EnySpree wrote:Why is this being called an excellent post by some of you? It's excellent to say we're doomed to be horrible for another decade?
This is sports not the 9/11... this is not the sports equivalent to building the freedom towers. This is not the earthquakes in haiti. It's sports.
We draft well, Melo comes back ready to go, we sign some legit nba players and motherfucker we are back just like that. Stop swimming in misery you negative Nancy's. You can't bring positivity through negativity
its not being negative its being honest. Its not like we enjoy being critical but the knicks kind of put themselves in this position with terrible decisions. Granted getting a lottery pick is good BUT the draft is a crapshoot even though im a big believer in the draft. Cap space is good BUT doesnt guaranteed anything. Remember in 2010 we were in the same spot and missed out
^Right the last 15yrs have been miserable as a Knick fan. No one is revelling in the misery. Fortunately I'm also a huge Giants, Yankees & Rangers fan but the Knicks are still my #1 team and the team I want to see win the most. Unfortunately we have one of the worst owners in sports history.
EnySpree - enough with the hyperbole. No one equated sports with world changing events like 9/11. What we Knicks fans are (down by law since 1967) is PASSIONATE. We are passionate, win or lose. This is not a plea to mutiny or jump ship... It is reality.
One cannot take inventory of the executive decisions, and witness former Knicks playing well throughout the league, and avoid the obvious. Something is very wrong here. Something is very, VERY wrong. We are mutants.
If you follow sports, NBA basketball in particular, just think of the Fred Carter 76ers for context. That is where we are. Can a miracle happen? Of course. That is why we watch.
The reality is that certifiable miracles, like going from worst to first, are rare, and require the planets aligning, the Hudson River parting and the Subways ALL running on schedule for a solid month.
gunsnewing wrote:^Right the last 15yrs have been miserable as a Knick fan. No one is rebelling in the misery. Fortunately I'm also a big Giants, Yankees & Rangers fan but the Knicks are still my #1 team and the team I want to see win the most. Unfortunately we have one of the worst owners in sports history.
exactly. Im a big sports fan and the knicks are my top favorite team. However i dont bullshit about how bad things are. I want them to win so badly but there is a good possibility it wont. Unfortunetly we live in the real world and not everything is sunshine and rainbows lol
I've been a little critical of Phil's(Mills, whatever) dealings recently but it as clear as day Dolan was and continues to be the underlying problem
gunsnewing wrote:I've been a little critical of Phil's(Mills, whatever) dealings recently but it as clear as day Dolan was and continues to be the underlying problem
i actually like phil. He came into a mess. Obviously he didnt resign jr smith and trade for bargnani. His only mistake was taking calderon and not getting a first rounder for tyson. I agree dolan will never give him full control since we know dolan is in charge of melo decisions
Did somebody say continuity?
Mozgov, Shump and JR, ALL contributing in Cleveland
Zach Randolph an All Star in Memphis.
Tyson, Felton now Stoudemire, in Dallas.
David Lee in Golden State, Lin in Los Angeles.
Wilson Chandler in Denver and... Jamal Crawford somewhere else, did I miss anyone?
misterearl wrote:Did somebody say continuity?Mozgov, Shump and JR, ALL contributing in Cleveland
Zach Randolph an All Star in Memphis.
Tyson, Felton now Stoudemire, in Dallas.
David Lee in Golden State, Lin in Los Angeles.
Wilson Chandler in Denver and... Jamal Crawford somewhere else, did I miss anyone?
trevor ariza has had good years too
VCoug wrote:EnySpree wrote:Why is this being called an excellent post by some of you? It's excellent to say we're doomed to be horrible for another decade?
This is sports not the 9/11... this is not the sports equivalent to building the freedom towers. This is not the earthquakes in haiti. It's sports.
We draft well, Melo comes back ready to go, we sign some legit nba players and motherfucker we are back just like that. Stop swimming in misery you negative Nancy's. You can't bring positivity through negativity
False. -1 * -1 = +1
i think some confuse negativity with just being honest
This is exactly what we all deserve...Woodson was winning here...He went 18-6 then won 54 games...This board was in uproar against Woodson after losing to Indiana in the second round..A team we should have lost to, by the way...He got zero fan and media support...Most here wanted him fired and you got it...Dolan listen to you, he beckoned your call...Exactly one month and half into his third season he was cut off at the knees...The Org was handed over to Phil and you cheered...Now we press on with the triangle and Fish at all cost...Eat it up..Don't complain please..
Right now, there isn't a plan..Seat of the pants GMing...If this don't work, lets make a trade...I sure hope Phil can pull out a miracle and land Aldridge in the off-season...Because next season will be long and there will be paper bags and chants in the Garden...
