Knicks · Id try to get rid of all cap space including CA (page 1)

Id move KP to C and give out max contracts to Demar Derozan and Nichols Batum. Two smaller contracts to A Scvehd 4 years 22mm and Boran Maranovich 4 years 22mm

Thats free agency.

I have 9 outlined guards from college Id like to get 3 of them--most likely from either the 2nd rd or undrafted but if I can get up high enough Id like to start with Denzell Valentine and hopeful to get Kay Felder early in rd 2with one of two of the other guards falling out of the draft so I can bring them to SL. It would give me an additional 38mm to get rid of CA and Lopez IF I can bring back limited on year deals or limited deals I might be able to push elsewhere in 3 ways.

That would leave me like this

C KP
F Batum (4 year max)
G Valentine (later first rd pick)
G Derozan(4 year max)
G Schveyd (4 years 22mm)

C Boban (4 years 22mm)
F Lance Thomas (3 years 10mm)
G Affalo
G Grant
G Felder (2nd round pick)

C Mamadou Ndiaye(undrafted C minX3) Westchester
F James Mcadoo (2 year minimum)
F Shonn Miller(undrafted minimum X3)
G Isiah Miles (undrafted minimumX3)
G D J Augustine (PG vet min)

crzymdups wrote:rinse wash repeat. every year we should get rid of all our players for picks and cap space. perpetual hope!

I thought about our negatives last night

A. We need age continuity. We need players to stay TOGETHER and the roster Phil built 1-15 is not like that.

B We need more of a mobile team with more guards--6 in the top 10 just like GS

C Batum is better for this team than Carmelo but they cant be on the same team

D We need to make use of roster spots 12-15 to develop(help rebuild the team longer term) Not having guys like Admundson Sasha etc.. anymore. It did nothing for us.

E We have rim protection in each unit but were more mobile--more capable of guarding the perimeter as well

Were a true 10 deep so we have a set 10 man rotation and have Mcadoo and Augustine as 11-12--the C in Westechester and the other two guys taking turns down in Westchester.

Wed have to trade
Lopez Carmelo Williams and Oquinn and waive and spread out Calderons contracts.

BRIGGS wrote:

crzymdups wrote:rinse wash repeat. every year we should get rid of all our players for picks and cap space. perpetual hope!

I thought about our negatives last night

A. We need age continuity. We need players to stay TOGETHER and the roster Phil built 1-15 is not like that.

B We need more of a mobile team with more guards--6 in the top 10 just like GS

C Batum is better for this team than Carmelo but they cant be on the same team

D We need to make use of roster spots 12-15 to develop(help rebuild the team longer term) Not having guys like Admundson Sasha etc.. anymore. It did nothing for us.

E We have rim protection in each unit but were more mobile--more capable of guarding the perimeter as well

Were a true 10 deep so we have a set 10 man rotation and have Mcadoo and Augustine as 11-12--the C in Westechester and the other two guys taking turns down in Westchester.

Wed have to trade
Lopez Carmelo Williams and Oquinn and waive and spread out Calderons contracts.

Why couldn't Batum and Melo be on the same team?

We definitely need to upgrade the guards.

The roster is mostly guys 27 or younger. Look around the league - it makes sense to mesh younger guys with veterans. The Spurs do it, Miami does it, Minnesota is doing it. What's the age continuity between Kawhi and LMA and Duncan? Those guys are all at different stages of their career.

BRIGGS wrote:C KP
F Batum (4 year max)
G Valentine (later first rd pick)
G Derozan(4 year max)
G Schveyd (4 years 22mm)

C Boban (4 years 22mm)
F Lance Thomas (3 years 10mm)
G Affalo
G Grant
G Felder (2nd round pick)

That's an awful, perpetual lottery team unless KP becomes superman as a sophmore. DeRozan is overrated. Schved is a career 35% shooter. Batum as Power forward Im not sure how that works. Boban is basically a pop culture sensation and a role player. I like Lance. Afflalo sucks, doesnt pass, doesnt rebound if his shot is off he is a huge net negative. Grant I like but he is far from a sure thing at this point. Valentine and Felder I am assuming are draft picks who are coming out this year so who knows what theyll be. But yeah, this looks like a disaster. Sorry cant get on board.

fishmike wrote:Melo trades are as equally entertaining as threads regarding who we will pick if we make the lottery. Both an equal waste of time.

I never understood that attiude. People in your camp pretend that NTCs can't be waived. KG had two and was traded both times despite him being emmensely loyal. Needless to say, Melo can and hopefully will be dealt (stated by a huge Melo fan that is a bigger Knick fan).

BRIGGS wrote:for draft picks pieces and players.

Id move KP to C and give out max contracts to Demar Derozan and Nichols Batum. Two smaller contracts to A Scvehd 4 years 22mm and Boran Maranovich 4 years 22mm

Thats free agency.

