Knicks · ONCE AGAIN MDA QUITS..did not want the lame duck status (page 5)
Gsus wrote:Would love to see him coach the Wolves. Free Tricky Ricky, let him run wild. He's an instinctive point guard, and he can thrive in MDA's system. Add Kevin Love, the stretch four that he so covets, spacing with Kevin Martin, and Brewer leaking out and scoring in 7 seconds or less...that would be a very fun team to watch. I hope he gets it.
nash can shoot, rubio to date hasnt been able to. that might limit things and that is a bad recipe for that system.
sidsanders wrote:Gsus wrote:Would love to see him coach the Wolves. Free Tricky Ricky, let him run wild. He's an instinctive point guard, and he can thrive in MDA's system. Add Kevin Love, the stretch four that he so covets, spacing with Kevin Martin, and Brewer leaking out and scoring in 7 seconds or less...that would be a very fun team to watch. I hope he gets it.nash can shoot, rubio to date hasnt been able to. that might limit things and that is a bad recipe for that system.
Playing for MDA almost all guards improve their shooting and that included Nash. My bet is so would Rubio. Haven't we seen this happen enough to know PG's play better under MDA?
nixluva wrote:sidsanders wrote:Gsus wrote:Would love to see him coach the Wolves. Free Tricky Ricky, let him run wild. He's an instinctive point guard, and he can thrive in MDA's system. Add Kevin Love, the stretch four that he so covets, spacing with Kevin Martin, and Brewer leaking out and scoring in 7 seconds or less...that would be a very fun team to watch. I hope he gets it.nash can shoot, rubio to date hasnt been able to. that might limit things and that is a bad recipe for that system.
Playing for MDA almost all guards improve their shooting and that included Nash. My bet is so would Rubio. Haven't we seen this happen enough to know PG's play better under MDA?
How about Tony Douglass?
nixluva wrote:sidsanders wrote:Gsus wrote:Would love to see him coach the Wolves. Free Tricky Ricky, let him run wild. He's an instinctive point guard, and he can thrive in MDA's system. Add Kevin Love, the stretch four that he so covets, spacing with Kevin Martin, and Brewer leaking out and scoring in 7 seconds or less...that would be a very fun team to watch. I hope he gets it.nash can shoot, rubio to date hasnt been able to. that might limit things and that is a bad recipe for that system.
Playing for MDA almost all guards improve their shooting and that included Nash. My bet is so would Rubio. Haven't we seen this happen enough to know PG's play better under MDA?
rubio has been pretty terrible with his shot (38% this year is his best to date). nash pre dantoni was 47% or so and has always been 40% from 3. do no see rubio getting to that level of nash in dal much less phx. if he changes his shot selection, his shooting stats could improve.
mreinman wrote:nixluva wrote:sidsanders wrote:Gsus wrote:Would love to see him coach the Wolves. Free Tricky Ricky, let him run wild. He's an instinctive point guard, and he can thrive in MDA's system. Add Kevin Love, the stretch four that he so covets, spacing with Kevin Martin, and Brewer leaking out and scoring in 7 seconds or less...that would be a very fun team to watch. I hope he gets it.nash can shoot, rubio to date hasnt been able to. that might limit things and that is a bad recipe for that system.
Playing for MDA almost all guards improve their shooting and that included Nash. My bet is so would Rubio. Haven't we seen this happen enough to know PG's play better under MDA?
How about Tony Douglass?
NO ONE could make TD into a PG. Besides that's about the only one that didn't get better.
sidsanders wrote:nixluva wrote:sidsanders wrote:Gsus wrote:Would love to see him coach the Wolves. Free Tricky Ricky, let him run wild. He's an instinctive point guard, and he can thrive in MDA's system. Add Kevin Love, the stretch four that he so covets, spacing with Kevin Martin, and Brewer leaking out and scoring in 7 seconds or less...that would be a very fun team to watch. I hope he gets it.nash can shoot, rubio to date hasnt been able to. that might limit things and that is a bad recipe for that system.
Playing for MDA almost all guards improve their shooting and that included Nash. My bet is so would Rubio. Haven't we seen this happen enough to know PG's play better under MDA?
rubio has been pretty terrible with his shot (38% this year is his best to date). nash pre dantoni was 47% or so and has always been 40% from 3. do no see rubio getting to that level of nash in dal much less phx. if he changes his shot selection, his shooting stats could improve.
