Knicks · So despite having jose, larkin and prigs, phil was still searching for a pg, (page 1)

The Knicks appear to be done attempting to deal since the team’s attempt to trade J.R. Smith, Iman Shumpert, Amar’e Stoudemire, Andrea Bargnani and Tim Hardaway Jr. has failed.
According to SportsWorldReport.com, Knicks president Phil Jackson has been shopping the aforementioned collection of players in hopes of acquiring “a true point guard,” despite the team trading for Jose Calderon soon after Jackson took the position.

Because of the lack of interest in those players, the team will not try to deal Pablo Prigioni, who was reportedly a target of the Utah Jazz. There was a deal in place, but talks are off since the Knicks need a backup point guard.

SportsWorldReport.com suggests that the Knicks could continue to try and push one of those deals along in an attempt to land top free agents Greg Monroe and/or Rajon Rondo next summer.

I thought we were kind of set at the position.

Nalod wrote:The report loses validity when Rondo was mentioned.
Im not seeing him as a PHis kind of player.

it's about defense in my opinion. you need a dude who can stop the point of attack. p&r is a secondary option when the triangle falls apart.

rondo may not be everyone's favorite but if you can acquire him to participate in the triangle i think that would work out pretty well for the knicks, absent his 3 ball corner accuracy....

franco12 wrote:I'm not the least bit surprised - I still think we're weak at PG, even with Calderon. He is certainly an upgrade over Felton, but hardly enough that you can focus on other needs.

Completely agree with you. Calderon is not the answer, even though he probably is better than Felton.

Regarding the Jazz, I wonder who Phil wanted in return for Prigioni. Ian Clark? I don't think that would've been a lot to ask for in return. Not a true PG but he seems to be coming along nicely as far as operating with the ball in his hands and he can really shoot the ball. Good upside...Gimmie Clark and we got a deal..

Was Stephen Curry

Ask yourself who on our team remotely resembles him

Phil thus is applying pressure on fans pipes

If this report is true about point guard concerns

While having Calderon in the mix, it speaks volumes

How does Phil get played

How does Calderon get played

Nalod wrote:The report loses validity when Rondo was mentioned.
Im not seeing him as a PHis kind of player.

Phil is good at taking guys who don't appearb
to fit in his system and finding them a role. He's the anti-. What I don't understand is why the author believes the Knicks must make a move now to make a play in free agency. The money is going to drop of our cap regardless. If anything, trading STAT now probably hurts us because it mans we'd probably have to take back a longer term deal.

dk7th wrote:

Nalod wrote:The report loses validity when Rondo was mentioned.
Im not seeing him as a PHis kind of player.

it's about defense in my opinion. you need a dude who can stop the point of attack. p&r is a secondary option when the triangle falls apart.

rondo may not be everyone's favorite but if you can acquire him to participate in the triangle i think that would work out pretty well for the knicks, absent his 3 ball corner accuracy....

Surprised you're a Rondo fan. Remember when he went down the Celts offense actually improved. Not saying that is the end all be all condemnation of the guy but I think Rondo was lucky to play with 3 hall of famer who happened to be all around great team players with multifaceted skill sets and all in their primes, albeit the twilight of their primes.

Rondo is also an infamous malcontent who clashed with teammates and coaches regularly throughout the years.

Rondo is dynamic but the guy cannot shoot from anywhere on the floor and I think he's a guy who needs a very tailor made roster around him.

H1AND1 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

Nalod wrote:The report loses validity when Rondo was mentioned.
Im not seeing him as a PHis kind of player.

it's about defense in my opinion. you need a dude who can stop the point of attack. p&r is a secondary option when the triangle falls apart.

rondo may not be everyone's favorite but if you can acquire him to participate in the triangle i think that would work out pretty well for the knicks, absent his 3 ball corner accuracy....

Surprised you're a Rondo fan. Remember when he went down the Celts offense actually improved. Not saying that is the end all be all condemnation of the guy but I think Rondo was lucky to play with 3 hall of famer who happened to be all around great team players with multifaceted skill sets and all in their primes, albeit the twilight of their primes.

Rondo is also an infamous malcontent who clashed with teammates and coaches regularly throughout the years.

