Knicks · Highlights of Jahill Okafor vs Toledo 2 nights ago (page 2)

No, at 19 years old he won't ever fill out either.
He won't grow.
He won't work on his game.

ACC season is starts so the next 6 weeks we can see how he does in the conference and hits the wall of exhaustion.

The midrange shot and smoothness is what I saw and got me excited.

I think the notion of "Trade him to win now......" as if this is all about Melo and ony melo is wrong.
Think of Melo as not the center piece, but as a role player to build with. When Melo is 35, then what?
DOes phil just leave? Or is there a culture in place? I think when Pop retires his legacy and culture can continue.

Towns is still my guy

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:I think people are wrong about Okafor. His base is so strong that he's not going to have as much trouble scoring inside as some think. He's also quick footed and agile and knows how to use his length at a high level already. He's only going to get stronger and has really gotten stronger since his high school to 1st year in college. I like guys with a strong base and low center of gravity like Okafor has. He's going to be able to move and bang with no problems cuz he's going to be lower and stronger than a lot of taller and thinner guys. Tyson Chandler will get moved quite easily by a strong kid like Okafor. If he can mix in a mid range game he will be unstoppable.

Okafor seems to have already figured out how to score against bigger guys. He keeps the defender at length and his moves are so quick and cover so much ground. Then he has those big hands and total ball control and uses those long arms to finish outside the reach of his defender. Teams will end up fouling him more than stopping his moves. I think this is the perfect offense for Okafor. He can post and pass out of it and if Phil can surround him with shooters he should be quite effective. I admit that his weight and lack of hops does concern me a bit, but Duncan almost never jumps and he's great. It's not all about being able to jump thru the roof.

You don't even predict anymore. You just prophesize.

So you don't use any kind of scouting on a players attributes to predict what he should do on the next level? We don't know if we will end up with this kid but his game is self evident already. He's built like an offensive lineman. But with long arms and big hands. He's skilled, quick and agile but takes up tons of space. So it's not that hard to predict what he should be able to do.

Lots of players have learned how to play below the rim and be successful. Skill and brains over dump raw athletic ability.

knickscity wrote:He wont be scoring like that against NBA competition. And I doubt Phil does the wait game anyway. If he drafts Okafor he's gonna trade him for some help to win now.

Why do you think Phil is going to trade whoever we draft? I'm not saying that you're wrong, but I get the impression that Phil likes younger players that don't have well established bad habits and will be easier to mold. Plus Okafor (Kart Anthony Towns as well)passing ability and post game seem like the exact type of big man that would thrive in the triangle.

KEEPCAMBYNY wrote:

knickscity wrote:He wont be scoring like that against NBA competition. And I doubt Phil does the wait game anyway. If he drafts Okafor he's gonna trade him for some help to win now.

Why do you think Phil is going to trade whoever we draft? I'm not saying that you're wrong, but I get the impression that Phil likes younger players that don't have well established bad habits and will be easier to mold. Plus Okafor (Kart Anthony Towns as well)passing ability and post game seem like the exact type of big man that would thrive in the triangle.

Not to mention that we have cap space!!! There's no need to trade anyone in order to help the team "win now." Phil doesn't have to get it all done in one summer. He's not under any specific pressure to build a contender in one shot. I think he's got to know that it's going to be a process and not a quick fix. If the Knicks can land a stud in this draft that would go a long way towards changing the fortunes of the team going forward.

This gives other views of how much Okafor does play above the rim.

I like that he uses his quickness and not just getting by on brute force because he would not be able to translate that on the next level. What I would like to see more is defensive quickness when hedging on screens and becoming a better overall defender.

yellowboy90 wrote:I like that he uses his quickness and not just getting by on brute force because he would not be able to translate that on the next level. What I would like to see more is defensive quickness when hedging on screens and becoming a better overall defender.