I have 9 outlined guards from college Id like to get 3 of them--most likely from either the 2nd rd or undrafted but if I can get up high enough Id like to start with Denzell Valentine and hopeful to get Kay Felder early in rd 2with one of two of the other guards falling out of the draft so I can bring them to SL. It would give me an additional 38mm to get rid of CA and Lopez IF I can bring back limited on year deals or limited deals I might be able to push elsewhere in 3 ways.

That would leave me like this

C KP
F Batum (4 year max)
G Valentine (later first rd pick)
G Derozan(4 year max)
G Schveyd (4 years 22mm)

C Boban (4 years 22mm)
F Lance Thomas (3 years 10mm)
G Affalo
G Grant
G Felder (2nd round pick)

C Mamadou Ndiaye(undrafted C minX3) Westchester
F James Mcadoo (2 year minimum)
F Shonn Miller(undrafted minimum X3)
G Isiah Miles (undrafted minimumX3)
G D J Augustine (PG vet min)

Why would both Batum and Derozan, sign with a rebuilding team? Because that's what we'd be without Melo and I can't see above average veterans flocking here when so many contenders will have cap space.

NardDogNation wrote:

fishmike wrote:Melo trades are as equally entertaining as threads regarding who we will pick if we make the lottery. Both an equal waste of time.

I never understood that attiude. People in your camp pretend that NTCs can't be waived. KG had two and was traded both times despite him being emmensely loyal. Needless to say, Melo can and hopefully will be dealt (stated by a huge Melo fan that is a bigger Knick fan).

Got any other examples? Is there anything in the KG situation that resembles ours? Pretty sure the answer is a big NO to both, but feel free to write a few paragraphs. If you are thinking up trade scenarios with Melo you must have time on your hands. Entertain us...

H1AND1 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:C KP
F Batum (4 year max)
G Valentine (later first rd pick)
G Derozan(4 year max)
G Schveyd (4 years 22mm)

C Boban (4 years 22mm)
F Lance Thomas (3 years 10mm)
G Affalo
G Grant
G Felder (2nd round pick)

That's an awful, perpetual lottery team unless KP becomes superman as a sophmore. DeRozan is overrated. Schved is a career 35% shooter. Batum as Power forward Im not sure how that works. Boban is basically a pop culture sensation and a role player. I like Lance. Afflalo sucks, doesnt pass, doesnt rebound if his shot is off he is a huge net negative. Grant I like but he is far from a sure thing at this point. Valentine and Felder I am assuming are draft picks who are coming out this year so who knows what theyll be. But yeah, this looks like a disaster. Sorry cant get on board.

You dont watch much NBA then.

fishmike wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

fishmike wrote:Melo trades are as equally entertaining as threads regarding who we will pick if we make the lottery. Both an equal waste of time.

I never understood that attiude. People in your camp pretend that NTCs can't be waived. KG had two and was traded both times despite him being emmensely loyal. Needless to say, Melo can and hopefully will be dealt (stated by a huge Melo fan that is a bigger Knick fan).

right... I equally dont understand the attitude that because something immensely rare happening one place means it can happen in another. Also KG waived it after being convinced by Paul Pierce, and waived it again when the Brooklyn situation was a total disaster. KG waiving his clause does not mean "it happens."

Got any other examples? Is there anything in the KG situation that resembles ours? Pretty sure the answer is a big NO to both, but feel free to write a few paragraphs. If you are thinking up trade scenarios with Melo you must have time on your hands. Entertain us...

No-trade clauses are by definition, rare. So you criticize the KG situation as being "rare" or an exception to the rule seems....misguided. Aside from him, I can only think of Kobe who has one....maybe Duncan on the Spurs. And if that is the case, then no-trade clauses have been waived 33%-50% of the time, which isn't exactly a "rare" occurrence.

NardDogNation wrote:

fishmike wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

fishmike wrote:Melo trades are as equally entertaining as threads regarding who we will pick if we make the lottery. Both an equal waste of time.

I never understood that attiude. People in your camp pretend that NTCs can't be waived. KG had two and was traded both times despite him being emmensely loyal. Needless to say, Melo can and hopefully will be dealt (stated by a huge Melo fan that is a bigger Knick fan).

right... I equally dont understand the attitude that because something immensely rare happening one place means it can happen in another. Also KG waived it after being convinced by Paul Pierce, and waived it again when the Brooklyn situation was a total disaster. KG waiving his clause does not mean "it happens."

Got any other examples? Is there anything in the KG situation that resembles ours? Pretty sure the answer is a big NO to both, but feel free to write a few paragraphs. If you are thinking up trade scenarios with Melo you must have time on your hands. Entertain us...

No-trade clauses are by definition, rare. So you criticize the KG situation as being "rare" or an exception to the rule seems....misguided. Aside from him, I can only think of Kobe who has one....maybe Duncan on the Spurs. And if that is the case, then no-trade clauses have been waived 33%-50% of the time, which isn't exactly a "rare" occurrence.

At least make these stupid proposals a viable destination, and there is really only 1... LA. Do you really think he's waiving his clause to play in Utah or some of these other places? Is that common sense? Waste of time and space.

crzymdups wrote:Briggs, Shved is under contract in Russia for 3 years with no opt out. Time to let that one go.

fishmike wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

fishmike wrote:Melo trades are as equally entertaining as threads regarding who we will pick if we make the lottery. Both an equal waste of time.

