knicks1248 wrote:BRIGGS wrote:Jim Dolan has done the same thing with Carmelo as he did with isiah. He made a terrible trade that hamstrung the team twice once with the original and second with bargain. Now his idiot move to give a ntc has stuck is in the mid with him He could've left for clev and we would've had multi assets to improve which is what we needed to do. So were stuck with him and will be forced. By him to over pay for a pro pg either through free agency or trade and it still Wong be near enough
Assets??? your going to give a player a max contract and then trade him a yr later (if he didn't have the NTC)how assinine would that look.
You act as if Melo is a overrated, or a bad influence..relax brigg
Its not that he makes no sense with the direction of the franchise. We need to surround Porzingis with a high draft pick young core
Jmpasq wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
He would of never signed without the NTC. He knows we would of shipped him somewhere awful. We should of lowered our offer once he demanded that. Honestly I think Phil believed Melo would see the light and he would be able to trade him. He underestimated his stubbornness
If he were to sign for less then max then he would just sign with the Bulls.
If we let Melo walk, and have no draft pick in 2016. How do we acquire these high level lotto picks? We could probably eat a bad contract for a mid round pick or late lotto possibly. That's about it.
BRIGGS wrote:DrAlphaeus wrote:BRIGGS wrote:DrAlphaeus wrote:BRIGGS wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:StarksEwing1 wrote:fishmike wrote:meloshouldgo wrote:Vmart wrote:Melo is a liability all because of NTC. We cannot view him as an asset. His rate of depreciation is staggering with each passing year. The return rate of his service has diminished as a result of poor numbers and injury history which is starting to pile on. Even if the Knicks were to trade they would be luck to yield a top 5 pick. At best your looking at multiple mid to late round picks for him if he desires a change of scenery. Melo has the Knicks basically held hostage. He knows he is no longer a top player and he knows the downside has started. Right now he doesn't even desire a championship or a run.
Agree with the first part he is a liability. But you can't trade liabilities unless you do a swap meaning you as acquire other liabilities. Or you can just write them off. We don't have any good options.Mistake 1 - resigning Melo
MISTAKE 2 - NTC
Mistake 3 - Overpaying by anout 140%
Only the Knicks can make three mistake in one transaction. Huge fail on Dolan/ Phil
so when you remove the liability what is the Knicks record? And with the liability? Do you guys even think before you post? Are you Knick fans?VMart can you quantify the bold statement? Melo's shot has been off, but this is his best year defensively, he's at his career high for rebounds and is above his career high in assists, oh.. and the team cant win without him on the floor. Kind of makes your liability statement look not so clever.
You guys are like grumpy monkeys. This shiny object isn't fun to play with anymore. You need a new shiny object.
had a feeling fishmike or jrdomc would lead the melo bridgade. Listen I personally have been happy with melo this year and im ok if he stays. However I still feel a trade would be beneficial for both sides. Melo can have a chance to win a title and we can use the picks/assets to continue to build around KP
Well said and i agree. It's just so annoying how much people cry about crap on here and just look for things to hate on. If it's not Fisher it's Calderon or Melo or Phil or.............................give it a break and stop hating so much. We'd be nowhere without Melo and hating on someone that actually wants to be here and wants to bring this city/team a championship is absolutely ridiculous. If Melo was on another team right now and never played for us and his name was on the trade block i guarantee you the people that are hating on him now would be hoping we could trade for him.
No hating--Id just rather do whats in the best interests for the KNicks. Would I rather have 2 Brooklyn picks David Lee and Jae Crwoder--I mean come on. I might think Id rather have Crwoder than Melo straight up for the longer term than add in the picks and cap space??????
No hating? I call bullshit. What's the señorita crap about?
Hes a pssy for holding up the Knicks.
So you are hating. You aren't talking like some dispassionate business man. You sound like a jilted lover.
I guess as a fan I know hes just going to gpo south here and Id rather build around KP with 20-27 years olds who can stay together. Hes a good player just not for this team. Much better for Cleveland. Thats why we are 23-32 and perhaps luck to be that.
