Knicks · Isola knick Waiters rumor (page 1)

Isola reports the current rumor is Shumpert and Dalembert for waiters. Sam works straight up for Waiters. If Shumpert is in the deal I think the Knicks have to take Hayward back. I think I would do it for Waiters. Sam for Waiters is a no brainer in my opinion.

Dalembert for Waiters is basically swapping crap.
We shouldn't be including Shumpert

Serious question. Is Waiters even good? Like, at all? He certainly hasn't done anything of not his first two seasons and he's been brutal this year. Last season he shot 45% on 2fg and 36% on 3fg. And his advanced stats are atrocious. His career high in WS/48 is 0.037 and his WS/48 this season is -0.024. His career high in ORating is 99. His career high in TS% is 50% and is currently 42%. His career high eFG% is 47% and is currently 39%. And he's making a guaranteed $5M+ next season so it eats into more of our cap space.

Moar Stoopid players the better!

JR needs a playmate.

VCoug wrote:Serious question. Is Waiters even good? Like, at all? He certainly hasn't done anything of not his first two seasons and he's been brutal this year. Last season he shot 45% on 2fg and 36% on 3fg. And his advanced stats are atrocious. His career high in WS/48 is 0.037 and his WS/48 this season is -0.024. His career high in ORating is 99. His career high in TS% is 50% and is currently 42%. His career high eFG% is 47% and is currently 39%. And he's making a guaranteed $5M+ next season so it eats into more of our cap space.

I think Waiters is incredibly talented. He has a very strained relationship with Irving and appears to be a bit of a headcase but the talent is there. I think he could be a very good player in a new environment. I also think the Knicks have nothing to lose and would be upgrading their talent.

Bonn1997 wrote:Dalembert for Waiters is basically swapping crap.
We shouldn't be including Shumpert

Trade checker works with Sam for Dion. Adding Shump means the Knicks have take salary back. I do think the Cavs could get more for Waiters unless they are trying to just dump him.
On a side note, I think Dalembert is going to be moved. He has a very tradable contract.

Like it. He'd be our best penetrator, something it seems we lack...

skeng wrote:Like it. He'd be our best penetrator, something it seems we lack...

I agree. He can also play the point.

Hold on a second. I was joking, but not really.

Doesn't he have a reputation as being kind of dumb? Does this not concern anyone?

Dumb plus bad-tempered in NYC as a Knick hardly sounds like a recipe for flourishing. We're not the Indiana Pacers who can rehab Lance.

Just asking. Sounds like a potential gain asset-wise, but hardly a character builder or necessarily a team building type of player.

I'm sold and Waiters is Anti my fan principle

But I can no longer put up with this trash

MIN	FGM-FGA	 FG%	3PM-3PA	 3P%	FTM-FTA	 FT%	REB	AST	BLK	STL	PF	TO	PTS

17	2-7	.286	0-1	.000	0-0	.000	2	1	0	2	1	0	4
25	0-4	.000	0-2	.000	0-0	.000	6	4	0	2	3	1	0
23	4-11	.364	1-4	.250	0-0	.000	1	2	0	1	3	2	9
25	3-13	.231	0-3	.000	0-0	.000	3	1	0	2	4	2	6
21	3-9	.333	0-4	.000	1-2	.500	0	1	1	0	3	2	7
29	4-11	.364	1-3	.333	1-1	1.000	3	4	0	2	4	1	10
30	2-10	.200	0-4	.000	3-4	.750	6	5	0	1	5	2	7
32	3-7	.429	0-3	.000	1-3	.333	2	3	0	4	2	2	7
28	1-11	.091	1-2	.500	0-0	.000	4	1	0	1	4	4	3

I also like the dynamic of Waiters

And THJR playing on the same team juicing each other up

But if this isn't some made up rumor and is possible

This is as risky as it gets, we add $5mil more of salary

Which is a pro and con as we get another yr to review Waiters

No risk to lose him next year but eats into cap

Either New York makes or breaks Waiters

Here's Isola's take:

WE’RE WAIT-ING

Dion Waiters has been linked to the Knicks for two seasons now and the latest proposal being talked about is the Cavs guard being dealt for Shumpert and Samuel Dalembert. However, a Knicks source says the deal “makes no sense for us.”

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basket...

Splat wrote:Hold on a second. I was joking, but not really.

Doesn't he have a reputation as being kind of dumb? Does this not concern anyone?

Dumb plus bad-tempered in NYC as a Knick hardly sounds like a recipe for flourishing. We're not the Indiana Pacers who can rehab Lance.

Just asking. Sounds like a potential gain asset-wise, but hardly a character builder or necessarily a team building type of player.

I believe he has the rep of wanting the ball and then wanting to shoot. Do we really need more guys like that?

I like his talent but his head isn't right. How many times have we as knicks fans talked outrselves into taking on others teams headcases?

Waiters has a bit too much JR in him for my taste and there is only one ball.

But hey maybe waiters will be the headcases who finally pans out.

PS- For a supposed shooter, his advanced shooting stars are horrid.

CrushAlot wrote:Here's Isola's take:

WE’RE WAIT-ING

Dion Waiters has been linked to the Knicks for two seasons now and the latest proposal being talked about is the Cavs guard being dealt for Shumpert and Samuel Dalembert. However, a Knicks source says the deal “makes no sense for us.”

