Knicks · we have a 50 win team on our hands this year, i'm good at feeling these things out (page 10)

F500ONE wrote:The previous GM received full support for the moves he was making with a means to an end goal.

The only difference, the end goal keeps changing

The previous GM made moves that supposedly fit Melo and the style of play

He made moves that suggested we were in win now mode, none of them really worked

Probably some doubted they ever would

We've built twice around a player in his prime and now are doing it as he's coming out, stakes could never be higher
Okay so now we've hired Phil, we have some direction

The top heavy part of the plan is older and the outside competition is getting younger-better

The top heavy part of the plan also took too much of the pie, to make it easier to execute the plan

I think Phil has a good sense of what it takes to win, he simply doesn't have the resources to accomplish peak results

We're probably better than we were 10yrs ago or so, but not too hard improving on a low benchmark

We need long sustaining success starting with and going beyond Phil and Melo's contractual tenure

I don't see it, I see another flash in the pan plan.

I think the difference of opinion continuing the divide on this board is that some of us on the optimistic side see Phil building around his system and not a single player.....the thinking is that Phil sees Melo having a superior talent level to succeed in his system. There seem to be some on this board pooo poooing system or team basketball in favor of individual metrics for an individual player. One prominent poster even posted that the "system" and a quarter would get you a gumball.

Some seem to be trying so hard to describe basketball as an individual game with individual performance metrics driving the bus.......instead of what it is......a flowing team game, where the interdependancies of players on the floor help drive team success. I was 50/50 on wanting Melo back or not. But I'll defer to Phil believing that Melo can be a force in the triangle as coached by Fisher....instead of being a continual skeptic and pretending to think I know more about basketball than Phil because I'm good at being able to quickly google up individual advanced basketball stats while I sit at work wasting company money.

F500ONE wrote:

fishmike wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

knickscity wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:OMG! I just wrote that it's more likely Phil will look to acquire some Near Max guys rather than blow it all on one max guy and then not have any cap for much else. WTF?

nixluva wrote:It seems to me that there could be more value in finding a way to get the help we need outside of adding a Max FA. Phil is going to have to really come up with a plan that builds this team with near max players rather than splurge for that one max guy and have very little else. I'm pretty sure that Phil and his staff have crunched the numbers and laid out multiple scenarios for what they can do with the cap next summer. I'm sure that they quickly came to realize that this was not going to be easy to figure out. This is why the move to add youth was so important. You have to find a way to secure cheap talent. The best way is with young players. That young talent is the lifeline for a GM. Think of how much different our team would look if Phil had not made the trade?

WTF??? Why so tense?

So the beginning of supporting for this approach started with Phil making the Dallas trade?

Shouldn't this always be a front office's MO

Did you support the Bargnani trade giving up 2 picks and a 1st which could have equated to adding more youthful talent going for our rebuild future

Are you a forward thinking fan or an in the moment kind

For the record stop giving Phil lay on thick kudos because if I recall correctly we rejected several Chandler trades over the past yr or so

Our team could look very much the same had Grunwald or Mills pulled the trigger on deals

Phil hasn't done anything out of the ordinary had we hired an ordinary GM

He hasn't even scratched the surface of his $60mil paycheck

Phil made a good deal imo, and I wont knock him because the previous GM's didnt do it. Phil has recognized that the backcourt is too crowded, so I'd like to see how he will address that.

Imo, this upcoming season should be all about establishing the culture he wants, if the teams can win games in the process that would be a plus initself.

Phil gets no grade by me til i see what he does in 2015, whether that means making good signings to the roster and keeping flexibility for 2016 as well.

Right after Melo was signed Phil was interviewed during the Knicks sl game against Charlotte. Phil said he is hoping to bring in two really good players with the cap space that the Knicks have available in 2015.

Crush i'm convinced that most of the guys complaining and doubting have no idea what Phil has been saying. This is why they're talking such nonsense. They really haven't dug deep into what's going on and the possibilities that are being created for this franchise since Phil came on board. No one is saying he's perfect or anything, but he's done a good job so far with very limited resources. Did anyone expect a sexy move so early considering what Phil had to work with? I do know that he didn't lose in the trade with Dallas. He got a better PG which we needed and young assets to boot. That's a win in my book.

you nailed it. Most thought this was a sit and wait offseason, no picks, no MLE, no cap space, players nobody wanted to trade for, etc etc.. we heard it all. Phil gets us younger, jettisons guys who a problem last year, has a good draft, adds a couple prospects, fixes PG and sets us up to have a good season, but guys would rather spin their wheels about MElo's no trade or Calderon's $7mm year. Its going to be a good year. Keep posting and stay thirsty

The previous GM received full support for the moves he was making with a means to an end goal.

The only difference, the end goal keeps changing

The previous GM made moves that supposedly fit Melo and the style of play

He made moves that suggested we were in win now mode, none of them really worked

Probably some doubted they ever would

We've built twice around a player in his prime and now are doing it as he's coming out, stakes could never be higher

Okay so now we've hired Phil, we have some direction

The top heavy part of the plan is older and the outside competition is getting younger-better

The top heavy part of the plan also took too much of the pie, to make it easier to execute the plan

I think Phil has a good sense of what it takes to win, he simply doesn't have the resources to accomplish peak results

We're probably better than we were 10yrs ago or so, but not too hard improving on a low benchmark

We need long sustaining success starting with and going beyond Phil and Melo's contractual tenure

I don't see it, I see another flash in the pan plan.

funny.. its all about Melo for you guys. The flash in the pan already happened. 10 years of losing seasons. Melo is talented enough to fix that alone, and essentially did. 3 straight winning seasons and 3 straight years the winning % improved. Thats called progress. The problem is there is a setback year in that history so you have some folks like yourself who are stuck in the past and think nothing changes and this is just another flash in the pan.

Feel free to believe that. Its your opinion which you post daily here. I get it. Of course if its win now flash in the pants why draft guys? Why trade for younger players? Why aquire picks and use them for players and not trades? Why is THjr still here?

Your view is riddled with emotion, most of it disdain for Melo. Did you ever tell me who your max guys were? Do you think we are buidling a sustainable winner with guys like Thadeus Young? No.. its a stars league. You need premier talent or your getting nothing done, and premier talent like to play with other premier talent. Its why Derrick Rose said "playing with Melo would have made the game easy."

Do you remember the last time the Knicks had cap space and a losing team? Best they could do was $100mm for an uninsured Amare. They couldnt even get Joe Johnson in here for a $100mm. But you like to pretend that it doesnt matter, that if we let Melo walk for nothing that NBA FAs would just be dying to come play on a 25 win team with JR Smith and THjr. If you believe that I can see why the Melo signing would bug you. David Aldridge... another Melo apologist apparently... add him to the list of guys who understand why he's a max player.

