Knicks · Analytics (page 1)

The Boston Celtics have one of the most interesting front offices in the NBA with a basketball lifer in Danny Ainge working side-by-side with people from more of an analytics background.

Daryl Morey, who is considered a pioneer in basketball analytics, was previously with the Celtics' front office.

"I think that there remains great value (in analytics), and it continues to progress and improve," Ainge said. "Where we are as an organization today is much further along than we ever have been in the last 10 years. We're identifying what's relevant and what isn't, and we're continuing to improve those things that we can actually rely on and what things we can't rely on.

"You win with great players, obviously. That's the one way everybody knows how to win. But I think everybody is looking for an edge. Everybody is looking for little tweaks in the system."

Jackson: Analytics Movement Helps Owners Understand Game

Like other major sports, the NBA has moved more towards analytics and have hired many general managers and front office staff with MBAs and degrees in economics rather than former players.

Phil Jackson believes that the trend has been in part due to owners seeking modes of evaluation they can understand.

"I think that it's a really important movement," said Jackson. "I think a lot of owners have turned the game, the general managers' jobs, over to people who are more analytic-minded than basketball hierarchy or guys who have been around the league. I mean it seems to be the pattern, and I think they speak their language because a lot of these guys are financial guys. You give them statistics — this stock has done such and such over the past three months, and this is up. This is a language that they can talk, and a statistical language that's pretty good. So I can understand that penchant. I do think that it's still about that being able to look a guy in the eyes and kind of understand that this one is going to go in the fox hole with you and this guy is going to be one of the guys who's on board with what we're doing. Yeah, he's going to be on the line when it comes to that time that's the challenge. And then the rest of the stuff kind of falls in together."

This is like following a team run by the N. Korean gov

Yea, but Dolan supposedly has adopted this route as well.

Which could be why they made no move at the deadline?

But, if the Knicks & Dolan were really looking at numbers/statistics, they would have realized they had to make a move, and become sellers at the deadline.

fishmike wrote:I miss MDA and Walsh. Not because Im such a fan, but simply because they told you things. We knew why they drafted Gallo and Hill. We knew why they sent guys packing. It was what you see is what you get. It made following the team easier because right or wrong you could at least understand what their rationale was.

This is like following a team run by the N. Korean gov

And that is one thing I love about MDA - he tells it like it is. No filter. Sometimes I might disagree with him and feel is approach is flawed, but you have to respect his open nature.

franco12 wrote:

fishmike wrote:I miss MDA and Walsh. Not because Im such a fan, but simply because they told you things. We knew why they drafted Gallo and Hill. We knew why they sent guys packing. It was what you see is what you get. It made following the team easier because right or wrong you could at least understand what their rationale was.

This is like following a team run by the N. Korean gov

And that is one thing I love about MDA - he tells it like it is. No filter. Sometimes I might disagree with him and feel is approach is flawed, but you have to respect his open nature.

dk7th wrote:gallinari is a prototypical advanced stat player. if he could stay healthy he would be an all-star reserve level player.

Well that isn't good enough to win with. Even if he could stay healthy.

Sambakick wrote:MDA is about to lose yet another job. Let's not all make him out to be a Playboy centerfold now.

Its not his coaching I miss, rather how he was simply up front with his thinking, especially after a loss. "I put in player xxxx looking for xxxx. I didnt work out."

Where as the only adjustment Woody has made all season is whether he plays Melo 38 minutes, 40 minutes or 45 minutes.

fishmike wrote:

Sambakick wrote:MDA is about to lose yet another job. Let's not all make him out to be a Playboy centerfold now.

he was an OK coach at best here... and he did try different things, players, lineups...

Its not his coaching I miss, rather how he was simply up front with his thinking, especially after a loss. "I put in player xxxx looking for xxxx. I didnt work out."

Where as the only adjustment Woody has made all season is whether he plays Melo 38 minutes, 40 minutes or 45 minutes.

Woody had his team press full court in the last minute or so of the pistons game, like you do in college.

franco12 wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Sambakick wrote:MDA is about to lose yet another job. Let's not all make him out to be a Playboy centerfold now.

he was an OK coach at best here... and he did try different things, players, lineups...