Yep why don't posters understand that. Melo is the best player on the team, he makes the team better however he makes no sense with Porzingis here. All Melo will do will make sure we add enough high priced mediocre players that we make the playoffs net year when we really need to be very bad.
newyorknewyork wrote:Jmpasq wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
He would of never signed without the NTC. He knows we would of shipped him somewhere awful. We should of lowered our offer once he demanded that. Honestly I think Phil believed Melo would see the light and he would be able to trade him. He underestimated his stubbornness
If he were to sign for less then max then he would just sign with the Bulls.
If we let Melo walk, and have no draft pick in 2016. How do we acquire these high level lotto picks? We could probably eat a bad contract for a mid round pick or late lotto possibly. That's about it.
Im not sure he would of signed with the Bulls with equal deals on the table. He would let us trade him now if that was the case
Jmpasq wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
He would of never signed without the NTC. He knows we would of shipped him somewhere awful. We should of lowered our offer once he demanded that. Honestly I think Phil believed Melo would see the light and he would be able to trade him. He underestimated his stubbornness
You could offer him 4 yrs, 96 mil with a no trade clause or 5/124 without it. Both beat any offer other teams can make. If he'd rather take an inferior offer elsewhere, then he doesn't want to be here. We've been a bad lottery team with him anyway since the signing (40 wins, 97 losses) - so I don't care if he signed elsewhere. To be clear, I would have traded him well before he became an FA but that's ancient history.
Bonn1997 wrote:Jmpasq wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
He would of never signed without the NTC. He knows we would of shipped him somewhere awful. We should of lowered our offer once he demanded that. Honestly I think Phil believed Melo would see the light and he would be able to trade him. He underestimated his stubbornness
You could offer him 4 yrs, 96 mil with a no trade clause or 5/124 without it. Both beat any offer other teams can make. If he'd rather take an inferior offer elsewhere, then he doesn't want to be here. We've been a bad lottery team with him anyway since the signing (40 wins, 97 losses) - so I don't care if he signed elsewhere. To be clear, I would have traded him well before he became an FA but that's ancient history.
No one will give him NTC nut MSG.
NTC is something Melo want to fight for on behalf of the players.
This in his mind is his future legacy as players representative.
Unfortunately to players and fortunately for the game of basketball he himself is an example of everything wrong with NTC.
arkrud wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Jmpasq wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
He would of never signed without the NTC. He knows we would of shipped him somewhere awful. We should of lowered our offer once he demanded that. Honestly I think Phil believed Melo would see the light and he would be able to trade him. He underestimated his stubbornness
You could offer him 4 yrs, 96 mil with a no trade clause or 5/124 without it. Both beat any offer other teams can make. If he'd rather take an inferior offer elsewhere, then he doesn't want to be here. We've been a bad lottery team with him anyway since the signing (40 wins, 97 losses) - so I don't care if he signed elsewhere. To be clear, I would have traded him well before he became an FA but that's ancient history.
No one will give him NTC nut MSG.
NTC is something Melo want to fight for on behalf of the players.
This in his mind is his future legacy as players representative.
Unfortunately to players and fortunately for the game of basketball he himself is an example of everything wrong with NTC.
actually its everything right with the NTC. The players value is capped. Guys like Melo sacrfice money so the NBA's middle class can get paid. So the NTC at least gives the player some control over his career once they sign. Its funny.. money makes it all better right? Imagine your company tells you that you need to move to Clev or Phili because they pay you well and suck it up. Its for the best of the company. Sorry those cities suck to live and you need to move your family. These guys are humans and deserve to make the money they can earn and live where they want to live. If you have earned the right for more control than you have earned the right to exercise that control.
Knicks traded an unprotected pick for Bargs. Knicks are probably in the lottery this year and imagine they win and miss on Ben Simmons. Thats Knick's front office management. However somehow this responsibility is on Melo to "do the right thing" and let the Knicks trade him so they can restock the cupboard after years of poor management while this player carried the load night after night. That strikes you as fair? Reasonable? But its sports and Melo isnt winning here and its OUR team so he should "do the right thing" or face the venom of fans.