F500ONE wrote:

fishmike wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

knickscity wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:OMG! I just wrote that it's more likely Phil will look to acquire some Near Max guys rather than blow it all on one max guy and then not have any cap for much else. WTF?

nixluva wrote:It seems to me that there could be more value in finding a way to get the help we need outside of adding a Max FA. Phil is going to have to really come up with a plan that builds this team with near max players rather than splurge for that one max guy and have very little else. I'm pretty sure that Phil and his staff have crunched the numbers and laid out multiple scenarios for what they can do with the cap next summer. I'm sure that they quickly came to realize that this was not going to be easy to figure out. This is why the move to add youth was so important. You have to find a way to secure cheap talent. The best way is with young players. That young talent is the lifeline for a GM. Think of how much different our team would look if Phil had not made the trade?

WTF??? Why so tense?

So the beginning of supporting for this approach started with Phil making the Dallas trade?

Shouldn't this always be a front office's MO

Did you support the Bargnani trade giving up 2 picks and a 1st which could have equated to adding more youthful talent going for our rebuild future

Are you a forward thinking fan or an in the moment kind

For the record stop giving Phil lay on thick kudos because if I recall correctly we rejected several Chandler trades over the past yr or so

Our team could look very much the same had Grunwald or Mills pulled the trigger on deals

Phil hasn't done anything out of the ordinary had we hired an ordinary GM

He hasn't even scratched the surface of his $60mil paycheck

Phil made a good deal imo, and I wont knock him because the previous GM's didnt do it. Phil has recognized that the backcourt is too crowded, so I'd like to see how he will address that.

Imo, this upcoming season should be all about establishing the culture he wants, if the teams can win games in the process that would be a plus initself.

Phil gets no grade by me til i see what he does in 2015, whether that means making good signings to the roster and keeping flexibility for 2016 as well.

Right after Melo was signed Phil was interviewed during the Knicks sl game against Charlotte. Phil said he is hoping to bring in two really good players with the cap space that the Knicks have available in 2015.

Crush i'm convinced that most of the guys complaining and doubting have no idea what Phil has been saying. This is why they're talking such nonsense. They really haven't dug deep into what's going on and the possibilities that are being created for this franchise since Phil came on board. No one is saying he's perfect or anything, but he's done a good job so far with very limited resources. Did anyone expect a sexy move so early considering what Phil had to work with? I do know that he didn't lose in the trade with Dallas. He got a better PG which we needed and young assets to boot. That's a win in my book.

you nailed it. Most thought this was a sit and wait offseason, no picks, no MLE, no cap space, players nobody wanted to trade for, etc etc.. we heard it all. Phil gets us younger, jettisons guys who a problem last year, has a good draft, adds a couple prospects, fixes PG and sets us up to have a good season, but guys would rather spin their wheels about MElo's no trade or Calderon's $7mm year. Its going to be a good year. Keep posting and stay thirsty

The previous GM received full support for the moves he was making with a means to an end goal.

The only difference, the end goal keeps changing

The previous GM made moves that supposedly fit Melo and the style of play

He made moves that suggested we were in win now mode, none of them really worked

Probably some doubted they ever would

We've built twice around a player in his prime and now are doing it as he's coming out, stakes could never be higher

Okay so now we've hired Phil, we have some direction

The top heavy part of the plan is older and the outside competition is getting younger-better

The top heavy part of the plan also took too much of the pie, to make it easier to execute the plan

I think Phil has a good sense of what it takes to win, he simply doesn't have the resources to accomplish peak results

We're probably better than we were 10yrs ago or so, but not too hard improving on a low benchmark

We need long sustaining success starting with and going beyond Phil and Melo's contractual tenure

I don't see it, I see another flash in the pan plan.

We never "built" around melo

aside from getting bargs

fishmike wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

fishmike wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

knickscity wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:OMG! I just wrote that it's more likely Phil will look to acquire some Near Max guys rather than blow it all on one max guy and then not have any cap for much else. WTF?

nixluva wrote:It seems to me that there could be more value in finding a way to get the help we need outside of adding a Max FA. Phil is going to have to really come up with a plan that builds this team with near max players rather than splurge for that one max guy and have very little else. I'm pretty sure that Phil and his staff have crunched the numbers and laid out multiple scenarios for what they can do with the cap next summer. I'm sure that they quickly came to realize that this was not going to be easy to figure out. This is why the move to add youth was so important. You have to find a way to secure cheap talent. The best way is with young players. That young talent is the lifeline for a GM. Think of how much different our team would look if Phil had not made the trade?

WTF??? Why so tense?

So the beginning of supporting for this approach started with Phil making the Dallas trade?

Shouldn't this always be a front office's MO

Did you support the Bargnani trade giving up 2 picks and a 1st which could have equated to adding more youthful talent going for our rebuild future

Are you a forward thinking fan or an in the moment kind

For the record stop giving Phil lay on thick kudos because if I recall correctly we rejected several Chandler trades over the past yr or so

Our team could look very much the same had Grunwald or Mills pulled the trigger on deals

Phil hasn't done anything out of the ordinary had we hired an ordinary GM

He hasn't even scratched the surface of his $60mil paycheck

Phil made a good deal imo, and I wont knock him because the previous GM's didnt do it. Phil has recognized that the backcourt is too crowded, so I'd like to see how he will address that.

Imo, this upcoming season should be all about establishing the culture he wants, if the teams can win games in the process that would be a plus initself.

Phil gets no grade by me til i see what he does in 2015, whether that means making good signings to the roster and keeping flexibility for 2016 as well.

Right after Melo was signed Phil was interviewed during the Knicks sl game against Charlotte. Phil said he is hoping to bring in two really good players with the cap space that the Knicks have available in 2015.

Crush i'm convinced that most of the guys complaining and doubting have no idea what Phil has been saying. This is why they're talking such nonsense. They really haven't dug deep into what's going on and the possibilities that are being created for this franchise since Phil came on board. No one is saying he's perfect or anything, but he's done a good job so far with very limited resources. Did anyone expect a sexy move so early considering what Phil had to work with? I do know that he didn't lose in the trade with Dallas. He got a better PG which we needed and young assets to boot. That's a win in my book.

you nailed it. Most thought this was a sit and wait offseason, no picks, no MLE, no cap space, players nobody wanted to trade for, etc etc.. we heard it all. Phil gets us younger, jettisons guys who a problem last year, has a good draft, adds a couple prospects, fixes PG and sets us up to have a good season, but guys would rather spin their wheels about MElo's no trade or Calderon's $7mm year. Its going to be a good year. Keep posting and stay thirsty

The previous GM received full support for the moves he was making with a means to an end goal.

