Knicks · Game Thread: Knicks @Nets 7:30 - Who is worse? (page 17)

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:Perception of Fish sure has done a 180 with many

No issues with Fisher. This is a work in progress and the guy is a first year head coach. The triangle is almost a dysfunctional offense if you are down more than 5. It works great when you are leading. I think there will be a lot more growing pains with this team but I think Fish gets it and will be a great one when all is said and done.

Yeah, I can't worry about him either. He'll probably end up having a nice career coaching. This roster is possibly incapable of learning the triangle though. Not sure what kind of drama that indicates, but I think it is more than a question of giving them 30 games to learn it. If Melo doesn't have his head in the game and he is not fully committed, trying to run the triangle is going to lay an egg.

Only wrinkle I can see right now is waiting to see if Jose can help enough to get Melo in sync and cooperating. Outside of that, I'm still thinking under 30 wins this season. A high pick is good, but I hate to see the core player not buy in. It could become a problem.

Anyone else think Pierce puts Melo in a funk? Seems to be a really tough match up for him and Pierce's mouth seems to impact Melo's game.
On a side note, it doesn't seem to matter who Alan Anderson plays for he kills the Knicks.

Don't forget Melo waited for KG after a game to "talk". Those Celtics mindfuc'd him good. I've never had full confidence in Melo's mindset. I think he gets rattled. The whole superstar thing to me is very much about mindset. Melo doesn't have that. Sure, he loves the adrenalin of having the ball at the end of the game and all that, but that doesn't require any thoughtfulness.

I've mocked him for his pre-season superstar comment, but let's be real. It was a sign of serious insecurity. He'd just landed a whopper deal and he says that? He's not as confident as he should be. Why? Well, its simply really. If his shots are not falling, his game is just not diverse enough for him to impact anything at all. And he knows it in his heart, yet he doesn't do anything to change it. So he goes into a funk. Its kind of childish.

His confidence thus is subject to drop-offs and we're seeing him slumping. It's all mental. He did not come into this season prepared to change. It was lip service. I call him fake for a reason. I'm not just on some jihad. He says stuff that is not truly sincere just because he thinks that is what he should say, but it lacks conviction and follow through.

He's basically a simple man without much going on analytically upstairs. He doesn't have the mind to work with. He's a talented guy, but a profoundly ordinary human being in every other way.

It is going to be very difficult for him to change. I'd love it, but I think I've been pretty accurate in my assessment of this guy. He's selfish and if it takes embarrassing the crap out of him to make him change, then I think you do it. Bench him. Send a message. Otherwise, this is not going to turn out well.

Waiting on Melo to change of his own volition becomes a game of fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. We're in phase 2. Do Phil and Fish let Melo get away with this kind of play? If they care about the future of the franchise, they better lay down the law soon.

I disagree about Melo coming into this season not ready to change. I think Melo was really close to going to Chicago. I think Phil presented his vision and Melo bought in. I also think Melo put in the work before camp both getting in shape to play the three and also working out and practicing the new offense with the young guys weeks before camp started. I do agree about him being a simple man. But I disagree about the outcome.

CrushAlot wrote:I disagree about Melo coming into this season not ready to change. I think Melo was really close to going to Chicago. I think Phil presented his vision and Melo bought in. I also think Melo put in the work before camp both getting in shape to play the three and also working out and practicing the new offense with the young guys weeks before camp started. I do agree about him being a simple man. But I disagree about the outcome.

I definitely grant it is too early in the season to make any conclusive statements about Melo's mindset and intentions coming into this season. I see serious indications it was lacking and maybe lip service, but to be fair we have to extend him and everyone the leeway to figure things out.

If we enter the All-Star break and Melo keeps playing like his is now, then I will be waving the white flag. Until then, I'll keep enough of an open mind in the event he comes out of his slump and starts to play better. Though I know he is not a leader and probably never will be, I know his failure would doom the franchise so I'd like to see him succeed.

P.S. I do believe he bought into Phil's rap and he worked out well and practiced and all that. Sort of what you'd expect, so its not like he gets an extra pat on the head for it. But the issue is his resolve. I've seen him lose focus before. He regresses and forgets game plans so easily. It is one thing to say "I'm down with this" and it is another thing entirely to stick with the program through ups and downs. His priorities seem to degenerate too easily. Let's hope that changes.

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:Perception of Fish sure has done a 180 with many

No issues with Fisher. This is a work in progress and the guy is a first year head coach. The triangle is almost a dysfunctional offense if you are down more than 5. It works great when you are leading. I think there will be a lot more growing pains with this team but I think Fish gets it and will be a great one when all is said and done.

Yeah, I can't worry about him either. He'll probably end up having a nice career coaching. This roster is possibly incapable of learning the triangle though. Not sure what kind of drama that indicates, but I think it is more than a question of giving them 30 games to learn it. If Melo doesn't have his head in the game and he is not fully committed, trying to run the triangle is going to lay an egg.

Only wrinkle I can see right now is waiting to see if Jose can help enough to get Melo in sync and cooperating. Outside of that, I'm still thinking under 30 wins this season. A high pick is good, but I hate to see the core player not buy in. It could become a problem.

Anyone else think Pierce puts Melo in a funk? Seems to be a really tough match up for him and Pierce's mouth seems to impact Melo's game.
On a side note, it doesn't seem to matter who Alan Anderson plays for he kills the Knicks.

Don't forget Melo waited for KG after a game to "talk". Those Celtics mindfuc'd him good. I've never had full confidence in Melo's mindset. I think he gets rattled. The whole superstar thing to me is very much about mindset. Melo doesn't have that. Sure, he loves the adrenalin of having the ball at the end of the game and all that, but that doesn't require any thoughtfulness.

I've mocked him for his pre-season superstar comment, but let's be real. It was a sign of serious insecurity. He'd just landed a whopper deal and he says that? He's not as confident as he should be. Why? Well, its simply really. If his shots are not falling, his game is just not diverse enough for him to impact anything at all. And he knows it in his heart, yet he doesn't do anything to change it. So he goes into a funk. Its kind of childish.

His confidence thus is subject to drop-offs and we're seeing him slumping. It's all mental. He did not come into this season prepared to change. It was lip service. I call him fake for a reason. I'm not just on some jihad. He says stuff that is not truly sincere just because he thinks that is what he should say, but it lacks conviction and follow through.

He's basically a simple man without much going on analytically upstairs. He doesn't have the mind to work with. He's a talented guy, but a profoundly ordinary human being in every other way.

It is going to be very difficult for him to change. I'd love it, but I think I've been pretty accurate in my assessment of this guy. He's selfish and if it takes embarrassing the crap out of him to make him change, then I think you do it. Bench him. Send a message. Otherwise, this is not going to turn out well.

Waiting on Melo to change of his own volition becomes a game of fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. We're in phase 2. Do Phil and Fish let Melo get away with this kind of play? If they care about the future of the franchise, they better lay down the law soon.

I disagree about Melo coming into this season not ready to change. I think Melo was really close to going to Chicago. I think Phil presented his vision and Melo bought in. I also think Melo put in the work before camp both getting in shape to play the three and also working out and practicing the new offense with the young guys weeks before camp started. I do agree about him being a simple man. But I disagree about the outcome.

Getting ready physically has nothing to do with mental preparation

Nor does it have to do with how a player mentally sees his place in this game

Hence Phil bringing in mindfulness training

Splat gets it, Melo doesn't and neither do some fans

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:I disagree about Melo coming into this season not ready to change. I think Melo was really close to going to Chicago. I think Phil presented his vision and Melo bought in. I also think Melo put in the work before camp both getting in shape to play the three and also working out and practicing the new offense with the young guys weeks before camp started. I do agree about him being a simple man. But I disagree about the outcome.

I definitely grant it is too early in the season to make any conclusive statements about Melo's mindset and intentions coming into this season. I see serious indications it was lacking and maybe lip service, but to be fair we have to extend him and everyone the leeway to figure things out.