That's the point. MDA usually makes a decent PG better and a great PG can reach MVP levels. So the possible improvement for Rubio could be substantial. Just learning where to get those good shots and taking more shots in those great spots will do wonders for Rubio.
nixluva wrote:mreinman wrote:nixluva wrote:sidsanders wrote:Gsus wrote:Would love to see him coach the Wolves. Free Tricky Ricky, let him run wild. He's an instinctive point guard, and he can thrive in MDA's system. Add Kevin Love, the stretch four that he so covets, spacing with Kevin Martin, and Brewer leaking out and scoring in 7 seconds or less...that would be a very fun team to watch. I hope he gets it.nash can shoot, rubio to date hasnt been able to. that might limit things and that is a bad recipe for that system.
Playing for MDA almost all guards improve their shooting and that included Nash. My bet is so would Rubio. Haven't we seen this happen enough to know PG's play better under MDA?
How about Tony Douglass?
NO ONE could make TD into a PG. Besides that's about the only one that didn't get better.
MDA having to try TD at the PG shows how problematic the roster was at that time. It speaks volumes to the "Clumsy" roster was had.
Nalod wrote:nixluva wrote:mreinman wrote:nixluva wrote:sidsanders wrote:Gsus wrote:Would love to see him coach the Wolves. Free Tricky Ricky, let him run wild. He's an instinctive point guard, and he can thrive in MDA's system. Add Kevin Love, the stretch four that he so covets, spacing with Kevin Martin, and Brewer leaking out and scoring in 7 seconds or less...that would be a very fun team to watch. I hope he gets it.nash can shoot, rubio to date hasnt been able to. that might limit things and that is a bad recipe for that system.
Playing for MDA almost all guards improve their shooting and that included Nash. My bet is so would Rubio. Haven't we seen this happen enough to know PG's play better under MDA?
How about Tony Douglass?
NO ONE could make TD into a PG. Besides that's about the only one that didn't get better.
MDA having to try TD at the PG shows how problematic the roster was at that time. It speaks volumes to the "Clumsy" roster was had.
Exactly! And that was thanks to the Billups amnesty and Tyson signing. Starphuck.
Nalod wrote:nixluva wrote:mreinman wrote:nixluva wrote:sidsanders wrote:Gsus wrote:Would love to see him coach the Wolves. Free Tricky Ricky, let him run wild. He's an instinctive point guard, and he can thrive in MDA's system. Add Kevin Love, the stretch four that he so covets, spacing with Kevin Martin, and Brewer leaking out and scoring in 7 seconds or less...that would be a very fun team to watch. I hope he gets it.nash can shoot, rubio to date hasnt been able to. that might limit things and that is a bad recipe for that system.
Playing for MDA almost all guards improve their shooting and that included Nash. My bet is so would Rubio. Haven't we seen this happen enough to know PG's play better under MDA?
How about Tony Douglass?
NO ONE could make TD into a PG. Besides that's about the only one that didn't get better.
MDA having to try TD at the PG shows how problematic the roster was at that time. It speaks volumes to the "Clumsy" roster was had.
prior to drafting TD, his clips/highlights had not shown him making one single pass to a team mate..I looked all over the place for some of his college high lights. Just showed him shooting at will, and gambling on defense. I think he had one double digit assit game in his entire career thus far. Even duhon elevated his game under MDA..
knicks1248 wrote:Nalod wrote:nixluva wrote:mreinman wrote:nixluva wrote:sidsanders wrote:Gsus wrote:Would love to see him coach the Wolves. Free Tricky Ricky, let him run wild. He's an instinctive point guard, and he can thrive in MDA's system. Add Kevin Love, the stretch four that he so covets, spacing with Kevin Martin, and Brewer leaking out and scoring in 7 seconds or less...that would be a very fun team to watch. I hope he gets it.nash can shoot, rubio to date hasnt been able to. that might limit things and that is a bad recipe for that system.
Playing for MDA almost all guards improve their shooting and that included Nash. My bet is so would Rubio. Haven't we seen this happen enough to know PG's play better under MDA?
How about Tony Douglass?
NO ONE could make TD into a PG. Besides that's about the only one that didn't get better.