The only difference, the end goal keeps changing

The previous GM made moves that supposedly fit Melo and the style of play

He made moves that suggested we were in win now mode, none of them really worked

Probably some doubted they ever would

We've built twice around a player in his prime and now are doing it as he's coming out, stakes could never be higher

Okay so now we've hired Phil, we have some direction

The top heavy part of the plan is older and the outside competition is getting younger-better

The top heavy part of the plan also took too much of the pie, to make it easier to execute the plan

I think Phil has a good sense of what it takes to win, he simply doesn't have the resources to accomplish peak results

We're probably better than we were 10yrs ago or so, but not too hard improving on a low benchmark

We need long sustaining success starting with and going beyond Phil and Melo's contractual tenure

I don't see it, I see another flash in the pan plan.

funny.. its all about Melo for you guys. The flash in the pan already happened. 10 years of losing seasons. Melo is talented enough to fix that alone, and essentially did. 3 straight winning seasons and 3 straight years the winning % improved. Thats called progress. The problem is there is a setback year in that history so you have some folks like yourself who are stuck in the past and think nothing changes and this is just another flash in the pan.

Feel free to believe that. Its your opinion which you post daily here. I get it. Of course if its win now flash in the pants why draft guys? Why trade for younger players? Why aquire picks and use them for players and not trades? Why is THjr still here?

Your view is riddled with emotion, most of it disdain for Melo. Did you ever tell me who your max guys were? Do you think we are buidling a sustainable winner with guys like Thadeus Young? No.. its a stars league. You need premier talent or your getting nothing done, and premier talent like to play with other premier talent. Its why Derrick Rose said "playing with Melo would have made the game easy."

Do you remember the last time the Knicks had cap space and a losing team? Best they could do was $100mm for an uninsured Amare. They couldnt even get Joe Johnson in here for a $100mm. But you like to pretend that it doesnt matter, that if we let Melo walk for nothing that NBA FAs would just be dying to come play on a 25 win team with JR Smith and THjr. If you believe that I can see why the Melo signing would bug you. David Aldridge... another Melo apologist apparently... add him to the list of guys who understand why he's a max player.

It's why Derrick Rose didn't recruit Melo and asked for Pau Gasol's personal number to talk championship

If you're asking me would I trade Amar'e and Shump for Thad Young in a 3 team with Clev and Minny

Yes I'd do the trifecta every day of the week, 3 times daily every month of the year.

No free agents came to play with Melo this summer nor last but I do see them flocking elsewhere for cheap////

Year in and Year Out

Last time I checked Tyson said he came here to play with Amar'e

This after Amar'e started showing signs of wearing down

With Melo it's a different story

Something we may see repeated next summer

mreinman wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

fishmike wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

knickscity wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:OMG! I just wrote that it's more likely Phil will look to acquire some Near Max guys rather than blow it all on one max guy and then not have any cap for much else. WTF?

nixluva wrote:It seems to me that there could be more value in finding a way to get the help we need outside of adding a Max FA. Phil is going to have to really come up with a plan that builds this team with near max players rather than splurge for that one max guy and have very little else. I'm pretty sure that Phil and his staff have crunched the numbers and laid out multiple scenarios for what they can do with the cap next summer. I'm sure that they quickly came to realize that this was not going to be easy to figure out. This is why the move to add youth was so important. You have to find a way to secure cheap talent. The best way is with young players. That young talent is the lifeline for a GM. Think of how much different our team would look if Phil had not made the trade?

WTF??? Why so tense?

So the beginning of supporting for this approach started with Phil making the Dallas trade?

Shouldn't this always be a front office's MO

Did you support the Bargnani trade giving up 2 picks and a 1st which could have equated to adding more youthful talent going for our rebuild future

Are you a forward thinking fan or an in the moment kind

For the record stop giving Phil lay on thick kudos because if I recall correctly we rejected several Chandler trades over the past yr or so

Our team could look very much the same had Grunwald or Mills pulled the trigger on deals

Phil hasn't done anything out of the ordinary had we hired an ordinary GM

He hasn't even scratched the surface of his $60mil paycheck

Phil made a good deal imo, and I wont knock him because the previous GM's didnt do it. Phil has recognized that the backcourt is too crowded, so I'd like to see how he will address that.

Imo, this upcoming season should be all about establishing the culture he wants, if the teams can win games in the process that would be a plus initself.

Phil gets no grade by me til i see what he does in 2015, whether that means making good signings to the roster and keeping flexibility for 2016 as well.

Right after Melo was signed Phil was interviewed during the Knicks sl game against Charlotte. Phil said he is hoping to bring in two really good players with the cap space that the Knicks have available in 2015.

Crush i'm convinced that most of the guys complaining and doubting have no idea what Phil has been saying. This is why they're talking such nonsense. They really haven't dug deep into what's going on and the possibilities that are being created for this franchise since Phil came on board. No one is saying he's perfect or anything, but he's done a good job so far with very limited resources. Did anyone expect a sexy move so early considering what Phil had to work with? I do know that he didn't lose in the trade with Dallas. He got a better PG which we needed and young assets to boot. That's a win in my book.

you nailed it. Most thought this was a sit and wait offseason, no picks, no MLE, no cap space, players nobody wanted to trade for, etc etc.. we heard it all. Phil gets us younger, jettisons guys who a problem last year, has a good draft, adds a couple prospects, fixes PG and sets us up to have a good season, but guys would rather spin their wheels about MElo's no trade or Calderon's $7mm year. Its going to be a good year. Keep posting and stay thirsty

The previous GM received full support for the moves he was making with a means to an end goal.

The only difference, the end goal keeps changing

The previous GM made moves that supposedly fit Melo and the style of play

He made moves that suggested we were in win now mode, none of them really worked

Probably some doubted they ever would

We've built twice around a player in his prime and now are doing it as he's coming out, stakes could never be higher

Okay so now we've hired Phil, we have some direction

The top heavy part of the plan is older and the outside competition is getting younger-better

The top heavy part of the plan also took too much of the pie, to make it easier to execute the plan

I think Phil has a good sense of what it takes to win, he simply doesn't have the resources to accomplish peak results

We're probably better than we were 10yrs ago or so, but not too hard improving on a low benchmark

We need long sustaining success starting with and going beyond Phil and Melo's contractual tenure

I don't see it, I see another flash in the pan plan.

We never "built" around melo

aside from getting bargs

So Tyson-Smith-K-Mart weren't guys brought here to help Melo?

Let's agree their plan to build around him was awfully executed

How could we contend if we weren't building around anyone?

Were we building around your favorite, in Amare

foosballnick wrote:

F500ONE wrote:The previous GM received full support for the moves he was making with a means to an end goal.