Rondo is dynamic but the guy cannot shoot from anywhere on the floor and I think he's a guy who needs a very tailor made roster around him.

as i said he is not everyone's favorite. add to this that jackson allegedly said that curry is an ideal player in the triangle. well sure he is, since he can shoot from anywhere, move without the ball, is a willing and creative passer.

not a great defender though... and the knicks need a defender real bad. plus if anyone could get to rondo it would have to be jackson.

no question rondo benefited from having pierce and garnett as superb playmakers.

so the question is: would you rather have prigioni and calderon on the one hand or rondo?

dk7th wrote:

H1AND1 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

Nalod wrote:The report loses validity when Rondo was mentioned.
Im not seeing him as a PHis kind of player.

it's about defense in my opinion. you need a dude who can stop the point of attack. p&r is a secondary option when the triangle falls apart.

rondo may not be everyone's favorite but if you can acquire him to participate in the triangle i think that would work out pretty well for the knicks, absent his 3 ball corner accuracy....

Surprised you're a Rondo fan. Remember when he went down the Celts offense actually improved. Not saying that is the end all be all condemnation of the guy but I think Rondo was lucky to play with 3 hall of famer who happened to be all around great team players with multifaceted skill sets and all in their primes, albeit the twilight of their primes.

Rondo is also an infamous malcontent who clashed with teammates and coaches regularly throughout the years.

Rondo is dynamic but the guy cannot shoot from anywhere on the floor and I think he's a guy who needs a very tailor made roster around him.

as i said he is not everyone's favorite. add to this that jackson allegedly said that curry is an ideal player in the triangle. well sure he is, since he can shoot from anywhere, move without the ball, is a willing and creative passer.

not a great defender though... and the knicks need a defender real bad. plus if anyone could get to rondo it would have to be jackson.

no question rondo benefited from having pierce and garnett as superb playmakers.

so the question is: would you rather have prigioni and calderon on the one hand or rondo?

Yes Curry is an amazing scorer but an atrocious defender.

I would not want Rondo at the max which is what he is going to demand. I'd rather roll the dice with a mid tier PG with Calderon and Larkin as back ups. I'm a fan of Eric Bledsoe as he is a legit 2 way Point Guard who can defend both guard positions. He also wants the max but if nobody gives it to him id love to swoop in and get him. I think on the other hand some team will trade for Rondo midseason and max him out. If Bledsoe could be had for 10-12 million id jump at him.

H1AND1 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

H1AND1 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

Nalod wrote:The report loses validity when Rondo was mentioned.
Im not seeing him as a PHis kind of player.

it's about defense in my opinion. you need a dude who can stop the point of attack. p&r is a secondary option when the triangle falls apart.

rondo may not be everyone's favorite but if you can acquire him to participate in the triangle i think that would work out pretty well for the knicks, absent his 3 ball corner accuracy....

Surprised you're a Rondo fan. Remember when he went down the Celts offense actually improved. Not saying that is the end all be all condemnation of the guy but I think Rondo was lucky to play with 3 hall of famer who happened to be all around great team players with multifaceted skill sets and all in their primes, albeit the twilight of their primes.

Rondo is also an infamous malcontent who clashed with teammates and coaches regularly throughout the years.

Rondo is dynamic but the guy cannot shoot from anywhere on the floor and I think he's a guy who needs a very tailor made roster around him.

as i said he is not everyone's favorite. add to this that jackson allegedly said that curry is an ideal player in the triangle. well sure he is, since he can shoot from anywhere, move without the ball, is a willing and creative passer.

not a great defender though... and the knicks need a defender real bad. plus if anyone could get to rondo it would have to be jackson.

no question rondo benefited from having pierce and garnett as superb playmakers.

so the question is: would you rather have prigioni and calderon on the one hand or rondo?

Yes Curry is an amazing scorer but an atrocious defender.

I would not want Rondo at the max which is what he is going to demand. I'd rather roll the dice with a mid tier PG with Calderon and Larkin as back ups. I'm a fan of Eric Bledsoe as he is a legit 2 way Point Guard who can defend both guard positions. He also wants the max but if nobody gives it to him id love to swoop in and get him. I think on the other hand some team will trade for Rondo midseason and max him out. If Bledsoe could be had for 10-12 million id jump at him.