MDA having to try TD at the PG shows how problematic the roster was at that time. It speaks volumes to the "Clumsy" roster was had.
prior to drafting TD, his clips/highlights had not shown him making one single pass to a team mate..I looked all over the place for some of his college high lights. Just showed him shooting at will, and gambling on defense. I think he had one double digit assit game in his entire career thus far. Even duhon elevated his game under MDA..
Ok, we agree. We drafted TD NOT to play point. WHat was up with the roster that neccessitated this? YOu saying MDA has no record of improving PG play? Not sure what your saying.
Nalod wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Nalod wrote:nixluva wrote:mreinman wrote:nixluva wrote:sidsanders wrote:Gsus wrote:Would love to see him coach the Wolves. Free Tricky Ricky, let him run wild. He's an instinctive point guard, and he can thrive in MDA's system. Add Kevin Love, the stretch four that he so covets, spacing with Kevin Martin, and Brewer leaking out and scoring in 7 seconds or less...that would be a very fun team to watch. I hope he gets it.nash can shoot, rubio to date hasnt been able to. that might limit things and that is a bad recipe for that system.
Playing for MDA almost all guards improve their shooting and that included Nash. My bet is so would Rubio. Haven't we seen this happen enough to know PG's play better under MDA?
How about Tony Douglass?
NO ONE could make TD into a PG. Besides that's about the only one that didn't get better.
MDA having to try TD at the PG shows how problematic the roster was at that time. It speaks volumes to the "Clumsy" roster was had.
prior to drafting TD, his clips/highlights had not shown him making one single pass to a team mate..I looked all over the place for some of his college high lights. Just showed him shooting at will, and gambling on defense. I think he had one double digit assit game in his entire career thus far. Even duhon elevated his game under MDA..
Ok, we agree. We drafted TD NOT to play point. WHat was up with the roster that neccessitated this? YOu saying MDA has no record of improving PG play? Not sure what your saying.
Yet we amnesty CB and make TD our starting PG. How did we possibly expect to be successful with this move?
mreinman wrote:Nalod wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Nalod wrote:nixluva wrote:mreinman wrote:nixluva wrote:sidsanders wrote:Gsus wrote:Would love to see him coach the Wolves. Free Tricky Ricky, let him run wild. He's an instinctive point guard, and he can thrive in MDA's system. Add Kevin Love, the stretch four that he so covets, spacing with Kevin Martin, and Brewer leaking out and scoring in 7 seconds or less...that would be a very fun team to watch. I hope he gets it.nash can shoot, rubio to date hasnt been able to. that might limit things and that is a bad recipe for that system.
Playing for MDA almost all guards improve their shooting and that included Nash. My bet is so would Rubio. Haven't we seen this happen enough to know PG's play better under MDA?
How about Tony Douglass?
NO ONE could make TD into a PG. Besides that's about the only one that didn't get better.
MDA having to try TD at the PG shows how problematic the roster was at that time. It speaks volumes to the "Clumsy" roster was had.
prior to drafting TD, his clips/highlights had not shown him making one single pass to a team mate..I looked all over the place for some of his college high lights. Just showed him shooting at will, and gambling on defense. I think he had one double digit assit game in his entire career thus far. Even duhon elevated his game under MDA..
Ok, we agree. We drafted TD NOT to play point. WHat was up with the roster that neccessitated this? YOu saying MDA has no record of improving PG play? Not sure what your saying.
Yet we amnesty CB and make TD our starting PG. How did we possibly expect to be successful with this move?
Dude do you remember that CB tore is acl litte after we amnestied him and he miss the entire yr.
Then everybody would have been like the knicks are retards for keeping a 34 yr old pg..
Besides he was way to slow to run anything close to mda's system
knicks1248 wrote:mreinman wrote:Nalod wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Nalod wrote:nixluva wrote:mreinman wrote:nixluva wrote:sidsanders wrote:Gsus wrote:Would love to see him coach the Wolves. Free Tricky Ricky, let him run wild. He's an instinctive point guard, and he can thrive in MDA's system. Add Kevin Love, the stretch four that he so covets, spacing with Kevin Martin, and Brewer leaking out and scoring in 7 seconds or less...that would be a very fun team to watch. I hope he gets it.nash can shoot, rubio to date hasnt been able to. that might limit things and that is a bad recipe for that system.
