NardDogNation wrote:gunsnewing wrote:We'll see how Towns responds when kentucky needs him. They won by 40pts last night.
You'd make a no.1 pick out of a guy that has little baring on his team's success? Last time something like that happened, the Hawks ended up picking Marvin Williams at no.2. That didn't exactly work out well for them with CP3 and D-Will still on the board.
What in the hell are you talking about? Without Towns there is no way that team could have stayed undefeated.
TPercy wrote:NardDogNation wrote:gunsnewing wrote:We'll see how Towns responds when kentucky needs him. They won by 40pts last night.
You'd make a no.1 pick out of a guy that has little baring on his team's success? Last time something like that happened, the Hawks ended up picking Marvin Williams at no.2. That didn't exactly work out well for them with CP3 and D-Will still on the board.
What in the hell are you talking about? Without Towns there is no way that team could have stayed undefeated.
Maybe, maybe not. When you can beat a March Madness team by 40 without him being a factor, I'd seriously question that especially when you have Dakari Johnson and Trey Lyles to fill the void.
Its hard to really judge Towns because he plays on a great and deep team especially in the frontcourt. Not saying i wouldnt want him but between him and russell it would be a tough choice
BRIGGS wrote:NardDogNation wrote:WaltLongmire wrote:NardDogNation wrote:GustavBahler wrote:IDK, Im starting to like Kaminsky over both of them.
I definitely like Kaminsky over Towns. Can't say the same yet for Okafor. But when it comes to fits, I think that Kaminsky is the better option. My dream would be to get the no.1 pick, then trade down to get both D'Angelo Russell and Frank Kaminsky.
Don't think Kaminsky could ever have the post game OK4 will have, just as OK4 will never have Kaminsky's range on the jump shot.
A guy like OK4, or Towns, if he develops, would really open up the floor on the offensive end, as teams would eventually have to collapse on him defensively. We rarely have the kind of spacing when the ball is dumped into the post, because teams don't react as much to our players in the post, at least from what I've seen.
Kaminsky does not help our interior D and shot blocking, though.
Neither will Okafor. Fortunately, Kaminsky is much longer and just as smart, which will allow him to better contest shots. Defensively, he reminds me of Pau Gasol in the sense that they are not elite defenders but can get stops because of their length and IQ.
Offensively, Okafor figures to be the more effective player but in a game that values spacing, Kaminsky is who I'd favor especially with Melo looking to drive. If our objective is to remain in the draft, our best option would be to trade down to get multiple picks and hope that D'Angelo Russell and Frank Kaminsky are available at both picks. They fit the triangle like a glove and are win-now players. IMO, their combined talent and fit exceeds whatever value that Okafor alone could bring (and I'm a big believer in him).
I like Frank--posted so several times(I think hes a clear cut top 10 pick)--but he is not Ok4 and there is no way the Knick swill pass on Towns for ANY player at 2. If you look back at the Ok4 Kaminsky video --Kaminsky had all sorts of problems handling Ok4 1-1 and that is senior to freshmen--project out where ok4 has worked hard on his body and game as Frank has the last 3 years.
not my preference but I 100% understand and would have to support that
BRIGGS wrote:NardDogNation wrote:WaltLongmire wrote:NardDogNation wrote:GustavBahler wrote:IDK, Im starting to like Kaminsky over both of them.
I definitely like Kaminsky over Towns. Can't say the same yet for Okafor. But when it comes to fits, I think that Kaminsky is the better option. My dream would be to get the no.1 pick, then trade down to get both D'Angelo Russell and Frank Kaminsky.
Don't think Kaminsky could ever have the post game OK4 will have, just as OK4 will never have Kaminsky's range on the jump shot.
A guy like OK4, or Towns, if he develops, would really open up the floor on the offensive end, as teams would eventually have to collapse on him defensively. We rarely have the kind of spacing when the ball is dumped into the post, because teams don't react as much to our players in the post, at least from what I've seen.
Kaminsky does not help our interior D and shot blocking, though.
Neither will Okafor. Fortunately, Kaminsky is much longer and just as smart, which will allow him to better contest shots. Defensively, he reminds me of Pau Gasol in the sense that they are not elite defenders but can get stops because of their length and IQ.
Offensively, Okafor figures to be the more effective player but in a game that values spacing, Kaminsky is who I'd favor especially with Melo looking to drive. If our objective is to remain in the draft, our best option would be to trade down to get multiple picks and hope that D'Angelo Russell and Frank Kaminsky are available at both picks. They fit the triangle like a glove and are win-now players. IMO, their combined talent and fit exceeds whatever value that Okafor alone could bring (and I'm a big believer in him).
