round Pick. This will build us up really quick. This will give Houston the last piece for this Big 3. Harden, Dwight and Melo would contend with anybody.I wouldnt trade Parsons for Melo straight--forget anything else.
I think Morey would do this trade. We are so pissed at Melo and state of Knicks that you will tend to undervalue Melo. Fans at the Rockets forum think that they don't have enough to pry Melo from us. They think Boston with multiple 1st round picks and expiring in Humpries could offer more. Clippers too where Blake and Dudley can be offered.
Melo is not a good fit with what we have. Knicks blew their wad when they got him and also was stupid enough to shun the gift from the basketball gods.
NYKBocker wrote:BRIGGS wrote:NYKBocker wrote:Blow this shit up! Offer Melo to Houston for Asik, Lin, Montiejunas, Chandler Parsons, Greg Smith and a 1st Round Pick. This will build us up really quick. This will give Houston the last piece for this Big 3. Harden, Dwight and Melo would contend with anybody.I wouldnt trade Parsons for Melo straight--forget anything else.
I think Morey would do this trade. We are so pissed at Melo and state of Knicks that you will tend to undervalue Melo. Fans at the Rockets forum think that they don't have enough to pry Melo from us. They think Boston with multiple 1st round picks and expiring in Humpries could offer more. Clippers too where Blake and Dudley can be offered.
Melo is not a good fit with what we have. Knicks blew their wad when they got him and also was stupid enough to shun the gift from the basketball gods.
Morey is a metrics specialist. I don't know exactly which stat systems he uses but I'd be surprised if he held Melo in high regard.
Bonn1997 wrote:NYKBocker wrote:BRIGGS wrote:NYKBocker wrote:Blow this shit up! Offer Melo to Houston for Asik, Lin, Montiejunas, Chandler Parsons, Greg Smith and a 1st Round Pick. This will build us up really quick. This will give Houston the last piece for this Big 3. Harden, Dwight and Melo would contend with anybody.I wouldnt trade Parsons for Melo straight--forget anything else.
I think Morey would do this trade. We are so pissed at Melo and state of Knicks that you will tend to undervalue Melo. Fans at the Rockets forum think that they don't have enough to pry Melo from us. They think Boston with multiple 1st round picks and expiring in Humpries could offer more. Clippers too where Blake and Dudley can be offered.
Melo is not a good fit with what we have. Knicks blew their wad when they got him and also was stupid enough to shun the gift from the basketball gods.
Morey is a metrics specialist. I don't know exactly which stat systems he uses but I'd be surprised if he held Melo in high regard.
Maybe we could hack his computer and alter Melo's stats.
smackeddog wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:NYKBocker wrote:BRIGGS wrote:NYKBocker wrote:Blow this shit up! Offer Melo to Houston for Asik, Lin, Montiejunas, Chandler Parsons, Greg Smith and a 1st Round Pick. This will build us up really quick. This will give Houston the last piece for this Big 3. Harden, Dwight and Melo would contend with anybody.I wouldnt trade Parsons for Melo straight--forget anything else.
I think Morey would do this trade. We are so pissed at Melo and state of Knicks that you will tend to undervalue Melo. Fans at the Rockets forum think that they don't have enough to pry Melo from us. They think Boston with multiple 1st round picks and expiring in Humpries could offer more. Clippers too where Blake and Dudley can be offered.
Melo is not a good fit with what we have. Knicks blew their wad when they got him and also was stupid enough to shun the gift from the basketball gods.
Morey is a metrics specialist. I don't know exactly which stat systems he uses but I'd be surprised if he held Melo in high regard.Maybe we could hack his computer and alter Melo's stats.
Job for the intern. Where is Bip? martin...you think you can afford to give him another project?
jrodmc wrote:nehemiah wrote:BRIGGS wrote:nehemiah wrote:The problem with jrod's post above is that while he has written "Melo sucks" three times, he doesn't really (like REALLY) comprehend that Melo actually sucks.Melo doesnt stink hes a great player who does not play team basketball the right way. If Melo made it his goal of having 4-5 assists per game and was part of a team that limited ISO play he'd be much better for the team. He needs a coach to say either play this way--or we'll facilitate you not being here. You cant have such a large asset playing bad team basketball on top of which he can just leave with no Knick compensation. He either needs to comply to a better brand of team basketball and agree to a reduced contract i.e 5 years 100mm(so we can fill out the roster the right way) or I would trad e him to the best offer. Dolan has to understand that Melo is not on Lebron or Durants level of play. He keeps grouping him in there--but hes not them. He *could* be a part of a great team but he needs to play the right way and he cant take 30mm per.