Its not his coaching I miss, rather how he was simply up front with his thinking, especially after a loss. "I put in player xxxx looking for xxxx. I didnt work out."

Where as the only adjustment Woody has made all season is whether he plays Melo 38 minutes, 40 minutes or 45 minutes.

Woody had his team press full court in the last minute or so of the pistons game, like you do in college.

You cant ask NBA players to press and trap, then play regular defense. How did it work out? I didnt even know they played Det until I saw the score on UK

fishmike wrote:I miss MDA and Walsh. Not because Im such a fan, but simply because they told you things. We knew why they drafted Gallo and Hill. We knew why they sent guys packing.

I miss Walsh for that reason. Pringles? Hell no - remember when he told the reporters that the Knicks were in Love with Steph Curry when everyone had their doubts about him being able to play point? I still hate for that

djsunyc wrote:i saw the thread creator and thought this thread was about "anal ticks" - something fish usually gets since he spends many a weekend in side woods of jersey rest stops.

so THAT'S why he behaves like he has a bug up his azz!

Sambakick wrote:

dk7th wrote:gallinari is a prototypical advanced stat player. if he could stay healthy he would be an all-star reserve level player.

Well that isn't good enough to win with. Even if he could stay healthy.

as i was walking to work this morning i was thinking that an "advanced stat player" is what in the past has been termed a "complete player."

being complete as a player doesn't necessarily mean that you excel at any one thing but that you are average or better at almost all the things that basketball requires. an argument can be made that gallo is that sort of player, but if you want to quibble you can say he could probably average a rebound or two more per game.

if you want to have a winning team you need as many complete players as possible, and as a matter of fact if you look at what the mvp race is all about this year it is all about being as complete and as efficient as possible.

djsunyc wrote:i saw the thread creator and thought this thread was about "anal ticks" - something fish usually gets since he spends many a weekend in side woods of jersey rest stops.

SupremeCommander wrote:

fishmike wrote:I miss MDA and Walsh. Not because Im such a fan, but simply because they told you things. We knew why they drafted Gallo and Hill. We knew why they sent guys packing.

I miss Walsh for that reason. Pringles? Hell no - remember when he told the reporters that the Knicks were in Love with Steph Curry when everyone had their doubts about him being able to play point? I still hate for that

MDA had a core of Nash-Kobe-Dwight-Gasol for maybe 10 games last season. On paper thats an allstar roster.......a few years too late.

Look at that roster now. MDA to me is doing a good job with what he got.

Analytics might be telling Dolan that he screwed up.

Water is under the bridge so its about moving forward!

fishmike wrote:

franco12 wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Sambakick wrote:MDA is about to lose yet another job. Let's not all make him out to be a Playboy centerfold now.

he was an OK coach at best here... and he did try different things, players, lineups...

Its not his coaching I miss, rather how he was simply up front with his thinking, especially after a loss. "I put in player xxxx looking for xxxx. I didnt work out."

Where as the only adjustment Woody has made all season is whether he plays Melo 38 minutes, 40 minutes or 45 minutes.

Woody had his team press full court in the last minute or so of the pistons game, like you do in college.

I missed that... but that just doesnt fly in the NBA. I believe Calipari tried that (or was it Pitino). NBA players dont press. You can get some good on the ball defenders to pressure opposing guards but the whole press and trap scramble doesnt work in this league. Too much effort with min returns and too many easy buckets.

You cant ask NBA players to press and trap, then play regular defense. How did it work out? I didnt even know they played Det until I saw the score on UK

That was Pitino with our beloved Knicks - how can you forget!

Blast from past:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/a...

Of course- that wouldn't work full time in today's NBA.

But - what I saw from Woodson was maybe a desire to get his players to care - even though the game was long decided- to care.

Its the one adjustment I've seen him make - and I think its too little, too late.

fishmike wrote:I miss MDA and Walsh. Not because Im such a fan, but simply because they told you things. We knew why they drafted Gallo and Hill. We knew why they sent guys packing. It was what you see is what you get. It made following the team easier because right or wrong you could at least understand what their rationale was.

This is like following a team run by the N. Korean gov

Jim Dong Ill...indeed!