Playing for MDA almost all guards improve their shooting and that included Nash. My bet is so would Rubio. Haven't we seen this happen enough to know PG's play better under MDA?
How about Tony Douglass?
NO ONE could make TD into a PG. Besides that's about the only one that didn't get better.
MDA having to try TD at the PG shows how problematic the roster was at that time. It speaks volumes to the "Clumsy" roster was had.
prior to drafting TD, his clips/highlights had not shown him making one single pass to a team mate..I looked all over the place for some of his college high lights. Just showed him shooting at will, and gambling on defense. I think he had one double digit assit game in his entire career thus far. Even duhon elevated his game under MDA..
Ok, we agree. We drafted TD NOT to play point. WHat was up with the roster that neccessitated this? YOu saying MDA has no record of improving PG play? Not sure what your saying.
Yet we amnesty CB and make TD our starting PG. How did we possibly expect to be successful with this move?
Dude do you remember that CB tore is acl litte after we amnestied him and he miss the entire yr.
Then everybody would have been like the knicks are retards for keeping a 34 yr old pg..
Besides he was way to slow to run anything close to mda's system
So he tore his ACL, sh1t happens. But even if by some fluke, it happened here. He was going to expire. Then, we amnesty Amare that same summer that CB expires.
Guess what ...
Too slow? How about BD? Bibby? TD? He was not too slow and actually played well for LAC.
toad wrote:Rubio could use a little MDA magic. His shine is all but gone these days, looking like he might never live up to that early hype.
To be fair, when people are comparing you to Jerry West and Steve Nash, is anyone really surprised he may never live up to the hype?
mreinman wrote:knicks1248 wrote:mreinman wrote:Nalod wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Nalod wrote:nixluva wrote:mreinman wrote:nixluva wrote:sidsanders wrote:Gsus wrote:Would love to see him coach the Wolves. Free Tricky Ricky, let him run wild. He's an instinctive point guard, and he can thrive in MDA's system. Add Kevin Love, the stretch four that he so covets, spacing with Kevin Martin, and Brewer leaking out and scoring in 7 seconds or less...that would be a very fun team to watch. I hope he gets it.nash can shoot, rubio to date hasnt been able to. that might limit things and that is a bad recipe for that system.
Playing for MDA almost all guards improve their shooting and that included Nash. My bet is so would Rubio. Haven't we seen this happen enough to know PG's play better under MDA?
How about Tony Douglass?
NO ONE could make TD into a PG. Besides that's about the only one that didn't get better.
MDA having to try TD at the PG shows how problematic the roster was at that time. It speaks volumes to the "Clumsy" roster was had.
prior to drafting TD, his clips/highlights had not shown him making one single pass to a team mate..I looked all over the place for some of his college high lights. Just showed him shooting at will, and gambling on defense. I think he had one double digit assit game in his entire career thus far. Even duhon elevated his game under MDA..
Ok, we agree. We drafted TD NOT to play point. WHat was up with the roster that neccessitated this? YOu saying MDA has no record of improving PG play? Not sure what your saying.
Yet we amnesty CB and make TD our starting PG. How did we possibly expect to be successful with this move?
Dude do you remember that CB tore is acl litte after we amnestied him and he miss the entire yr.
Then everybody would have been like the knicks are retards for keeping a 34 yr old pg..
Besides he was way to slow to run anything close to mda's system
So he tore his ACL, sh1t happens. But even if by some fluke, it happened here. He was going to expire. Then, we amnesty Amare that same summer that CB expires.
Guess what ...
Too slow? How about BD? Bibby? TD? He was not too slow and actually played well for LAC.
There was nothing flukey about CB's injury woes, the guy broke down after his first 22 games as a knick, and we went into the playoffs with TD anyway. There was zero reason to believe he would last a season or anything close to it.
You have to face reality, MDA never had any kind of real team here, and he certainly wasn't responsible for bringing majority of them in.
Most of the lakers players had career years offensively, but look up and down that line up, none of them were remotely associated with DOY.
