Knicks · tell me how this guy doesn't look like dirk and absolutely should be pick 4 (page 3)

crzymdups wrote:It's something of a bummer to be discussing the virtues of Stein vs Kaminsky instead of Okafor vs Towns, but que sera.

+1
It is very sad

Dude looks like a taller Mareese Speights. He might be 7-1 but the guy doesn't have the physical body needed to be a starter in my opinion. Maybe he can be Mirotic but will he be able to rebound? Is he going to struggle to defend?

BRIGGS wrote:http://fansided.com/2015/05/26/frank-kam...

he looks good & we all know what Frank can do in college and will do in NBA
as far as 4th pick? You seem to have 1 guy you like at some spot every now
& then every other week

Will you change 4th? by June draft night 2015?

LOL

Downside:Bargnani
Upside: Pau Gasol
Major upside: Dirk
Probably: Better version of Cody Zeller?

If anyone want to claims Frank will be able to do that Step back/aside fade jumper gold!
as consistent as Dirk developed it in NBA, That may be a stretch in the pros'

We got to see vs major defensive teams pressure
we always knew Dirk was a better perimeter J' consistent with D on him
than Dirk driving to hoops for points or creating.

DJMUSIC wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:http://fansided.com/2015/05/26/frank-kam...

he looks good & we all know what Frank can do in college and will do in NBA
as far as 4th pick? You seem to have 1 guy you like at some spot every now
& then every other week

Will you change 4th? by June draft night 2015?

LOL

I agree with you this has been hard stuff but Im staying here and I guarantee this is it--I convinced mysefl 6 weeks ago --hedged and now Im standstill with this pick. In fact I will not make one more post about the 4th pick until the draft about 1 other player other than Kaminsky.

BRIGGS wrote:

Vmart wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

smackeddog wrote:Time for a "the case for Kaminsky thread', methinks.

My main issue with him, is if you draft him, you'd better pray we sign Gasol, because otherwise I don't see how you build a team thats good enough defensively to make the playoffs.

That's my issue with him.

I'm sort of convinced that we're signing Greg Monroe - Monroe and Kaminsky would be terrible together.

Perhaps that's a false assumption I'm toiling under though.

Kaminsky Monroe would be the best passing big men tandem in the nba. Since Frank can play a Mobil 4 Monroe would have his space in the paint . On defense you have 2 seven footers

yeah, I'm coming around to that idea... oy, this draft is confusing me.

I'd still prefer Stein. But Kaminsky may be the best pure shooter of the lotto picks - he's at least second best behind Russell.

His ability to stretch to the three point line would give Melo and possibly Monroe a ton of space.

No way he's a better pure shooter than Russell imho

Russell is a good shooter but not a pure shooter. Curry is a pure shooter, Bird was a pure shooter Mullin was a pure shooter. 41% from three point line does not make you a pure shooter if that is the criteria then Calderon is a pure shooter.

I know a lot of you guys think I'm not a Russell fan I am I like his game it has a lot of potential. But once you get past his three point shooting and get inside his number don't standout.

I like Kaminsky to me he is this years McDermot.

McDermott is 6-8 tops Frank is 7-1 that's a HUGE difference I also think Frank is a better all around skill player despite the extra size.

Referring to them both being seniors and Wooden winners who put up great numbers.

yellowboy90 wrote:Dude looks like a taller Mareese Speights. He might be 7-1 but the guy doesn't have the physical body needed to be a starter in my opinion. Maybe he can be Mirotic but will he be able to rebound? Is he going to struggle to defend?

At 7-1 235 he'll be more than big enough to hold his own against 4 or even 5's. The problem for other teams will be guarding Frank and how Franks spacing abilities will effect defenses. You need to bring a big man out 27 feet to guard him which leaves open opportunities for everyone else.

BRIGGS wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:Dude looks like a taller Mareese Speights. He might be 7-1 but the guy doesn't have the physical body needed to be a starter in my opinion. Maybe he can be Mirotic but will he be able to rebound? Is he going to struggle to defend?