I never understood that attiude. People in your camp pretend that NTCs can't be waived. KG had two and was traded both times despite him being emmensely loyal. Needless to say, Melo can and hopefully will be dealt (stated by a huge Melo fan that is a bigger Knick fan).

right... I equally dont understand the attitude that because something immensely rare happening one place means it can happen in another. Also KG waived it after being convinced by Paul Pierce, and waived it again when the Brooklyn situation was a total disaster. KG waiving his clause does not mean "it happens."

Got any other examples? Is there anything in the KG situation that resembles ours? Pretty sure the answer is a big NO to both, but feel free to write a few paragraphs. If you are thinking up trade scenarios with Melo you must have time on your hands. Entertain us...

fish - congratulations on regaining exclusive control of the Fish moniker with only a slight reference to a past Knick coach.

Be careful lest you end up like him- tossed out like yesterdays Briggs thread of instanta fix knick roster overnight transformation into G State 2.0 East.

I will say I think we should be smart to evaluate trade scenarios at the deadline that involve us considering selling assets in return for long term prospects. I'd even consider trading Porzingas if the deal was obscene enough - think Boston and all their draft picks.

Is a Melo trade likely? No. I wish, because I think he has too many miles on his body to remain healthy and productive enough over the life of his contract.

Hope I'm wrong!

Knixkik wrote:Not a good looking team, sorry.

Hmm I kind of think Batum at PF would bring out his premium potential. Valentine is an NBA starter right now and goes with the concept of 5 guys who will move the ball and can shoot the 3. Derozan is my athletic scorer and instead of overpaying a Conley or anyone else I simply pay Schveyd 1/3 anbd he will give me what I want.

Second line up same 3 guards with one primary 3 points hoot (Affalo) yet able to spread the floor more by playing 4-1 with a good defender at my mobile 4.

3rd line is 3 prospects and 2 vets. No team really goes past 12 deep for the most part and the way to build assets is to develop them. There is no pressure on them to start or even be part of the main team and they have a full year year and half to prove they belong here or they are simply removed.

fishmike wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

fishmike wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

fishmike wrote:Melo trades are as equally entertaining as threads regarding who we will pick if we make the lottery. Both an equal waste of time.

I never understood that attiude. People in your camp pretend that NTCs can't be waived. KG had two and was traded both times despite him being emmensely loyal. Needless to say, Melo can and hopefully will be dealt (stated by a huge Melo fan that is a bigger Knick fan).

right... I equally dont understand the attitude that because something immensely rare happening one place means it can happen in another. Also KG waived it after being convinced by Paul Pierce, and waived it again when the Brooklyn situation was a total disaster. KG waiving his clause does not mean "it happens."

Got any other examples? Is there anything in the KG situation that resembles ours? Pretty sure the answer is a big NO to both, but feel free to write a few paragraphs. If you are thinking up trade scenarios with Melo you must have time on your hands. Entertain us...

No-trade clauses are by definition, rare. So you criticize the KG situation as being "rare" or an exception to the rule seems....misguided. Aside from him, I can only think of Kobe who has one....maybe Duncan on the Spurs. And if that is the case, then no-trade clauses have been waived 33%-50% of the time, which isn't exactly a "rare" occurrence.

ok, how about common sense? Why did Melo sign a contract to play in NY?

At least make these stupid proposals a viable destination, and there is really only 1... LA. Do you really think he's waiving his clause to play in Utah or some of these other places? Is that common sense? Waste of time and space.

Dude, calm your ass down. If views that differ from your own are so upsetting then maybe a forum for the exchange of ideas isn't for you.

To answer your question, Melo re-signed here because it was the more financially viable option. He managed to get higher annual raises, an additional year to his contract and immediate access to the largest economic market on the face of the Earth ALL gauranteed. Simply put, we were a sound business decision especially for a guy entering the twilight of his career and whose body is about to pull an Amar'e. I also think that the idea of playing for Phil Jackson made him feel a bit more optimistic about us being competitive. But given Melo's track record, money and the bright lights are what is appealing to him (which is why he left a better DEN team to come here via trade instead of free agency).

The NTC was not some act of undying loyalty for the franchise on his part, it was a means to ensure that his fascination with the "bright lights", the only element of his contract that was NOT guaranteed, could be maintained even if it wasn't in NY. Now, he has the ability to pick where he wants to go with his gauranteed money. And fortunately for him, there are other cities that break about even with us given their financial markets AND ability to be a contender. Like you mentioned LAC is one of them. I also think that MIA and CHI, the 4th and 3rd largest markets in the country, have a puncher's chance as well. All 3 teams can produce compelling packages that would allow them to still be a contender if they traded for him and have the spare assets to satisfy us. Outside of those 3, I don't see Melo going anywhere. But those 3 are compelling enough where I think it would happen when we are ready to pull the plug.