I'll bet a whole lot of $ that MDA gets a HC job (in the nba or college)before woodson..
knicks1248 wrote:mreinman wrote:knicks1248 wrote:mreinman wrote:Nalod wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Nalod wrote:nixluva wrote:mreinman wrote:nixluva wrote:sidsanders wrote:Gsus wrote:Would love to see him coach the Wolves. Free Tricky Ricky, let him run wild. He's an instinctive point guard, and he can thrive in MDA's system. Add Kevin Love, the stretch four that he so covets, spacing with Kevin Martin, and Brewer leaking out and scoring in 7 seconds or less...that would be a very fun team to watch. I hope he gets it.nash can shoot, rubio to date hasnt been able to. that might limit things and that is a bad recipe for that system.
Playing for MDA almost all guards improve their shooting and that included Nash. My bet is so would Rubio. Haven't we seen this happen enough to know PG's play better under MDA?
How about Tony Douglass?
NO ONE could make TD into a PG. Besides that's about the only one that didn't get better.
MDA having to try TD at the PG shows how problematic the roster was at that time. It speaks volumes to the "Clumsy" roster was had.
prior to drafting TD, his clips/highlights had not shown him making one single pass to a team mate..I looked all over the place for some of his college high lights. Just showed him shooting at will, and gambling on defense. I think he had one double digit assit game in his entire career thus far. Even duhon elevated his game under MDA..
Ok, we agree. We drafted TD NOT to play point. WHat was up with the roster that neccessitated this? YOu saying MDA has no record of improving PG play? Not sure what your saying.
Yet we amnesty CB and make TD our starting PG. How did we possibly expect to be successful with this move?
Dude do you remember that CB tore is acl litte after we amnestied him and he miss the entire yr.
Then everybody would have been like the knicks are retards for keeping a 34 yr old pg..
Besides he was way to slow to run anything close to mda's system
So he tore his ACL, sh1t happens. But even if by some fluke, it happened here. He was going to expire. Then, we amnesty Amare that same summer that CB expires.
Guess what ...
Too slow? How about BD? Bibby? TD? He was not too slow and actually played well for LAC.
There was nothing flukey about CB's injury woes, the guy broke down after his first 22 games as a knick, and we went into the playoffs with TD anyway. There was zero reason to believe he would last a season or anything close to it.
You have to face reality, MDA never had any kind of real team here, and he certainly wasn't responsible for bringing majority of them in.
Most of the lakers players had career years offensively, but look up and down that line up, none of them were remotely associated with DOY.
I'll bet a whole lot of $ that MDA gets a HC job (in the nba or college)before woodson..
You can't predict an ACL and look at his history before that. Did not miss that many games.
And, regardless its irrelevant. He was an expiring that could have helped us out a lot. Instead we overpay for a flash in the pan(ish) type of player while bidding against nobody and ... you know the rest.
Also, you want to gamble on a guy like rondo for multiple years yet you were worried about CB's expiring?
mreinman wrote:knicks1248 wrote:mreinman wrote:knicks1248 wrote:mreinman wrote:Nalod wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Nalod wrote:nixluva wrote:mreinman wrote:nixluva wrote:sidsanders wrote:Gsus wrote:Would love to see him coach the Wolves. Free Tricky Ricky, let him run wild. He's an instinctive point guard, and he can thrive in MDA's system. Add Kevin Love, the stretch four that he so covets, spacing with Kevin Martin, and Brewer leaking out and scoring in 7 seconds or less...that would be a very fun team to watch. I hope he gets it.nash can shoot, rubio to date hasnt been able to. that might limit things and that is a bad recipe for that system.
Playing for MDA almost all guards improve their shooting and that included Nash. My bet is so would Rubio. Haven't we seen this happen enough to know PG's play better under MDA?
How about Tony Douglass?
NO ONE could make TD into a PG. Besides that's about the only one that didn't get better.
MDA having to try TD at the PG shows how problematic the roster was at that time. It speaks volumes to the "Clumsy" roster was had.
prior to drafting TD, his clips/highlights had not shown him making one single pass to a team mate..I looked all over the place for some of his college high lights. Just showed him shooting at will, and gambling on defense. I think he had one double digit assit game in his entire career thus far. Even duhon elevated his game under MDA..
Ok, we agree. We drafted TD NOT to play point. WHat was up with the roster that neccessitated this? YOu saying MDA has no record of improving PG play? Not sure what your saying.
Yet we amnesty CB and make TD our starting PG. How did we possibly expect to be successful with this move?
Dude do you remember that CB tore is acl litte after we amnestied him and he miss the entire yr.