The only difference, the end goal keeps changing

The previous GM made moves that supposedly fit Melo and the style of play

He made moves that suggested we were in win now mode, none of them really worked

Probably some doubted they ever would

We've built twice around a player in his prime and now are doing it as he's coming out, stakes could never be higher
Okay so now we've hired Phil, we have some direction

The top heavy part of the plan is older and the outside competition is getting younger-better

The top heavy part of the plan also took too much of the pie, to make it easier to execute the plan

I think Phil has a good sense of what it takes to win, he simply doesn't have the resources to accomplish peak results

We're probably better than we were 10yrs ago or so, but not too hard improving on a low benchmark

We need long sustaining success starting with and going beyond Phil and Melo's contractual tenure

I don't see it, I see another flash in the pan plan.

I think the difference of opinion continuing the divide on this board is that some of us on the optimistic side see Phil building around his system and not a single player.....the thinking is that Phil sees Melo having a superior talent level to succeed in his system. There seem to be some on this board pooo poooing system or team basketball in favor of individual metrics for an individual player. One prominent poster even posted that the "system" and a quarter would get you a gumball.

Some seem to be trying so hard to describe basketball as an individual game with individual performance metrics driving the bus.......instead of what it is......a flowing team game, where the interdependancies of players on the floor help drive team success. I was 50/50 on wanting Melo back or not. But I'll defer to Phil believing that Melo can be a force in the triangle as coached by Fisher....instead of being a continual skeptic and pretending to think I know more about basketball than Phil because I'm good at being able to quickly google up individual advanced basketball stats while I sit at work wasting company money.

But...but...I'm really improving my typing skills! That's not a total waste of money! And I learn more about error-filled statistical analysis on this site than I did during any stat course I took in college!

Imagine deferring to Phil about pro basketball. What a great leap of faith that must represent for some.

Melo Disappointment. It's seems to be so very tough to leave behind.

Rose didn't call/recruit Melo but personally talk to Gasol so that means what?

Rose didn't recruit Lebron James when he was up a few years ago so what did that mean?

Noah, the team leader and heart and soul of the team, did recruit Melo so what does that mean?

Also, when you continually only have the mMLE it's pretty hard to say your are building. It's pretty hard to Build when there is an anchor weighing down your FA moves. Then on top of that you make a terrible trade by giving up a 1st. I saw the trade for Bargs coming but I didn't see the 1st rd draft pick.

foosballnick wrote:

F500ONE wrote:The previous GM received full support for the moves he was making with a means to an end goal.

The only difference, the end goal keeps changing

The previous GM made moves that supposedly fit Melo and the style of play

He made moves that suggested we were in win now mode, none of them really worked

Probably some doubted they ever would

We've built twice around a player in his prime and now are doing it as he's coming out, stakes could never be higher
Okay so now we've hired Phil, we have some direction

The top heavy part of the plan is older and the outside competition is getting younger-better

The top heavy part of the plan also took too much of the pie, to make it easier to execute the plan

I think Phil has a good sense of what it takes to win, he simply doesn't have the resources to accomplish peak results

We're probably better than we were 10yrs ago or so, but not too hard improving on a low benchmark

We need long sustaining success starting with and going beyond Phil and Melo's contractual tenure

I don't see it, I see another flash in the pan plan.

I think the difference of opinion continuing the divide on this board is that some of us on the optimistic side see Phil building around his system and not a single player.....the thinking is that Phil sees Melo having a superior talent level to succeed in his system. There seem to be some on this board pooo poooing system or team basketball in favor of individual metrics for an individual player. One prominent poster even posted that the "system" and a quarter would get you a gumball.

Some seem to be trying so hard to describe basketball as an individual game with individual performance metrics driving the bus.......instead of what it is......a flowing team game, where the interdependancies of players on the floor help drive team success. I was 50/50 on wanting Melo back or not. But I'll defer to Phil believing that Melo can be a force in the triangle as coached by Fisher....instead of being a continual skeptic and pretending to think I know more about basketball than Phil because I'm good at being able to quickly google up individual advanced basketball stats while I sit at work wasting company money.

melo has played in a system once and how'd that work out?

he is looked at on an individual basis no more and no less than any other high ticket player, not as a pretext for prejudice but as a way to analyze his value to the team he plays for. and not all advanced metrics are individual in nature-- i am surprised anyone would make such a dumb assertion. but that those numbers show melo in a negative light-- the same numbers that show other big names in a positive light-- is not the fault of the metrics or the people that use them.

yet this is the crux of your complaint: melo's numbers are not good so it isn't fair that people use those numbers.

what optimists are hoping for is that the ultimate individualistic player will be able to change his game, changing terrible habits and subsuming his outsized ego, and conform to a system.

so far in his career there has not been much of this "interdependency" you cite. in fact, it appears both to the eyes and within the statistics that melo has a tendency to eschew interdependency.

we are asking an awful lot of the triangle to change one player.

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

fishmike wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

knickscity wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:OMG! I just wrote that it's more likely Phil will look to acquire some Near Max guys rather than blow it all on one max guy and then not have any cap for much else. WTF?

nixluva wrote:It seems to me that there could be more value in finding a way to get the help we need outside of adding a Max FA. Phil is going to have to really come up with a plan that builds this team with near max players rather than splurge for that one max guy and have very little else. I'm pretty sure that Phil and his staff have crunched the numbers and laid out multiple scenarios for what they can do with the cap next summer. I'm sure that they quickly came to realize that this was not going to be easy to figure out. This is why the move to add youth was so important. You have to find a way to secure cheap talent. The best way is with young players. That young talent is the lifeline for a GM. Think of how much different our team would look if Phil had not made the trade?

WTF??? Why so tense?

So the beginning of supporting for this approach started with Phil making the Dallas trade?

Shouldn't this always be a front office's MO

Did you support the Bargnani trade giving up 2 picks and a 1st which could have equated to adding more youthful talent going for our rebuild future

Are you a forward thinking fan or an in the moment kind

For the record stop giving Phil lay on thick kudos because if I recall correctly we rejected several Chandler trades over the past yr or so

Our team could look very much the same had Grunwald or Mills pulled the trigger on deals

Phil hasn't done anything out of the ordinary had we hired an ordinary GM

He hasn't even scratched the surface of his $60mil paycheck

Phil made a good deal imo, and I wont knock him because the previous GM's didnt do it. Phil has recognized that the backcourt is too crowded, so I'd like to see how he will address that.

Imo, this upcoming season should be all about establishing the culture he wants, if the teams can win games in the process that would be a plus initself.

Phil gets no grade by me til i see what he does in 2015, whether that means making good signings to the roster and keeping flexibility for 2016 as well.

