Knicks · no matter what's happening now.... we're still on the right path to get better (page 2)

Envy, is it really necessary to tell people they don't know anything about basketball? Saying the point of the Triangle is to generate predominantly mid-range shots is not accurate at all and it is certainly not a clever way of validating this season's shot chart. Having a center who can pass and hit the mid-range is ideal in the system, because centers often float into that range anyway, but that's an aspect of their position more than the system itself.

I probably should have ignored that post when the poster mentioned the Knicks are playing better defense this year.

Splat wrote:Envy, is it really necessary to tell people they don't know anything about basketball? Saying the point of the Triangle is to generate predominantly mid-range shots is not accurate at all and it is certainly not a clever way of validating this season's shot chart. Having a center who can pass and hit the mid-range is ideal in the system, because centers often float into that range anyway, but that's an aspect of their position more than the system itself.

I didn't say the poster didn't know basketball. Just stated he knows not what he is talking about. Predominantly a post system that requires all the players to post up? Nonsense.

The triangle does require the post player to set up in the post position but it's not the only think the offense does. With the Lakers they played through Shaq. In Chicago who did they play through? Bill cartwright and luc longley? There's more than one way to run this thing.

You tell me not to talk about the stupid things you say but you guys can just go back and forth with the lies your limited basketball knowledge allows you to debate?

Btw, stop changing your screen names.

EnySpree wrote:

Splat wrote:Envy, is it really necessary to tell people they don't know anything about basketball? Saying the point of the Triangle is to generate predominantly mid-range shots is not accurate at all and it is certainly not a clever way of validating this season's shot chart. Having a center who can pass and hit the mid-range is ideal in the system, because centers often float into that range anyway, but that's an aspect of their position more than the system itself.

I didn't say the poster didn't know basketball. Just stated he knows not what he is talking about. Predominantly a post system that requires all the players to post up? Nonsense.

The triangle does require the post player to set up in the post position but it's not the only think the offense does. With the Lakers they played through Shaq. In Chicago who did they play through? Bill cartwright and luc longley? There's more than one way to run this thing.

You tell me not to talk about the stupid things you say but you guys can just go back and forth with the lies your limited basketball knowledge allows you to debate?

Btw, stop changing your screen names.

Well, my screen name certainly hasnt changed, my time here is what it is. but yes, the triangle does require a high number of post scores, who actually does it up to the talent. Jordan certainly posted up....as did his underling in Kobe. the Bulls thrived in the paint as did the Lakers. They werent primarily shooting jumpshots and thats where your assessment is off base. the lead guard barely shot at all, hell Ron Harper went from 20ppg to single didgits in Phil offense from the Bulls to the Lakers. The offense has always been between positions 2-5, with the lead guard at best as a corner man or cutter. All of the primary pieces on the Bulls and Lakers could make plays and post up, to disagree despite watching those games is quite concerning.

EnySpree wrote:

Splat wrote:Envy, is it really necessary to tell people they don't know anything about basketball? Saying the point of the Triangle is to generate predominantly mid-range shots is not accurate at all and it is certainly not a clever way of validating this season's shot chart. Having a center who can pass and hit the mid-range is ideal in the system, because centers often float into that range anyway, but that's an aspect of their position more than the system itself.

I didn't say the poster didn't know basketball. Just stated he knows not what he is talking about. Predominantly a post system that requires all the players to post up? Nonsense.

The triangle does require the post player to set up in the post position but it's not the only think the offense does. With the Lakers they played through Shaq. In Chicago who did they play through? Bill cartwright and luc longley? There's more than one way to run this thing.

You tell me not to talk about the stupid things you say but you guys can just go back and forth with the lies your limited basketball knowledge allows you to debate?

Btw, stop changing your screen names.

The bolded above is simply bizarre. No comment.

And are you going out of your way to prove you're a thug?

I say things people may find provocative, but they are my opinions. Here you are going after me in a completely ludicrous fashion. Now you're accusing me changing screen names. I didn't see you posting like a lunatic before, but in this thread you're really off your rocker.

You really are proving yourself to be incapable of just stating your case. I'm done with this.

Thug?

So I start a thread talking about we have nothing to worry about and we're on the right path and now I'm debating nonsense to two know it alls that don't no anything. That is alarming and what is wrong with the fan base.

I've always felt a person who calls someone else a know it all is knowledge challenged themselves. but if you feel I know nothing, yet are responding...what does that say about you?

EnySpree wrote:No need to panic yet.

6 games in so far.....we took it to Cleveland and Charlotte. Two playoff caliber teams.... not many teams are at their best. We're not at 100% regardless of whatever sarcastic jab you have for the team.

We need to get healthy to better gauge what we're dealing with.

we always could make a trade.... maybe Kobe or someone else.

If we start clicking, we make the playoffs. If we don't we get a lottery pick. We will have super cap space next year.

How are we in a bad situation? This is the best situation we've been in since the summer we got Sprewell and Camby.

Late reply...but agree 100%

knickscity wrote:I've always felt a person who calls someone else a know it all is knowledge challenged themselves. but if you feel I know nothing, yet are responding...what does that say about you?

That I'm a loser that likes to talk to imaginary people on the Internet in between scrolling through various specialty porn websites

Awesome assessment, I agree.

