Knicks · Phil keeps taking about D wins (page 1)

Yet our team is thin defensively from 1-2-3

What exactly would you have him do in such a short span of time? The better 2 way guards were overpaid. He did address the defense and boards as best he could. Hopefully with better defensive bigs that will help our perimeter players a lot. Not much different than when we had a healthy Tyson and not much else defensively. It's a process and it's gonna take some time.

Jerian and Gallo are good defensive guards. Afflalo has not been as good as he once was but hopefully with some good D behind him he can improve. It's gonna take a team effort rather than having great individual defenders. Phil even mentioned using more pressure against the opposing guards and perhaps using some zone at times.

nixluva wrote:What exactly would you have him do in such a short span of time? The better 2 way guards were overpaid. He did address the defense and boards as best he could. Hopefully with better defensive bigs that will help our perimeter players a lot. Not much different than when we had a healthy Tyson and not much else defensively. It's a process and it's gonna take some time.

Jerian and Gallo are good defensive guards. Afflalo has not been as good as he once was but hopefully with some good D behind him he can improve. It's gonna take a team effort rather than having great individual defenders. Phil even mentioned using more pressure against the opposing guards and perhaps using some zone at times.

Usually you use good athletes to press

BRIGGS wrote:

nixluva wrote:What exactly would you have him do in such a short span of time? The better 2 way guards were overpaid. He did address the defense and boards as best he could. Hopefully with better defensive bigs that will help our perimeter players a lot. Not much different than when we had a healthy Tyson and not much else defensively. It's a process and it's gonna take some time.

Jerian and Gallo are good defensive guards. Afflalo has not been as good as he once was but hopefully with some good D behind him he can improve. It's gonna take a team effort rather than having great individual defenders. Phil even mentioned using more pressure against the opposing guards and perhaps using some zone at times.

Usually you use good athletes to press

We do have some good athletes!!! Perhaps if you focused less on the few players we have that are old and lack athletic ability then you might notice that we have some younger players who can defend.

To seriously talk about backcourt defense, Phil has to trade Calderon, and perhaps the Crawford rumor isnt true at all.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/134189...
Thought he talked about how guys would impact the game on both ends of the court. Also, not the strongest endorsement of Thanasis.

nixluva wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

nixluva wrote:What exactly would you have him do in such a short span of time? The better 2 way guards were overpaid. He did address the defense and boards as best he could. Hopefully with better defensive bigs that will help our perimeter players a lot. Not much different than when we had a healthy Tyson and not much else defensively. It's a process and it's gonna take some time.

Jerian and Gallo are good defensive guards. Afflalo has not been as good as he once was but hopefully with some good D behind him he can improve. It's gonna take a team effort rather than having great individual defenders. Phil even mentioned using more pressure against the opposing guards and perhaps using some zone at times.

Usually you use good athletes to press

We do have some good athletes!!! Perhaps if you focused less on the few players we have that are old and lack athletic ability then you might notice that we have some younger players who can defend.

briggs brings up fair points. I have always respected your optimism but we still have a lot of defensive liabilities out there. That doesnt mean we are terrible defensively but we definetly need more defense

BRIGGS wrote:Yet our team is thin defensively from 1-2-3

Jerian Grant, Langston Galloway, Arron Afflalo, Thanasis Antetokounmpo, Lance Thomas are all/can all be good defenders.

Over half the team in general are good defenders - Robin Lopez, Kyle O'Quinn, potentially Porzingis, etc.

This is compared to last year when the team routinely rolled Tim Hardaway Jr, Amar'e, Bargnani, JR Smith out on the floor.

I think the defense will be much improved.

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

nixluva wrote:What exactly would you have him do in such a short span of time? The better 2 way guards were overpaid. He did address the defense and boards as best he could. Hopefully with better defensive bigs that will help our perimeter players a lot. Not much different than when we had a healthy Tyson and not much else defensively. It's a process and it's gonna take some time.