If we enter the All-Star break and Melo keeps playing like his is now, then I will be waving the white flag. Until then, I'll keep enough of an open mind in the event he comes out of his slump and starts to play better. Though I know he is not a leader and probably never will be, I know his failure would doom the franchise so I'd like to see him succeed.

I agree. If his moping/slump continues until the break then the Knicks need to play the young guys a ton and tank. They may need to look into moving Melo. I don't think that happens. I think Melo with a reasonable coach and a reasonable team wins 45 games every year. I think he has a reasonable coach. I am not sure about this years team. In NY we haven't seen him with more talented teammates. Hopefully Jose has a Kidd like role on this team.

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:I disagree about Melo coming into this season not ready to change. I think Melo was really close to going to Chicago. I think Phil presented his vision and Melo bought in. I also think Melo put in the work before camp both getting in shape to play the three and also working out and practicing the new offense with the young guys weeks before camp started. I do agree about him being a simple man. But I disagree about the outcome.

I definitely grant it is too early in the season to make any conclusive statements about Melo's mindset and intentions coming into this season. I see serious indications it was lacking and maybe lip service, but to be fair we have to extend him and everyone the leeway to figure things out.

If we enter the All-Star break and Melo keeps playing like his is now, then I will be waving the white flag. Until then, I'll keep enough of an open mind in the event he comes out of his slump and starts to play better. Though I know he is not a leader and probably never will be, I know his failure would doom the franchise so I'd like to see him succeed.

I agree. If his moping/slump continues until the break then the Knicks need to play the young guys a ton and tank. They may need to look into moving Melo. I don't think that happens. I think Melo with a reasonable coach and a reasonable team wins 45 games every year. I think he has a reasonable coach. I am not sure about this years team. In NY we haven't seen him with more talented teammates. Hopefully Jose has a Kidd like role on this team.

Is that why we made all the changes and

Shelled out all that dough since 2011

To accomplish such middle road success

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:Perception of Fish sure has done a 180 with many

No issues with Fisher. This is a work in progress and the guy is a first year head coach. The triangle is almost a dysfunctional offense if you are down more than 5. It works great when you are leading. I think there will be a lot more growing pains with this team but I think Fish gets it and will be a great one when all is said and done.

Yeah, I can't worry about him either. He'll probably end up having a nice career coaching. This roster is possibly incapable of learning the triangle though. Not sure what kind of drama that indicates, but I think it is more than a question of giving them 30 games to learn it. If Melo doesn't have his head in the game and he is not fully committed, trying to run the triangle is going to lay an egg.

Only wrinkle I can see right now is waiting to see if Jose can help enough to get Melo in sync and cooperating. Outside of that, I'm still thinking under 30 wins this season. A high pick is good, but I hate to see the core player not buy in. It could become a problem.

Anyone else think Pierce puts Melo in a funk? Seems to be a really tough match up for him and Pierce's mouth seems to impact Melo's game.
On a side note, it doesn't seem to matter who Alan Anderson plays for he kills the Knicks.

Don't forget Melo waited for KG after a game to "talk". Those Celtics mindfuc'd him good. I've never had full confidence in Melo's mindset. I think he gets rattled. The whole superstar thing to me is very much about mindset. Melo doesn't have that. Sure, he loves the adrenalin of having the ball at the end of the game and all that, but that doesn't require any thoughtfulness.

I've mocked him for his pre-season superstar comment, but let's be real. It was a sign of serious insecurity. He'd just landed a whopper deal and he says that? He's not as confident as he should be. Why? Well, its simply really. If his shots are not falling, his game is just not diverse enough for him to impact anything at all. And he knows it in his heart, yet he doesn't do anything to change it. So he goes into a funk. Its kind of childish.

His confidence thus is subject to drop-offs and we're seeing him slumping. It's all mental. He did not come into this season prepared to change. It was lip service. I call him fake for a reason. I'm not just on some jihad. He says stuff that is not truly sincere just because he thinks that is what he should say, but it lacks conviction and follow through.

He's basically a simple man without much going on analytically upstairs. He doesn't have the mind to work with. He's a talented guy, but a profoundly ordinary human being in every other way.

It is going to be very difficult for him to change. I'd love it, but I think I've been pretty accurate in my assessment of this guy. He's selfish and if it takes embarrassing the crap out of him to make him change, then I think you do it. Bench him. Send a message. Otherwise, this is not going to turn out well.

Waiting on Melo to change of his own volition becomes a game of fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. We're in phase 2. Do Phil and Fish let Melo get away with this kind of play? If they care about the future of the franchise, they better lay down the law soon.

I disagree about Melo coming into this season not ready to change. I think Melo was really close to going to Chicago. I think Phil presented his vision and Melo bought in. I also think Melo put in the work before camp both getting in shape to play the three and also working out and practicing the new offense with the young guys weeks before camp started. I do agree about him being a simple man. But I disagree about the outcome.

Getting ready physically has nothing to do with mental preparation

Nor does it have to do with how a player mentally sees his place in this game

Hence Phil bringing in mindfulness training

Splat gets it, Melo doesn't and neither do some fans

Totally disagree about the getting ready physically comment. If you are working on your game and conditioning how are you not preparing for the season. What type of mental preparation are you suggesting Melo and players participate in?

man we really screwed up. The outlook towards the future would be so much more positive had Phil not caved in to all of Melo's demands

I'm suppose to be excited about the possibility of maybe adding Marc Gasol to this mess when our "franchise player" is not even capable of buying into a team concept?

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:Perception of Fish sure has done a 180 with many

No issues with Fisher. This is a work in progress and the guy is a first year head coach. The triangle is almost a dysfunctional offense if you are down more than 5. It works great when you are leading. I think there will be a lot more growing pains with this team but I think Fish gets it and will be a great one when all is said and done.

Yeah, I can't worry about him either. He'll probably end up having a nice career coaching. This roster is possibly incapable of learning the triangle though. Not sure what kind of drama that indicates, but I think it is more than a question of giving them 30 games to learn it. If Melo doesn't have his head in the game and he is not fully committed, trying to run the triangle is going to lay an egg.

Only wrinkle I can see right now is waiting to see if Jose can help enough to get Melo in sync and cooperating. Outside of that, I'm still thinking under 30 wins this season. A high pick is good, but I hate to see the core player not buy in. It could become a problem.

Anyone else think Pierce puts Melo in a funk? Seems to be a really tough match up for him and Pierce's mouth seems to impact Melo's game.
On a side note, it doesn't seem to matter who Alan Anderson plays for he kills the Knicks.

Don't forget Melo waited for KG after a game to "talk". Those Celtics mindfuc'd him good. I've never had full confidence in Melo's mindset. I think he gets rattled. The whole superstar thing to me is very much about mindset. Melo doesn't have that. Sure, he loves the adrenalin of having the ball at the end of the game and all that, but that doesn't require any thoughtfulness.

I've mocked him for his pre-season superstar comment, but let's be real. It was a sign of serious insecurity. He'd just landed a whopper deal and he says that? He's not as confident as he should be. Why? Well, its simply really. If his shots are not falling, his game is just not diverse enough for him to impact anything at all. And he knows it in his heart, yet he doesn't do anything to change it. So he goes into a funk. Its kind of childish.

His confidence thus is subject to drop-offs and we're seeing him slumping. It's all mental. He did not come into this season prepared to change. It was lip service. I call him fake for a reason. I'm not just on some jihad. He says stuff that is not truly sincere just because he thinks that is what he should say, but it lacks conviction and follow through.

He's basically a simple man without much going on analytically upstairs. He doesn't have the mind to work with. He's a talented guy, but a profoundly ordinary human being in every other way.

It is going to be very difficult for him to change. I'd love it, but I think I've been pretty accurate in my assessment of this guy. He's selfish and if it takes embarrassing the crap out of him to make him change, then I think you do it. Bench him. Send a message. Otherwise, this is not going to turn out well.

