nyknickzingis wrote:Monroe is better on offense in terms of being able to create his own shot.
For defense, screen setting, little intangibles, RLO way better.
I actually have always liked him - and my respect for his game grew ten fold when I saw him battle Dwight a few years ago in the playoffs. He did a fantastic job in basically playing him straight up the entire series. His team won, and he was a key part of that.He does that for us as well, when need be. Tonight outplayed Whiteside, he's outplayed Drummond as well. With RLO the stats don't reflect his impact. He's a solid starter to have if you have 3 weapons on the floor that can flat out score. Since we don't always have all our weapons going - often RLO's lack of scoring skill is exposed or picked on. The key for him longterm is for KP to develop and for us into a reliable 18-20 ppg guy to be able to get someone to do what Afflalo's been doing the last few games on a consistent basis.
He dominated whiteside tonight. He seems to shot down all traditional bigs.
And to be fair to those who were criticizing Lopez, he was awful on offense early on in the season. That was the offense though. He was used to PnR basketball in Portland, and some post ups, and in NY all of a sudden he was being thrown the ball plenty in post ups. His instincts were to do something, and when he did it was awful. Now he's much much better when he catches the ball in the post. He looks for cutters first, ans does alot of what Samaki Walker was talking about in that video. Once the cutters do their movement, if there's no play to be made to a teammate, he makes a post move, usually a pivot or spin and then a hook. Very simple and he gets it way better. He first looks to make the pass, then when that's not available the post move comes. And his balance in the post has improved considerably.
If Lopez can give this team what he's done the last 10-15 games, we're going to be real happy with him. He just can't revert to being the other Lopez from early in the season - holding the ball too long, making poor unbalanced post moves.
I just love how a month ago practically everyone on this board was wanting him gone and making up trades of who we can trade him for but some people kept bringing up the fact that this is a whole new team and almost every player on our team is learning a new offense (triangle) so we need to give him time and all the other guys who weren't playing well time to learn the offense. It's like people just look right past that and you just can't do that. The same goes for Grant, this kid is gonna need time cause not only is he a rookie but he's played in one certain offense for 4 years in college and now he's coming to the NBA to learn to play a totally different way. What i'm saying is that people need to learn patience on here and while i'm at it the same goes for D.Fisher. This guy is in his second year of being a head coach and was given a absolutely horrible team to coach last year so this is his first year of coaching a real team and he's trying to teach this system to a team that is full of players that have never played in this system. I have no idea if Fisher will end up being a good head coach or not but it looks to me like these players are starting to get this system especially Rolo and with that he's looking much more like he will be a good head coach but we're still a ways away from saying if he will or won't yet.
PATIENCE PEOPLE PATIENCE.
yikes. after a few good games folks are quick to bring up this post. lol
i believe someone else said it best..."monroe is better than rolo on offense but lopez is better at everything else"
im happy he is on the team
newyorker4ever wrote:I just love how a month ago practically everyone on this board was wanting him gone and making up trades of who we can trade him for but some people kept bringing up the fact that this is a whole new team and almost every player on our team is learning a new offense (triangle) so we need to give him time and all the other guys who weren't playing well time to learn the offense. It's like people just look right past that and you just can't do that. The same goes for Grant, this kid is gonna need time cause not only is he a rookie but he's played in one certain offense for 4 years in college and now he's coming to the NBA to learn to play a totally different way. What i'm saying is that people need to learn patience on here and while i'm at it the same goes for D.Fisher. This guy is in his second year of being a head coach and was given a absolutely horrible team to coach last year so this is his first year of coaching a real team and he's trying to teach this system to a team that is full of players that have never played in this system. I have no idea if Fisher will end up being a good head coach or not but it looks to me like these players are starting to get this system especially Rolo and with that he's looking much more like he will be a good head coach but we're still a ways away from saying if he will or won't yet.PATIENCE PEOPLE PATIENCE.
Its all about patience. Lopez was going to figure it out at some point, just like Fisher was going to improve, Melo was going to get his rhythm back, and KP was going to come down to earth a little bit and look like a rookie from time to time. Need to just give these things time to balance out.