Right after Melo was signed Phil was interviewed during the Knicks sl game against Charlotte. Phil said he is hoping to bring in two really good players with the cap space that the Knicks have available in 2015.

Crush i'm convinced that most of the guys complaining and doubting have no idea what Phil has been saying. This is why they're talking such nonsense. They really haven't dug deep into what's going on and the possibilities that are being created for this franchise since Phil came on board. No one is saying he's perfect or anything, but he's done a good job so far with very limited resources. Did anyone expect a sexy move so early considering what Phil had to work with? I do know that he didn't lose in the trade with Dallas. He got a better PG which we needed and young assets to boot. That's a win in my book.

you nailed it. Most thought this was a sit and wait offseason, no picks, no MLE, no cap space, players nobody wanted to trade for, etc etc.. we heard it all. Phil gets us younger, jettisons guys who a problem last year, has a good draft, adds a couple prospects, fixes PG and sets us up to have a good season, but guys would rather spin their wheels about MElo's no trade or Calderon's $7mm year. Its going to be a good year. Keep posting and stay thirsty

The previous GM received full support for the moves he was making with a means to an end goal.

The only difference, the end goal keeps changing

The previous GM made moves that supposedly fit Melo and the style of play

He made moves that suggested we were in win now mode, none of them really worked

Probably some doubted they ever would

We've built twice around a player in his prime and now are doing it as he's coming out, stakes could never be higher

Okay so now we've hired Phil, we have some direction

The top heavy part of the plan is older and the outside competition is getting younger-better

The top heavy part of the plan also took too much of the pie, to make it easier to execute the plan

I think Phil has a good sense of what it takes to win, he simply doesn't have the resources to accomplish peak results

We're probably better than we were 10yrs ago or so, but not too hard improving on a low benchmark

We need long sustaining success starting with and going beyond Phil and Melo's contractual tenure

I don't see it, I see another flash in the pan plan.

We never "built" around melo

aside from getting bargs

So Tyson-Smith-K-Mart weren't guys brought here to help Melo?

Let's agree their plan to build around him was awfully executed

How could we contend if we weren't building around anyone?

Were we building around your favorite, in Amare

Were we building around Amare when we brought in Melo? Of course not!

We can agree that whatever they did was awfully executed.

Overpaying for Tyson and wasting our amnesty while losing our only PG was not building, it was destroying.

Kmart is 90 and Smith is an idiot.

I guess it all depends what "building" is.

F500ONE wrote:
It's why Derrick Rose didn't recruit Melo and asked for Pau Gasol's personal number to talk championship

If you're asking me would I trade Amar'e and Shump for Thad Young in a 3 team with Clev and Minny

Yes I'd do the trifecta every day of the week, 3 times daily every month of the year.

No free agents came to play with Melo this summer nor last but I do see them flocking elsewhere for cheap////

Year in and Year Out

Last time I checked Tyson said he came here to play with Amar'e

This after Amar'e started showing signs of wearing down

With Melo it's a different story

Something we may see repeated next summer

IMO it's all about winning. This year if we have a team that plays at a higher level and with a team oriented approach that Phil is instilling in the franchise, players will see this team as a more enticing destination.

It's not only about Free Agents tho. Phil has set things up for this team to be able to make trades too. I doubt that he's done making trades so we'll see what Phil does next.

Most importantly Phil is already working on Melo. This is what he does. He did it with MJ and Kobe. To get guys that are inherently solo acts to work within a team concept. Phil see this as his next master feat. To be the man that gets Melo to buy into the tam concept enough to win big.

mreinman wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

fishmike wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

knickscity wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:OMG! I just wrote that it's more likely Phil will look to acquire some Near Max guys rather than blow it all on one max guy and then not have any cap for much else. WTF?

nixluva wrote:It seems to me that there could be more value in finding a way to get the help we need outside of adding a Max FA. Phil is going to have to really come up with a plan that builds this team with near max players rather than splurge for that one max guy and have very little else. I'm pretty sure that Phil and his staff have crunched the numbers and laid out multiple scenarios for what they can do with the cap next summer. I'm sure that they quickly came to realize that this was not going to be easy to figure out. This is why the move to add youth was so important. You have to find a way to secure cheap talent. The best way is with young players. That young talent is the lifeline for a GM. Think of how much different our team would look if Phil had not made the trade?

WTF??? Why so tense?

So the beginning of supporting for this approach started with Phil making the Dallas trade?

Shouldn't this always be a front office's MO

Did you support the Bargnani trade giving up 2 picks and a 1st which could have equated to adding more youthful talent going for our rebuild future

Are you a forward thinking fan or an in the moment kind

For the record stop giving Phil lay on thick kudos because if I recall correctly we rejected several Chandler trades over the past yr or so

Our team could look very much the same had Grunwald or Mills pulled the trigger on deals

Phil hasn't done anything out of the ordinary had we hired an ordinary GM

He hasn't even scratched the surface of his $60mil paycheck

Phil made a good deal imo, and I wont knock him because the previous GM's didnt do it. Phil has recognized that the backcourt is too crowded, so I'd like to see how he will address that.

Imo, this upcoming season should be all about establishing the culture he wants, if the teams can win games in the process that would be a plus initself.

Phil gets no grade by me til i see what he does in 2015, whether that means making good signings to the roster and keeping flexibility for 2016 as well.

Right after Melo was signed Phil was interviewed during the Knicks sl game against Charlotte. Phil said he is hoping to bring in two really good players with the cap space that the Knicks have available in 2015.

Crush i'm convinced that most of the guys complaining and doubting have no idea what Phil has been saying. This is why they're talking such nonsense. They really haven't dug deep into what's going on and the possibilities that are being created for this franchise since Phil came on board. No one is saying he's perfect or anything, but he's done a good job so far with very limited resources. Did anyone expect a sexy move so early considering what Phil had to work with? I do know that he didn't lose in the trade with Dallas. He got a better PG which we needed and young assets to boot. That's a win in my book.

you nailed it. Most thought this was a sit and wait offseason, no picks, no MLE, no cap space, players nobody wanted to trade for, etc etc.. we heard it all. Phil gets us younger, jettisons guys who a problem last year, has a good draft, adds a couple prospects, fixes PG and sets us up to have a good season, but guys would rather spin their wheels about MElo's no trade or Calderon's $7mm year. Its going to be a good year. Keep posting and stay thirsty

The previous GM received full support for the moves he was making with a means to an end goal.