Jerian and Gallo are good defensive guards. Afflalo has not been as good as he once was but hopefully with some good D behind him he can improve. It's gonna take a team effort rather than having great individual defenders. Phil even mentioned using more pressure against the opposing guards and perhaps using some zone at times.

Usually you use good athletes to press

We do have some good athletes!!! Perhaps if you focused less on the few players we have that are old and lack athletic ability then you might notice that we have some younger players who can defend.

briggs brings up fair points. I have always respected your optimism but we still have a lot of defensive liabilities out there. That doesnt mean we are terrible defensively but we definetly need more defense

As crzymdups pointed out Phil has in fact added a lot more defense to the roster. Focusing on the few guys who don't have any defensive ability is missing the larger point. That's my disagreement with BRIGGS post. We all know there are still areas we need to improve on. BRIGGS point was that Phil talks about D but didn't do anything at the 1,2 or 3. That's not TRUE. You seem to feel the need to want to make me come down off my optimistic view, but this is misplaced. My view about the FACT that Phil has added more defensive talent isn't about optimism it's just a fact. Phil has tried to improve the teams defensive talent. Literally the majority of the players he's brought in are players with some defensive acumen.

crzymdups wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Yet our team is thin defensively from 1-2-3

Jerian Grant, Langston Galloway, Arron Afflalo, Thanasis Antetokounmpo, Lance Thomas are all/can all be good defenders.

Over half the team in general are good defenders - Robin Lopez, Kyle O'Quinn, potentially Porzingis, etc.

This is compared to last year when the team routinely rolled Tim Hardaway Jr, Amar'e, Bargnani, JR Smith out on the floor.

I think the defense will be much improved.

I should be improved considering we were terrible last year. We have guys who have the instincts and the skills, but not the experience. i think folks have their sights a bit high. This team could be a really good defensive club, I dont doubt that. I dont think it will happen as quick as folks may expect because quite a few of those defensive minds have to learn the game as well.

nixluva wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

nixluva wrote:What exactly would you have him do in such a short span of time? The better 2 way guards were overpaid. He did address the defense and boards as best he could. Hopefully with better defensive bigs that will help our perimeter players a lot. Not much different than when we had a healthy Tyson and not much else defensively. It's a process and it's gonna take some time.

Jerian and Gallo are good defensive guards. Afflalo has not been as good as he once was but hopefully with some good D behind him he can improve. It's gonna take a team effort rather than having great individual defenders. Phil even mentioned using more pressure against the opposing guards and perhaps using some zone at times.

Usually you use good athletes to press

We do have some good athletes!!! Perhaps if you focused less on the few players we have that are old and lack athletic ability then you might notice that we have some younger players who can defend.

briggs brings up fair points. I have always respected your optimism but we still have a lot of defensive liabilities out there. That doesnt mean we are terrible defensively but we definetly need more defense

As crzymdups pointed out Phil has in fact added a lot more defense to the roster. Focusing on the few guys who don't have any defensive ability is missing the larger point. That's my disagreement with BRIGGS post. We all know there are still areas we need to improve on. BRIGGS point was that Phil talks about D but didn't do anything at the 1,2 or 3. That's not TRUE. You seem to feel the need to want to make me come down off my optimistic view, but this is misplaced. My view about the FACT that Phil has added more defensive talent isn't about optimism it's just a fact. Phil has tried to improve the teams defensive talent. Literally the majority of the players he's brought in are players with some defensive acumen.

well you misinterpreted bigtime from what i said. I actually like the defense the newer guys have HOWEVER we do need some more defense to IMO. Secondly i was paying you a compliment by saying you are positive. Im the same way i hate to dwell on negativity

Who is gonna be on the floor to lock up on D with the Knicks up 6 with 2 minutes left in the 4th? OQ, Lopez, afflalo, Gallo, Grant?