Yeah he has more developing to do in his overall game, but he's already pretty developed at his young age. The word that comes to mind is that Okafor is FLUID. He has so much smoothness to his movement. He not wasting energy. He's light on his feet despite his weight. We can only hope that we can get rewarded for this awful season with being able to draft this kid. IMO it would make it all worth it.

holfresh wrote:

nixluva wrote:I think people are wrong about Okafor. His base is so strong that he's not going to have as much trouble scoring inside as some think. He's also quick footed and agile and knows how to use his length at a high level already. He's only going to get stronger and has really gotten stronger since his high school to 1st year in college. I like guys with a strong base and low center of gravity like Okafor has. He's going to be able to move and bang with no problems cuz he's going to be lower and stronger than a lot of taller and thinner guys. Tyson Chandler will get moved quite easily by a strong kid like Okafor. If he can mix in a mid range game he will be unstoppable.

Okafor seems to have already figured out how to score against bigger guys. He keeps the defender at length and his moves are so quick and cover so much ground. Then he has those big hands and total ball control and uses those long arms to finish outside the reach of his defender. Teams will end up fouling him more than stopping his moves. I think this is the perfect offense for Okafor. He can post and pass out of it and if Phil can surround him with shooters he should be quite effective. I admit that his weight and lack of hops does concern me a bit, but Duncan almost never jumps and he's great. It's not all about being able to jump thru the roof.

Duncan never jumps???..Check out Tim in college..

Ho-ly-Shit. I never saw Tim in college. His game was beautiful. I need to look up more gametape of him.

BRIGGS wrote:This gives other views of how much Okafor does play above the rim.

Do you think we could entice Hakeem Olajuwon to come to the Knicks and be a big man coach (if we draft Okafor)?

Duncan isn't jumping any higher than Okafor in his video!!! As he's gotten older Duncan most certainly doesn't jump a lot so I fail to see the point of showing his college videos. Dude just isn't a high flyer, but anyone that big is gonna dunk the ball when they can. The point still remains that Okafor has a lot in common with a guy like Duncan or a Greg Monroe. Guys who get it done without having to dunk everything. They have skills and agility and just enough athletic ability to get it done.

You mean Demarcus Cousins not Greg Monroe right? Monroe is not that good

gunsnewing wrote:You mean Demarcus Cousins not Greg Monroe right? Monroe is not that good

Well we can ignore Greg Monroe, but I mean more in terms of style of play. Yes Cousins is a good idea. Let's go with that.

How was Greg Monroe in college? He has been a disappointed after a promising rookie year. Seems like doesn't impose his will on the game. Doesn;t excel at anything. Is kind of just there

KEEPCAMBYNY wrote:

knickscity wrote:He wont be scoring like that against NBA competition. And I doubt Phil does the wait game anyway. If he drafts Okafor he's gonna trade him for some help to win now.

Why do you think Phil is going to trade whoever we draft? I'm not saying that you're wrong, but I get the impression that Phil likes younger players that don't have well established bad habits and will be easier to mold. Plus Okafor (Kart Anthony Towns as well)passing ability and post game seem like the exact type of big man that would thrive in the triangle.

It would make no sense. You would be trading a player who may be able to produce while on a rookie scale contract. For example Damion Lillard is earning only 3.3mil this season. Trading the pick for a proven player would eat up cap space that you would be able to use on another player unless he is also on a rookie scale contract.

Trading the pick would put him in the line of fire. Nobody will question him for keeping the draft pick. Also Phil has no history of doing such things. He has always played and developed young players throughout his coaching career.

If we were to trade Okafor though it better at least be to dump Calderon &/or Smiths contract, add one proven player, and a couple future assets. Like a deal with the Suns for the bank.

I don't have the super high expectations others do but I'd still love to get this guy. I wish we would trade Melo and do some serious rebuilding but I might change my mind about one thing: even if we're keeping Melo I still want to keep the pick. We'd just have to make it through those 4 remaining years of his contract and then there would be better possibilities.

Bonn1997 wrote:I don't have the super high expectations others do but I'd still love to get this guy. I wish we would trade Melo and do some serious rebuilding but I might change my mind about one thing: even if we're keeping Melo I still want to keep the pick. We'd just have to make it through those 4 remaining years of his contract and then there would be better possibilities.