The only difference, the end goal keeps changing

The previous GM made moves that supposedly fit Melo and the style of play

He made moves that suggested we were in win now mode, none of them really worked

Probably some doubted they ever would

We've built twice around a player in his prime and now are doing it as he's coming out, stakes could never be higher

Okay so now we've hired Phil, we have some direction

The top heavy part of the plan is older and the outside competition is getting younger-better

The top heavy part of the plan also took too much of the pie, to make it easier to execute the plan

I think Phil has a good sense of what it takes to win, he simply doesn't have the resources to accomplish peak results

We're probably better than we were 10yrs ago or so, but not too hard improving on a low benchmark

We need long sustaining success starting with and going beyond Phil and Melo's contractual tenure

I don't see it, I see another flash in the pan plan.

We never "built" around melo

aside from getting bargs

So Tyson-Smith-K-Mart weren't guys brought here to help Melo?

Let's agree their plan to build around him was awfully executed

How could we contend if we weren't building around anyone?

Were we building around your favorite, in Amare

Were we building around Amare when we brought in Melo? Of course not!

We can agree that whatever they did was awfully executed.

Overpaying for Tyson and wasting our amnesty while losing our only PG was not building, it was destroying.

Kmart is 90 and Smith is an idiot.

I guess it all depends what "building" is.

your only saying this now, but when tyson came in a gave us some defensive credibility and won DPOY, were you still thinking we overpaid, especially being a key member of a championship team (in dallas). Amare wasn't breaking down, and billups got hurt a few wks into the season and eneded up missing a yr.

You guys think coaches and GMs get a ton of time to develop, groom, and put together a nice ROSTER..wrong. they get a yr or 2

nixluva wrote:

F500ONE wrote:
It's why Derrick Rose didn't recruit Melo and asked for Pau Gasol's personal number to talk championship

If you're asking me would I trade Amar'e and Shump for Thad Young in a 3 team with Clev and Minny

Yes I'd do the trifecta every day of the week, 3 times daily every month of the year.

No free agents came to play with Melo this summer nor last but I do see them flocking elsewhere for cheap////

Year in and Year Out

Last time I checked Tyson said he came here to play with Amar'e

This after Amar'e started showing signs of wearing down

With Melo it's a different story

Something we may see repeated next summer

IMO it's all about winning. This year if we have a team that plays at a higher level and with a team oriented approach that Phil is instilling in the franchise, players will see this team as a more enticing destination.

It's not only about Free Agents tho. Phil has set things up for this team to be able to make trades too. I doubt that he's done making trades so we'll see what Phil does next.

Most importantly Phil is already working on Melo. This is what he does. He did it with MJ and Kobe. To get guys that are inherently solo acts to work within a team concept. Phil see this as his next master feat. To be the man that gets Melo to buy into the tam concept enough to win big.

do you regard melo as possessing the same level of basketball skills and acumen as jordan and bryant?

knicks1248 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

fishmike wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

knickscity wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:OMG! I just wrote that it's more likely Phil will look to acquire some Near Max guys rather than blow it all on one max guy and then not have any cap for much else. WTF?

nixluva wrote:It seems to me that there could be more value in finding a way to get the help we need outside of adding a Max FA. Phil is going to have to really come up with a plan that builds this team with near max players rather than splurge for that one max guy and have very little else. I'm pretty sure that Phil and his staff have crunched the numbers and laid out multiple scenarios for what they can do with the cap next summer. I'm sure that they quickly came to realize that this was not going to be easy to figure out. This is why the move to add youth was so important. You have to find a way to secure cheap talent. The best way is with young players. That young talent is the lifeline for a GM. Think of how much different our team would look if Phil had not made the trade?

WTF??? Why so tense?

So the beginning of supporting for this approach started with Phil making the Dallas trade?

Shouldn't this always be a front office's MO

Did you support the Bargnani trade giving up 2 picks and a 1st which could have equated to adding more youthful talent going for our rebuild future

Are you a forward thinking fan or an in the moment kind

For the record stop giving Phil lay on thick kudos because if I recall correctly we rejected several Chandler trades over the past yr or so

Our team could look very much the same had Grunwald or Mills pulled the trigger on deals

Phil hasn't done anything out of the ordinary had we hired an ordinary GM

He hasn't even scratched the surface of his $60mil paycheck

Phil made a good deal imo, and I wont knock him because the previous GM's didnt do it. Phil has recognized that the backcourt is too crowded, so I'd like to see how he will address that.

Imo, this upcoming season should be all about establishing the culture he wants, if the teams can win games in the process that would be a plus initself.

Phil gets no grade by me til i see what he does in 2015, whether that means making good signings to the roster and keeping flexibility for 2016 as well.

Right after Melo was signed Phil was interviewed during the Knicks sl game against Charlotte. Phil said he is hoping to bring in two really good players with the cap space that the Knicks have available in 2015.

Crush i'm convinced that most of the guys complaining and doubting have no idea what Phil has been saying. This is why they're talking such nonsense. They really haven't dug deep into what's going on and the possibilities that are being created for this franchise since Phil came on board. No one is saying he's perfect or anything, but he's done a good job so far with very limited resources. Did anyone expect a sexy move so early considering what Phil had to work with? I do know that he didn't lose in the trade with Dallas. He got a better PG which we needed and young assets to boot. That's a win in my book.

you nailed it. Most thought this was a sit and wait offseason, no picks, no MLE, no cap space, players nobody wanted to trade for, etc etc.. we heard it all. Phil gets us younger, jettisons guys who a problem last year, has a good draft, adds a couple prospects, fixes PG and sets us up to have a good season, but guys would rather spin their wheels about MElo's no trade or Calderon's $7mm year. Its going to be a good year. Keep posting and stay thirsty

The previous GM received full support for the moves he was making with a means to an end goal.

The only difference, the end goal keeps changing

The previous GM made moves that supposedly fit Melo and the style of play

He made moves that suggested we were in win now mode, none of them really worked

Probably some doubted they ever would

We've built twice around a player in his prime and now are doing it as he's coming out, stakes could never be higher

Okay so now we've hired Phil, we have some direction

The top heavy part of the plan is older and the outside competition is getting younger-better

The top heavy part of the plan also took too much of the pie, to make it easier to execute the plan

I think Phil has a good sense of what it takes to win, he simply doesn't have the resources to accomplish peak results

We're probably better than we were 10yrs ago or so, but not too hard improving on a low benchmark

We need long sustaining success starting with and going beyond Phil and Melo's contractual tenure

I don't see it, I see another flash in the pan plan.

We never "built" around melo

aside from getting bargs

So Tyson-Smith-K-Mart weren't guys brought here to help Melo?

Let's agree their plan to build around him was awfully executed

How could we contend if we weren't building around anyone?

Were we building around your favorite, in Amare

Were we building around Amare when we brought in Melo? Of course not!

We can agree that whatever they did was awfully executed.

Overpaying for Tyson and wasting our amnesty while losing our only PG was not building, it was destroying.

Kmart is 90 and Smith is an idiot.