At 7-1 235 he'll be more than big enough to hold his own against 4 or even 5's. The problem for other teams will be guarding Frank and how Franks spacing abilities will effect defenses. You need to bring a big man out 27 feet to guard him which leaves open opportunities for everyone else.

Yes, and Bargs is also 7-1, big deal. The guy has problems defending strength. Speights was a big guy with fantastic offensive talent and now he is just a back up jump shooting big.

BRIGGS wrote:

DJMUSIC wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:http://fansided.com/2015/05/26/frank-kam...

he looks good & we all know what Frank can do in college and will do in NBA
as far as 4th pick? You seem to have 1 guy you like at some spot every now
& then every other week

Will you change 4th? by June draft night 2015?

LOL

I agree with you this has been hard stuff but Im staying here and I guarantee this is it--I convinced mysefl 6 weeks ago --hedged and now Im standstill with this pick. In fact I will not make one more post about the 4th pick until the draft about 1 other player other than Kaminsky.

anyone we get at 4 (long as no FRED WEIS)
even Frank will help Knicks

ITs ashame we got no more picks
no 2nd rnd 2015, no 1st /2nd 2016

How can we be bad ? when draft years a good
Its a wonder which FA wants to come here until 2017,2018

Sad
Love Knicks Logos
but this is Absurd!

We got 1 stinking pick at #4, we stink 2 yrs next is three yrs
I feel we're (fans) are getting Jipped! draftwise OR Org being able to build us up.

I aint one whom feel we going to get right FA whom wont jip us either $$$
They all cannot play in NY Or take the pressure.

Its going to be a bad 1-2 next years here
Only thing by time Knicks build back up 2018? we will see the last
of asbin Coach Derrick Fisher a laker Whom cost us ping pong balls this year.

Fisher exodus as Knick coach is like a chip
cause I never ever thought he should have been over Kerr, over Mark Jackson or any
name coach whom was best suited for the mess here.

Fisher will be in NBA 5-6 yrs before we know he can coach.

yellowboy90 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:Dude looks like a taller Mareese Speights. He might be 7-1 but the guy doesn't have the physical body needed to be a starter in my opinion. Maybe he can be Mirotic but will he be able to rebound? Is he going to struggle to defend?

At 7-1 235 he'll be more than big enough to hold his own against 4 or even 5's. The problem for other teams will be guarding Frank and how Franks spacing abilities will effect defenses. You need to bring a big man out 27 feet to guard him which leaves open opportunities for everyone else.

Yes, and Bargs is also 7-1, big deal. The guy has problems defending strength. Speights was a big guy with fantastic offensive talent and now he is just a back up jump shooting big.

Sometimes fans look at the physical stuff and completely forget the mental aspect of this, and any, sport.

Which of the top center prospects did Kaminsky get beat up by? He seems destined to be a 4, but has done well with a lot of guys destined to be centers in this league. Any team which drafts him has to be sure that he can compete defensively at the position they want him to play...I assume the Knicks will do their due diligence in this area of his game.

And to be honest, Bargs' problem is not defending strength, its his lack of awareness as a help defender, rebounding toughness, and decision making.

yellowboy90 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:Dude looks like a taller Mareese Speights. He might be 7-1 but the guy doesn't have the physical body needed to be a starter in my opinion. Maybe he can be Mirotic but will he be able to rebound? Is he going to struggle to defend?

At 7-1 235 he'll be more than big enough to hold his own against 4 or even 5's. The problem for other teams will be guarding Frank and how Franks spacing abilities will effect defenses. You need to bring a big man out 27 feet to guard him which leaves open opportunities for everyone else.

Yes, and Bargs is also 7-1, big deal. The guy has problems defending strength. Speights was a big guy with fantastic offensive talent and now he is just a back up jump shooting big.

Why are you comparing Speights with Kaminsky? dont see one similarity? Lets wait and see.