Knixkik wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:I just love how a month ago practically everyone on this board was wanting him gone and making up trades of who we can trade him for but some people kept bringing up the fact that this is a whole new team and almost every player on our team is learning a new offense (triangle) so we need to give him time and all the other guys who weren't playing well time to learn the offense. It's like people just look right past that and you just can't do that. The same goes for Grant, this kid is gonna need time cause not only is he a rookie but he's played in one certain offense for 4 years in college and now he's coming to the NBA to learn to play a totally different way. What i'm saying is that people need to learn patience on here and while i'm at it the same goes for D.Fisher. This guy is in his second year of being a head coach and was given a absolutely horrible team to coach last year so this is his first year of coaching a real team and he's trying to teach this system to a team that is full of players that have never played in this system. I have no idea if Fisher will end up being a good head coach or not but it looks to me like these players are starting to get this system especially Rolo and with that he's looking much more like he will be a good head coach but we're still a ways away from saying if he will or won't yet.PATIENCE PEOPLE PATIENCE.
Its all about patience. Lopez was going to figure it out at some point, just like Fisher was going to improve, Melo was going to get his rhythm back, and KP was going to come down to earth a little bit and look like a rookie from time to time. Need to just give these things time to balance out.
I agree about patience! This team has needed time to adjust and gel. The chemistry is getting better and Fish is getting better. They still have a chance to make the roster deeper as well, but the players we have are starting to get it and execute at a higher level. There's still a lot of upside with this team as they raise their level of play.
RoLo in particular has really made a huge difference and as he continues to develop that is going to be a big boost for this team. He's still relatively young for a C and both RoLo and KP are a heck of a tandem on the defensive end.
callmened wrote:yikes. after a few good games folks are quick to bring up this post. loli believe someone else said it best..."monroe is better than rolo on offense but lopez is better at everything else"
im happy he is on the team
well after each bad game we got to see a billion rolo sux posts so trying to balance it out (a bit)
callmened wrote:yikes. after a few good games folks are quick to bring up this post. loli believe someone else said it best..."monroe is better than rolo on offense but lopez is better at everything else"
im happy he is on the team
Lopez has taken a lot of shyte from certain folks around here.
I do expect, though, that mreinman might experience some added satisfaction in keeping this thread current (and contradicted) because of who originated it.
WaltLongmire wrote:callmened wrote:yikes. after a few good games folks are quick to bring up this post. loli believe someone else said it best..."monroe is better than rolo on offense but lopez is better at everything else"
im happy he is on the team
Lopez has taken a lot of shyte from certain folks around here.I do expect, though, that mreinman might experience some added satisfaction in keeping this thread current (and contradicted) because of who originated it.
and this is what bothers me. He comes up with an idea / position and he creates 20 thousands threads saying the same wrong crap over and over again as if he is the daddy and we are his little boys and what he says we should be listening to and taking notes.
If you keep bumping your own threads again and again them it is open season to bump your threads as well.
I still say there was nothing not to like about the Maurice Taylor trade. Just not at the time.
And Cole is -274.71 * better than Rolo.
who still wishes we got monroe over rolo? Rolo outplayed him tonight even though monroe got hot late.
Rolo scored 14 on 8 shots and monroe scored 28 on 16 shots. So same efficient. Both had 9 boards and they both had 2 assists. They both had a block.
Rolo played sik defense and monroe played none.
mreinman wrote:who still wishes we got monroe over rolo? Rolo outplayed him tonight even though monroe got hot late. Rolo scored 14 on 8 shots and monroe scored 28 on 16 shots. So same efficient. Both had 9 boards and they both had 2 assists. They both had a block.
Rolo played sik defense and monroe played none.
The D is the big thing for me...Rolo's offense is icing on the cake.
Monroe is not a terrible 1/1 player defender-has a strong base, but you simply do not feel his presence on the defensive end as a shot blocker and intimidating presence.
Add Parker to their defensive mix, and you have a pretty weak frontline, and when the Greek has to play outside on an opponent's SF, you really have no shot blocking presence in the middle.
WaltLongmire wrote:mreinman wrote:who still wishes we got monroe over rolo? Rolo outplayed him tonight even though monroe got hot late. Rolo scored 14 on 8 shots and monroe scored 28 on 16 shots. So same efficient. Both had 9 boards and they both had 2 assists. They both had a block.
