Knicks · What would you think with Calderon coming off the bench at SG? (page 1)

I think it would be beneficial for the team and him to come off the bench at SG. He wouldn't have to guard the top PG and would just need to follow the sub SG. At 6.3, he's tall enough and would provide his shooting.

Starting :

Gallo (for the first half of the season)
Affalo
Melo
Dwill
Lopez

Bench :

Grant (start during the second half of the season if he plays well)
Calderon
Thomas (or Ledo if he can play at 3)
KP
Oquinn

I think both line ups are balanced between offense and defense.

is there an option for 'on the bench in street clothes'?

2nd guard off the bench, Grant being first - makes sense. We don't really have anyone else.

It would be nice if Ledo could supplant him, but I don't see that happening.

Calderon is a good player when healthy. Watch him in the preseason and come back to me.

He should start at pg.

shinmen wrote:I think it would be beneficial for the team and him to come off the bench at SG. He wouldn't have to guard the top PG and would just need to follow the sub SG. At 6.3, he's tall enough and would provide his shooting.

Starting :

Gallo (for the first half of the season)
Affalo
Melo
Dwill
Lopez

Bench :

Grant (start during the second half of the season if he plays well)
Calderon
Thomas (or Ledo if he can play at 3)
KP
Oquinn

I think both line ups are balanced between offense and defense.

Team gonna need someone to organize and run the triangle, so way Calderon doesn't start for beginning of season unless Grant exceeds expectations.

TPercy wrote:He should start at pg.

Oh my! You must not give a darn about the Knicks! This dude (Calderon) is old and decrepit. Other then his ability to shoot; which he does not use enough, he is not worth a darn. He doesn't rebound, defend, and can't run the fastbreak. So no, he should not be a starter; in fact, we should cut him and use the spot on a promising young I drafted prospect

martin wrote:

shinmen wrote:I think it would be beneficial for the team and him to come off the bench at SG. He wouldn't have to guard the top PG and would just need to follow the sub SG. At 6.3, he's tall enough and would provide his shooting.

Starting :

Gallo (for the first half of the season)
Affalo
Melo
Dwill
Lopez

Bench :

Grant (start during the second half of the season if he plays well)
Calderon
Thomas (or Ledo if he can play at 3)
KP
Oquinn

I think both line ups are balanced between offense and defense.

Team gonna need someone to organize and run the triangle, so way Calderon doesn't start for beginning of season unless Grant exceeds expectations.

The triangle is supposed to be a system with no real need of a pure PG. I think on the bench, his defense would be less of a problem, his health would be preserved and he can flourish on the offensive end.

If he is going to play substantial mins... then there's no way he can be on the second unit. They younger guys would run him out of the building.

He should start at PG and have a quick pull from Fisher if he's being mauled on defense.

In the Triangle there really isn't so much a PG in the traditional sense. Jose is going to be playing that typical role for mid range and the 3pt shooting guard Phil has always had. So basically for our purposes he's like a SG in this offense. Jose will use screens to get open for his jumper and look to setup team mates.

Jerian is more of a Lead Guard in this offense. He's there to work off screens, break down his man and get into the teeth of the defense, in the same role that Shved had last year. You have to be able to get to the rim in that role. So you wouldn't see Jerian cut to the corner and hide out there. He'd be more likely to operate in the Pinch Post, use Drag Screens and drive because he's more of a threat with the ball going to the basket.

Seems like we have this conversation about once a week. Its a long season, if Grant can grow into the role he earns the minutes and plays. Calderon should start. BTW, nobody can contain the top Pg's in the league, they blow by everyone or work off picks. He is a temparary player and the best thing is for him to play well and get traded in the long run. Until then he can help our yoots on the court as well.

I think the Knicks are looking at Jose to run the point as the starter. From the Phil Files,

Jose Calderon expects perfection, and since our operation of the triangle -- while improving -- remains far from perfect, Jose gets frustrated. When that happens, he gets tight and makes mistakes. Overall, though, and more often than not, everybody plays hard

shinmen wrote:

martin wrote:

shinmen wrote:I think it would be beneficial for the team and him to come off the bench at SG. He wouldn't have to guard the top PG and would just need to follow the sub SG. At 6.3, he's tall enough and would provide his shooting.