This would be my SL team

C-Thabeet
F Kaminsky
F Early
G Thansis
G N Wolters

PF Benimon
F Eddie
G Connougton
PG Fuzaro

and I wouldnt lose a game. We need to start a mentality where we are winners starting from the ground up.

BRIGGS wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:Dude looks like a taller Mareese Speights. He might be 7-1 but the guy doesn't have the physical body needed to be a starter in my opinion. Maybe he can be Mirotic but will he be able to rebound? Is he going to struggle to defend?

At 7-1 235 he'll be more than big enough to hold his own against 4 or even 5's. The problem for other teams will be guarding Frank and how Franks spacing abilities will effect defenses. You need to bring a big man out 27 feet to guard him which leaves open opportunities for everyone else.

Yes, and Bargs is also 7-1, big deal. The guy has problems defending strength. Speights was a big guy with fantastic offensive talent and now he is just a back up jump shooting big.

Why are you comparing Speights with Kaminsky? dont see one similarity? Lets wait and see.

This would be my SL team

C-Thabeet
F Kaminsky
F Early
G Thansis
G N Wolters

PF Benimon
F Eddie
G Connougton
PG Fuzaro

and I wouldnt lose a game. We need to start a mentality where we are winners starting from the ground up.

Because they both possessed similar attributes offensively as draftees. I am not talking about Speights the player now but the player that was a potential lottery pick but just missed and went 16.

yellowboy90 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:Dude looks like a taller Mareese Speights. He might be 7-1 but the guy doesn't have the physical body needed to be a starter in my opinion. Maybe he can be Mirotic but will he be able to rebound? Is he going to struggle to defend?

At 7-1 235 he'll be more than big enough to hold his own against 4 or even 5's. The problem for other teams will be guarding Frank and how Franks spacing abilities will effect defenses. You need to bring a big man out 27 feet to guard him which leaves open opportunities for everyone else.

Yes, and Bargs is also 7-1, big deal. The guy has problems defending strength. Speights was a big guy with fantastic offensive talent and now he is just a back up jump shooting big.

Why are you comparing Speights with Kaminsky? dont see one similarity? Lets wait and see.

This would be my SL team

C-Thabeet
F Kaminsky
F Early
G Thansis
G N Wolters

PF Benimon
F Eddie
G Connougton
PG Fuzaro

and I wouldnt lose a game. We need to start a mentality where we are winners starting from the ground up.

Because they both possessed similar attributes offensively as draftees. I am not talking about Speights the player now but the player that was a potential lottery pick but just missed and went 16.

They did? I know you like Florida and probably know them better than me for sure--but Speights was an early entry draftee who never took a 3 in college and plays the game much more similar to Amare Stoudemire.

WaltLongmire wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:Dude looks like a taller Mareese Speights. He might be 7-1 but the guy doesn't have the physical body needed to be a starter in my opinion. Maybe he can be Mirotic but will he be able to rebound? Is he going to struggle to defend?

At 7-1 235 he'll be more than big enough to hold his own against 4 or even 5's. The problem for other teams will be guarding Frank and how Franks spacing abilities will effect defenses. You need to bring a big man out 27 feet to guard him which leaves open opportunities for everyone else.

Yes, and Bargs is also 7-1, big deal. The guy has problems defending strength. Speights was a big guy with fantastic offensive talent and now he is just a back up jump shooting big.

Sometimes fans look at the physical stuff and completely forget the mental aspect of this, and any, sport.

Which of the top center prospects did Kaminsky get beat up by? He seems destined to be a 4, but has done well with a lot of guys destined to be centers in this league. Any team which drafts him has to be sure that he can compete defensively at the position they want him to play...I assume the Knicks will do their due diligence in this area of his game.

And to be honest, Bargs' problem is not defending strength, its his lack of awareness as a help defender, rebounding toughness, and decision making.