I find that thinking incredibly narrow minded, selfish, and having no basis in reality. Might even call it un-American.
fishmike wrote:arkrud wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Jmpasq wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
He would of never signed without the NTC. He knows we would of shipped him somewhere awful. We should of lowered our offer once he demanded that. Honestly I think Phil believed Melo would see the light and he would be able to trade him. He underestimated his stubbornness
You could offer him 4 yrs, 96 mil with a no trade clause or 5/124 without it. Both beat any offer other teams can make. If he'd rather take an inferior offer elsewhere, then he doesn't want to be here. We've been a bad lottery team with him anyway since the signing (40 wins, 97 losses) - so I don't care if he signed elsewhere. To be clear, I would have traded him well before he became an FA but that's ancient history.
No one will give him NTC nut MSG.
NTC is something Melo want to fight for on behalf of the players.
This in his mind is his future legacy as players representative.
Unfortunately to players and fortunately for the game of basketball he himself is an example of everything wrong with NTC.
actually its everything right with the NTC. The players value is capped. Guys like Melo sacrfice money so the NBA's middle class can get paid. So the NTC at least gives the player some control over his career once they sign. Its funny.. money makes it all better right? Imagine your company tells you that you need to move to Clev or Phili because they pay you well and suck it up. Its for the best of the company. Sorry those cities suck to live and you need to move your family. These guys are humans and deserve to make the money they can earn and live where they want to live. If you have earned the right for more control than you have earned the right to exercise that control. Knicks traded an unprotected pick for Bargs. Knicks are probably in the lottery this year and imagine they win and miss on Ben Simmons. Thats Knick's front office management. However somehow this responsibility is on Melo to "do the right thing" and let the Knicks trade him so they can restock the cupboard after years of poor management while this player carried the load night after night. That strikes you as fair? Reasonable? But its sports and Melo isnt winning here and its OUR team so he should "do the right thing" or face the venom of fans.
I find that thinking incredibly narrow minded, selfish, and having no basis in reality. Might even call it un-American.
i wish there were more neutral fans. I think both melo lovers and haters are off base
Jmpasq wrote:newyorknewyork wrote:Jmpasq wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
He would of never signed without the NTC. He knows we would of shipped him somewhere awful. We should of lowered our offer once he demanded that. Honestly I think Phil believed Melo would see the light and he would be able to trade him. He underestimated his stubbornness
If he were to sign for less then max then he would just sign with the Bulls.
If we let Melo walk, and have no draft pick in 2016. How do we acquire these high level lotto picks? We could probably eat a bad contract for a mid round pick or late lotto possibly. That's about it.
Im not sure he would of signed with the Bulls with equal deals on the table. He would let us trade him now if that was the case
If Phil told Carmelo that he would only sign him for a certain price. Then Melo would sign with the Bulls. There was nothing for us to offer Carmelo at the time that made us more appealing then the Bulls or Houston other then a ton of money.
If Carmelo ends up being hobbled down the road then we get Lotto picks as consolation prizes going forward minus this yr. Or he actually maintains enough health to actual build a good team with him and KP.
If we let Melo walk for nothing then that Brooklyn pick wouldn't even be a possibility. But it is due to us resigning Melo.
fishmike wrote:arkrud wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Jmpasq wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
He would of never signed without the NTC. He knows we would of shipped him somewhere awful. We should of lowered our offer once he demanded that. Honestly I think Phil believed Melo would see the light and he would be able to trade him. He underestimated his stubbornness
You could offer him 4 yrs, 96 mil with a no trade clause or 5/124 without it. Both beat any offer other teams can make. If he'd rather take an inferior offer elsewhere, then he doesn't want to be here. We've been a bad lottery team with him anyway since the signing (40 wins, 97 losses) - so I don't care if he signed elsewhere. To be clear, I would have traded him well before he became an FA but that's ancient history.
No one will give him NTC nut MSG.