Waiting on Melo to change of his own volition becomes a game of fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. We're in phase 2. Do Phil and Fish let Melo get away with this kind of play? If they care about the future of the franchise, they better lay down the law soon.

I disagree about Melo coming into this season not ready to change. I think Melo was really close to going to Chicago. I think Phil presented his vision and Melo bought in. I also think Melo put in the work before camp both getting in shape to play the three and also working out and practicing the new offense with the young guys weeks before camp started. I do agree about him being a simple man. But I disagree about the outcome.

Getting ready physically has nothing to do with mental preparation

Nor does it have to do with how a player mentally sees his place in this game

Hence Phil bringing in mindfulness training

Splat gets it, Melo doesn't and neither do some fans

Totally disagree about the getting ready physically comment. If you are working on your game and conditioning how are you not preparing for the season. What type of mental preparation are you suggesting Melo and players participate in?

Mental preparation has to do with how he sees the game

How he can do different things in an unfamiliar system

Working on the parts of his game he's not good at

Studying film, exercising proper leadership

Taking in the examples of past time greats

Maybe spending quality time around guys like Clyde-Larry Johnson

etc etc///// He has to see the game from a different vista

In order to truly change

It's not about losing weight or working on bounce back dribble jumpers

In one offseason

Also he openly admitted he lost weight to extend his playing career

Motives weren't 100% pure nor TEAM oriented

gunsnewing wrote:man we really screwed up. The outlook towards the future would be so much more positive had Phil not caved in to all of Melo's demands

I'm suppose to be excited about the possibility of maybe adding Marc Gasol to this mess when our "franchise player" is not even capable of buying into a team concept?

Yeah, we blew it. Most don't get it. But it has a very, very low probability of leading to becoming a contender with Melo as the centerpiece.

What people called ELITE is so off-base.

Melo is an ELITE hired gun.

That does not make him a superstar.

It does not make him a centerpiece.

It makes him a piece you can put on already good team to help put you over the top.

The misguided fantasy that you can build around Melo is like a cheap urban legend that will never die. There are millions of suckers who buy it, thus Dolan buys it, thus Melo gets paid and you end up with a lot of fanboys who then equate financial success as proof of his elite status as a player.

Melo is merely a cog.

The really sad part is even if everything goes well, the upside is never all that great because your core player is not a leader.

All you can really get is what you get on a game by game basis with Melo. Does he have a hot hand and help you win the game? Cool! Wow!

But you can win any number of battles, but you'll never win the war when you depend on a player who is hot or not.

Besides, its crap basketball and apparently lots of guys love bad basketball. Melo is their hero. He's their Saint Chuck.

yea winning battles but not winning wars is a microcosm of Melo's playoff career. It's what happens when you are not capable of positively impacting a game when the shot is off

its why he can look great beating Chicago in double OT than get completely shut down by Deng the following time they square off.

but its always someone else's fault when he comes up short at the end of the year

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:Perception of Fish sure has done a 180 with many

No issues with Fisher. This is a work in progress and the guy is a first year head coach. The triangle is almost a dysfunctional offense if you are down more than 5. It works great when you are leading. I think there will be a lot more growing pains with this team but I think Fish gets it and will be a great one when all is said and done.

Yeah, I can't worry about him either. He'll probably end up having a nice career coaching. This roster is possibly incapable of learning the triangle though. Not sure what kind of drama that indicates, but I think it is more than a question of giving them 30 games to learn it. If Melo doesn't have his head in the game and he is not fully committed, trying to run the triangle is going to lay an egg.

Only wrinkle I can see right now is waiting to see if Jose can help enough to get Melo in sync and cooperating. Outside of that, I'm still thinking under 30 wins this season. A high pick is good, but I hate to see the core player not buy in. It could become a problem.

Anyone else think Pierce puts Melo in a funk? Seems to be a really tough match up for him and Pierce's mouth seems to impact Melo's game.
On a side note, it doesn't seem to matter who Alan Anderson plays for he kills the Knicks.

Don't forget Melo waited for KG after a game to "talk". Those Celtics mindfuc'd him good. I've never had full confidence in Melo's mindset. I think he gets rattled. The whole superstar thing to me is very much about mindset. Melo doesn't have that. Sure, he loves the adrenalin of having the ball at the end of the game and all that, but that doesn't require any thoughtfulness.

I've mocked him for his pre-season superstar comment, but let's be real. It was a sign of serious insecurity. He'd just landed a whopper deal and he says that? He's not as confident as he should be. Why? Well, its simply really. If his shots are not falling, his game is just not diverse enough for him to impact anything at all. And he knows it in his heart, yet he doesn't do anything to change it. So he goes into a funk. Its kind of childish.

His confidence thus is subject to drop-offs and we're seeing him slumping. It's all mental. He did not come into this season prepared to change. It was lip service. I call him fake for a reason. I'm not just on some jihad. He says stuff that is not truly sincere just because he thinks that is what he should say, but it lacks conviction and follow through.

He's basically a simple man without much going on analytically upstairs. He doesn't have the mind to work with. He's a talented guy, but a profoundly ordinary human being in every other way.

It is going to be very difficult for him to change. I'd love it, but I think I've been pretty accurate in my assessment of this guy. He's selfish and if it takes embarrassing the crap out of him to make him change, then I think you do it. Bench him. Send a message. Otherwise, this is not going to turn out well.

Waiting on Melo to change of his own volition becomes a game of fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. We're in phase 2. Do Phil and Fish let Melo get away with this kind of play? If they care about the future of the franchise, they better lay down the law soon.

I disagree about Melo coming into this season not ready to change. I think Melo was really close to going to Chicago. I think Phil presented his vision and Melo bought in. I also think Melo put in the work before camp both getting in shape to play the three and also working out and practicing the new offense with the young guys weeks before camp started. I do agree about him being a simple man. But I disagree about the outcome.

Getting ready physically has nothing to do with mental preparation

Nor does it have to do with how a player mentally sees his place in this game

Hence Phil bringing in mindfulness training

Splat gets it, Melo doesn't and neither do some fans

Totally disagree about the getting ready physically comment. If you are working on your game and conditioning how are you not preparing for the season. What type of mental preparation are you suggesting Melo and players participate in?

Mental preparation has to do with how he sees the game

How he can do different things in an unfamiliar system

Working on the parts of his game he's not good at

Studying film, exercising proper leadership

Taking in the examples of past time greats

Maybe spending quality time around guys like Clyde-Larry Johnson

etc etc///// He has to see the game from a different vista

In order to truly change

It's not about losing weight or working on bounce back dribble jumpers

In one offseason

Also he openly admitted he lost weight to extend his playing career

Motives weren't 100% pure nor TEAM oriented

Aah. Not sure that was very well defined. Guys go their separate ways in the offseason and do their own work. Some plays on the dream team or usa select. Are Clyde and LJ working out with guys? I know Hakeem is. Is it about who you work out with or who your trainer is when you train? Melo was working out with teammates several weeks before training camp and working on the triangle. I don't think he came late to those work outs. If they were going on prior to his being there they weren't talked about in the press. Seems like a Melo slam. He has his faults but this mental training that you speak of is not something separate from working on your game and conditioning that guys do in the off season that I am aware of. Nothing that you posted changes my opinion on this.

Splat wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:man we really screwed up. The outlook towards the future would be so much more positive had Phil not caved in to all of Melo's demands

I'm suppose to be excited about the possibility of maybe adding Marc Gasol to this mess when our "franchise player" is not even capable of buying into a team concept?

Yeah, we blew it. Most don't get it. But it has a very, very low probability of leading to becoming a contender with Melo as the centerpiece.

What people called ELITE is so off-base.

Melo is an ELITE hired gun.

That does not make him a superstar.

It does not make him a centerpiece.