He is not going to have the physical advantage that he did against younger players and now as those younger players mature and gain a better understanding of the game he'll potentially struggle against them too. That's just on post play what happens against the 4s in the nba that stretch the floor.

BRIGGS wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:Dude looks like a taller Mareese Speights. He might be 7-1 but the guy doesn't have the physical body needed to be a starter in my opinion. Maybe he can be Mirotic but will he be able to rebound? Is he going to struggle to defend?

At 7-1 235 he'll be more than big enough to hold his own against 4 or even 5's. The problem for other teams will be guarding Frank and how Franks spacing abilities will effect defenses. You need to bring a big man out 27 feet to guard him which leaves open opportunities for everyone else.

Yes, and Bargs is also 7-1, big deal. The guy has problems defending strength. Speights was a big guy with fantastic offensive talent and now he is just a back up jump shooting big.

Why are you comparing Speights with Kaminsky? dont see one similarity? Lets wait and see.

This would be my SL team

C-Thabeet
F Kaminsky
F Early
G Thansis
G N Wolters

PF Benimon
F Eddie
G Connougton
PG Fuzaro

and I wouldnt lose a game. We need to start a mentality where we are winners starting from the ground up.

Because they both possessed similar attributes offensively as draftees. I am not talking about Speights the player now but the player that was a potential lottery pick but just missed and went 16.

They did? I know you like Florida and probably know them better than me for sure--but Speights was an early entry draftee who never took a 3 in college and plays the game much more similar to Amare Stoudemire.

He was an in and out player with a post game and smooth jumper. He wasn't Amar'e at all. Then in workouts he would flash his 3pt shooting ability, ala Towns. Dude was shooting 62.4% from the field on almost 10 FGs as a sophomore. The dude had talent off the charts.

The potential saving grace for Kaminsky is his mental make up and IQ. Will he work on his short comings and combine the scouting report with anticipation to make up for his weaknesses? Will his offense be so good that it makes up for his potentially shoty D? I just don't know.

yellowboy90 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:Dude looks like a taller Mareese Speights. He might be 7-1 but the guy doesn't have the physical body needed to be a starter in my opinion. Maybe he can be Mirotic but will he be able to rebound? Is he going to struggle to defend?

At 7-1 235 he'll be more than big enough to hold his own against 4 or even 5's. The problem for other teams will be guarding Frank and how Franks spacing abilities will effect defenses. You need to bring a big man out 27 feet to guard him which leaves open opportunities for everyone else.

Yes, and Bargs is also 7-1, big deal. The guy has problems defending strength. Speights was a big guy with fantastic offensive talent and now he is just a back up jump shooting big.

Why are you comparing Speights with Kaminsky? dont see one similarity? Lets wait and see.

This would be my SL team

C-Thabeet
F Kaminsky
F Early
G Thansis
G N Wolters

PF Benimon
F Eddie
G Connougton
PG Fuzaro

and I wouldnt lose a game. We need to start a mentality where we are winners starting from the ground up.

Because they both possessed similar attributes offensively as draftees. I am not talking about Speights the player now but the player that was a potential lottery pick but just missed and went 16.

They did? I know you like Florida and probably know them better than me for sure--but Speights was an early entry draftee who never took a 3 in college and plays the game much more similar to Amare Stoudemire.

He was an in and out player with a post game and smooth jumper. He wasn't Amar'e at all. Then in workouts he would flash his 3pt shooting ability, ala Towns. Dude was shooting 62.4% from the field on almost 10 FGs as a sophomore. The dude had talent off the charts.

The potential saving grace for Kaminsky is his mental make up and IQ. Will he work on his short comings and combine the scouting report with anticipation to make up for his weaknesses? Will his offense be so good that it makes up for his potentially shoty D? I just don't know.