Starting :

Gallo (for the first half of the season)
Affalo
Melo
Dwill
Lopez

Bench :

Grant (start during the second half of the season if he plays well)
Calderon
Thomas (or Ledo if he can play at 3)
KP
Oquinn

I think both line ups are balanced between offense and defense.

Team gonna need someone to organize and run the triangle, so way Calderon doesn't start for beginning of season unless Grant exceeds expectations.

The triangle is supposed to be a system with no real need of a pure PG. I think on the bench, his defense would be less of a problem, his health would be preserved and he can flourish on the offensive end.

For me I guess there is a distinction between a PG that has the ball in his hands for a good bit of the offense and one that runs the offense. Calderon probably can do both and the team as a whole may been someone smart like Calderon to help learn the Triangle faster. My hope is he gets traded at the deadline.

shinmen wrote:I think it would be beneficial for the team and him to come off the bench at SG. He wouldn't have to guard the top PG and would just need to follow the sub SG. At 6.3, he's tall enough and would provide his shooting.

Starting :

Gallo (for the first half of the season)
Affalo
Melo
Dwill
Lopez

Bench :

Grant (start during the second half of the season if he plays well)
Calderon
Thomas (or Ledo if he can play at 3)
KP
Oquinn

I think both line ups are balanced between offense and defense.

It would help our defense right away. I didnt like the way Langston looked in SL I was expecting WAY WAY more but it is SL. I dont like the Knicks with all of the slow players in unit 1 Melo Calderon Lopez. its recipe for disaster.

martin wrote:

shinmen wrote:

martin wrote:

shinmen wrote:I think it would be beneficial for the team and him to come off the bench at SG. He wouldn't have to guard the top PG and would just need to follow the sub SG. At 6.3, he's tall enough and would provide his shooting.

Starting :

Gallo (for the first half of the season)
Affalo
Melo
Dwill
Lopez

Bench :

Grant (start during the second half of the season if he plays well)
Calderon
Thomas (or Ledo if he can play at 3)
KP
Oquinn

I think both line ups are balanced between offense and defense.

Team gonna need someone to organize and run the triangle, so way Calderon doesn't start for beginning of season unless Grant exceeds expectations.

The triangle is supposed to be a system with no real need of a pure PG. I think on the bench, his defense would be less of a problem, his health would be preserved and he can flourish on the offensive end.

For me I guess there is a distinction between a PG that has the ball in his hands for a good bit of the offense and one that runs the offense. Calderon probably can do both and the team as a whole may been someone smart like Calderon to help learn the Triangle faster. My hope is he gets traded at the deadline.

I actually think Jerian won't have any issues with this system. He's already showing me that he understands his role and he has the talent to fulfill his specific role in the offense as an attacking guard who can get penetration and setup his teammates. Jose and Jerian provide this team with 2 high quality guards. Despite what some people think Jose is a good player and should bounce back this year. As long as we put Jose out there with good defenders he should be fine.

Calderon could be used as the 2nd/3rd ball handler and space the floor as a shooter, IF we have someone else to INITIATE the OFFENSE through with the PG and another position that could create/penetrate/facilitate with consistency

Though because of his weak DEFENSE and age, it would likely be off the bench against 2nd unit players, maybe 3rd unit at times
Not sure if he would be better at defending the backup PG or SG

That was why I wanted to add SG, Jeff Taylor, who signed with Europe, and would target him next season for a 2year vet min deal
Along with Justin Hamilton who would be the backup Center that could hit wide open 3pters on a 2year vet min deal

While Mike James isn't a traditional Phil Jackson/Triangle type player, he can CREATE/PENETRATE/ and CREATE, and we need talents like that with many HIGH IQ ROLE PLAYERS already