It makes him a piece you can put on already good team to help put you over the top.

The misguided fantasy that you can build around Melo is like a cheap urban legend that will never die. There are millions of suckers who buy it, thus Dolan buys it, thus Melo gets paid and you end up with a lot of fanboys who then equate financial success as proof of his elite status as a player.

Melo is merely a cog.

The really sad part is even if everything goes well, the upside is never all that great because your core player is not a leader.

All you can really get is what you get on a game by game basis with Melo. Does he have a hot hand and help you win the game? Cool! Wow!

But you can win any number of battles, but you'll never win the war when you depend on a player who is hot or not.

Besides, its crap basketball and apparently lots of guys love bad basketball. Melo is their hero. He's their Saint Chuck.

Yeah the mythical and urban legend stories with

UnicornMelo have run 12yrs too long

It doesn't take 2 organizations 12-16yrs

To come up with a winning formula around him

Because it doesn't exist, never did

And if Melo needs a Bulls team to win

Name me a star player who hasn't won that wouldn't need the same roster to win

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:Perception of Fish sure has done a 180 with many

No issues with Fisher. This is a work in progress and the guy is a first year head coach. The triangle is almost a dysfunctional offense if you are down more than 5. It works great when you are leading. I think there will be a lot more growing pains with this team but I think Fish gets it and will be a great one when all is said and done.

Yeah, I can't worry about him either. He'll probably end up having a nice career coaching. This roster is possibly incapable of learning the triangle though. Not sure what kind of drama that indicates, but I think it is more than a question of giving them 30 games to learn it. If Melo doesn't have his head in the game and he is not fully committed, trying to run the triangle is going to lay an egg.

Only wrinkle I can see right now is waiting to see if Jose can help enough to get Melo in sync and cooperating. Outside of that, I'm still thinking under 30 wins this season. A high pick is good, but I hate to see the core player not buy in. It could become a problem.

Anyone else think Pierce puts Melo in a funk? Seems to be a really tough match up for him and Pierce's mouth seems to impact Melo's game.
On a side note, it doesn't seem to matter who Alan Anderson plays for he kills the Knicks.

Don't forget Melo waited for KG after a game to "talk". Those Celtics mindfuc'd him good. I've never had full confidence in Melo's mindset. I think he gets rattled. The whole superstar thing to me is very much about mindset. Melo doesn't have that. Sure, he loves the adrenalin of having the ball at the end of the game and all that, but that doesn't require any thoughtfulness.

I've mocked him for his pre-season superstar comment, but let's be real. It was a sign of serious insecurity. He'd just landed a whopper deal and he says that? He's not as confident as he should be. Why? Well, its simply really. If his shots are not falling, his game is just not diverse enough for him to impact anything at all. And he knows it in his heart, yet he doesn't do anything to change it. So he goes into a funk. Its kind of childish.

His confidence thus is subject to drop-offs and we're seeing him slumping. It's all mental. He did not come into this season prepared to change. It was lip service. I call him fake for a reason. I'm not just on some jihad. He says stuff that is not truly sincere just because he thinks that is what he should say, but it lacks conviction and follow through.

He's basically a simple man without much going on analytically upstairs. He doesn't have the mind to work with. He's a talented guy, but a profoundly ordinary human being in every other way.

It is going to be very difficult for him to change. I'd love it, but I think I've been pretty accurate in my assessment of this guy. He's selfish and if it takes embarrassing the crap out of him to make him change, then I think you do it. Bench him. Send a message. Otherwise, this is not going to turn out well.

Waiting on Melo to change of his own volition becomes a game of fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. We're in phase 2. Do Phil and Fish let Melo get away with this kind of play? If they care about the future of the franchise, they better lay down the law soon.

I disagree about Melo coming into this season not ready to change. I think Melo was really close to going to Chicago. I think Phil presented his vision and Melo bought in. I also think Melo put in the work before camp both getting in shape to play the three and also working out and practicing the new offense with the young guys weeks before camp started. I do agree about him being a simple man. But I disagree about the outcome.

Getting ready physically has nothing to do with mental preparation

Nor does it have to do with how a player mentally sees his place in this game

Hence Phil bringing in mindfulness training

Splat gets it, Melo doesn't and neither do some fans

Totally disagree about the getting ready physically comment. If you are working on your game and conditioning how are you not preparing for the season. What type of mental preparation are you suggesting Melo and players participate in?

Mental preparation has to do with how he sees the game

How he can do different things in an unfamiliar system

Working on the parts of his game he's not good at

Studying film, exercising proper leadership

Taking in the examples of past time greats

Maybe spending quality time around guys like Clyde-Larry Johnson

etc etc///// He has to see the game from a different vista

In order to truly change

It's not about losing weight or working on bounce back dribble jumpers

In one offseason

Also he openly admitted he lost weight to extend his playing career

Motives weren't 100% pure nor TEAM oriented

Aah. Not sure that was very well defined. Guys go their separate ways in the offseason and do their own work. Some plays on the dream team or usa select. Are Clyde and LJ working out with guys? I know Hakeem is. Is it about who you work out with or who your trainer is when you train? Melo was working out with teammates several weeks before training camp and working on the triangle. I don't think he came late to those work outs. If they were going on prior to his being there they weren't talked about in the press. Seems like a Melo slam. He has his faults but this mental training that you speak of is not something separate from working on your game and conditioning that guys do in the off season that I am aware of. Nothing that you posted changes my opinion on this.

Actually it does make sense what I said

Like he mentioned he hadn't spent much time around

Phil the whole off-season, guess what he should have

Matter of fact 1 step further

Fisher mentioned Phil surprised by calling him up

To go pay an old friend a visit, That person was Tex Winters

It was a passing of the torch type of visit

Guess who else should have requested to to spend time with him and actually do it

Melo said Phil handed him the Triangle playbook and said study it

Does it look like he has, I'd say no

Instead he's on concert trying to be Digital Melo during the offseason

The fact he made the public comment he doesn't see himself

Winning the scoring title in this offense shows you how his mind works

He's full of mental fragility

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:Perception of Fish sure has done a 180 with many

No issues with Fisher. This is a work in progress and the guy is a first year head coach. The triangle is almost a dysfunctional offense if you are down more than 5. It works great when you are leading. I think there will be a lot more growing pains with this team but I think Fish gets it and will be a great one when all is said and done.

Yeah, I can't worry about him either. He'll probably end up having a nice career coaching. This roster is possibly incapable of learning the triangle though. Not sure what kind of drama that indicates, but I think it is more than a question of giving them 30 games to learn it. If Melo doesn't have his head in the game and he is not fully committed, trying to run the triangle is going to lay an egg.

Only wrinkle I can see right now is waiting to see if Jose can help enough to get Melo in sync and cooperating. Outside of that, I'm still thinking under 30 wins this season. A high pick is good, but I hate to see the core player not buy in. It could become a problem.

Anyone else think Pierce puts Melo in a funk? Seems to be a really tough match up for him and Pierce's mouth seems to impact Melo's game.
On a side note, it doesn't seem to matter who Alan Anderson plays for he kills the Knicks.

Don't forget Melo waited for KG after a game to "talk". Those Celtics mindfuc'd him good. I've never had full confidence in Melo's mindset. I think he gets rattled. The whole superstar thing to me is very much about mindset. Melo doesn't have that. Sure, he loves the adrenalin of having the ball at the end of the game and all that, but that doesn't require any thoughtfulness.

I've mocked him for his pre-season superstar comment, but let's be real. It was a sign of serious insecurity. He'd just landed a whopper deal and he says that? He's not as confident as he should be. Why? Well, its simply really. If his shots are not falling, his game is just not diverse enough for him to impact anything at all. And he knows it in his heart, yet he doesn't do anything to change it. So he goes into a funk. Its kind of childish.