NTC is something Melo want to fight for on behalf of the players.
This in his mind is his future legacy as players representative.
Unfortunately to players and fortunately for the game of basketball he himself is an example of everything wrong with NTC.
actually its everything right with the NTC. The players value is capped. Guys like Melo sacrfice money so the NBA's middle class can get paid. So the NTC at least gives the player some control over his career once they sign. Its funny.. money makes it all better right? Imagine your company tells you that you need to move to Clev or Phili because they pay you well and suck it up. Its for the best of the company. Sorry those cities suck to live and you need to move your family. These guys are humans and deserve to make the money they can earn and live where they want to live. If you have earned the right for more control than you have earned the right to exercise that control. Knicks traded an unprotected pick for Bargs. Knicks are probably in the lottery this year and imagine they win and miss on Ben Simmons. Thats Knick's front office management. However somehow this responsibility is on Melo to "do the right thing" and let the Knicks trade him so they can restock the cupboard after years of poor management while this player carried the load night after night. That strikes you as fair? Reasonable? But its sports and Melo isnt winning here and its OUR team so he should "do the right thing" or face the venom of fans.
I find that thinking incredibly narrow minded, selfish, and having no basis in reality. Might even call it un-American.
Thank you. I get tired of dealing with the moral panic and outrage about Melo asking for what any one of us would ask for in the same situation.
fishmike wrote:arkrud wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Jmpasq wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
He would of never signed without the NTC. He knows we would of shipped him somewhere awful. We should of lowered our offer once he demanded that. Honestly I think Phil believed Melo would see the light and he would be able to trade him. He underestimated his stubbornness
You could offer him 4 yrs, 96 mil with a no trade clause or 5/124 without it. Both beat any offer other teams can make. If he'd rather take an inferior offer elsewhere, then he doesn't want to be here. We've been a bad lottery team with him anyway since the signing (40 wins, 97 losses) - so I don't care if he signed elsewhere. To be clear, I would have traded him well before he became an FA but that's ancient history.
No one will give him NTC nut MSG.
NTC is something Melo want to fight for on behalf of the players.
This in his mind is his future legacy as players representative.
Unfortunately to players and fortunately for the game of basketball he himself is an example of everything wrong with NTC.
actually its everything right with the NTC. The players value is capped. Guys like Melo sacrfice money so the NBA's middle class can get paid. So the NTC at least gives the player some control over his career once they sign. Its funny.. money makes it all better right? Imagine your company tells you that you need to move to Clev or Phili because they pay you well and suck it up. Its for the best of the company. Sorry those cities suck to live and you need to move your family. These guys are humans and deserve to make the money they can earn and live where they want to live. If you have earned the right for more control than you have earned the right to exercise that control. Knicks traded an unprotected pick for Bargs. Knicks are probably in the lottery this year and imagine they win and miss on Ben Simmons. Thats Knick's front office management. However somehow this responsibility is on Melo to "do the right thing" and let the Knicks trade him so they can restock the cupboard after years of poor management while this player carried the load night after night. That strikes you as fair? Reasonable? But its sports and Melo isnt winning here and its OUR team so he should "do the right thing" or face the venom of fans.
I find that thinking incredibly narrow minded, selfish, and having no basis in reality. Might even call it un-American.
NTC will be dual-edge sword. Using is owners will able to negotiate the players contract length and salaries down.
The players protection should be handles using insurance policy not player contracts.
Why fans need to pay with watching crappy product because of some unfortunate player health or personal issues?
America is the country of opportunity but it always was a country of accountability.
Not much later and that's why we as a country start sucking.
Everyone wants entitlements but no one want to be accountable for laziness and selfishness.
Time to stop handing free lunches for those who can use their hands and brains to earn it.
Time to stop the corruption of the minds of American people.
If melo left, were we at now and with whom?
Do we actually draft KP or trade the pick for other assets to fill a thin roster?
Do we have our no. 1 pick or does Toronto have it? If Melo's knee is just a post surgical expected symptom and plays thru it might his value still be ok this summer and he might be more inclined to accept a trade in the off season?