BRIGGS wrote:Vmart wrote:Has Dolan really ruined anything he needs a winner as badly as we do for him it's money in the pockets for us it a good nights sleep. Instead of blaming Dolan lets see what he has tried to do to win. He brought in Isiah which at the time people liked, then he brought, Larry Brown which at the time people liked, he brought in Amare which at the time looked like a great move. He brought in Melo which most liked, so you have an owner trying to do his best but everything seems to back fire on him. His last move was to bring Phil Jackson which most people like to top it off he is out of the picture and gave the keys to Phil which everyone seems to like. I always said you want an owner like Dolan who spends money, I just think the people around him haven't managed his deep pockets to well. Phil gets it you can see the plan taking place top pick to go with cap space, the Knicks will be relevant very quickly. Then we can thank Dolan for bringing in Phil Jackson. This is a very tough market to play in the media is harsh here and they look for any angle to take shots at the Knicks. You know and I know that the media here plays a huge role and sometime they scare good players away. To me the biggest culprit is the media they are the toughest team in town they damage the Knicks much harder than anyone.
As fans we need to realize also that this year is a major step in the right direction for this franchise and we need to let what is happening happen for the good. The Media wants to stir the fan base, with their useless stories. Fans need to be wise to it.
Vmart like dolan stepping into thecarmelo trade and giving denver carte blanche over all of our assets? How about saying no to giving toronto an unrestricted pick for bargs? At the end of the day yhe owner needs to have a say right? But dolans say has been brutal for the knicks on a side note why doesn't dolan give tix holders back someloot.
If you had hired so called experts, to tell you what move needs to be done and how they plan on doing it. Whether it's throwing In a extra pick or whatever and they f' up a trade you blame the owner. No it doesn't work like that that f' up was Grunwald's not Dolan's.
As for Denver trade I know what he was thinking, he was thinking I got Amare all I need now is Melo to complete this superstar tandem. There was a lot of pressure from the media and the fans to get Melo here ASAP. We gave up a lot I agree but in hind sight was it really that bad? Most of what was involved has either regressed or not panned out.
Like that Sixer GM said your not going to hit a home run every time. He rolled the dice on the Melo deal it wasn't so bad. We weren't going to go to far anyways after Amare threw out his back.
holfresh wrote:This is exactly what we all deserve...Woodson was winning here...He went 18-6 then won 54 games...This board was in uproar against Woodson after losing to Indiana in the second round..A team we should have lost to, by the way...He got zero fan and media support...Most here wanted him fired and you got it...Dolan listen to you, he beckoned your call...Exactly one month and half into his third season he was cut off at the knees...The Org was handed over to Phil and you cheered...Now we press on with the triangle and Fish at all cost...Eat it up..Don't complain please..
Right now, there isn't a plan..Seat of the pants GMing...If this don't work, lets make a trade...I sure hope Phil can pull out a miracle and land Aldridge in the off-season...Because next season will be long and there will be paper bags and chants in the Garden...
also we dont have our pick next year thanks to the bargnani trade. Basically we need to draft one of okafor towns or russell, then we gotta hit a homerun in free agency. Its easier said then done
Vmart wrote:BRIGGS wrote:Vmart wrote:Has Dolan really ruined anything he needs a winner as badly as we do for him it's money in the pockets for us it a good nights sleep. Instead of blaming Dolan lets see what he has tried to do to win. He brought in Isiah which at the time people liked, then he brought, Larry Brown which at the time people liked, he brought in Amare which at the time looked like a great move. He brought in Melo which most liked, so you have an owner trying to do his best but everything seems to back fire on him. His last move was to bring Phil Jackson which most people like to top it off he is out of the picture and gave the keys to Phil which everyone seems to like. I always said you want an owner like Dolan who spends money, I just think the people around him haven't managed his deep pockets to well. Phil gets it you can see the plan taking place top pick to go with cap space, the Knicks will be relevant very quickly. Then we can thank Dolan for bringing in Phil Jackson. This is a very tough market to play in the media is harsh here and they look for any angle to take shots at the Knicks. You know and I know that the media here plays a huge role and sometime they scare good players away. To me the biggest culprit is the media they are the toughest team in town they damage the Knicks much harder than anyone.
As fans we need to realize also that this year is a major step in the right direction for this franchise and we need to let what is happening happen for the good. The Media wants to stir the fan base, with their useless stories. Fans need to be wise to it.
Vmart like dolan stepping into thecarmelo trade and giving denver carte blanche over all of our assets? How about saying no to giving toronto an unrestricted pick for bargs? At the end of the day yhe owner needs to have a say right? But dolans say has been brutal for the knicks on a side note why doesn't dolan give tix holders back someloot.