Paris907 wrote:Who is gonna be on the floor to lock up on D with the Knicks up 6 with 2 minutes left in the 4th? OQ, Lopez, afflalo, Gallo, Grant?

Not sure what Gallo's role will be with the improved roster but if you take out O'quinn or Gallo and put in Melo that might be the line up.

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

nixluva wrote:What exactly would you have him do in such a short span of time? The better 2 way guards were overpaid. He did address the defense and boards as best he could. Hopefully with better defensive bigs that will help our perimeter players a lot. Not much different than when we had a healthy Tyson and not much else defensively. It's a process and it's gonna take some time.

Jerian and Gallo are good defensive guards. Afflalo has not been as good as he once was but hopefully with some good D behind him he can improve. It's gonna take a team effort rather than having great individual defenders. Phil even mentioned using more pressure against the opposing guards and perhaps using some zone at times.

Usually you use good athletes to press

We do have some good athletes!!! Perhaps if you focused less on the few players we have that are old and lack athletic ability then you might notice that we have some younger players who can defend.

briggs brings up fair points. I have always respected your optimism but we still have a lot of defensive liabilities out there. That doesnt mean we are terrible defensively but we definetly need more defense

As crzymdups pointed out Phil has in fact added a lot more defense to the roster. Focusing on the few guys who don't have any defensive ability is missing the larger point. That's my disagreement with BRIGGS post. We all know there are still areas we need to improve on. BRIGGS point was that Phil talks about D but didn't do anything at the 1,2 or 3. That's not TRUE. You seem to feel the need to want to make me come down off my optimistic view, but this is misplaced. My view about the FACT that Phil has added more defensive talent isn't about optimism it's just a fact. Phil has tried to improve the teams defensive talent. Literally the majority of the players he's brought in are players with some defensive acumen.

well you misinterpreted bigtime from what i said. I actually like the defense the newer guys have HOWEVER we do need some more defense to IMO. Secondly i was paying you a compliment by saying you are positive. Im the same way i hate to dwell on negativity

I don't disagree with you about the guys Phil brought in. My disagreement was with what BRIGGS was saying, which is that Phil didn't address the issue of needing more defense at the 1, 2 and 3 position. Of course we need more, but that doesn't mean Phil didn't make improvements as BRIGGS was stating. I'm sure that if Phil could move Jose for a 2 way guard he would.

nixluva wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

nixluva wrote:What exactly would you have him do in such a short span of time? The better 2 way guards were overpaid. He did address the defense and boards as best he could. Hopefully with better defensive bigs that will help our perimeter players a lot. Not much different than when we had a healthy Tyson and not much else defensively. It's a process and it's gonna take some time.

Jerian and Gallo are good defensive guards. Afflalo has not been as good as he once was but hopefully with some good D behind him he can improve. It's gonna take a team effort rather than having great individual defenders. Phil even mentioned using more pressure against the opposing guards and perhaps using some zone at times.

Usually you use good athletes to press

We do have some good athletes!!! Perhaps if you focused less on the few players we have that are old and lack athletic ability then you might notice that we have some younger players who can defend.

briggs brings up fair points. I have always respected your optimism but we still have a lot of defensive liabilities out there. That doesnt mean we are terrible defensively but we definetly need more defense

As crzymdups pointed out Phil has in fact added a lot more defense to the roster. Focusing on the few guys who don't have any defensive ability is missing the larger point. That's my disagreement with BRIGGS post. We all know there are still areas we need to improve on. BRIGGS point was that Phil talks about D but didn't do anything at the 1,2 or 3. That's not TRUE. You seem to feel the need to want to make me come down off my optimistic view, but this is misplaced. My view about the FACT that Phil has added more defensive talent isn't about optimism it's just a fact. Phil has tried to improve the teams defensive talent. Literally the majority of the players he's brought in are players with some defensive acumen.