Yup it really isn't that bad unless we give Melo another 5yr max contract which would not surprise me

gunsnewing wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:I don't have the super high expectations others do but I'd still love to get this guy. I wish we would trade Melo and do some serious rebuilding but I might change my mind about one thing: even if we're keeping Melo I still want to keep the pick. We'd just have to make it through those 4 remaining years of his contract and then there would be better possibilities.

Yup it really isn't that bad unless we give Melo another 5yr max contract which would not surprise me

IMO it just takes the pressure off Okafor in his early years. He won't be all alone on the team and trying to carry a team. Not to mention but Phil should be able to get even more front line help with the cap space he has. Imagine If he could add another pick as well and you basically are doing a rebuild but just with a good player already on board. We could be looking at a lot of younger players next year. It depends on who Phil targets.

Free Agents - Reggie Jackson, Brandon Knight, Tobias Harris, Tristan Thompson, Cory Joseph, Khris Middleton, Thomas Robinson?
Draft pick - Okafor, Towns, Mudiay?
Shumpert?
Hardaway
Early
Thanasis
Larkin
Wear
Acy
Galloway
Aldrich

nixluva wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:I don't have the super high expectations others do but I'd still love to get this guy. I wish we would trade Melo and do some serious rebuilding but I might change my mind about one thing: even if we're keeping Melo I still want to keep the pick. We'd just have to make it through those 4 remaining years of his contract and then there would be better possibilities.

Yup it really isn't that bad unless we give Melo another 5yr max contract which would not surprise me

IMO it just takes the pressure off Okafor in his early years. He won't be all alone on the team and trying to carry a team. Not to mention but Phil should be able to get even more front line help with the cap space he has. Imagine If he could add another pick as well and you basically are doing a rebuild but just with a good player already on board. We could be looking at a lot of younger players next year. It depends on who Phil targets.

Free Agents - Reggie Jackson, Brandon Knight, Tobias Harris, Tristan Thompson, Cory Joseph, Khris Middleton, Thomas Robinson?
Draft pick - Okafor, Towns, Mudiay?
Shumpert?
Hardaway
Early
Thanasis
Larkin
Wear
Acy
Galloway
Aldrich

If we're a .150 team right now, that leaves a lot of weight for the draft pick and FAs to carry.

We are .150? That seems high

Bonn1997 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:I don't have the super high expectations others do but I'd still love to get this guy. I wish we would trade Melo and do some serious rebuilding but I might change my mind about one thing: even if we're keeping Melo I still want to keep the pick. We'd just have to make it through those 4 remaining years of his contract and then there would be better possibilities.

Yup it really isn't that bad unless we give Melo another 5yr max contract which would not surprise me

IMO it just takes the pressure off Okafor in his early years. He won't be all alone on the team and trying to carry a team. Not to mention but Phil should be able to get even more front line help with the cap space he has. Imagine If he could add another pick as well and you basically are doing a rebuild but just with a good player already on board. We could be looking at a lot of younger players next year. It depends on who Phil targets.

Free Agents - Reggie Jackson, Brandon Knight, Tobias Harris, Tristan Thompson, Cory Joseph, Khris Middleton, Thomas Robinson?
Draft pick - Okafor, Towns, Mudiay?
Shumpert?
Hardaway
Early
Thanasis
Larkin
Wear
Acy
Galloway
Aldrich

If we're a .150 team right now, that leaves a lot of weight for the draft pick and FAs to carry.

At least some of this sad record is due to really poor health from our key players in addition to the lack of talent, poor fit for the system and a rookie Head Coach. It's really a perfect storm of factors and not just one thing that has led to this .143 team. In terms of how the pressure would be distributed it would be lessened by the presence of Melo who would remain the guy with the most pressure on him. If all the scoring was on our draft pick and young FA's I think it would be a much tougher haul for them. In any event i'd think we'd much rather have that problem with a younger team that has talent and future in development, than what we have now.

Who knows maybe Melo will not want to be part of such a young group and be willing to accept a trade. I can only good things resulting from this bad season. The hands are being forced to a nearly full rebuild.