I like Frank--posted so several times(I think hes a clear cut top 10 pick)--but he is not Ok4 and there is no way the Knick swill pass on Towns for ANY player at 2. If you look back at the Ok4 Kaminsky video --Kaminsky had all sorts of problems handling Ok4 1-1 and that is senior to freshmen--project out where ok4 has worked hard on his body and game as Frank has the last 3 years.
I think Okafor has HOF caliber talent. I think Kaminsky could make an all-star game or two during his career ala Brad Miller. I have no misconceptions of the heirarchy that exists with these two players but I still think that Kaminsky is a better fit for our team than Okafor at the 5 spot. With a guy like Melo abroad, a big man that can space the floor and pass are at a premium, and Kaminsky ranks better in both aspects to Okafor IMHO. That doesn't mean I'd take him at 1 or 2 though. I'd prefer to trade the pick to a team like the Lakers (for 4 and 25) or the Sixers (for 3 and 15) to select Kaminsky with the latter pick.
If we do keep the pick and it's top 2, I agree with you that it needs to be either Towns or Okafor. Personally though, I think it's a poor maximization of the value that pick holds. There is a history of the Knicks doing this and it has inevitably come back to bite us in the ass e.g. selecting Shumpert in the 1st round when no one (but the Suns) considered him to be anything better than a 2nd round pick. He turned out to be a serviceable player but we theoretically could've traded down and ended up with a later first rounder to take Nikola Mirotic and a 2nd round to still select Shumpert. The same deal happened during the Gallinari draft; no one was really talking about the guy as a top tier lottery talent but we picked him at 6 when we could've theoretically taken Brook Lopez at 6 and then traded him to the Nets for picks 10 and 21. Looking at that draft, I have a hard time believing that Gallo (with back problems) wouldn't have been around at 10. And at 21, we would've had our pick of Serge Ibaka, Ryan Anderson, Nicolas Batum and DeAndre Jordan to pick from. Anyway, the point is that we need to look beyond just the BPA and start trying to find the best value in the draft, which entertains the possibility of trading down.
NardDogNation wrote:TPercy wrote:NardDogNation wrote:gunsnewing wrote:We'll see how Towns responds when kentucky needs him. They won by 40pts last night.
You'd make a no.1 pick out of a guy that has little baring on his team's success? Last time something like that happened, the Hawks ended up picking Marvin Williams at no.2. That didn't exactly work out well for them with CP3 and D-Will still on the board.
What in the hell are you talking about? Without Towns there is no way that team could have stayed undefeated.
Maybe, maybe not. When you can beat a March Madness team by 40 without him being a factor, I'd seriously question that especially when you have Dakari Johnson and Trey Lyles to fill the void.
I gotta question if you watched Towns at all this year besides last night based on that statement
gunsnewing wrote:NardDogNation wrote:TPercy wrote:NardDogNation wrote:gunsnewing wrote:We'll see how Towns responds when kentucky needs him. They won by 40pts last night.
You'd make a no.1 pick out of a guy that has little baring on his team's success? Last time something like that happened, the Hawks ended up picking Marvin Williams at no.2. That didn't exactly work out well for them with CP3 and D-Will still on the board.
What in the hell are you talking about? Without Towns there is no way that team could have stayed undefeated.
Maybe, maybe not. When you can beat a March Madness team by 40 without him being a factor, I'd seriously question that especially when you have Dakari Johnson and Trey Lyles to fill the void.
I gotta question if you watched Towns at all this year besides last night based on that statement
Never a full game but I've usually been able to see them when they've been on national TV. The same goes for Duke; a lesser extent for Ohio, Arizona and Wisconsin. And I've bought the hype of all their stars....aside from Towns. Like I said, time will tell but I think there are major pitfalls with him.
You must've missed the games where towns won for them down the stretch
gunsnewing wrote:NardDogNation wrote:TPercy wrote:NardDogNation wrote:gunsnewing wrote:We'll see how Towns responds when kentucky needs him. They won by 40pts last night.
You'd make a no.1 pick out of a guy that has little baring on his team's success? Last time something like that happened, the Hawks ended up picking Marvin Williams at no.2. That didn't exactly work out well for them with CP3 and D-Will still on the board.
What in the hell are you talking about? Without Towns there is no way that team could have stayed undefeated.
Maybe, maybe not. When you can beat a March Madness team by 40 without him being a factor, I'd seriously question that especially when you have Dakari Johnson and Trey Lyles to fill the void.
I gotta question if you watched Towns at all this year besides last night based on that statement
Seriously. Towns has the highest ws/40 in the league. He is the most impactful platyer on that team.
You claim he is "Raw" but he actually has a pretty adaquate post game that has potential to get better.
You go on that this "pf" problem he has means he will have to COMPLETELY change the way he plays in the NBA, how hard is it to stop committing unnecessary fouls.