If you had hired so called experts, to tell you what move needs to be done and how they plan on doing it. Whether it's throwing In a extra pick or whatever and they f' up a trade you blame the owner. No it doesn't work like that that f' up was Grunwald's not Dolan's.
As for Denver trade I know what he was thinking, he was thinking I got Amare all I need now is Melo to complete this superstar tandem. There was a lot of pressure from the media and the fans to get Melo here ASAP. We gave up a lot I agree but in hind sight was it really that bad? Most of what was involved has either regressed or not panned out.
Like that Sixer GM said your not going to hit a home run every time. He rolled the dice on the Melo deal it wasn't so bad. We weren't going to go to far anyways after Amare threw out his back.
you are a rare breed, a fan that actually praises dolan. Im not sure i should laugh or cry
Vmart wrote:Has Dolan really ruined anything he needs a winner as badly as we do for him it's money in the pockets for us it a good nights sleep. Instead of blaming Dolan lets see what he has tried to do to win. He brought in Isiah which at the time people liked, then he brought, Larry Brown which at the time people liked, he brought in Amare which at the time looked like a great move. He brought in Melo which most liked, so you have an owner trying to do his best but everything seems to back fire on him. His last move was to bring Phil Jackson which most people like to top it off he is out of the picture and gave the keys to Phil which everyone seems to like. I always said you want an owner like Dolan who spends money, I just think the people around him haven't managed his deep pockets to well. Phil gets it you can see the plan taking place top pick to go with cap space, the Knicks will be relevant very quickly. Then we can thank Dolan for bringing in Phil Jackson. This is a very tough market to play in the media is harsh here and they look for any angle to take shots at the Knicks. You know and I know that the media here plays a huge role and sometime they scare good players away. To me the biggest culprit is the media they are the toughest team in town they damage the Knicks much harder than anyone.
As fans we need to realize also that this year is a major step in the right direction for this franchise and we need to let what is happening happen for the good. The Media wants to stir the fan base, with their useless stories. Fans need to be wise to it.
I really have a problem with the print media covering this team. They seem vindictive and eager to portray the team in the worst light possible. They do not recognize the Knicks losses as a tanked season, they see it as "atrocious". Our failure to give away more draft picks for RFAs at the trade deadline is characterized as Jackson being outwitted and outmaneuvered. I don't want to seem like a revisionist historian here, but although I had hope for the Knicks this season, it was always the best move for us to tank this season since we have our pick and had little hope of competing against the powerhouses THIS year. Honestly, I have stopped reading Berman and Isola outright. F--- them, go cover the Islanders. We need some writers that are fans too. Jackson has made good decisions IMO. Ones that I support. Not having the assets to make the deals for RFAs at the deadline is not his fault, its a characteristic of an organization that has mortgaged its future to try and appease the masses (stirred by the media) in the present.
I am pro-zenmaster too... and I will be pro whoever his successor is whenever he gets sick of the medias BS. But I hope PJ is the guy to take this team to the holy land. He really brought a ray of hope to this team -- even if we have to tank this year to put ourselves in the best position to win in the future.
StarksEwing1 wrote:EnySpree wrote:Why is this being called an excellent post by some of you? It's excellent to say we're doomed to be horrible for another decade?
This is sports not the 9/11... this is not the sports equivalent to building the freedom towers. This is not the earthquakes in haiti. It's sports.
We draft well, Melo comes back ready to go, we sign some legit nba players and motherfucker we are back just like that. Stop swimming in misery you negative Nancy's. You can't bring positivity through negativity
its not being negative its being honest. Its not like we enjoy being critical but the knicks kind of put themselves in this position with terrible decisions. Granted getting a lottery pick is good BUT the draft is a crapshoot even though im a big believer in the draft. Cap space is good BUT doesnt guaranteed anything. Remember in 2010 we were in the same spot and missed out
It's not being honest is being obvious.....yeah we've sucked for 15 years so at this point were domed to suck for 10 more? Why so at 10? Are we waiting for FEMA? Jesus?