Rolo played sik defense and monroe played none.
The D is the big thing for me...Rolo's offense is icing on the cake.
Monroe is not a terrible 1/1 player defender-has a strong base, but you simply do not feel his presence on the defensive end as a shot blocker and intimidating presence.
Add Parker to their defensive mix, and you have a pretty weak frontline, and when the Greek has to play outside on an opponent's SF, you really have no shot blocking presence in the middle.
and not just the defense but the leadership, attitude and hustle
I wonder if Monroe thinks maybe he should have signed with the Knicks? He figured Milwaukee was a better team, but they're worse. Detroit, who he left, are playing much better as well. Sometimes players, no matter what numbers they put up, just aren't winners.
He's got a 2017 opt out and I guarantee he will sign elsewhere.
I like the way Lopez has played the last ten games--probably the best string of games hes had in 3 years. Do we know definitely whether we would be better or worse with Monroe? He wont give you that force Lopez gives(or has now been giving) which is big time. But would Monroe score 18-20 points here and benefit from playing backed up by Porzingis as well?
BRIGGS wrote:I like the way Lopez has played the last ten games--probably the best string of games hes had in 3 years. Do we know definitely whether we would be better or worse with Monroe? He wont give you that force Lopez gives(or has now been giving) which is big time. But would Monroe score 18-20 points here and benefit from playing backed up by Porzingis as well?
well first, monroe is not 100x better than monroe. Monroe is a good offensive player but I would take lopez over him any day.
Interesting that lopez always wins and monroe always loses ... does that have to do with them? perhaps yes.
The whole thread was misguided anyway. It's not about who the better player is, it's about who the better fit is and that is ROLO by a mile. The last thing we needed was a big who scores but doesn't play D. It would've totally changed the nature of our team. Our bigs r so could in the paint Calderon is not a defensive liability anymore. I'm very glad we got ROLO instead of Greg Monroe. ESPECIALLY with the emergence of KP
I don't have the time or inclination to go back through 9 pages of posts, but has anyone commented on the possible Freudian slip Briggs made by almost spelling Monroe's last name as closely as possible to 'Manure'?
Rolo is a great center for this particular team we have.
BRIGGS wrote:
I like the way Lopez has played the last ten games-- probably the best string of games hes had in 3 years. Do we know definitely whether we would be better or worse with Monroe? He wont give you that force Lopez gives(or has now been giving) which is big time. But would Monroe score 18-20 points here and benefit from playing backed up by Porzingis as well?
In what sense? This is just the normal Lopez.
Porzingis/Monroe/Melo would also have been fantastic. The key difference is roles. Porzingis would need to anchor more and be a full time rim protector, something he doesn't have to do right now with Lopez. On offense though, you'd see less dry spots in the offense and less reliance on so much ball movement to get an open shot. With Lopez, he can create some shots in the post, but he's mainly a guy who sets great screens and holds great post position. Monroe OTOH can actually score regardless - again and again down there. He's got many more moves.
I think the potential on offense is higher with Monroe, but the defensive potential is higher with Lopez. In a way that's what we're seeing. We aren't a team a that can overwhelm teams with our scoring ability. We don't even have a true defined 2nd option - which would not be the case with Monroe. But, we're a much better defensive, rebounding and intangibles team with Lopez in the middle. It also allows Porzingis to play PF for a few years until he is strong and smart enough to play more minutes at 5. With Monroe, Porzingis wouldn't be able to stay out of foul trouble as much as he'd be the guy on defense that would have to do much of what Lopez is. He has the skill for it, but not the smarts or ability to stay out of foul trouble. And he'd get pushed around considerably.
IMO Phil wanted Monroe first with good reason, the offense would be on a different level, but he also got his 2nd option for good reason. Both would have had their positives and negatives. That said, Lopez is a fantastic teammate and a great intangibles guy. He is not selfish at all. I can see him root for a teammate's success playing 10 minutes a night. I can't see Monroe being like that. For the longrun, I think having Lopez is way better. In the short run, I think Monroe would give us something we do need - a defined 2nd option who brings it every night - and that's why I understand why Phil wanted him first, Lopez 2nd.