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basket...

Who is this source, if this source is Phil

I'm telling you this year may drag on longer then we'd prefer

There isn't a move we can make

If we can't make this move

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Here's Isola's take:

WE’RE WAIT-ING

Dion Waiters has been linked to the Knicks for two seasons now and the latest proposal being talked about is the Cavs guard being dealt for Shumpert and Samuel Dalembert. However, a Knicks source says the deal “makes no sense for us.”

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basket...

Who is this source, if this source is Phil

I'm telling you this year may drag on longer then we'd prefer

There isn't a move we can make

If we can't make this move

I don't know that Isola has a source that is actually reputable. Checking most of the Waiters rumors and it seems like they are trying to package him with Tristan to get a bit more than what the Knicks have to offer. If the Knicks can get Waiters for Dalembert and Shump they need to do it.

This maybe the original source of speculation. Saw that Herring linked to an article that referenced this. Isola's source may just be a fan blog.
http://hoopshabit.com/2014/11/24/clevela...

But where? How? And what do the Cavaliers need to look for?

Two things: a defensive center and a defensive wing that can hit three-pointers, the latter often being affectionately referred to as a 3-And-D player.

It’s more difficult for the Cavs to make a trade than it seems though. Most of their intriguing pieces are signed to deals that make them un-tradable. That leaves very few options, especially after the most recent deal that Anderson Varejao signed.

But here’s one that may pique some interest:
•New York Knicks receive ◦Tristan Thompson
◦Dion Waiters
◦2015 1st round pick (via Miami)

•Cleveland Cavaliers receive ◦Samuel Dalembert
◦Iman Shumpert
◦Arnett Moultrie

Now give this a few moments to sink in.

Why it’s good for New York:
•Thompson is a good rebounder who’s better than that injury-ridden Italian they still have on the roster
•Both guys they’d be getting are young (23 and 22 respectively)
•A starting lineup of Amar’e Stoudemire, Thompson, Carmelo Anthony, J.R. Smith and Jose Calderon could be fun
•They won’t be a lot worse defensively
•Their record is 4-10, they might like to explore options
•THEY’D GET A DRAFT PICK!!!
•Dalembert is 33 years old
•Gets rid of Moultrie’s contract

Why it’s good for Cleveland:
•They get a good defensive wing in Shumpert
•Opponents have only scored 40.4 percent of the time when being defended by Dalembert at the rim
•No more antics from Waiters
•They’d be closer to winning now
•This would push them to immediate favorites in the East
•LeBron would be happy
•Blatt could stagger the Big Three’s minutes more
•Rotations would likely be cemented quicker
•A starting lineup of Dalembert, Love, James, Shumpert and Irving would be fun
•Anderson Varejao gets more rest

In a perfect world, this is the sort of thing that would go down. And if things don’t get better over the coming months, then perhaps it will. But until then, it’s difficult to say for certain what this team will become with the way it is.

This is just one option, Cavs. But if you want things like this to stop, then maybe you should consider it.

Next: NBA: 50 Greatest Players Of All Time
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sure ... lets go get one of the worst players in the league because we think we see talent.

mreinman wrote:sure ... lets go get one of the worst players in the league because we think we see talent.

He is very talented. He played on the usa select team this past summer. He is a bit of a head case but he is also young and comes at a very low cost. I think you have to hope he figures things out and benefits from a new situation/environment.

I've got mixed emotions. I think Waiters has star potential for a team where he can be a significant member of the offense. At this rate, we are going to lose Shumpert for nothing so I much rather have Waiters on a cost-controlled deal. However, I think that Reggie Jackson will be imminently available when Russell Westbrook gets his conditioning back. And right now, I think that Jackson can be a better system player for us long-term AND the move would allow us to add multiple contracts during the offseason before using his Bird Right's to re-sign him.

The only way I'd balk on a Shumpert for Jackson deal is if we managed to dump JR Smith in the process (to CLE). That would create another, small trade exception and alleviate us of JR's contract a year early.

CrushAlot wrote:

mreinman wrote:sure ... lets go get one of the worst players in the league because we think we see talent.

He is very talented. He played on the usa select team this past summer. He is a bit of a head case but he is also young and comes at a very low cost. I think you have to hope he figures things out and benefits from a new situation/environment.

he makes 3.5 million, no?

he is worth the minimum.

mreinman wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

mreinman wrote:sure ... lets go get one of the worst players in the league because we think we see talent.

He is very talented. He played on the usa select team this past summer. He is a bit of a head case but he is also young and comes at a very low cost. I think you have to hope he figures things out and benefits from a new situation/environment.

he makes 3.5 million, no?

he is worth the minimum.

I think he makes 4 mil. But he is a very young, talented player. The Knicks are not going to have Shump or dalembert back. If they can get a talented but flawed player on a rookie deal I think they have to consider it. Waiters is a very dynamic offensive player already.

mreinman wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

mreinman wrote:sure ... lets go get one of the worst players in the league because we think we see talent.

He is very talented. He played on the usa select team this past summer. He is a bit of a head case but he is also young and comes at a very low cost. I think you have to hope he figures things out and benefits from a new situation/environment.

he makes 3.5 million, no?

he is worth the minimum.

$4M this season, $5.1M next season, and a $6.7M QO the year after.