A) Apparently you don't know how to read these charts
B) Apparently in your world an ideal basketball team does not have to worry about defense
@holfresh
how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
holfresh wrote:foosballnick wrote:holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:Just savor this a bit, Lopez was the 5 best player in the starting lineup in Portland that got rolled in the first round of the playoffs..He is the second highest paid player on our team next year..
rolo is a very effective player and will be great here. but news flash, fred g.: lillard ain't all that-- sorry!-- and aldridge needs to tighten up his game a bunch. unless lillard improves a bunch he will be having "change of scenery."
portland's underachieving can be lain squarely at the feet of those two players.
Yeah right..They refused to resign/traded three starters because Aldridge left..They just backed up a Brinks truck for Lilliard..You can look at the playoff numbers to see who the real players are..Aldridge was playing with a torn ligament in his thumb..He said he couldn't feel around his thumb..
then, as when clyde addressed felton's hand injury... don't shoot!
He was their best player, even with a bad hand, he was their best option...
if he can't shoot then he needs to do other things... like pass the rock and defend, for instance-- but hey guess what... that's not his game, which is why he decided to go to san antonio.
You are blind dude..It's ok that u don't get it...
lol okay what is it i am blind to now?
Here are the differences in how you view things versus how I view things..In battle, soldiers fall from attrition in pursuit towards their goal...When the flag bearer falls, the platoon knows who will rise to the occasion, grab the flag and charge up the hill ahead of everyone...Everyone on the battle field knows who will grab that flag, it's not even a question...Some guys will follow and some guys won't...The guy who grabs the flag is your leader for simply doing that act...Your leader is made on the battle field not in the barracks, as many here want to suggest...Aldrige grabbed that flag and charged uphill and no one followed...Melo grabbed that flag against Indy and Shump followed as best he could...LeBron grabbed that flag and Mozgov followed...Curry grabbed the flag and the whole team followed...Get it????
Heres the difference in how you view things vs some of the rest of us......you are preparing for a battle with a flag bearing leader charging up the hill taking shots. We are preparing for an entire long term war where it is not just about one flag bearing hero but about the infantry and tanks and marines and homeland protection etc. There are different roles on a roster, and when you are preparing for war, you have to ensure you are prepared for the long haul on offense and defense. The Knicks are not there yet, but adding another flag bearer on offense while it might win some battles does not seem like the right way to build for war.
Isn't that the entire crux of my argument??..Adding pieces who are willing to share the burden and have shown courage thru action we have seen, not imagined??? Thats what teams like Boston did who added KG and Ray Allen and let Rondo develop in a winning atmosphere...The Heat with LeBron and Bosh along with young players like Charlmers and Cole..The Lakers adding Shaq who went to the Finals before going to LA then later adding Gasol...Portland didn't want to resign the pieces that failed in the last battle that you now qualify as infantry men, and who can blame them...We added soft players, guys who didn't want to run up that hill..Guys who were riding the pine in the playoffs and on lottery teams...They aren't hungry...But that's the foundation you think are tanks and marines...They are soft and are nice young men..I hear they come from good families according to Phil...That's the priority it seems..Aldridge and Melo would be a nice foundation with additional pieces that can be added next year to compete with the East...
no. your argument is flawed.
1) jackson catered to dolan/isaiah by acquiescing to paying melo the max.
2) the 2014-15 season was a disaster which put off a win-now agenda and jackson course-corrected
3) the course correction yanked the franchise into full rebuild mode
4) the draft lottery defied the odds and we were left with the fourth pick, cementing the course correction for a rebuild
5) in full rebuild it's better to get younger players with fewer minutes played on cheaper and shorter contracts
lets look at your scenario: the "triangular" knicks draft mudiay or winslow and then sign aldridge----> melo, aldridge, mudiay/winslow.... how many wins? how far into the playoffs? 2015-16
It seems to me that Phil was able to address as he put it "have a present and also have a future component" to the franchise. I know for some and SAS it seems like we needed to go hard for win now, but Phil made a choice to look more long term. It's just a case of Phil believing this was the best route for this franchise to go. I think Phil had DeAndre and RoLo as his 2 main targets. He said over and over and over that he wanted a defensive Center. LMA and Monroe weren't that guy. Phil obviously felt he already had his scoring PF in KP. It's not about this year alone. Phil wanted to build with long term success in mind.