EwingsGlass wrote:Vmart wrote:Has Dolan really ruined anything he needs a winner as badly as we do for him it's money in the pockets for us it a good nights sleep. Instead of blaming Dolan lets see what he has tried to do to win. He brought in Isiah which at the time people liked, then he brought, Larry Brown which at the time people liked, he brought in Amare which at the time looked like a great move. He brought in Melo which most liked, so you have an owner trying to do his best but everything seems to back fire on him. His last move was to bring Phil Jackson which most people like to top it off he is out of the picture and gave the keys to Phil which everyone seems to like. I always said you want an owner like Dolan who spends money, I just think the people around him haven't managed his deep pockets to well. Phil gets it you can see the plan taking place top pick to go with cap space, the Knicks will be relevant very quickly. Then we can thank Dolan for bringing in Phil Jackson. This is a very tough market to play in the media is harsh here and they look for any angle to take shots at the Knicks. You know and I know that the media here plays a huge role and sometime they scare good players away. To me the biggest culprit is the media they are the toughest team in town they damage the Knicks much harder than anyone.
As fans we need to realize also that this year is a major step in the right direction for this franchise and we need to let what is happening happen for the good. The Media wants to stir the fan base, with their useless stories. Fans need to be wise to it.
I really have a problem with the print media covering this team. They seem vindictive and eager to portray the team in the worst light possible. They do not recognize the Knicks losses as a tanked season, they see it as "atrocious". Our failure to give away more draft picks for RFAs at the trade deadline is characterized as Jackson being outwitted and outmaneuvered. I don't want to seem like a revisionist historian here, but although I had hope for the Knicks this season, it was always the best move for us to tank this season since we have our pick and had little hope of competing against the powerhouses THIS year. Honestly, I have stopped reading Berman and Isola outright. F--- them, go cover the Islanders. We need some writers that are fans too. Jackson has made good decisions IMO. Ones that I support. Not having the assets to make the deals for RFAs at the deadline is not his fault, its a characteristic of an organization that has mortgaged its future to try and appease the masses (stirred by the media) in the present.
I am pro-zenmaster too... and I will be pro whoever his successor is whenever he gets sick of the medias BS. But I hope PJ is the guy to take this team to the holy land. He really brought a ray of hope to this team -- even if we have to tank this year to put ourselves in the best position to win in the future.
Because it's not a tanked season. Phil took on extra salary past this season in an attempt to improve this team to the playoffs. He said that when he made the trade, he said it again prior to the beginning of the season, and he's said it again on multiple occasions that he thought he had built a playoff caliber team. Instead, he built the worst team in franchise history.
misterearl wrote:Despite the capacity crowds and the optimism of nixluva, the Answer Man reports a sobering fact of professional sports. There is no guarantee that the damage inflicted on our beloved basketball team can be corrected by all the Kings horses, Kings men and Uncle Phil.Ten wins.
Think about that a moment. Unlike the Spurs, who had David Robinson and a magic draft pick, we have an injured, ego-centric shooter and not much else. There are moments the rose-tinted shades are raised and the glare from Golden State, San Antonio, Washington, Cleveland and even Atlanta... is blinding. Philadelphia and Boston will have a battalion of yoots to deploy.
We hang our hopes on Langston Galloway.
Most troubling, however, is the corporate mentality that relies on cash over creativity. The mission statement is callous and cold. We have no heart and soul. When the owner insults a loyal, yet frustrated, fan what more needs to be said?
It will require a decade of good karma, rolling sevens on a crapshoot of draft picks and the patience of as much time as it took to make the mess. Are you prepared for that?
All of us sense some degree of truth in the notion that Dolan is an inveterate poison and that the team may never win while he remains owner. But then reason comes back to us and we remember that players play, coaches coach, and owners run a business.
If the Knicks find their way through the forest to a clearing (not necessarily a chip, but at least back to multiple ECFs with a shot at winning it all) then please remember this post.
I already added it to my UK bookmarks folder for future reference. I won't hold it against you because I detest Dolan with all of my NYK fan spirit, but I also recognize that owners don't really hamper true winners. Time will tell.
EnySpree wrote:StarksEwing1 wrote:EnySpree wrote:Why is this being called an excellent post by some of you? It's excellent to say we're doomed to be horrible for another decade?
This is sports not the 9/11... this is not the sports equivalent to building the freedom towers. This is not the earthquakes in haiti. It's sports.
We draft well, Melo comes back ready to go, we sign some legit nba players and motherfucker we are back just like that. Stop swimming in misery you negative Nancy's. You can't bring positivity through negativity
its not being negative its being honest. Its not like we enjoy being critical but the knicks kind of put themselves in this position with terrible decisions. Granted getting a lottery pick is good BUT the draft is a crapshoot even though im a big believer in the draft. Cap space is good BUT doesnt guaranteed anything. Remember in 2010 we were in the same spot and missed out
It's not being honest is being obvious.....yeah we've sucked for 15 years so at this point were domed to suck for 10 more? Why so at 10? Are we waiting for FEMA? Jesus?
nobody said we will suck. The point is you cant just assume everything will be terrific. We have gotten our hopes up too much to just assume anything