Call me negative but I think this roster will be turned over before we are good again. Fish said this team will need to be good defensively to compete and their D has only regressed. Nobody is guarding the ball well and everyone seems to be afraid to leave their man to help.

knickscity wrote:

EnySpree wrote:

knickscity wrote:

Splat wrote:

knickscity wrote:

Splat wrote:

dk7th wrote:as long as melo is here the triangle is in peril, and if the triangle is in peril then the knicks are going to remain a stunning mediocrity.

It will be interesting if mentions of the triangle coming out of Fish, Phil and MSG start to taper off and then disappear altogether when they finally concede they don't have the players for it. Not predicting this, but it feels like a possibility now.

They honestly havent run the triangle much at all this season. The elements we do see are basic elements of organized basketball.

Oh I agree. Bless Nixluva's optimistic soul, but he was insisting they've been running it. And I'm like um, barely

I kinda feel bad for him, even he knows this team sucks at this point, he's just banking on Calderon making things easier on offense. The issue with that is if the team is in fact running the triangle then the ball WONT be in calderon's hands exclusively.

The funny part is no one is really turning over the ball now, the assists are up and the ball movement certainly is there. They are losing because 1) they dont play a lick of team defense which involves helping and the majority arent playing good man defense. Then they take the bulk of their shots on the worst location of the floor...the midrange.

Funny part is the Knicks ate actually playing better defense this year and the triangle calls for most of the shots be taken mid range. You have no idea what you are talking about

Actually the triangle offense comes from the low post, the primary reason why they traded Chandler...he cant shoot or pass. If you actually believe the triangle is driven by the most inefficient shot in basketball you're clueless about the system.

It's nearly a requirment that all players on the floor have a post game in the triangle. It does give players the green light to play their natural games but the structure of scoring comes from near the basket not from the mid range.

That's an interesting statement. The triangle was created and had success in the NBA(through Phil) when the mid range shot was not really considered inefficient. It was also during a time when most player midrange game was excellent. Does it need a post presence, I think so.

yellowboy90 wrote:

knickscity wrote:

EnySpree wrote:

knickscity wrote:

Splat wrote:

knickscity wrote:

Splat wrote:

dk7th wrote:as long as melo is here the triangle is in peril, and if the triangle is in peril then the knicks are going to remain a stunning mediocrity.

It will be interesting if mentions of the triangle coming out of Fish, Phil and MSG start to taper off and then disappear altogether when they finally concede they don't have the players for it. Not predicting this, but it feels like a possibility now.

They honestly havent run the triangle much at all this season. The elements we do see are basic elements of organized basketball.

Oh I agree. Bless Nixluva's optimistic soul, but he was insisting they've been running it. And I'm like um, barely

I kinda feel bad for him, even he knows this team sucks at this point, he's just banking on Calderon making things easier on offense. The issue with that is if the team is in fact running the triangle then the ball WONT be in calderon's hands exclusively.

The funny part is no one is really turning over the ball now, the assists are up and the ball movement certainly is there. They are losing because 1) they dont play a lick of team defense which involves helping and the majority arent playing good man defense. Then they take the bulk of their shots on the worst location of the floor...the midrange.

Funny part is the Knicks ate actually playing better defense this year and the triangle calls for most of the shots be taken mid range. You have no idea what you are talking about

Actually the triangle offense comes from the low post, the primary reason why they traded Chandler...he cant shoot or pass. If you actually believe the triangle is driven by the most inefficient shot in basketball you're clueless about the system.

It's nearly a requirment that all players on the floor have a post game in the triangle. It does give players the green light to play their natural games but the structure of scoring comes from near the basket not from the mid range.

That's an interesting statement. The triangle was created and had success in the NBA(through Phil) when the mid range shot was not really considered inefficient. It was also during a time when most player midrange game was excellent. Does it need a post presence, I think so.

Not really though. Phil's best players everywhere he's coached could post up and attacked the rim. The mid range was not the primary shot.

Don't know what happened in that 2nd half, but the first half was beautiful basketball.

They show flashes of very good and very bad which is to be expected. Getting Calderon back will help a lot.

tj23 wrote:Call me negative but I think this roster will be turned over before we are good again. Fish said this team will need to be good defensively to compete and their D has only regressed. Nobody is guarding the ball well and everyone seems to be afraid to leave their man to help.

The roster practically naturally turns itself over this summer

Were you stating this as if Phil is on the verge

Of flipping this burnt french toast roster in the skillet

To pouring some buttermilk pancakes to golden brown finish by February

Or were you implying Phil works his wizardry by watching the paint dry

F500ONE wrote:

tj23 wrote:Call me negative but I think this roster will be turned over before we are good again. Fish said this team will need to be good defensively to compete and their D has only regressed. Nobody is guarding the ball well and everyone seems to be afraid to leave their man to help.

The roster practically naturally turns itself over this summer

Were you stating this as if Phil is on the verge

Of flipping this burnt french toast roster in the skillet

To pouring some buttermilk pancakes to golden brown finish by February

Or were you implying Phil works his wizardry by watching the paint dry

Dammit man now I gotta run to the Diner and get some French toast on thick egg challah!!

Some maple syrup, powdered sugar and butter!!