mreinman wrote:@holfresh how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
Much as I hate to admit it, dk7 is right..He does take some horrible shots...What's even more crazy is some of those long two's are turn around jumpers...I think those shots changes when he isn't the primary option and he does have to feel he needs to take those shots to carry the team...Sort of like Melo forcing bad shots as well...These two players needs better players around them..
holfresh wrote:mreinman wrote:@holfresh how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
Much as I hate to admit it, dk7 is right..He does take some horrible shots...What's even more crazy is some of those long two's are turn around jumpers...I think those shots changes when he isn't the primary option and he does have to feel he needs to take those shots to carry the team...Sort of like Melo forcing bad shots as well...These two players needs better players around them..
ugh ... stop with the excuses. LA likes bad shots, it has nothing to do with his teammates.
mreinman wrote:holfresh wrote:mreinman wrote:@holfresh how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
Much as I hate to admit it, dk7 is right..He does take some horrible shots...What's even more crazy is some of those long two's are turn around jumpers...I think those shots changes when he isn't the primary option and he does have to feel he needs to take those shots to carry the team...Sort of like Melo forcing bad shots as well...These two players needs better players around them..
ugh ... stop with the excuses. LA likes bad shots, it has nothing to do with his teammates.
OK..He is a very good player that likes bad shots...
holfresh wrote:mreinman wrote:@holfresh how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
Much as I hate to admit it, dk7 is right..He does take some horrible shots...What's even more crazy is some of those long two's are turn around jumpers...I think those shots changes when he isn't the primary option and he does have to feel he needs to take those shots to carry the team...Sort of like Melo forcing bad shots as well...These two players needs better players around them..
never mind who spoke the truth, me or whomever-- the truth is the truth. he needs to tighten up his game if he wants to win and what better place than san antonio to do that. god bless them and now lets focus on the new york knickerbockers.
dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:mreinman wrote:@holfresh how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
Much as I hate to admit it, dk7 is right..He does take some horrible shots...What's even more crazy is some of those long two's are turn around jumpers...I think those shots changes when he isn't the primary option and he does have to feel he needs to take those shots to carry the team...Sort of like Melo forcing bad shots as well...These two players needs better players around them..
never mind who spoke the truth, me or whomever-- the truth is the truth. he needs to tighten up his game if he wants to win and what better place than san antonio to do that. god bless them and now lets focus on the new york knickerbockers.
U can start with tightening up the office of Head of Basketball Operations then the coaching staff..
holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:mreinman wrote:@holfresh how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
Much as I hate to admit it, dk7 is right..He does take some horrible shots...What's even more crazy is some of those long two's are turn around jumpers...I think those shots changes when he isn't the primary option and he does have to feel he needs to take those shots to carry the team...Sort of like Melo forcing bad shots as well...These two players needs better players around them..
never mind who spoke the truth, me or whomever-- the truth is the truth. he needs to tighten up his game if he wants to win and what better place than san antonio to do that. god bless them and now lets focus on the new york knickerbockers.
U can start with tightening up the office of Head of Basketball Operations then the coaching staff..
Are you suggesting removing Phil and Fisher?
holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:mreinman wrote:@holfresh how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
Much as I hate to admit it, dk7 is right..He does take some horrible shots...What's even more crazy is some of those long two's are turn around jumpers...I think those shots changes when he isn't the primary option and he does have to feel he needs to take those shots to carry the team...Sort of like Melo forcing bad shots as well...These two players needs better players around them..
never mind who spoke the truth, me or whomever-- the truth is the truth. he needs to tighten up his game if he wants to win and what better place than san antonio to do that. god bless them and now lets focus on the new york knickerbockers.