When Thanasis and N Dour develop, they would be ideal for the way the NBA is evolving towards SMALL ball
With Thanasis playing a YOUNG Ariza role and N Dour playing Draymond Green's role as he is currently listed at 200pds and has much room to get improve with his potential

While Derek Fisher should do some tweaks withe THE TRIANGLE, like both Gentry and Steve Kerr did, with a system that is interchangeable
With Zone DEFENSE and multiple 3pt shooters with great range, the NBA has evolved and changed much since Phil Jackson's days as a Head Coach

The Hammer Play, is a great play that is derived from The Triangle, with the PF/C and SG/SF using the screen to free the shooter up
Though we would need a PG/SG that could penetrate/finish in the paint and have the ability to create/pass that Grant could currently do or Westbrook if we acquire him

The 3pt shot in the baseline is a shot that EVERY PLAYER SHOULD DEVELOP that is the easiest 3pt shot that players such as Bruce Bowen had a career out of along with his DEFENSE
Whether this is CA, Calderon/Galloway, Affalo, Thanasis, KP, or whoever that would be shooting the baseline jumper that Danny Green excels in

If you watch it carefully, the Triangle is basically the strong side, and the weak side being part of the Hammer Play, with the DEFENSE unable to recover in time, as STOPPING the layup would be the reaction of the DEFENSE

To execute the play,
Though Spurs have Parker, Manu, Patty Mills, and Ray McCallum to INITIATE and EXECUTE this, a BIG PF/C to set the good screen, along with the HIGH IQ and perfect timing of the team

If fisher and the knicks are planning on running a lot more, which they did in SL, not sure how calderon fits into the scheme of things.

Isiah Thomas is a small PG, however, Derek Fisher was not exactly a Phil Jackson type PG either
But Thomas's contract like Fisher's was a cap friendly contract, however, his ability to penetrate and finish, create his own shot and for the team, and facilitate >>> Derek Fisher
Fisher was able to hit a % 3pt shot with clutchness without taking many shots, while Thomas has shown he is capable of being a backup PG and a starting PG with his weakness being DEFENSE
However, his speed/quickness can not be taught, and could be used on both OFF and on DEF to stay in front of Defenders

While a trade for a sign and trade in David Lee would fit in the Triangle on our bench
Boston simply has too many PG/SG's on their roster and will have to decide who they keep

To execute the hammer consistently, we need 2 PG/SG's or 2 players that could penetrate and finish, and create/facilitate consistently, with shooters at the G/F to spread the floor, and a C that could set great screens that KP is currently too skinny to do
We currently only have Grant to do this and that is why we need to add more players that could penetrate/finish and create/facilitate with consistency

knicks1248 wrote:If fisher and the knicks are planning on running a lot more, which they did in SL, not sure how calderon fits into the scheme of things.

I think the second unit will run more with Galloway and Grant running the show, possibly Derrick Williams, who is a beast on the break.

I think the first unit will be Calderon, Afflalo, Melo, Porzingis, ROLO and will play a more deliberate pace and run more of a pure triangle.

crzymdups wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:If fisher and the knicks are planning on running a lot more, which they did in SL, not sure how calderon fits into the scheme of things.

I think the second unit will run more with Galloway and Grant running the show, possibly Derrick Williams, who is a beast on the break.

I think the first unit will be Calderon, Afflalo, Melo, Porzingis, ROLO and will play a more deliberate pace and run more of a pure triangle.

I hope KP does not start.

BRIGGS wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:If fisher and the knicks are planning on running a lot more, which they did in SL, not sure how calderon fits into the scheme of things.

I think the second unit will run more with Galloway and Grant running the show, possibly Derrick Williams, who is a beast on the break.

I think the first unit will be Calderon, Afflalo, Melo, Porzingis, ROLO and will play a more deliberate pace and run more of a pure triangle.

I hope KP does not start.

I think he might start but play only 20-24mpg.

I think it makes much more sense, line-up-wise, to start KP over O'Quinn (too slow, more of a center) or Derrick Williams (too small, more of a combo forward, doesn't defend, doesn't rebound)