I guess it all depends what "building" is.

your only saying this now, but when tyson came in a gave us some defensive credibility and won DPOY, were you still thinking we overpaid, especially being a key member of a championship team (in dallas). Amare wasn't breaking down, and billups got hurt a few wks into the season and eneded up missing a yr.

You guys think coaches and GMs get a ton of time to develop, groom, and put together a nice ROSTER..wrong. they get a yr or 2

Yes. I hated the move then. I always hated the move.

What did you say about Bargs when we signed him? Do you think that our idiot GM knew that he was one of the worst players in the NBA?

mreinman wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

fishmike wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

knickscity wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:OMG! I just wrote that it's more likely Phil will look to acquire some Near Max guys rather than blow it all on one max guy and then not have any cap for much else. WTF?

nixluva wrote:It seems to me that there could be more value in finding a way to get the help we need outside of adding a Max FA. Phil is going to have to really come up with a plan that builds this team with near max players rather than splurge for that one max guy and have very little else. I'm pretty sure that Phil and his staff have crunched the numbers and laid out multiple scenarios for what they can do with the cap next summer. I'm sure that they quickly came to realize that this was not going to be easy to figure out. This is why the move to add youth was so important. You have to find a way to secure cheap talent. The best way is with young players. That young talent is the lifeline for a GM. Think of how much different our team would look if Phil had not made the trade?

WTF??? Why so tense?

So the beginning of supporting for this approach started with Phil making the Dallas trade?

Shouldn't this always be a front office's MO

Did you support the Bargnani trade giving up 2 picks and a 1st which could have equated to adding more youthful talent going for our rebuild future

Are you a forward thinking fan or an in the moment kind

For the record stop giving Phil lay on thick kudos because if I recall correctly we rejected several Chandler trades over the past yr or so

Our team could look very much the same had Grunwald or Mills pulled the trigger on deals

Phil hasn't done anything out of the ordinary had we hired an ordinary GM

He hasn't even scratched the surface of his $60mil paycheck

Phil made a good deal imo, and I wont knock him because the previous GM's didnt do it. Phil has recognized that the backcourt is too crowded, so I'd like to see how he will address that.

Imo, this upcoming season should be all about establishing the culture he wants, if the teams can win games in the process that would be a plus initself.

Phil gets no grade by me til i see what he does in 2015, whether that means making good signings to the roster and keeping flexibility for 2016 as well.

Right after Melo was signed Phil was interviewed during the Knicks sl game against Charlotte. Phil said he is hoping to bring in two really good players with the cap space that the Knicks have available in 2015.

Crush i'm convinced that most of the guys complaining and doubting have no idea what Phil has been saying. This is why they're talking such nonsense. They really haven't dug deep into what's going on and the possibilities that are being created for this franchise since Phil came on board. No one is saying he's perfect or anything, but he's done a good job so far with very limited resources. Did anyone expect a sexy move so early considering what Phil had to work with? I do know that he didn't lose in the trade with Dallas. He got a better PG which we needed and young assets to boot. That's a win in my book.

you nailed it. Most thought this was a sit and wait offseason, no picks, no MLE, no cap space, players nobody wanted to trade for, etc etc.. we heard it all. Phil gets us younger, jettisons guys who a problem last year, has a good draft, adds a couple prospects, fixes PG and sets us up to have a good season, but guys would rather spin their wheels about MElo's no trade or Calderon's $7mm year. Its going to be a good year. Keep posting and stay thirsty

The previous GM received full support for the moves he was making with a means to an end goal.

The only difference, the end goal keeps changing

The previous GM made moves that supposedly fit Melo and the style of play

He made moves that suggested we were in win now mode, none of them really worked

Probably some doubted they ever would

We've built twice around a player in his prime and now are doing it as he's coming out, stakes could never be higher

Okay so now we've hired Phil, we have some direction

The top heavy part of the plan is older and the outside competition is getting younger-better

The top heavy part of the plan also took too much of the pie, to make it easier to execute the plan

I think Phil has a good sense of what it takes to win, he simply doesn't have the resources to accomplish peak results

We're probably better than we were 10yrs ago or so, but not too hard improving on a low benchmark

We need long sustaining success starting with and going beyond Phil and Melo's contractual tenure

I don't see it, I see another flash in the pan plan.

We never "built" around melo

aside from getting bargs

So Tyson-Smith-K-Mart weren't guys brought here to help Melo?

Let's agree their plan to build around him was awfully executed

How could we contend if we weren't building around anyone?

Were we building around your favorite, in Amare

Were we building around Amare when we brought in Melo? Of course not!

We can agree that whatever they did was awfully executed.

Overpaying for Tyson and wasting our amnesty while losing our only PG was not building, it was destroying.

Kmart is 90 and Smith is an idiot.

I guess it all depends what "building" is.

your only saying this now, but when tyson came in a gave us some defensive credibility and won DPOY, were you still thinking we overpaid, especially being a key member of a championship team (in dallas). Amare wasn't breaking down, and billups got hurt a few wks into the season and eneded up missing a yr.

You guys think coaches and GMs get a ton of time to develop, groom, and put together a nice ROSTER..wrong. they get a yr or 2

Yes. I hated the move then. I always hated the move.

What did you say about Bargs when we signed him? Do you think that our idiot GM knew that he was one of the worst players in the NBA?

I think what they saw, was what most people thought, he just needed a change of venue, what better then woodson phony MDA system

The problem was that they did not see anything - they should have seen and known that you don't trade a first round pick for one of the worst players in the game and hope that the change of venue is the answer.

Maybe we should have traded a couple of first for Darko ...

yellowboy90 wrote:Rose didn't call/recruit Melo but personally talk to Gasol so that means what?

Rose didn't recruit Lebron James when he was up a few years ago so what did that mean?

Noah, the team leader and heart and soul of the team, did recruit Melo so what does that mean?

Also, when you continually only have the mMLE it's pretty hard to say your are building. It's pretty hard to Build when there is an anchor weighing down your FA moves. Then on top of that you make a terrible trade by giving up a 1st. I saw the trade for Bargs coming but I didn't see the 1st rd draft pick.

rose didn't want melo because it would be a terrible fit-- despite what noah said... and noah s hands down one of my favorite players, a top ten player.

rose didn't want lebron because he would have to change his game too much at too early an age-- plus rose got shut down by lebron that one series.

rose wants to play with gasol because that's a great fit.

mreinman wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

fishmike wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

knickscity wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:OMG! I just wrote that it's more likely Phil will look to acquire some Near Max guys rather than blow it all on one max guy and then not have any cap for much else. WTF?

nixluva wrote:It seems to me that there could be more value in finding a way to get the help we need outside of adding a Max FA. Phil is going to have to really come up with a plan that builds this team with near max players rather than splurge for that one max guy and have very little else. I'm pretty sure that Phil and his staff have crunched the numbers and laid out multiple scenarios for what they can do with the cap next summer. I'm sure that they quickly came to realize that this was not going to be easy to figure out. This is why the move to add youth was so important. You have to find a way to secure cheap talent. The best way is with young players. That young talent is the lifeline for a GM. Think of how much different our team would look if Phil had not made the trade?