His confidence thus is subject to drop-offs and we're seeing him slumping. It's all mental. He did not come into this season prepared to change. It was lip service. I call him fake for a reason. I'm not just on some jihad. He says stuff that is not truly sincere just because he thinks that is what he should say, but it lacks conviction and follow through.

He's basically a simple man without much going on analytically upstairs. He doesn't have the mind to work with. He's a talented guy, but a profoundly ordinary human being in every other way.

It is going to be very difficult for him to change. I'd love it, but I think I've been pretty accurate in my assessment of this guy. He's selfish and if it takes embarrassing the crap out of him to make him change, then I think you do it. Bench him. Send a message. Otherwise, this is not going to turn out well.

Waiting on Melo to change of his own volition becomes a game of fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. We're in phase 2. Do Phil and Fish let Melo get away with this kind of play? If they care about the future of the franchise, they better lay down the law soon.

I disagree about Melo coming into this season not ready to change. I think Melo was really close to going to Chicago. I think Phil presented his vision and Melo bought in. I also think Melo put in the work before camp both getting in shape to play the three and also working out and practicing the new offense with the young guys weeks before camp started. I do agree about him being a simple man. But I disagree about the outcome.

Getting ready physically has nothing to do with mental preparation

Nor does it have to do with how a player mentally sees his place in this game

Hence Phil bringing in mindfulness training

Splat gets it, Melo doesn't and neither do some fans

Totally disagree about the getting ready physically comment. If you are working on your game and conditioning how are you not preparing for the season. What type of mental preparation are you suggesting Melo and players participate in?

Mental preparation has to do with how he sees the game

How he can do different things in an unfamiliar system

Working on the parts of his game he's not good at

Studying film, exercising proper leadership

Taking in the examples of past time greats

Maybe spending quality time around guys like Clyde-Larry Johnson

etc etc///// He has to see the game from a different vista

In order to truly change

It's not about losing weight or working on bounce back dribble jumpers

In one offseason

Also he openly admitted he lost weight to extend his playing career

Motives weren't 100% pure nor TEAM oriented

Aah. Not sure that was very well defined. Guys go their separate ways in the offseason and do their own work. Some plays on the dream team or usa select. Are Clyde and LJ working out with guys? I know Hakeem is. Is it about who you work out with or who your trainer is when you train? Melo was working out with teammates several weeks before training camp and working on the triangle. I don't think he came late to those work outs. If they were going on prior to his being there they weren't talked about in the press. Seems like a Melo slam. He has his faults but this mental training that you speak of is not something separate from working on your game and conditioning that guys do in the off season that I am aware of. Nothing that you posted changes my opinion on this.

Actually it does make sense what I said

Like he mentioned he hadn't spent much time around

Phil the whole off-season, guess what he should have

Matter of fact 1 step further

Fisher mentioned Phil surprised by calling him up

To go pay an old friend a visit, That person was Tex Winters

It was a passing of the torch type of visit

Guess who else should have requested to to spend time with him and actually do it

Melo said Phil handed him the Triangle playbook and study it

Does it look he has

Instead he's on concert trying to be Digital Melo during the offseason

The fact he made the public comment he doesn't see himself

Winning the scoring title in this offense shows you how his mind works

He's full of mental fragility

Who did Phil spend time around? He was in Europe for his son's wedding and on the west coast. I get Melo criticism. But this mental training for players is a unique new way to criticize a guy that does train and prepare for the season and showed up several weeks before camp to work with his teammates on the new offense. What happened to your Clyde, LJ points? What guys are accessible that provide mental training that Melo did not reach out to?

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:Perception of Fish sure has done a 180 with many

No issues with Fisher. This is a work in progress and the guy is a first year head coach. The triangle is almost a dysfunctional offense if you are down more than 5. It works great when you are leading. I think there will be a lot more growing pains with this team but I think Fish gets it and will be a great one when all is said and done.

Yeah, I can't worry about him either. He'll probably end up having a nice career coaching. This roster is possibly incapable of learning the triangle though. Not sure what kind of drama that indicates, but I think it is more than a question of giving them 30 games to learn it. If Melo doesn't have his head in the game and he is not fully committed, trying to run the triangle is going to lay an egg.

Only wrinkle I can see right now is waiting to see if Jose can help enough to get Melo in sync and cooperating. Outside of that, I'm still thinking under 30 wins this season. A high pick is good, but I hate to see the core player not buy in. It could become a problem.

Anyone else think Pierce puts Melo in a funk? Seems to be a really tough match up for him and Pierce's mouth seems to impact Melo's game.
On a side note, it doesn't seem to matter who Alan Anderson plays for he kills the Knicks.

Don't forget Melo waited for KG after a game to "talk". Those Celtics mindfuc'd him good. I've never had full confidence in Melo's mindset. I think he gets rattled. The whole superstar thing to me is very much about mindset. Melo doesn't have that. Sure, he loves the adrenalin of having the ball at the end of the game and all that, but that doesn't require any thoughtfulness.

I've mocked him for his pre-season superstar comment, but let's be real. It was a sign of serious insecurity. He'd just landed a whopper deal and he says that? He's not as confident as he should be. Why? Well, its simply really. If his shots are not falling, his game is just not diverse enough for him to impact anything at all. And he knows it in his heart, yet he doesn't do anything to change it. So he goes into a funk. Its kind of childish.

His confidence thus is subject to drop-offs and we're seeing him slumping. It's all mental. He did not come into this season prepared to change. It was lip service. I call him fake for a reason. I'm not just on some jihad. He says stuff that is not truly sincere just because he thinks that is what he should say, but it lacks conviction and follow through.

He's basically a simple man without much going on analytically upstairs. He doesn't have the mind to work with. He's a talented guy, but a profoundly ordinary human being in every other way.

It is going to be very difficult for him to change. I'd love it, but I think I've been pretty accurate in my assessment of this guy. He's selfish and if it takes embarrassing the crap out of him to make him change, then I think you do it. Bench him. Send a message. Otherwise, this is not going to turn out well.

Waiting on Melo to change of his own volition becomes a game of fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. We're in phase 2. Do Phil and Fish let Melo get away with this kind of play? If they care about the future of the franchise, they better lay down the law soon.

I disagree about Melo coming into this season not ready to change. I think Melo was really close to going to Chicago. I think Phil presented his vision and Melo bought in. I also think Melo put in the work before camp both getting in shape to play the three and also working out and practicing the new offense with the young guys weeks before camp started. I do agree about him being a simple man. But I disagree about the outcome.

Getting ready physically has nothing to do with mental preparation

Nor does it have to do with how a player mentally sees his place in this game

Hence Phil bringing in mindfulness training

Splat gets it, Melo doesn't and neither do some fans

Totally disagree about the getting ready physically comment. If you are working on your game and conditioning how are you not preparing for the season. What type of mental preparation are you suggesting Melo and players participate in?

Mental preparation has to do with how he sees the game

How he can do different things in an unfamiliar system

Working on the parts of his game he's not good at

Studying film, exercising proper leadership

Taking in the examples of past time greats

Maybe spending quality time around guys like Clyde-Larry Johnson

etc etc///// He has to see the game from a different vista

In order to truly change

It's not about losing weight or working on bounce back dribble jumpers

In one offseason

Also he openly admitted he lost weight to extend his playing career

Motives weren't 100% pure nor TEAM oriented

Aah. Not sure that was very well defined. Guys go their separate ways in the offseason and do their own work. Some plays on the dream team or usa select. Are Clyde and LJ working out with guys? I know Hakeem is. Is it about who you work out with or who your trainer is when you train? Melo was working out with teammates several weeks before training camp and working on the triangle. I don't think he came late to those work outs. If they were going on prior to his being there they weren't talked about in the press. Seems like a Melo slam. He has his faults but this mental training that you speak of is not something separate from working on your game and conditioning that guys do in the off season that I am aware of. Nothing that you posted changes my opinion on this.