U can start with tightening up the office of Head of Basketball Operations then the coaching staff..
longterm jackson wants the knicks to be a professional and respectable place associated with winning and long-term success. there is NO reason other than dolan. as long as he allows jackson to work the knicks can become more like san antonio. knicks have been a sick and unhealthy place with dolan's involvement.
who do you think cares more about the knicks, jackson or dolan?
knickscity wrote:holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:mreinman wrote:@holfresh how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
Much as I hate to admit it, dk7 is right..He does take some horrible shots...What's even more crazy is some of those long two's are turn around jumpers...I think those shots changes when he isn't the primary option and he does have to feel he needs to take those shots to carry the team...Sort of like Melo forcing bad shots as well...These two players needs better players around them..
never mind who spoke the truth, me or whomever-- the truth is the truth. he needs to tighten up his game if he wants to win and what better place than san antonio to do that. god bless them and now lets focus on the new york knickerbockers.
U can start with tightening up the office of Head of Basketball Operations then the coaching staff..
Are you suggesting removing Phil and Fisher?
I would suggest before removing them, the way things works needs to be retooled..Part of the problem in my opinion is that Jackson should allow his coach to dictate how the team plays..I believe players have to believe and bond with their coaches...The system that currently exist now where Jackson is calling all the shots hurts the team...It's ego...Fisher is a puppet...That should change to see if this guy can really coach...
dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:mreinman wrote:@holfresh how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
Much as I hate to admit it, dk7 is right..He does take some horrible shots...What's even more crazy is some of those long two's are turn around jumpers...I think those shots changes when he isn't the primary option and he does have to feel he needs to take those shots to carry the team...Sort of like Melo forcing bad shots as well...These two players needs better players around them..
never mind who spoke the truth, me or whomever-- the truth is the truth. he needs to tighten up his game if he wants to win and what better place than san antonio to do that. god bless them and now lets focus on the new york knickerbockers.
U can start with tightening up the office of Head of Basketball Operations then the coaching staff..
longterm jackson wants the knicks to be a professional and respectable place associated with winning and long-term success. there is NO reason other than dolan. as long as he allows jackson to work the knicks can become more like san antonio. knicks have been a sick and unhealthy place with dolan's involvement.
who do you think cares more about the knicks, jackson or dolan?
Actually Dolan..I think Jackson is driven by ego...Why doesn't Jackson allow his coach to call the shots like San Antonio?..How is that building a foundation for the Knicks going forward??
holfresh wrote:knickscity wrote:holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:mreinman wrote:@holfresh how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
Much as I hate to admit it, dk7 is right..He does take some horrible shots...What's even more crazy is some of those long two's are turn around jumpers...I think those shots changes when he isn't the primary option and he does have to feel he needs to take those shots to carry the team...Sort of like Melo forcing bad shots as well...These two players needs better players around them..
never mind who spoke the truth, me or whomever-- the truth is the truth. he needs to tighten up his game if he wants to win and what better place than san antonio to do that. god bless them and now lets focus on the new york knickerbockers.
U can start with tightening up the office of Head of Basketball Operations then the coaching staff..
Are you suggesting removing Phil and Fisher?
I would suggest before removing them, the way things works needs to be retooled..Part of the problem in my opinion is that Jackson should allow his coach to dictate how the team plays..I believe players have to believe and bond with their coaches...The system that currently exist now where Jackson is calling all the shots hurts the team...It's ego...Fisher is a puppet...That should change to see if this guy can really coach...
your take on the state of the knicks here in this post just about sums it up for me: you are delusional
dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:knickscity wrote:holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:mreinman wrote:@holfresh how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
Much as I hate to admit it, dk7 is right..He does take some horrible shots...What's even more crazy is some of those long two's are turn around jumpers...I think those shots changes when he isn't the primary option and he does have to feel he needs to take those shots to carry the team...Sort of like Melo forcing bad shots as well...These two players needs better players around them..
never mind who spoke the truth, me or whomever-- the truth is the truth. he needs to tighten up his game if he wants to win and what better place than san antonio to do that. god bless them and now lets focus on the new york knickerbockers.