Goran Dragic would be PERFECT for us. If I'm not mistaken, he is a free agent in 2015 and I would prefer him over Rondo despite Rondo being the better player. If we manage to acquire him and Monroe (who I think is already being fitted for his orange and blue Knick jersey), we'd be golden next season.

TripleThreat wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:I thought we were kind of set at the position.

Prigoni is 37 years old. He's really a saavy player, I like him a lot, but he's better suited for a reserve role at this point considering his age.

Larkin is young, on a rookie deal, but he's 5'11. It's just not very easy for sub 6 foot guards in the NBA to be quality starters, not in the modern NBA. Maybe he should have followed the baseball path like his father ( though those would be even bigger shoes to try to fill) However a JJ Barea type career wouldn't be out of the question ( i.e .a strong bench guard who can penetrate and cause havoc against the right matchups)

Calderon, the Knicks will have him for his ages 33, 34 and 35 years. He can't, as mentioned by many before, play defense, though he offers plus shooting. Dallas wasn't exactly strong at PG before or after the trade, so I think you have to see the last three years of this deal as part of the "tax" for the Knicks getting to unload Raymond Felton.

Jeremy Lin is 6'3 and just turned 26 years old. I believe Sports Science measured him out and his strength/speed metrics was on par with many other starting point guards in the league. If the Knicks had worked to keep him, they would have had his ages 24 and 25 years, along with this year, at 26, plus still had his Bird Rights. Along with the value of not having Bargnani and Felton on the roster (Novak was useful and played well with Lin, no need to try to jettison his contract despite being the better long range shooter and costing less in cap space, Lin on the roster would have made pursuing Felton unneccessary), cumulatively, the Knicks would still have a 1st round pick, three 2nd round picks and the valuation of three more 2nd round picks.

IMHO Rondo and Monroe can help certain teams in certain situations, but neither is really a fit for the Knicks in terms of what they would cost and where the Knicks are as a team right now or even a year from now. I think Rondo would be super interesting on the Suns ( 2 PG system, has enough long range shooting to hide him, the pace of the offense would suit him, I think he would make them lethal in transition, their medical staff is top notch and helped a lot of players around the league get another chance)

NardDogNation wrote:

H1AND1 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

H1AND1 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

Nalod wrote:The report loses validity when Rondo was mentioned.
Im not seeing him as a PHis kind of player.

it's about defense in my opinion. you need a dude who can stop the point of attack. p&r is a secondary option when the triangle falls apart.

rondo may not be everyone's favorite but if you can acquire him to participate in the triangle i think that would work out pretty well for the knicks, absent his 3 ball corner accuracy....

Surprised you're a Rondo fan. Remember when he went down the Celts offense actually improved. Not saying that is the end all be all condemnation of the guy but I think Rondo was lucky to play with 3 hall of famer who happened to be all around great team players with multifaceted skill sets and all in their primes, albeit the twilight of their primes.

Rondo is also an infamous malcontent who clashed with teammates and coaches regularly throughout the years.

Rondo is dynamic but the guy cannot shoot from anywhere on the floor and I think he's a guy who needs a very tailor made roster around him.

as i said he is not everyone's favorite. add to this that jackson allegedly said that curry is an ideal player in the triangle. well sure he is, since he can shoot from anywhere, move without the ball, is a willing and creative passer.

not a great defender though... and the knicks need a defender real bad. plus if anyone could get to rondo it would have to be jackson.

no question rondo benefited from having pierce and garnett as superb playmakers.

so the question is: would you rather have prigioni and calderon on the one hand or rondo?

Yes Curry is an amazing scorer but an atrocious defender.

I would not want Rondo at the max which is what he is going to demand. I'd rather roll the dice with a mid tier PG with Calderon and Larkin as back ups. I'm a fan of Eric Bledsoe as he is a legit 2 way Point Guard who can defend both guard positions. He also wants the max but if nobody gives it to him id love to swoop in and get him. I think on the other hand some team will trade for Rondo midseason and max him out. If Bledsoe could be had for 10-12 million id jump at him.