WTF??? Why so tense?

So the beginning of supporting for this approach started with Phil making the Dallas trade?

Shouldn't this always be a front office's MO

Did you support the Bargnani trade giving up 2 picks and a 1st which could have equated to adding more youthful talent going for our rebuild future

Are you a forward thinking fan or an in the moment kind

For the record stop giving Phil lay on thick kudos because if I recall correctly we rejected several Chandler trades over the past yr or so

Our team could look very much the same had Grunwald or Mills pulled the trigger on deals

Phil hasn't done anything out of the ordinary had we hired an ordinary GM

He hasn't even scratched the surface of his $60mil paycheck

Phil made a good deal imo, and I wont knock him because the previous GM's didnt do it. Phil has recognized that the backcourt is too crowded, so I'd like to see how he will address that.

Imo, this upcoming season should be all about establishing the culture he wants, if the teams can win games in the process that would be a plus initself.

Phil gets no grade by me til i see what he does in 2015, whether that means making good signings to the roster and keeping flexibility for 2016 as well.

Right after Melo was signed Phil was interviewed during the Knicks sl game against Charlotte. Phil said he is hoping to bring in two really good players with the cap space that the Knicks have available in 2015.

Crush i'm convinced that most of the guys complaining and doubting have no idea what Phil has been saying. This is why they're talking such nonsense. They really haven't dug deep into what's going on and the possibilities that are being created for this franchise since Phil came on board. No one is saying he's perfect or anything, but he's done a good job so far with very limited resources. Did anyone expect a sexy move so early considering what Phil had to work with? I do know that he didn't lose in the trade with Dallas. He got a better PG which we needed and young assets to boot. That's a win in my book.

you nailed it. Most thought this was a sit and wait offseason, no picks, no MLE, no cap space, players nobody wanted to trade for, etc etc.. we heard it all. Phil gets us younger, jettisons guys who a problem last year, has a good draft, adds a couple prospects, fixes PG and sets us up to have a good season, but guys would rather spin their wheels about MElo's no trade or Calderon's $7mm year. Its going to be a good year. Keep posting and stay thirsty

The previous GM received full support for the moves he was making with a means to an end goal.

The only difference, the end goal keeps changing

The previous GM made moves that supposedly fit Melo and the style of play

He made moves that suggested we were in win now mode, none of them really worked

Probably some doubted they ever would

We've built twice around a player in his prime and now are doing it as he's coming out, stakes could never be higher

Okay so now we've hired Phil, we have some direction

The top heavy part of the plan is older and the outside competition is getting younger-better

The top heavy part of the plan also took too much of the pie, to make it easier to execute the plan

I think Phil has a good sense of what it takes to win, he simply doesn't have the resources to accomplish peak results

We're probably better than we were 10yrs ago or so, but not too hard improving on a low benchmark

We need long sustaining success starting with and going beyond Phil and Melo's contractual tenure

I don't see it, I see another flash in the pan plan.

We never "built" around melo

aside from getting bargs

So Tyson-Smith-K-Mart weren't guys brought here to help Melo?

Let's agree their plan to build around him was awfully executed

How could we contend if we weren't building around anyone?

Were we building around your favorite, in Amare

Were we building around Amare when we brought in Melo? Of course not!

We can agree that whatever they did was awfully executed.

Overpaying for Tyson and wasting our amnesty while losing our only PG was not building, it was destroying.

Kmart is 90 and Smith is an idiot.

I guess it all depends what "building" is.

we had a system coach in d'antoni, and amare was an ideal player to fit that system-- the trouble was that they acquired felton.

so "building around" a player was not really the point.

then when dolan came in and decided he wanted melo in a knick uniform at any price, then bye-bye system, and hello "win-now"

lin came in and showed that a system could work, melo came back, then bye-bye d'antoni and eventually lin.

now we are back to instituting a system and we hope that an anti-system player is going to conform, comply, and excel.

dk7th wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:Rose didn't call/recruit Melo but personally talk to Gasol so that means what?

Rose didn't recruit Lebron James when he was up a few years ago so what did that mean?

Noah, the team leader and heart and soul of the team, did recruit Melo so what does that mean?

Also, when you continually only have the mMLE it's pretty hard to say your are building. It's pretty hard to Build when there is an anchor weighing down your FA moves. Then on top of that you make a terrible trade by giving up a 1st. I saw the trade for Bargs coming but I didn't see the 1st rd draft pick.

rose didn't want melo because it would be a terrible fit-- despite what noah said... and noah s hands down one of my favorite players, a top ten player.

rose didn't want lebron because he would have to change his game too much at too early an age-- plus rose got shut down by lebron that one series.

rose wants to play with gasol because that's a great fit.

Haha what? Is that a fact now?

Another poster, I believe TKF, made a great point about guys putting themselves out there to recruit. If the player being recruited doesn't come to your team you have to go to practice and face the guys that you play with that would have had to have been moved so that you could get a guy that you preferred to play with. Rose is on record as saying he wanted Anthony and talked to him about how great it would be playing in Chicago. He also was present when Melo was on his recruiting visit.

CrushAlot wrote:Another poster, I believe TKF, made a great point about guys putting themselves out there to recruit. If the player being recruited doesn't come to your team you have to go to practice and face the guys that you play with that would have had to have been moved so that you could get a guy that you preferred to play with. Rose is on record as saying he wanted Anthony and talked to him about how great it would be playing in Chicago. He also was present when Melo was on his recruiting visit.

When you recruit a player, you don't know who the GM is going to trade. That makes no sense. At best, you could guess but you wouldn't know. You don't even have to move players if the guy is signing as an FA anyway.

Bonn1997 wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Another poster, I believe TKF, made a great point about guys putting themselves out there to recruit. If the player being recruited doesn't come to your team you have to go to practice and face the guys that you play with that would have had to have been moved so that you could get a guy that you preferred to play with. Rose is on record as saying he wanted Anthony and talked to him about how great it would be playing in Chicago. He also was present when Melo was on his recruiting visit.

When you recruit a player, you don't know who the GM is going to trade. That makes no sense. At best, you could guess but you wouldn't know. You don't even have to move players if the guy is signing as an FA anyway.

Sure it does. And there were reports and speculation about who was going to be moved. I don't have an issue if a guy doesn't want to get involved because some of his teammates names are going to be put out there if another guy is signed.