well you misinterpreted bigtime from what i said. I actually like the defense the newer guys have HOWEVER we do need some more defense to IMO. Secondly i was paying you a compliment by saying you are positive. Im the same way i hate to dwell on negativity

I don't disagree with you about the guys Phil brought in. My disagreement was with what BRIGGS was saying, which is that Phil didn't address the issue of needing more defense at the 1, 2 and 3 position. Of course we need more, but that doesn't mean Phil didn't make improvements as BRIGGS was stating. I'm sure that if Phil could move Jose for a 2 way guard he would.

thats fine but you cant always get offended if some people bring up legit concerns. Most of us are HAPPY with the offseason moves but its important to remember we are coming off a 17 win year so its gonna be a long tough road despite the solid moves

We don't even have a defensive system

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

nixluva wrote:What exactly would you have him do in such a short span of time? The better 2 way guards were overpaid. He did address the defense and boards as best he could. Hopefully with better defensive bigs that will help our perimeter players a lot. Not much different than when we had a healthy Tyson and not much else defensively. It's a process and it's gonna take some time.

Jerian and Gallo are good defensive guards. Afflalo has not been as good as he once was but hopefully with some good D behind him he can improve. It's gonna take a team effort rather than having great individual defenders. Phil even mentioned using more pressure against the opposing guards and perhaps using some zone at times.

Usually you use good athletes to press

We do have some good athletes!!! Perhaps if you focused less on the few players we have that are old and lack athletic ability then you might notice that we have some younger players who can defend.

briggs brings up fair points. I have always respected your optimism but we still have a lot of defensive liabilities out there. That doesnt mean we are terrible defensively but we definetly need more defense

As crzymdups pointed out Phil has in fact added a lot more defense to the roster. Focusing on the few guys who don't have any defensive ability is missing the larger point. That's my disagreement with BRIGGS post. We all know there are still areas we need to improve on. BRIGGS point was that Phil talks about D but didn't do anything at the 1,2 or 3. That's not TRUE. You seem to feel the need to want to make me come down off my optimistic view, but this is misplaced. My view about the FACT that Phil has added more defensive talent isn't about optimism it's just a fact. Phil has tried to improve the teams defensive talent. Literally the majority of the players he's brought in are players with some defensive acumen.

well you misinterpreted bigtime from what i said. I actually like the defense the newer guys have HOWEVER we do need some more defense to IMO. Secondly i was paying you a compliment by saying you are positive. Im the same way i hate to dwell on negativity

I don't disagree with you about the guys Phil brought in. My disagreement was with what BRIGGS was saying, which is that Phil didn't address the issue of needing more defense at the 1, 2 and 3 position. Of course we need more, but that doesn't mean Phil didn't make improvements as BRIGGS was stating. I'm sure that if Phil could move Jose for a 2 way guard he would.

thats fine but you cant always get offended if some people bring up legit concerns. Most of us are HAPPY with the offseason moves but its important to remember we are coming off a 17 win year so its gonna be a long tough road despite the solid moves

I'm not personally offended. I simply don't agree that BRIGGS points are legit concerns. You need to stop trying to police my view points as you've been doing for the last few months. IMO BRIGGS was wrong. Phil has in fact tried to improve the teams defense at every position. I simply explained my reason for disagreeing with BRIGGS post. Now whether Phil has done enough to fix the defensive woes is what we'll have to see this year. My guess is that even Phil would tell you he's not done improving the team's perimeter defense.

nixluva wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

nixluva wrote:What exactly would you have him do in such a short span of time? The better 2 way guards were overpaid. He did address the defense and boards as best he could. Hopefully with better defensive bigs that will help our perimeter players a lot. Not much different than when we had a healthy Tyson and not much else defensively. It's a process and it's gonna take some time.

Jerian and Gallo are good defensive guards. Afflalo has not been as good as he once was but hopefully with some good D behind him he can improve. It's gonna take a team effort rather than having great individual defenders. Phil even mentioned using more pressure against the opposing guards and perhaps using some zone at times.