Goran Dragic would be PERFECT for us. If I'm not mistaken, he is a free agent in 2015 and I would prefer him over Rondo despite Rondo being the better player. If we manage to acquire him and Monroe (who I think is already being fitted for his orange and blue Knick jersey), we'd be golden next season.

I didn't realize Dragic was a FA in 2015. Interesting!

H1AND1 wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

H1AND1 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

H1AND1 wrote:

dk7th wrote:

Nalod wrote:The report loses validity when Rondo was mentioned.
Im not seeing him as a PHis kind of player.

it's about defense in my opinion. you need a dude who can stop the point of attack. p&r is a secondary option when the triangle falls apart.

rondo may not be everyone's favorite but if you can acquire him to participate in the triangle i think that would work out pretty well for the knicks, absent his 3 ball corner accuracy....

Surprised you're a Rondo fan. Remember when he went down the Celts offense actually improved. Not saying that is the end all be all condemnation of the guy but I think Rondo was lucky to play with 3 hall of famer who happened to be all around great team players with multifaceted skill sets and all in their primes, albeit the twilight of their primes.

Rondo is also an infamous malcontent who clashed with teammates and coaches regularly throughout the years.

Rondo is dynamic but the guy cannot shoot from anywhere on the floor and I think he's a guy who needs a very tailor made roster around him.

as i said he is not everyone's favorite. add to this that jackson allegedly said that curry is an ideal player in the triangle. well sure he is, since he can shoot from anywhere, move without the ball, is a willing and creative passer.

not a great defender though... and the knicks need a defender real bad. plus if anyone could get to rondo it would have to be jackson.

no question rondo benefited from having pierce and garnett as superb playmakers.

so the question is: would you rather have prigioni and calderon on the one hand or rondo?

Yes Curry is an amazing scorer but an atrocious defender.

I would not want Rondo at the max which is what he is going to demand. I'd rather roll the dice with a mid tier PG with Calderon and Larkin as back ups. I'm a fan of Eric Bledsoe as he is a legit 2 way Point Guard who can defend both guard positions. He also wants the max but if nobody gives it to him id love to swoop in and get him. I think on the other hand some team will trade for Rondo midseason and max him out. If Bledsoe could be had for 10-12 million id jump at him.

Goran Dragic would be PERFECT for us. If I'm not mistaken, he is a free agent in 2015 and I would prefer him over Rondo despite Rondo being the better player. If we manage to acquire him and Monroe (who I think is already being fitted for his orange and blue Knick jersey), we'd be golden next season.

I didn't realize Dragic was a FA in 2015. Interesting!

Well, conventional wisdom says that he'll opt out to be a free agent but he is technically under contract for the 2015-2016 season. Considering how well he played this past season though, the odds on bet is that he won't be taking $7.5 million to stick around in Phoenix. I'd be a little hesitant to offer the max but I suspect that is what it'll take to get him here.

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/phoenix.ht...

While Phil may say nice things about calderon and the trio of points, he clearly has a vision that has never utitlized the position in the way it's structured now.

knickscity wrote:The report makes sense. Despite what Phil said about Steph Curry, when has Phil ever had a bad defender at pg? When has he ever employed his pg to be a scorer? Ron Harper was a 20 ppg player the year before Chicago and was reduced to single digits to focus on defense.

While Phil may say nice things about calderon and the trio of points, he clearly has a vision that has never utitlized the position in the way it's structured now.

Two words: Steve. Kerr.

There's one thing that all of the pg's that ever played for phil have in common, they all were above avg 3 point shooters. Steve kerr was a complete joke when it came to defending oppose pgs, so was paxson, bj, blake.

I don't think the goal is always to just find better defenders. I think it's more important to teach a better concept and have a system that won't expose poor defenders as much. Lets face it, there isn't many very good pg defenders starting in this league, you can probably count them on one hand.

I recall Felton being a very solid defender under Larry brown, a big reason for that was concept, system, and who he had behind him. I mean really... how frequent can anyone defend a cross over. I think you guys put too much stock in individual defense.

The league is 35% defense, 65% offense. Go look on any roster in the NBA and tell me they have more defenders than scorers, and if the do, their a lottery team or 8th seed.

smackeddog wrote:There's no greater, more reliable source than the world famous SportsWorldReport.com!

exactly