U can start with tightening up the office of Head of Basketball Operations then the coaching staff..
Are you suggesting removing Phil and Fisher?
I would suggest before removing them, the way things works needs to be retooled..Part of the problem in my opinion is that Jackson should allow his coach to dictate how the team plays..I believe players have to believe and bond with their coaches...The system that currently exist now where Jackson is calling all the shots hurts the team...It's ego...Fisher is a puppet...That should change to see if this guy can really coach...
your take on the state of the knicks here in this post just about sums it up for me: you are delusional
29 other teams in the league allow their coaches to call the shot...27 of them have better records...I'm delusional for thinking a coach should run his team...
dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:mreinman wrote:@holfresh how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
Much as I hate to admit it, dk7 is right..He does take some horrible shots...What's even more crazy is some of those long two's are turn around jumpers...I think those shots changes when he isn't the primary option and he does have to feel he needs to take those shots to carry the team...Sort of like Melo forcing bad shots as well...These two players needs better players around them..
never mind who spoke the truth, me or whomever-- the truth is the truth. he needs to tighten up his game if he wants to win and what better place than san antonio to do that. god bless them and now lets focus on the new york knickerbockers.
U can start with tightening up the office of Head of Basketball Operations then the coaching staff..
longterm jackson wants the knicks to be a professional and respectable place associated with winning and long-term success. there is NO reason other than dolan. as long as he allows jackson to work the knicks can become more like san antonio. knicks have been a sick and unhealthy place with dolan's involvement.
who do you think cares more about the knicks, jackson or dolan?
The irony in this view is that Dolan for the most part has done nothing but hire people who were previously winners. I really cant stress that enough. People say he butts in, when has this happened other than the Melo trade? Isiah was a HOF basketball player, when did Dolan butt in on him? never and should have. When was Lenny Wilkens dictated on how to coach? Larry Brown? these "winners" sucked all on their own.
Now on the other end of the coin, fans need to understand that the NBA is a business and certain teams are needed to carry the NBA's bottom line of being profitable. As great as the Spurs are from a winning standpoint, they dont carry the NBA, and fans overall arent watching as the ratings are normally low with them on TV. So for an owner like Dolan who has a bottom line of making sure a basketball team in NY is worth it's name and it certainly is by being a multi-billion dollar team now, and edict of winning games isnt too far out of realm...or even telling Phil Jackson to resign Melo at all cost because Melo=butts in seats, merchandise..etc, unless fans are gonna buy Cleanthony Early's jerseys.
The Knicks as a business are doing great, and that has happened under Dolan, and if you disagree, the numbers are there. 2.5 billion in value. 11 teams at present are worth over 1 billion, the Spurs are just outside of the top 10 despite their decades of competent basketball, but the winning has gotten them into that 1 Billion dollar area.
To me doesnt matter who cares more about the Knicks, you can care and still fail.
holfresh wrote:knickscity wrote:holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:mreinman wrote:@holfresh how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
Much as I hate to admit it, dk7 is right..He does take some horrible shots...What's even more crazy is some of those long two's are turn around jumpers...I think those shots changes when he isn't the primary option and he does have to feel he needs to take those shots to carry the team...Sort of like Melo forcing bad shots as well...These two players needs better players around them..
never mind who spoke the truth, me or whomever-- the truth is the truth. he needs to tighten up his game if he wants to win and what better place than san antonio to do that. god bless them and now lets focus on the new york knickerbockers.
U can start with tightening up the office of Head of Basketball Operations then the coaching staff..