Then everybody would have been like the knicks are retards for keeping a 34 yr old pg..
Besides he was way to slow to run anything close to mda's system
So he tore his ACL, sh1t happens. But even if by some fluke, it happened here. He was going to expire. Then, we amnesty Amare that same summer that CB expires.
Guess what ...
Too slow? How about BD? Bibby? TD? He was not too slow and actually played well for LAC.
There was nothing flukey about CB's injury woes, the guy broke down after his first 22 games as a knick, and we went into the playoffs with TD anyway. There was zero reason to believe he would last a season or anything close to it.
You have to face reality, MDA never had any kind of real team here, and he certainly wasn't responsible for bringing majority of them in.
Most of the lakers players had career years offensively, but look up and down that line up, none of them were remotely associated with DOY.
I'll bet a whole lot of $ that MDA gets a HC job (in the nba or college)before woodson..
You can't predict an ACL and look at his history before that. Did not miss that many games.
And, regardless its irrelevant. He was an expiring that could have helped us out a lot. Instead we overpay for a flash in the pan(ish) type of player while bidding against nobody and ... you know the rest.
Also, you want to gamble on a guy like rondo for multiple years yet you were worried about CB's expiring?
Achilles not ACL if you are talking about Billups.
yellowboy90 wrote:mreinman wrote:knicks1248 wrote:mreinman wrote:knicks1248 wrote:mreinman wrote:Nalod wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Nalod wrote:nixluva wrote:mreinman wrote:nixluva wrote:sidsanders wrote:Gsus wrote:Would love to see him coach the Wolves. Free Tricky Ricky, let him run wild. He's an instinctive point guard, and he can thrive in MDA's system. Add Kevin Love, the stretch four that he so covets, spacing with Kevin Martin, and Brewer leaking out and scoring in 7 seconds or less...that would be a very fun team to watch. I hope he gets it.nash can shoot, rubio to date hasnt been able to. that might limit things and that is a bad recipe for that system.
Playing for MDA almost all guards improve their shooting and that included Nash. My bet is so would Rubio. Haven't we seen this happen enough to know PG's play better under MDA?
How about Tony Douglass?
NO ONE could make TD into a PG. Besides that's about the only one that didn't get better.
MDA having to try TD at the PG shows how problematic the roster was at that time. It speaks volumes to the "Clumsy" roster was had.
prior to drafting TD, his clips/highlights had not shown him making one single pass to a team mate..I looked all over the place for some of his college high lights. Just showed him shooting at will, and gambling on defense. I think he had one double digit assit game in his entire career thus far. Even duhon elevated his game under MDA..
Ok, we agree. We drafted TD NOT to play point. WHat was up with the roster that neccessitated this? YOu saying MDA has no record of improving PG play? Not sure what your saying.
Yet we amnesty CB and make TD our starting PG. How did we possibly expect to be successful with this move?
Dude do you remember that CB tore is acl litte after we amnestied him and he miss the entire yr.
Then everybody would have been like the knicks are retards for keeping a 34 yr old pg..
Besides he was way to slow to run anything close to mda's system
So he tore his ACL, sh1t happens. But even if by some fluke, it happened here. He was going to expire. Then, we amnesty Amare that same summer that CB expires.
Guess what ...
Too slow? How about BD? Bibby? TD? He was not too slow and actually played well for LAC.
There was nothing flukey about CB's injury woes, the guy broke down after his first 22 games as a knick, and we went into the playoffs with TD anyway. There was zero reason to believe he would last a season or anything close to it.
You have to face reality, MDA never had any kind of real team here, and he certainly wasn't responsible for bringing majority of them in.
Most of the lakers players had career years offensively, but look up and down that line up, none of them were remotely associated with DOY.
I'll bet a whole lot of $ that MDA gets a HC job (in the nba or college)before woodson..
You can't predict an ACL and look at his history before that. Did not miss that many games.
And, regardless its irrelevant. He was an expiring that could have helped us out a lot. Instead we overpay for a flash in the pan(ish) type of player while bidding against nobody and ... you know the rest.
Also, you want to gamble on a guy like rondo for multiple years yet you were worried about CB's expiring?
Achilles not ACL if you are talking about Billups.
Right ... I I think that may be more of an age thing but not 100 percent sure.
Still irrelevant