Actually it does make sense what I said

Like he mentioned he hadn't spent much time around

Phil the whole off-season, guess what he should have

Matter of fact 1 step further

Fisher mentioned Phil surprised by calling him up

To go pay an old friend a visit, That person was Tex Winters

It was a passing of the torch type of visit

Guess who else should have requested to to spend time with him and actually do it

Melo said Phil handed him the Triangle playbook and study it

Does it look he has

Instead he's on concert trying to be Digital Melo during the offseason

The fact he made the public comment he doesn't see himself

Winning the scoring title in this offense shows you how his mind works

He's full of mental fragility

Who did Phil spend time around? He was in Europe for his son's wedding and on the west coast. I get Melo criticism. But this mental training for players is a unique new way to criticize a guy that does train and prepare for the season and showed up several weeks before camp to work with his teammates on the new offense. What happened to your Clyde, LJ points? What guys are accessible that provide mental training that Melo did not reach out to?

He can hang around Clyde and talk to him about winning in New York

What approach did he take when Monroe was added to the team

I forgot to mention Reed, pick his brain too

Ask them how they led, showing up at gyms 3weeks before camp is not necessarily

Mental preparation, especially when Melo has probably done similar in seasons past

Ask elder contemporaries what he can improve on his game

Reading Phil's interview about how he thinks

Provided insight on mental preparations, players can do likewise

F50 if an athelete is invited to the Bloomberg Sports Business Summit is he supposed to decline the invitation. Are athletes not allowed to try and establish a post career business/income. Are you suggesting that a 20 minute interview about an athlete's investments deterred from his preparation for the upcoming season? What would you have him doing for that 20 minutes?

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:Perception of Fish sure has done a 180 with many

No issues with Fisher. This is a work in progress and the guy is a first year head coach. The triangle is almost a dysfunctional offense if you are down more than 5. It works great when you are leading. I think there will be a lot more growing pains with this team but I think Fish gets it and will be a great one when all is said and done.

Yeah, I can't worry about him either. He'll probably end up having a nice career coaching. This roster is possibly incapable of learning the triangle though. Not sure what kind of drama that indicates, but I think it is more than a question of giving them 30 games to learn it. If Melo doesn't have his head in the game and he is not fully committed, trying to run the triangle is going to lay an egg.

Only wrinkle I can see right now is waiting to see if Jose can help enough to get Melo in sync and cooperating. Outside of that, I'm still thinking under 30 wins this season. A high pick is good, but I hate to see the core player not buy in. It could become a problem.

Anyone else think Pierce puts Melo in a funk? Seems to be a really tough match up for him and Pierce's mouth seems to impact Melo's game.
On a side note, it doesn't seem to matter who Alan Anderson plays for he kills the Knicks.

Don't forget Melo waited for KG after a game to "talk". Those Celtics mindfuc'd him good. I've never had full confidence in Melo's mindset. I think he gets rattled. The whole superstar thing to me is very much about mindset. Melo doesn't have that. Sure, he loves the adrenalin of having the ball at the end of the game and all that, but that doesn't require any thoughtfulness.

I've mocked him for his pre-season superstar comment, but let's be real. It was a sign of serious insecurity. He'd just landed a whopper deal and he says that? He's not as confident as he should be. Why? Well, its simply really. If his shots are not falling, his game is just not diverse enough for him to impact anything at all. And he knows it in his heart, yet he doesn't do anything to change it. So he goes into a funk. Its kind of childish.

His confidence thus is subject to drop-offs and we're seeing him slumping. It's all mental. He did not come into this season prepared to change. It was lip service. I call him fake for a reason. I'm not just on some jihad. He says stuff that is not truly sincere just because he thinks that is what he should say, but it lacks conviction and follow through.

He's basically a simple man without much going on analytically upstairs. He doesn't have the mind to work with. He's a talented guy, but a profoundly ordinary human being in every other way.

It is going to be very difficult for him to change. I'd love it, but I think I've been pretty accurate in my assessment of this guy. He's selfish and if it takes embarrassing the crap out of him to make him change, then I think you do it. Bench him. Send a message. Otherwise, this is not going to turn out well.

Waiting on Melo to change of his own volition becomes a game of fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. We're in phase 2. Do Phil and Fish let Melo get away with this kind of play? If they care about the future of the franchise, they better lay down the law soon.

I disagree about Melo coming into this season not ready to change. I think Melo was really close to going to Chicago. I think Phil presented his vision and Melo bought in. I also think Melo put in the work before camp both getting in shape to play the three and also working out and practicing the new offense with the young guys weeks before camp started. I do agree about him being a simple man. But I disagree about the outcome.

Getting ready physically has nothing to do with mental preparation

Nor does it have to do with how a player mentally sees his place in this game

Hence Phil bringing in mindfulness training

Splat gets it, Melo doesn't and neither do some fans

Totally disagree about the getting ready physically comment. If you are working on your game and conditioning how are you not preparing for the season. What type of mental preparation are you suggesting Melo and players participate in?

Mental preparation has to do with how he sees the game

How he can do different things in an unfamiliar system

Working on the parts of his game he's not good at

Studying film, exercising proper leadership

Taking in the examples of past time greats

Maybe spending quality time around guys like Clyde-Larry Johnson

etc etc///// He has to see the game from a different vista

In order to truly change

It's not about losing weight or working on bounce back dribble jumpers

In one offseason

Also he openly admitted he lost weight to extend his playing career

Motives weren't 100% pure nor TEAM oriented

Aah. Not sure that was very well defined. Guys go their separate ways in the offseason and do their own work. Some plays on the dream team or usa select. Are Clyde and LJ working out with guys? I know Hakeem is. Is it about who you work out with or who your trainer is when you train? Melo was working out with teammates several weeks before training camp and working on the triangle. I don't think he came late to those work outs. If they were going on prior to his being there they weren't talked about in the press. Seems like a Melo slam. He has his faults but this mental training that you speak of is not something separate from working on your game and conditioning that guys do in the off season that I am aware of. Nothing that you posted changes my opinion on this.

Actually it does make sense what I said

Like he mentioned he hadn't spent much time around

Phil the whole off-season, guess what he should have

Matter of fact 1 step further

Fisher mentioned Phil surprised by calling him up

To go pay an old friend a visit, That person was Tex Winters

It was a passing of the torch type of visit

Guess who else should have requested to to spend time with him and actually do it

Melo said Phil handed him the Triangle playbook and study it

Does it look he has

Instead he's on concert trying to be Digital Melo during the offseason

The fact he made the public comment he doesn't see himself

Winning the scoring title in this offense shows you how his mind works

He's full of mental fragility

Who did Phil spend time around? He was in Europe for his son's wedding and on the west coast. I get Melo criticism. But this mental training for players is a unique new way to criticize a guy that does train and prepare for the season and showed up several weeks before camp to work with his teammates on the new offense. What happened to your Clyde, LJ points? What guys are accessible that provide mental training that Melo did not reach out to?

He can hang around Clyde and talk to him about winning in New York

What approach did he take when Monroe was added to the team

I forgot to mention Reed, pick his brain too

Ask them how they led, showing up at gyms 3weeks before camp is not necessarily

Mental preparation, especially when Melo has probably done similar in seasons past

Ask elder contemporaries when he can improve on his game

Reading Phil's interview about how he thinks

Provided insight on mental preparations, players can do likewise

Does Clyde want to hang around with Knick players in the offseason? He summers in St. Croix. Not sure that Reed works with Knick players but in general the mental training seems like a reach. The only thing I agree with is asking elder contemporaries for help. But we saw a huge difference in the success of the team when those guys were present. Kidd, Sheed, Kurt and reportedly Camby had a big impact on the 12-13 team. I think Calderon is that guy for the Knicks. Casey raves about him.

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:I disagree about Melo coming into this season not ready to change. I think Melo was really close to going to Chicago. I think Phil presented his vision and Melo bought in. I also think Melo put in the work before camp both getting in shape to play the three and also working out and practicing the new offense with the young guys weeks before camp started. I do agree about him being a simple man. But I disagree about the outcome.