Are you suggesting removing Phil and Fisher?
I would suggest before removing them, the way things works needs to be retooled..Part of the problem in my opinion is that Jackson should allow his coach to dictate how the team plays..I believe players have to believe and bond with their coaches...The system that currently exist now where Jackson is calling all the shots hurts the team...It's ego...Fisher is a puppet...That should change to see if this guy can really coach...
I do think Phil has done what you'r suggesting. he has built a team that really isnt triangle dependent. Fisher is certainly on the clock this season imo.
holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:knickscity wrote:holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:mreinman wrote:@holfresh how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
Much as I hate to admit it, dk7 is right..He does take some horrible shots...What's even more crazy is some of those long two's are turn around jumpers...I think those shots changes when he isn't the primary option and he does have to feel he needs to take those shots to carry the team...Sort of like Melo forcing bad shots as well...These two players needs better players around them..
never mind who spoke the truth, me or whomever-- the truth is the truth. he needs to tighten up his game if he wants to win and what better place than san antonio to do that. god bless them and now lets focus on the new york knickerbockers.
U can start with tightening up the office of Head of Basketball Operations then the coaching staff..
Are you suggesting removing Phil and Fisher?
I would suggest before removing them, the way things works needs to be retooled..Part of the problem in my opinion is that Jackson should allow his coach to dictate how the team plays..I believe players have to believe and bond with their coaches...The system that currently exist now where Jackson is calling all the shots hurts the team...It's ego...Fisher is a puppet...That should change to see if this guy can really coach...
your take on the state of the knicks here in this post just about sums it up for me: you are delusional
29 other teams in the league allow their coaches to call the shot...27 of them have better records...I'm delusional for thinking a coach should run his team...
You really don't pay any attention to what is actually going on with the Knicks do you??? Phil is the President of this team. He's got a young coach who he stated from day one that he wanted to mentor. Fish took the job knowing full well what Phil wanted to run. If you think that running the Triangle is a mistake or that Fish isn't making all his day to day decisions then you really are just not paying any attention.
Fish has been putting in all kinds of different things since he's been coach. He started with the basics and has bee tweaking things all along.
He even experimented with 4 out style ball this summer. Or did you not even bother to pay attention to the games?
There's nothing Triangle about these sets. Fish is allowed to do what he things best. He is also someone who won his rings running the Triangle so why wouldn't he still be willing to use it?
dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:knickscity wrote:holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:mreinman wrote:@holfresh how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
Much as I hate to admit it, dk7 is right..He does take some horrible shots...What's even more crazy is some of those long two's are turn around jumpers...I think those shots changes when he isn't the primary option and he does have to feel he needs to take those shots to carry the team...Sort of like Melo forcing bad shots as well...These two players needs better players around them..
never mind who spoke the truth, me or whomever-- the truth is the truth. he needs to tighten up his game if he wants to win and what better place than san antonio to do that. god bless them and now lets focus on the new york knickerbockers.
U can start with tightening up the office of Head of Basketball Operations then the coaching staff..
Are you suggesting removing Phil and Fisher?
I would suggest before removing them, the way things works needs to be retooled..Part of the problem in my opinion is that Jackson should allow his coach to dictate how the team plays..I believe players have to believe and bond with their coaches...The system that currently exist now where Jackson is calling all the shots hurts the team...It's ego...Fisher is a puppet...That should change to see if this guy can really coach...
your take on the state of the knicks here in this post just about sums it up for me: you are delusional
I'll go one further..Insisting that his coach and the organization run the triangle almost guarantees the entire system gets scrapped as soon as Jackson leaves..So the idea of a foundation is being build for the future is pure fantasy..
holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:knickscity wrote:holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:mreinman wrote:@holfresh how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
Much as I hate to admit it, dk7 is right..He does take some horrible shots...What's even more crazy is some of those long two's are turn around jumpers...I think those shots changes when he isn't the primary option and he does have to feel he needs to take those shots to carry the team...Sort of like Melo forcing bad shots as well...These two players needs better players around them..
never mind who spoke the truth, me or whomever-- the truth is the truth. he needs to tighten up his game if he wants to win and what better place than san antonio to do that. god bless them and now lets focus on the new york knickerbockers.