Frank Kaminsky has a chance to be one of "the main guys" from the 4 in the NBA in years to come. If Frank is aggressive and keeps working on his body--his upside is solid. What would Frank average if he played 38 minutes and was afforded 13-15 shots a night? His basketball IQ is very high his skills are off the charts and hes 7-1. He's not a non athlete either. When you are the guy in the post--like Okafor was there will be periods that you just cant keep a 100% efficiency on the D but I think Frank has all the defensive fundamentals down--he knows how to position sit on someone's shoulder or weak side to offset some quickness issues. The only negative is his wingspan(or wongspan if you like) at 7-1 he can afford to give some space but not as much as a guy like Porzingis can with his expansive reach. I think Frank has many similarities in projection to Vucevic although they are not the same player. Vucevic was also criticized for many similar traits and went 16. Really he was a top 3 choice.

he's a 22 yr old kid that wasnt engaged when kentucky was up 50 killing opponents. i wouldnt know him for that. i think he;ll be an excellent NBA player. im just not sure i take him at #4

I like Frank, but he could just as easily be Ryan Anderson. I still put him light years ahead of WCS or Porzingis.

gunsnewing wrote:

crzymdups wrote:It's something of a bummer to be discussing the virtues of Stein vs Kaminsky instead of Okafor vs Towns, but que sera.

+1
It is very sad

Yup, I try not to think about it

I don't mind the Knicks getting D'Angelo, Justise, or Mudiay but i would prefer that they trade down. Even if Okafor somehow slips to the 4th pick, trading down would be wise. I think Kaminsky would be a good idea if it includes Jerian Grant because our 4th pick is worth two prospects and getting a second will fill in the void for next year's draft. Kaminsky & Jerian is skilled upperclassmen that can fit well into the system and are ready to contribute now. They have just as much upside as these one&dones and won't take time to develop like them. IMO, I think Kaminsky is a hybrid of Nowitzki, Paul Gasol, Mehmet Okur, Spencer Hawes, Olynyk, Channing Frye, and whatever stretch 4 you can think of. He moves better and has a better handle than them. He has all the tools as a triangle player because he can post up, shoot, and pass.

I haven't seen many stretch 4's lead a break like a point guard and throw alleys like this

I think Jerian is just as good if not better than D'Angelo & Mudiay. Athletically, he isn't that different from Mudiay

Even DX knows he's a very good passer with great court vision. Besides age there isn't that much difference between him and mudiay

Besides MGasol, LaMarcus, and Paul Millsap: Greg is the only one that makes sense, IMO. He financially leaves room for the Knicks to build and have depth which the other 3 don't. He can post, shoot, pass, and he's young. Giving him the max won't look so bad when the cap increases. He's not a great rim protector which is why i would rather have him playing his natural position at power forward and have an under appreciated Koufos protecting the paint. Koufos is cheap and still young. Before Cleveland got Mosgov they were eyeing him.

He's also athletic, rugged, and very mobile. Just look at this

Koufos is looking for a starting role and i think he can easily average a double double and give you about 2 blocks per game.

http://greenstreet.weei.com/sports/bosto...

the Celtics are in desperate need of a rim protector, and Koufos was as good as any backup center in that regard. According to NBA.com/stats, the 7-foot, 265-pound former first-round pick held opponents to 46.9 percent shooting at the rim, putting him in good company with Defensive Player of the Year candidates Tim Duncan and Draymond Green at the same percentage.

Offensively, Koufos has proven a capable scorer around the basket, converting 56.2 percent of his shots inside of 8 feet.

http://espn.go.com/blog/marc-stein/post/...

Rim protection is his forte, but he also coped very well against Aldridge in the Portland series, and has not only proven very durable over the year but has quietly started nearly 150 games in his career. He's more seasoned than you think.

C--- Koufos / Ajinca / Bachynski
PF---- Greg Monroe / Kaminsky / JSmith or Bargnani for vet minimum
SF---- Melo / Thomas / Early
SG---- Wes Matthews / Hardaway / Thanasis
PG---- Galloway / Calderon / Jerian Grant

Other than that my list makes sense and is good enough to compete against the Cavaliers in a weak @$$ east