I agree in general with what you wrote. However, we must not separate Melo's insight into his own game. If he's not making good decisions in order to help a team, your effectiveness is negatively affected. That is also part of what makes a great player -- is good decision making -- this requires a very accurate assessment of one's ability -- and more than anyone, they have to be brutally honest with themselves. Someone who is missing close to 60% of their shots does not have good insight into their game, and has been making poor decisions. This doesn't automatically mean that Melo shouldn't shoot as often. He may actually not be taking some shots he should take -- these are split second decisions and require very good instincts.
And when you take the above and incorporate it into analyzing Melo's game, he sucks. In fact, I think they would have a better record without Melo this year (so far).
Seriously? Do you even watch or even listen to games? Who else is hitting shots this season? Please tell me. Do you know what you have without Melo this season? 30 point blowout losses. Consistently. Does that sound even vaguely familiar to you?
The only reason we're in games at all this season is because of Melo. And you don't have a JKidd or a Sheed to point to as being the actual MVP carrying the team to bail you out this time.
Melo sucks. You are truly hilarious. Welcome to Somberland. Sorry you couldn't join last season.
And that is the problem here.
The majority of the members of this site are NOT watching the game. Their looking at the boxscore, ESPN highlights or reading BLOGS about the games.
Its not even worth getting into a discussion about it...especially with Briggs who seems to change his opinion every other day.
It's tough
Bonn1997 wrote:tkf wrote:BRIGGS wrote:NYKBocker wrote:Blow this shit up! Offer Melo to Houston for Asik, Lin, Montiejunas, Chandler Parsons, Greg Smith and a 1st Round Pick. This will build us up really quick. This will give Houston the last piece for this Big 3. Harden, Dwight and Melo would contend with anybody.I wouldnt trade Parsons for Melo straight--forget anything else.
exactly!!!
Is he saying he would or wouldn't? I don't think Morey would be interested in Melo though.
I think he is saying he wouldn't.. and morey most likely would not touch carmelo..
Knixkik wrote:tkf wrote:Knixkik wrote:Rookie wrote:tkf wrote:Rookie wrote:You know...the more I think about it, Melo to the Clippers for Griffin might be more realistic. They want to win now and Melo and CP3 can build their big 3 with Jordan.realistic to who? I doubt the clippers do that.. you do realize blake is averaging 21/11 on 54% shooting along with 3 dimes( more than carmelo) and he takes 7 less shots than carmelo.. blake doesn't have many plays run for him, he is a good facilitator, and is a natural PF.....
why would the clippers even consider this? plus Blakes best years are ahead of him..
Doc is a coach who could handle Melo. Right now, they are the 2nd, 3rd or 4th best team in the West. Melo could change that for them.
Melo would have an opportunity to take that team to the next level if all goes well, i agree with that. If we had to part ways with him, this would be our best oppportunity to get the highest value in return. But i still see Melo as a much better player than Griffin and obviously hope we can retool around him with the right players. These streaky, terrible shooting, no-defense guys we have couldn't even make Lebron look good.
how about this, how about melo taking the knicks to the next level.. which would be horrible right now, from absolutely horrible?
the delusion with this guy is unprecedented in pro sports..
You spend way too much effort trying to convince people of your views about this guy. I think most people know what you think about him.
I could say the same about you... am I not correct?