Would we get a better return of a trade?
Easy to blast and blame but its not like there is clarity if he left and his contract was off the books. Tanking this year would have made no sense. Last year we really could not have done much worse. As it stands KP at 4 might be better than anyone else.
Easy to stand up and say whats wrong but many of you lamenting and laying blame have not come up with a bonafide scenario that is better because hypotheticals don't carry any validity. The only one that caries any cred this week is Knicks1969 for his relentless slamming of Fish, and I'd say he really does not have the whole story either. When we hit .500 he was ok with him but the more we lost the more he called for his head. Guess what, a team that loses 10 of 11 is pretty telling. A broken clock is right twice a day.
I'd rather have Melo who can be traded than no Melo.
crzymdups wrote:fishmike wrote:arkrud wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Jmpasq wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
He would of never signed without the NTC. He knows we would of shipped him somewhere awful. We should of lowered our offer once he demanded that. Honestly I think Phil believed Melo would see the light and he would be able to trade him. He underestimated his stubbornness
You could offer him 4 yrs, 96 mil with a no trade clause or 5/124 without it. Both beat any offer other teams can make. If he'd rather take an inferior offer elsewhere, then he doesn't want to be here. We've been a bad lottery team with him anyway since the signing (40 wins, 97 losses) - so I don't care if he signed elsewhere. To be clear, I would have traded him well before he became an FA but that's ancient history.
No one will give him NTC nut MSG.
NTC is something Melo want to fight for on behalf of the players.
This in his mind is his future legacy as players representative.
Unfortunately to players and fortunately for the game of basketball he himself is an example of everything wrong with NTC.
actually its everything right with the NTC. The players value is capped. Guys like Melo sacrfice money so the NBA's middle class can get paid. So the NTC at least gives the player some control over his career once they sign. Its funny.. money makes it all better right? Imagine your company tells you that you need to move to Clev or Phili because they pay you well and suck it up. Its for the best of the company. Sorry those cities suck to live and you need to move your family. These guys are humans and deserve to make the money they can earn and live where they want to live. If you have earned the right for more control than you have earned the right to exercise that control. Knicks traded an unprotected pick for Bargs. Knicks are probably in the lottery this year and imagine they win and miss on Ben Simmons. Thats Knick's front office management. However somehow this responsibility is on Melo to "do the right thing" and let the Knicks trade him so they can restock the cupboard after years of poor management while this player carried the load night after night. That strikes you as fair? Reasonable? But its sports and Melo isnt winning here and its OUR team so he should "do the right thing" or face the venom of fans.
I find that thinking incredibly narrow minded, selfish, and having no basis in reality. Might even call it un-American.
Thank you. I get tired of dealing with the moral panic and outrage about Melo asking for what any one of us would ask for in the same situation.
its so old. You inject logic and actual real-world thinking and the gremlins around here call you a Melo lover. Trade him, keep him, I am fine either way. This site (and all fan sites I am sure) are littered with statements that they would never apply to themselves. Its nothing more than the culture of blame. Something isnt working, lets figure out who's fault it is.
fishmike wrote:crzymdups wrote:fishmike wrote:arkrud wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Jmpasq wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
He would of never signed without the NTC. He knows we would of shipped him somewhere awful. We should of lowered our offer once he demanded that. Honestly I think Phil believed Melo would see the light and he would be able to trade him. He underestimated his stubbornness
You could offer him 4 yrs, 96 mil with a no trade clause or 5/124 without it. Both beat any offer other teams can make. If he'd rather take an inferior offer elsewhere, then he doesn't want to be here. We've been a bad lottery team with him anyway since the signing (40 wins, 97 losses) - so I don't care if he signed elsewhere. To be clear, I would have traded him well before he became an FA but that's ancient history.
No one will give him NTC nut MSG.
NTC is something Melo want to fight for on behalf of the players.
This in his mind is his future legacy as players representative.