Usually you use good athletes to press

We do have some good athletes!!! Perhaps if you focused less on the few players we have that are old and lack athletic ability then you might notice that we have some younger players who can defend.

briggs brings up fair points. I have always respected your optimism but we still have a lot of defensive liabilities out there. That doesnt mean we are terrible defensively but we definetly need more defense

As crzymdups pointed out Phil has in fact added a lot more defense to the roster. Focusing on the few guys who don't have any defensive ability is missing the larger point. That's my disagreement with BRIGGS post. We all know there are still areas we need to improve on. BRIGGS point was that Phil talks about D but didn't do anything at the 1,2 or 3. That's not TRUE. You seem to feel the need to want to make me come down off my optimistic view, but this is misplaced. My view about the FACT that Phil has added more defensive talent isn't about optimism it's just a fact. Phil has tried to improve the teams defensive talent. Literally the majority of the players he's brought in are players with some defensive acumen.

well you misinterpreted bigtime from what i said. I actually like the defense the newer guys have HOWEVER we do need some more defense to IMO. Secondly i was paying you a compliment by saying you are positive. Im the same way i hate to dwell on negativity

I don't disagree with you about the guys Phil brought in. My disagreement was with what BRIGGS was saying, which is that Phil didn't address the issue of needing more defense at the 1, 2 and 3 position. Of course we need more, but that doesn't mean Phil didn't make improvements as BRIGGS was stating. I'm sure that if Phil could move Jose for a 2 way guard he would.

thats fine but you cant always get offended if some people bring up legit concerns. Most of us are HAPPY with the offseason moves but its important to remember we are coming off a 17 win year so its gonna be a long tough road despite the solid moves

I'm not personally offended. I simply don't agree that BRIGGS points are legit concerns. You need to stop trying to police my view points as you've been doing for the last few months. IMO BRIGGS was wrong. Phil has in fact tried to improve the teams defense at every position. I simply explained my reason for disagreeing with BRIGGS post. Now whether Phil has done enough to fix the defensive woes is what we'll have to see this year. My guess is that even Phil would tell you he's not done improving the team's perimeter defense.

dude once again you take offense to what amounts to nothing . I could care less about your views its your right to have any view you want. Hell even when i compliment your loyalty and knowledge you get upset lol. I give up. Anyway im excited to see how grant and KP perform as rookies. I do think we are much improved even though i still have concerns but i wont bother to tell you because it ends up giving me a headache

I really dont see how anyone disagrees with BRIGGS original post, the team is thin defensively at the 1-2-3. Phil did try to shore it up, but it's still thin. it's actually thin and inexperienced defensively. Affalo might be the only guard we can count on defensively, as Grant is a rookie, Galloway really isnt a point and is too short for the 2 and Calderon is garbage on that end. From the 3 spot Melo likely will soak up the majority of those minutes and he isnt a consistently decent defender either.

Afflalo is a decent defender.

knicks1248 wrote:We don't even have a defensive system

Phil and his coaches have been together for a long time and they have worked together to formulate defensive tactics. They've won a lot of games and titles together. You need to start respecting their collective knowledge.

The Lakers' DEFENSIVE funnel vision

Rambis was given task of improving team's defense, and his ideas, predicated on forcing the ball to one side of the court, are working
November 28, 2008|Mike Bresnahan | Bresnahan is a Times staff writer.

Kurt Rambis' pizza is getting cold.

It's been sitting there, sausage, mushrooms and mozzarella, all but ignored because the Lakers' defensive coach is on a roll.

The black ballpoint pen is flying as Rambis draws up defensive schemes, scrawling out Xs and O's on the wax paper that covers a table at an Italian bistro.

He talks about steals, blocked shots and overloading one side of the court. He emphasizes the necessity to jump into passing lanes to intercept skip passes. He talks and draws, and then, finally, he eats. His work is done . . . at least on paper.