U can start with tightening up the office of Head of Basketball Operations then the coaching staff..
Are you suggesting removing Phil and Fisher?
I would suggest before removing them, the way things works needs to be retooled..Part of the problem in my opinion is that Jackson should allow his coach to dictate how the team plays..I believe players have to believe and bond with their coaches...The system that currently exist now where Jackson is calling all the shots hurts the team...It's ego...Fisher is a puppet...That should change to see if this guy can really coach...
your take on the state of the knicks here in this post just about sums it up for me: you are delusional
I'll go one further..Insisting that his coach and the organization run the triangle almost guarantees the entire system gets scrapped as soon as Jackson leaves..So the idea of a foundation is being build for the future is pure fantasy..
You don't even know when Phil is going to leave. You don't know how things will have developed by that time. The offense has already been tweaked and will no doubt be tweaked some more. Even Phil kept tweaking the Triangle over the decades he was coaching. It was always changed to take advantage of talent Phil had and will be for this team as well.
You really have a low regard for a system that has won a ton of games, playoffs and titles. What kind of logic are you bringing to the table with that kind of attitude towards a highly successful system. How many modern offensive systems have been used by teams to win multiple 3peats? Even teams with great talent have found it difficult to pull off the 3peat. Obviously not many systems have been used to do that! So why should Fish and Phil abandon one that has been that successful?
nixluva wrote:holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:knickscity wrote:holfresh wrote:dk7th wrote:holfresh wrote:mreinman wrote:@holfresh how are you reading those charts? Do you see how many attempts LA takes in those crappy areas?
Much as I hate to admit it, dk7 is right..He does take some horrible shots...What's even more crazy is some of those long two's are turn around jumpers...I think those shots changes when he isn't the primary option and he does have to feel he needs to take those shots to carry the team...Sort of like Melo forcing bad shots as well...These two players needs better players around them..
never mind who spoke the truth, me or whomever-- the truth is the truth. he needs to tighten up his game if he wants to win and what better place than san antonio to do that. god bless them and now lets focus on the new york knickerbockers.
U can start with tightening up the office of Head of Basketball Operations then the coaching staff..
Are you suggesting removing Phil and Fisher?
I would suggest before removing them, the way things works needs to be retooled..Part of the problem in my opinion is that Jackson should allow his coach to dictate how the team plays..I believe players have to believe and bond with their coaches...The system that currently exist now where Jackson is calling all the shots hurts the team...It's ego...Fisher is a puppet...That should change to see if this guy can really coach...
your take on the state of the knicks here in this post just about sums it up for me: you are delusional
I'll go one further..Insisting that his coach and the organization run the triangle almost guarantees the entire system gets scrapped as soon as Jackson leaves..So the idea of a foundation is being build for the future is pure fantasy..
You don't even know when Phil is going to leave. You don't know how things will have developed by that time. The offense has already been tweaked and will no doubt be tweaked some more. Even Phil kept tweaking the Triangle over the decades he was coaching. It was always changed to take advantage of talent Phil had and will be for this team as well. You really have a low regard for a system that has won a ton of games, playoffs and titles. What kind of logic are you bringing to the table with that kind of attitude towards a highly successful system. How many modern offensive systems have been used by teams to win multiple 3peats? Even teams with great talent have found it difficult to pull off the 3peat. Obviously not many systems have been used to do that! So why should Fish and Phil abandon one that has been that successful?
Talk about a the success of the system when it didn't have the best players and best coach running it..I keep remembering the smart young lady who is a commentator on ESPN saying it took her three years to learn the triangle at Stanford..