I definitely grant it is too early in the season to make any conclusive statements about Melo's mindset and intentions coming into this season. I see serious indications it was lacking and maybe lip service, but to be fair we have to extend him and everyone the leeway to figure things out.

If we enter the All-Star break and Melo keeps playing like his is now, then I will be waving the white flag. Until then, I'll keep enough of an open mind in the event he comes out of his slump and starts to play better. Though I know he is not a leader and probably never will be, I know his failure would doom the franchise so I'd like to see him succeed.

I agree. If his moping/slump continues until the break then the Knicks need to play the young guys a ton and tank. They may need to look into moving Melo. I don't think that happens. I think Melo with a reasonable coach and a reasonable team wins 45 games every year. I think he has a reasonable coach. I am not sure about this years team. In NY we haven't seen him with more talented teammates. Hopefully Jose has a Kidd like role on this team.

Is that why we made all the changes and

Shelled out all that dough since 2011

To accomplish such middle road success

I think Walsh's tenure was a disaster. Start there. ZBo, Crawford, Hill, 2012 first round pick, DLee, Nate Rob etc. D'Antoni was a horrible hire but trading draft picks when you have a guy that assures lottery status is almost worse then hiring him and trying to make it look like it wasn't a mistake for three years.

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:Amare " we gotta stick with the offense and not go away from it"

I'd wager he's talking about Melo since Melo is the offense

Here we go again with Amar'e and his

"Guys Aren't Buying In"

"Guys Have To Trust And Execute What The Coach Wants"

"We Gotta Stick With The Offense And Not Go Away From It"

"We Have To Share The Ball"

Yet this STATUE goes 1-on-1 100-200% of the time

I didn't watch much of the post game. He is talking again? Not good. Amare has no sense of self. Phil needs to explore the Philly deal. If he can get a youngster and or a pick he should pull the trigger sooner rather than later.

Crush no team is taking on $23mil

While giving up a pick

Not in case you're talking of us giving up a future 1st

It saves Philly almost 20 mil. It is why they traded for Granger last year. They would want to do the deal at the deadline.

Please explain how

Philly has to pay out bonuses if they are too far below the cap. The trade speculation involves the Knicks giving something up but the trade if done at the deadline saves the sixers 9 mil.
http://www.basketballinsiders.com/nba-am...

The article clearly says/////

They would only owe him roughly 30 percent of his remaining contract, so they’d end up paying him $7 million in cash and likely extract a draft pick or a rookie scale player for their troubles.

It would require sending them a pick or THJR or Shump

Just as there is a cap on salary there is also a floor. The Sixers right now are BELOW the salaey floor and thus they have to pay all their players the difference between their total salaries and the salary floor figure as a bonus If They don't add salary to go over the floor by a certain date in the mid season. What Crush is saying is that the acquisition of a high priced player like Stat would bring them over the floor and then they'd avoid paying the difference to their players, saving money in the process.

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:Perception of Fish sure has done a 180 with many

No issues with Fisher. This is a work in progress and the guy is a first year head coach. The triangle is almost a dysfunctional offense if you are down more than 5. It works great when you are leading. I think there will be a lot more growing pains with this team but I think Fish gets it and will be a great one when all is said and done.

Yeah, I can't worry about him either. He'll probably end up having a nice career coaching. This roster is possibly incapable of learning the triangle though. Not sure what kind of drama that indicates, but I think it is more than a question of giving them 30 games to learn it. If Melo doesn't have his head in the game and he is not fully committed, trying to run the triangle is going to lay an egg.

Only wrinkle I can see right now is waiting to see if Jose can help enough to get Melo in sync and cooperating. Outside of that, I'm still thinking under 30 wins this season. A high pick is good, but I hate to see the core player not buy in. It could become a problem.

Anyone else think Pierce puts Melo in a funk? Seems to be a really tough match up for him and Pierce's mouth seems to impact Melo's game.
On a side note, it doesn't seem to matter who Alan Anderson plays for he kills the Knicks.

Don't forget Melo waited for KG after a game to "talk". Those Celtics mindfuc'd him good. I've never had full confidence in Melo's mindset. I think he gets rattled. The whole superstar thing to me is very much about mindset. Melo doesn't have that. Sure, he loves the adrenalin of having the ball at the end of the game and all that, but that doesn't require any thoughtfulness.

I've mocked him for his pre-season superstar comment, but let's be real. It was a sign of serious insecurity. He'd just landed a whopper deal and he says that? He's not as confident as he should be. Why? Well, its simply really. If his shots are not falling, his game is just not diverse enough for him to impact anything at all. And he knows it in his heart, yet he doesn't do anything to change it. So he goes into a funk. Its kind of childish.

His confidence thus is subject to drop-offs and we're seeing him slumping. It's all mental. He did not come into this season prepared to change. It was lip service. I call him fake for a reason. I'm not just on some jihad. He says stuff that is not truly sincere just because he thinks that is what he should say, but it lacks conviction and follow through.

He's basically a simple man without much going on analytically upstairs. He doesn't have the mind to work with. He's a talented guy, but a profoundly ordinary human being in every other way.

It is going to be very difficult for him to change. I'd love it, but I think I've been pretty accurate in my assessment of this guy. He's selfish and if it takes embarrassing the crap out of him to make him change, then I think you do it. Bench him. Send a message. Otherwise, this is not going to turn out well.

Waiting on Melo to change of his own volition becomes a game of fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. We're in phase 2. Do Phil and Fish let Melo get away with this kind of play? If they care about the future of the franchise, they better lay down the law soon.

I disagree about Melo coming into this season not ready to change. I think Melo was really close to going to Chicago. I think Phil presented his vision and Melo bought in. I also think Melo put in the work before camp both getting in shape to play the three and also working out and practicing the new offense with the young guys weeks before camp started. I do agree about him being a simple man. But I disagree about the outcome.

Getting ready physically has nothing to do with mental preparation

Nor does it have to do with how a player mentally sees his place in this game

Hence Phil bringing in mindfulness training

Splat gets it, Melo doesn't and neither do some fans

Totally disagree about the getting ready physically comment. If you are working on your game and conditioning how are you not preparing for the season. What type of mental preparation are you suggesting Melo and players participate in?

Mental preparation has to do with how he sees the game

How he can do different things in an unfamiliar system

Working on the parts of his game he's not good at

Studying film, exercising proper leadership

Taking in the examples of past time greats

Maybe spending quality time around guys like Clyde-Larry Johnson

etc etc///// He has to see the game from a different vista

In order to truly change

It's not about losing weight or working on bounce back dribble jumpers

In one offseason

Also he openly admitted he lost weight to extend his playing career

Motives weren't 100% pure nor TEAM oriented

Aah. Not sure that was very well defined. Guys go their separate ways in the offseason and do their own work. Some plays on the dream team or usa select. Are Clyde and LJ working out with guys? I know Hakeem is. Is it about who you work out with or who your trainer is when you train? Melo was working out with teammates several weeks before training camp and working on the triangle. I don't think he came late to those work outs. If they were going on prior to his being there they weren't talked about in the press. Seems like a Melo slam. He has his faults but this mental training that you speak of is not something separate from working on your game and conditioning that guys do in the off season that I am aware of. Nothing that you posted changes my opinion on this.

Actually it does make sense what I said

Like he mentioned he hadn't spent much time around

Phil the whole off-season, guess what he should have

Matter of fact 1 step further

Fisher mentioned Phil surprised by calling him up

To go pay an old friend a visit, That person was Tex Winters

It was a passing of the torch type of visit

Guess who else should have requested to to spend time with him and actually do it

Melo said Phil handed him the Triangle playbook and study it

Does it look he has

Instead he's on concert trying to be Digital Melo during the offseason

The fact he made the public comment he doesn't see himself

Winning the scoring title in this offense shows you how his mind works

He's full of mental fragility

Who did Phil spend time around? He was in Europe for his son's wedding and on the west coast. I get Melo criticism. But this mental training for players is a unique new way to criticize a guy that does train and prepare for the season and showed up several weeks before camp to work with his teammates on the new offense. What happened to your Clyde, LJ points? What guys are accessible that provide mental training that Melo did not reach out to?