Unfortunately to players and fortunately for the game of basketball he himself is an example of everything wrong with NTC.
actually its everything right with the NTC. The players value is capped. Guys like Melo sacrfice money so the NBA's middle class can get paid. So the NTC at least gives the player some control over his career once they sign. Its funny.. money makes it all better right? Imagine your company tells you that you need to move to Clev or Phili because they pay you well and suck it up. Its for the best of the company. Sorry those cities suck to live and you need to move your family. These guys are humans and deserve to make the money they can earn and live where they want to live. If you have earned the right for more control than you have earned the right to exercise that control. Knicks traded an unprotected pick for Bargs. Knicks are probably in the lottery this year and imagine they win and miss on Ben Simmons. Thats Knick's front office management. However somehow this responsibility is on Melo to "do the right thing" and let the Knicks trade him so they can restock the cupboard after years of poor management while this player carried the load night after night. That strikes you as fair? Reasonable? But its sports and Melo isnt winning here and its OUR team so he should "do the right thing" or face the venom of fans.
I find that thinking incredibly narrow minded, selfish, and having no basis in reality. Might even call it un-American.
Thank you. I get tired of dealing with the moral panic and outrage about Melo asking for what any one of us would ask for in the same situation.
its so old. You inject logic and actual real-world thinking and the gremlins around here call you a Melo lover. Trade him, keep him, I am fine either way. This site (and all fan sites I am sure) are littered with statements that they would never apply to themselves. Its nothing more than the culture of blame. Something isnt working, lets figure out who's fault it is.
people have a right to their opinions whether its positive or negative. I respect fans opinions who are either pro or anti melo. Either way i just wish we can move onto a different subject. For example we have a up and coming star in KP and Rambis might surprise us and be a effective coach
I'd rather have no Melo than a 31 year old shell of himself Melo that will diminish in trade assets each year even if he's healthy. This year Melo's trade worth maybe a 1st rounder and role players, next year it'll be a lottery protected 1st rounder and role players, the following year it'll be a future 1st rounder or just role players...
People aren't seeing the idiocy of keeping a depreciating asset with a No Trade Clause...
If you're going to rebuild, do it properly without an albatross contract that you're forced to play for 50-60 games a year hindering the rebuild. As long as he's here, you'll have this false sense of "competing for something" that you wouldn't have if it was a full blown youth movement and true rebuild.
fishmike wrote:crzymdups wrote:fishmike wrote:arkrud wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Jmpasq wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
He would of never signed without the NTC. He knows we would of shipped him somewhere awful. We should of lowered our offer once he demanded that. Honestly I think Phil believed Melo would see the light and he would be able to trade him. He underestimated his stubbornness
You could offer him 4 yrs, 96 mil with a no trade clause or 5/124 without it. Both beat any offer other teams can make. If he'd rather take an inferior offer elsewhere, then he doesn't want to be here. We've been a bad lottery team with him anyway since the signing (40 wins, 97 losses) - so I don't care if he signed elsewhere. To be clear, I would have traded him well before he became an FA but that's ancient history.
No one will give him NTC nut MSG.
NTC is something Melo want to fight for on behalf of the players.
This in his mind is his future legacy as players representative.
Unfortunately to players and fortunately for the game of basketball he himself is an example of everything wrong with NTC.
actually its everything right with the NTC. The players value is capped. Guys like Melo sacrfice money so the NBA's middle class can get paid. So the NTC at least gives the player some control over his career once they sign. Its funny.. money makes it all better right? Imagine your company tells you that you need to move to Clev or Phili because they pay you well and suck it up. Its for the best of the company. Sorry those cities suck to live and you need to move your family. These guys are humans and deserve to make the money they can earn and live where they want to live. If you have earned the right for more control than you have earned the right to exercise that control. Knicks traded an unprotected pick for Bargs. Knicks are probably in the lottery this year and imagine they win and miss on Ben Simmons. Thats Knick's front office management. However somehow this responsibility is on Melo to "do the right thing" and let the Knicks trade him so they can restock the cupboard after years of poor management while this player carried the load night after night. That strikes you as fair? Reasonable? But its sports and Melo isnt winning here and its OUR team so he should "do the right thing" or face the venom of fans.