You also say that he is "injury prone" when he hasn't been injured ONCE throughout this season
TPercy wrote:gunsnewing wrote:NardDogNation wrote:TPercy wrote:NardDogNation wrote:gunsnewing wrote:We'll see how Towns responds when kentucky needs him. They won by 40pts last night.
You'd make a no.1 pick out of a guy that has little baring on his team's success? Last time something like that happened, the Hawks ended up picking Marvin Williams at no.2. That didn't exactly work out well for them with CP3 and D-Will still on the board.
What in the hell are you talking about? Without Towns there is no way that team could have stayed undefeated.
Maybe, maybe not. When you can beat a March Madness team by 40 without him being a factor, I'd seriously question that especially when you have Dakari Johnson and Trey Lyles to fill the void.
I gotta question if you watched Towns at all this year besides last night based on that statement
Seriously. Towns has the highest ws/40 in the league. He is the most impactful platyer on that team.
Not even close to an accurate stat.
1) Towns can go full speed at all time knowing he's playing 20 minutes and getting platooned.
2) Towns is fouling at rate of 5.7/per 40 minutes
3) Towns is never the only 7 footer on the floor. NEVER
Now.. Im not disagreeing he's the most impactful, but he also plays a very limited role. 2nd rebounder on the team. 4th scorer on the team. They play a zone and Stien takes the opposing post threat and Towns roams to intimidate and picks up fouls at an epic rate. I agree Towns is the best on that team, but he's not the most important. Thats Stein
TPercy wrote:You claim he is "Raw" but he actually has a pretty adaquate post game that has potential to get better.
You go on that this "pf" problem he has means he will have to COMPLETELY change the way he plays in the NBA, how hard is it to stop committing unnecessary fouls.
You also say that he is "injury prone" when he hasn't been injured ONCE throughout this season
Aside from the "raw" comment, none of your qualms reflect anything I said. Are you even directing this comment towards me?
gunsnewing wrote:You must've missed the games where towns won for them down the stretch
I guess so. I'm no college basketball aficionado, so I'm not going to mount some all-out argument to defend my point. But based on what little I know of the game on that level and how it translates to the pros, I'm very concerned about Karl Towns. I believe that people are overrating what little he does, while overlooking some glaring shortcomings. He'd have a legitimate chance to quiet doubters like me on certain teams but I think an environment/stage like NY would break him. Time will tell. For his sake, I hope everything does work out for him.
have you been watching any games? or just based your opinion off of one or two tourney games?
NardDogNation wrote:TPercy wrote:You claim he is "Raw" but he actually has a pretty adaquate post game that has potential to get better.
You go on that this "pf" problem he has means he will have to COMPLETELY change the way he plays in the NBA, how hard is it to stop committing unnecessary fouls.
You also say that he is "injury prone" when he hasn't been injured ONCE throughout this season
Aside from the "raw" comment, none of your qualms reflect anything I said. Are you even directing this comment towards me?
You said he was injury prone too....
TPercy wrote:NardDogNation wrote:TPercy wrote:You claim he is "Raw" but he actually has a pretty adaquate post game that has potential to get better.
You go on that this "pf" problem he has means he will have to COMPLETELY change the way he plays in the NBA, how hard is it to stop committing unnecessary fouls.
You also say that he is "injury prone" when he hasn't been injured ONCE throughout this season
Aside from the "raw" comment, none of your qualms reflect anything I said. Are you even directing this comment towards me?
You said he was injury prone too....
Find me where I said that.
Selecting Towns is all about potential. Thats it. You can not use college stats to justify that pick.
Selecting OK4 is less about potential and more about college production.
So theres really no point in arguing Towns impact on a Kentucky team that has 6 potential 1st rounders. Either roll the dice with him, or take the safe route in OK4. This pick will tell a lot about our GM.
blkexec wrote:Selecting Towns is all about potential. Thats it. You can not use college stats to justify that pick.Selecting OK4 is less about potential and more about college production.
So theres really no point in arguing Towns impact on a Kentucky team that has 6 potential 1st rounders. Either roll the dice with him, or take the safe route in OK4. This pick will tell a lot about our GM.
ping pong balls have to bounce the knicks' way. i hate to say it but i think the knicks' have squandered their share of good fortune with that 124 million dollar contract with the no-trade clause.
dk7th wrote:blkexec wrote:Selecting Towns is all about potential. Thats it. You can not use college stats to justify that pick.Selecting OK4 is less about potential and more about college production.
So theres really no point in arguing Towns impact on a Kentucky team that has 6 potential 1st rounders. Either roll the dice with him, or take the safe route in OK4. This pick will tell a lot about our GM.
ping pong balls have to bounce the knicks' way. i hate to say it but i think the knicks' have squandered their share of good fortune with that 124 million dollar contract with the no-trade clause.
Glad to see you have stopped waffling about that