It was a given that the Lakers would score gobs of points this season, but Coach Phil Jackson wanted to put a stop to all the points being dropped on them (the team's defensive rank last season: 18th).

So Jackson gathered his coaches before training camp and told them he was appointing a defensive coach, something he hadn't done in his previous 18 years of coaching in the NBA.

"We didn't want to announce it and make a big deal about it like Boston did with their guy," Jackson said. "But Kurt is real good at this and he's willing."

Ah, yes. Boston.

The Celtics' defensive coach, Tom Thibodeau, made numerous headlines for his shut-it-down success last season, creating a template for championship-caliber teams via an unforgiving defense.

The Lakers could have used such a thing in the Finals, when the Celtics ended the Lakers' fairy tale by crushing them with Paul Pierce's slow, methodical, back-'em-down-the-lane style.

It has created a slow burn in the Lakers for, oh, about 164 days since their 131-92 humiliation in Game 6 of the Finals.

The Lakers began working on the new defense during training camp and continue to practice it almost every day. The results have been a boon.

The Lakers (12-1) are third in the league in opponents' shooting percentage (42.2%), sixth in points given up (92.7 a game), and first in point differential (14.3 a game).

The players have eaten it up, finding an appetite for steals (a league-best 10.4 a game) and blocked shots (6.2 a game, sixth-best in the league) that matches their zest for alley-oop dunks and three-on-one breaks.

"The thought process is that you want to win a championship. In order to beat a Boston, you've got to be a better defensive team than Boston," Kobe Bryant said. "If you want to hoist that trophy at the end of the year, we've got to be a great defensive team. That's the only way to get it done."

Rambis, in his seventh season as a Lakers assistant coach, had been in Jackson's ear for a while, pointing out an opportunity to take advantage of the NBA rule changes in 2001 that allowed zone defenses. Jackson ultimately relented over the summer.

"Kurt's been pestering me for a year or so about doing some things defensively that I was reluctant to do," Jackson said. "I come from the old school where you play man [defense], and you have that man and that's your primary goal."

The Lakers now use a lot of zone principles and try to keep the ball on one side of the court.

They put pressure on the ballhandler to try to force him to a particular side and then often overload the area by sending an extra defender to stand down near the post, essentially shifting the defense from man-to-man to zone.

Skip passes to the undermanned side can hurt the Lakers, but their defense has been quick to jump into passing lanes and create turnovers.

Crucial to their defensive success is extreme pressure on the ballhandler. Without that pressure, the ballhandler can see the court and find open teammates.

"We've got guys that have the capability of being a very disruptive defensive team," Rambis said. "We tried to give them goals to start training camp. They should be among the league leaders in defensive field-goal percentage, rebounds, shot blocks, steals, point differential. If you're among the league leaders in those categories, you're going to give yourself a chance to win."

The dramatic changes in personnel since last year's training camp have definitely helped.

Kwame Brown no longer patrols the middle -- er, tries to patrol the middle -- after being replaced by the younger and longer Andrew Bynum, who is gaining experience and confidence by the day.

Next to Bynum is fellow 7-footer Pau Gasol, who is fairly fluid for his size and is back to his natural position of power forward after playing center in Bynum's absence last season.

Bryant is an eight-time member of the All-Defensive team. The antagonistic, rangy forward Trevor Ariza is healthy after an injury-marred end to last season.

Word is spreading around the league.

"Their defense is much better than it was last year," New Orleans Coach Byron Scott said. "I think they learned from the Boston Celtics that you have to play defense to win championships. They really have done a heck of a job just getting after people, closing the lanes down and forcing people to shoot jump shots. When you get by them, you've got two 7-footers back there contesting shots."

http://articles.latimes.com/2008/nov/28/...

I think Phil is looking to recreate what he had in LA with RoLo and KP playing the Bynum and Gasol role in their own way.