He can hang around Clyde and talk to him about winning in New York

What approach did he take when Monroe was added to the team

I forgot to mention Reed, pick his brain too

Ask them how they led, showing up at gyms 3weeks before camp is not necessarily

Mental preparation, especially when Melo has probably done similar in seasons past

Ask elder contemporaries when he can improve on his game

Reading Phil's interview about how he thinks

Provided insight on mental preparations, players can do likewise

Does Clyde want to hang around with Knick players in the offseason? He summers in St. Croix. Not sure that Reed works with Knick players but in general the mental training seems like a reach. The only thing I agree with is asking elder contemporaries for help. But we saw a huge difference in the success of the team when those guys were present. Kidd, Sheed, Kurt and reportedly Camby had a big impact on the 12-13 team. I think Calderon is that guy for the Knicks. Casey raves about him.

Yeah he does

He commented on this last year

He said he'd be more than willing to help Shumpert

With his jumpshot and on defensive principles

He said he never ask players to use him as an outlet

But if they did he would be more than happy to help

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Splat wrote:Perception of Fish sure has done a 180 with many

No issues with Fisher. This is a work in progress and the guy is a first year head coach. The triangle is almost a dysfunctional offense if you are down more than 5. It works great when you are leading. I think there will be a lot more growing pains with this team but I think Fish gets it and will be a great one when all is said and done.

Yeah, I can't worry about him either. He'll probably end up having a nice career coaching. This roster is possibly incapable of learning the triangle though. Not sure what kind of drama that indicates, but I think it is more than a question of giving them 30 games to learn it. If Melo doesn't have his head in the game and he is not fully committed, trying to run the triangle is going to lay an egg.

Only wrinkle I can see right now is waiting to see if Jose can help enough to get Melo in sync and cooperating. Outside of that, I'm still thinking under 30 wins this season. A high pick is good, but I hate to see the core player not buy in. It could become a problem.

Anyone else think Pierce puts Melo in a funk? Seems to be a really tough match up for him and Pierce's mouth seems to impact Melo's game.
On a side note, it doesn't seem to matter who Alan Anderson plays for he kills the Knicks.

Don't forget Melo waited for KG after a game to "talk". Those Celtics mindfuc'd him good. I've never had full confidence in Melo's mindset. I think he gets rattled. The whole superstar thing to me is very much about mindset. Melo doesn't have that. Sure, he loves the adrenalin of having the ball at the end of the game and all that, but that doesn't require any thoughtfulness.

I've mocked him for his pre-season superstar comment, but let's be real. It was a sign of serious insecurity. He'd just landed a whopper deal and he says that? He's not as confident as he should be. Why? Well, its simply really. If his shots are not falling, his game is just not diverse enough for him to impact anything at all. And he knows it in his heart, yet he doesn't do anything to change it. So he goes into a funk. Its kind of childish.

His confidence thus is subject to drop-offs and we're seeing him slumping. It's all mental. He did not come into this season prepared to change. It was lip service. I call him fake for a reason. I'm not just on some jihad. He says stuff that is not truly sincere just because he thinks that is what he should say, but it lacks conviction and follow through.

He's basically a simple man without much going on analytically upstairs. He doesn't have the mind to work with. He's a talented guy, but a profoundly ordinary human being in every other way.

It is going to be very difficult for him to change. I'd love it, but I think I've been pretty accurate in my assessment of this guy. He's selfish and if it takes embarrassing the crap out of him to make him change, then I think you do it. Bench him. Send a message. Otherwise, this is not going to turn out well.

Waiting on Melo to change of his own volition becomes a game of fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. We're in phase 2. Do Phil and Fish let Melo get away with this kind of play? If they care about the future of the franchise, they better lay down the law soon.

I disagree about Melo coming into this season not ready to change. I think Melo was really close to going to Chicago. I think Phil presented his vision and Melo bought in. I also think Melo put in the work before camp both getting in shape to play the three and also working out and practicing the new offense with the young guys weeks before camp started. I do agree about him being a simple man. But I disagree about the outcome.

Getting ready physically has nothing to do with mental preparation

Nor does it have to do with how a player mentally sees his place in this game

Hence Phil bringing in mindfulness training

Splat gets it, Melo doesn't and neither do some fans

Totally disagree about the getting ready physically comment. If you are working on your game and conditioning how are you not preparing for the season. What type of mental preparation are you suggesting Melo and players participate in?

Mental preparation has to do with how he sees the game

How he can do different things in an unfamiliar system

Working on the parts of his game he's not good at

Studying film, exercising proper leadership

Taking in the examples of past time greats

Maybe spending quality time around guys like Clyde-Larry Johnson

etc etc///// He has to see the game from a different vista

In order to truly change

It's not about losing weight or working on bounce back dribble jumpers

In one offseason

Also he openly admitted he lost weight to extend his playing career

Motives weren't 100% pure nor TEAM oriented

Aah. Not sure that was very well defined. Guys go their separate ways in the offseason and do their own work. Some plays on the dream team or usa select. Are Clyde and LJ working out with guys? I know Hakeem is. Is it about who you work out with or who your trainer is when you train? Melo was working out with teammates several weeks before training camp and working on the triangle. I don't think he came late to those work outs. If they were going on prior to his being there they weren't talked about in the press. Seems like a Melo slam. He has his faults but this mental training that you speak of is not something separate from working on your game and conditioning that guys do in the off season that I am aware of. Nothing that you posted changes my opinion on this.

Actually it does make sense what I said

Like he mentioned he hadn't spent much time around

Phil the whole off-season, guess what he should have

Matter of fact 1 step further

Fisher mentioned Phil surprised by calling him up

To go pay an old friend a visit, That person was Tex Winters

It was a passing of the torch type of visit

Guess who else should have requested to to spend time with him and actually do it

Melo said Phil handed him the Triangle playbook and study it

Does it look he has

Instead he's on concert trying to be Digital Melo during the offseason

The fact he made the public comment he doesn't see himself

Winning the scoring title in this offense shows you how his mind works

He's full of mental fragility

Who did Phil spend time around? He was in Europe for his son's wedding and on the west coast. I get Melo criticism. But this mental training for players is a unique new way to criticize a guy that does train and prepare for the season and showed up several weeks before camp to work with his teammates on the new offense. What happened to your Clyde, LJ points? What guys are accessible that provide mental training that Melo did not reach out to?

He can hang around Clyde and talk to him about winning in New York

What approach did he take when Monroe was added to the team

I forgot to mention Reed, pick his brain too

Ask them how they led, showing up at gyms 3weeks before camp is not necessarily

Mental preparation, especially when Melo has probably done similar in seasons past

Ask elder contemporaries when he can improve on his game

Reading Phil's interview about how he thinks

Provided insight on mental preparations, players can do likewise

Does Clyde want to hang around with Knick players in the offseason? He summers in St. Croix. Not sure that Reed works with Knick players but in general the mental training seems like a reach. The only thing I agree with is asking elder contemporaries for help. But we saw a huge difference in the success of the team when those guys were present. Kidd, Sheed, Kurt and reportedly Camby had a big impact on the 12-13 team. I think Calderon is that guy for the Knicks. Casey raves about him.

Yeah he does

He commented on this last year

He said he'd be more than willing to help Shumpert

With his jumpshot and on defensive principles

He said he never ask players to use him as an outlet

But if they did he would be more than happy to help

Is that during the offseason or when he is working with the team? Also, is that the mental training that you were talking about?