Swishfm3 wrote:jrodmc wrote:nehemiah wrote:BRIGGS wrote:nehemiah wrote:The problem with jrod's post above is that while he has written "Melo sucks" three times, he doesn't really (like REALLY) comprehend that Melo actually sucks.Melo doesnt stink hes a great player who does not play team basketball the right way. If Melo made it his goal of having 4-5 assists per game and was part of a team that limited ISO play he'd be much better for the team. He needs a coach to say either play this way--or we'll facilitate you not being here. You cant have such a large asset playing bad team basketball on top of which he can just leave with no Knick compensation. He either needs to comply to a better brand of team basketball and agree to a reduced contract i.e 5 years 100mm(so we can fill out the roster the right way) or I would trad e him to the best offer. Dolan has to understand that Melo is not on Lebron or Durants level of play. He keeps grouping him in there--but hes not them. He *could* be a part of a great team but he needs to play the right way and he cant take 30mm per.
I agree in general with what you wrote. However, we must not separate Melo's insight into his own game. If he's not making good decisions in order to help a team, your effectiveness is negatively affected. That is also part of what makes a great player -- is good decision making -- this requires a very accurate assessment of one's ability -- and more than anyone, they have to be brutally honest with themselves. Someone who is missing close to 60% of their shots does not have good insight into their game, and has been making poor decisions. This doesn't automatically mean that Melo shouldn't shoot as often. He may actually not be taking some shots he should take -- these are split second decisions and require very good instincts.
And when you take the above and incorporate it into analyzing Melo's game, he sucks. In fact, I think they would have a better record without Melo this year (so far).
Seriously? Do you even watch or even listen to games? Who else is hitting shots this season? Please tell me. Do you know what you have without Melo this season? 30 point blowout losses. Consistently. Does that sound even vaguely familiar to you?
The only reason we're in games at all this season is because of Melo. And you don't have a JKidd or a Sheed to point to as being the actual MVP carrying the team to bail you out this time.
Melo sucks. You are truly hilarious. Welcome to Somberland. Sorry you couldn't join last season.
And that is the problem here.
The majority of the members of this site are NOT watching the game. Their looking at the boxscore, ESPN highlights or reading BLOGS about the games.
Its not even worth getting into a discussion about it...especially with Briggs who seems to change his opinion every other day.
actually I think they do watch..... take carmelo out and we still lose,except we play better defense... I don't know how anyone can sit here and say take melo out and we would be worse... a loss is a loss....we are getting blown out early in a lot of games anyway...
tkf wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:tkf wrote:BRIGGS wrote:NYKBocker wrote:Blow this shit up! Offer Melo to Houston for Asik, Lin, Montiejunas, Chandler Parsons, Greg Smith and a 1st Round Pick. This will build us up really quick. This will give Houston the last piece for this Big 3. Harden, Dwight and Melo would contend with anybody.I wouldnt trade Parsons for Melo straight--forget anything else.
exactly!!!
Is he saying he would or wouldn't? I don't think Morey would be interested in Melo though.I think he is saying he wouldn't.. and morey most likely would not touch carmelo..
You're right; I thought he was saying he wouldn't do it from the Knicks' perspective but I misread it.
BRIGGS wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:BRIGGS wrote:nehemiah wrote:The problem with jrod's post above is that while he has written "Melo sucks" three times, he doesn't really (like REALLY) comprehend that Melo actually sucks.Melo doesnt stink hes a great player who does not play team basketball the right way. If Melo made it his goal of having 4-5 assists per game and was part of a team that limited ISO play he'd be much better for the team. He needs a coach to say either play this way--or we'll facilitate you not being here. You cant have such a large asset playing bad team basketball on top of which he can just leave with no Knick compensation. He either needs to comply to a better brand of team basketball and agree to a reduced contract i.e 5 years 100mm(so we can fill out the roster the right way) or I would trad e him to the best offer. Dolan has to understand that Melo is not on Lebron or Durants level of play. He keeps grouping him in there--but hes not them. He *could* be a part of a great team but he needs to play the right way and he cant take 30mm per.
How can someone be a great player but not play the right way or play team basketball? Maybe you mean he has a great range of skills and is very flashy - he's good for highlight films. That doesn't make you a great player though.Hes got tremendous NBA talent--but hes not the best team player.
Melo is Iverson ver.2.0 Not the brightest player in the world, an offensive game that does not make others player and actually makes his teammates defend worse as they are not involved on the offense. I would definitely not build around this kind of player, if you are rebuilding you start with a point guard or center IMHO. These are the two toughest positions to fill in the NBA.