I find that thinking incredibly narrow minded, selfish, and having no basis in reality. Might even call it un-American.
Thank you. I get tired of dealing with the moral panic and outrage about Melo asking for what any one of us would ask for in the same situation.
its so old. You inject logic and actual real-world thinking and the gremlins around here call you a Melo lover. Trade him, keep him, I am fine either way. This site (and all fan sites I am sure) are littered with statements that they would never apply to themselves. Its nothing more than the culture of blame. Something isnt working, lets figure out who's fault it is.
Yep. Nothing more than "e-Heroes" set to make the world right by compartmentalizing all problems into one point of blame and one simple, unrealistic solution. Makes one's world nice and comfortable when you're not required to think too deeply beyond one step problem solving.
arkrud wrote:fishmike wrote:arkrud wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Jmpasq wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
He would of never signed without the NTC. He knows we would of shipped him somewhere awful. We should of lowered our offer once he demanded that. Honestly I think Phil believed Melo would see the light and he would be able to trade him. He underestimated his stubbornness
You could offer him 4 yrs, 96 mil with a no trade clause or 5/124 without it. Both beat any offer other teams can make. If he'd rather take an inferior offer elsewhere, then he doesn't want to be here. We've been a bad lottery team with him anyway since the signing (40 wins, 97 losses) - so I don't care if he signed elsewhere. To be clear, I would have traded him well before he became an FA but that's ancient history.
No one will give him NTC nut MSG.
NTC is something Melo want to fight for on behalf of the players.
This in his mind is his future legacy as players representative.
Unfortunately to players and fortunately for the game of basketball he himself is an example of everything wrong with NTC.
actually its everything right with the NTC. The players value is capped. Guys like Melo sacrfice money so the NBA's middle class can get paid. So the NTC at least gives the player some control over his career once they sign. Its funny.. money makes it all better right? Imagine your company tells you that you need to move to Clev or Phili because they pay you well and suck it up. Its for the best of the company. Sorry those cities suck to live and you need to move your family. These guys are humans and deserve to make the money they can earn and live where they want to live. If you have earned the right for more control than you have earned the right to exercise that control. Knicks traded an unprotected pick for Bargs. Knicks are probably in the lottery this year and imagine they win and miss on Ben Simmons. Thats Knick's front office management. However somehow this responsibility is on Melo to "do the right thing" and let the Knicks trade him so they can restock the cupboard after years of poor management while this player carried the load night after night. That strikes you as fair? Reasonable? But its sports and Melo isnt winning here and its OUR team so he should "do the right thing" or face the venom of fans.
I find that thinking incredibly narrow minded, selfish, and having no basis in reality. Might even call it un-American.
NTC will be dual-edge sword. Using is owners will able to negotiate the players contract length and salaries down.
The players protection should be handles using insurance policy not player contracts.
Why fans need to pay with watching crappy product because of some unfortunate player health or personal issues?
America is the country of opportunity but it always was a country of accountability.
Not much later and that's why we as a country start sucking.
Everyone wants entitlements but no one want to be accountable for laziness and selfishness.
Time to stop handing free lunches for those who can use their hands and brains to earn it.
Time to stop the corruption of the minds of American people.
America is NOT a land of accountability. I love my country but it's government and economy are run by people without any accountability, only blame. Do you know why we are trillions in debt, why banks were bailed out at the same time their execs were making millions and even the ones that lost jobs had massive golden parachutes? Do you know why none of those execs has been held accountable? Because the politicians made the laws that facilitated all of it. You go after execs you go after the law makers that made it possible. You know... the ones who need millions in campaign funds (where do those come from again?) to get elected. This is why not a single politician has attacked rich and powerful for lack of accountability, they are floating the bill. The closest we can get are liberals who threaten higher taxes on the wealthy.
Easy to say "this isnt working" with Melo and suggest we need to move on. What I find laughable are the folks that suggest this is his duty. Maybe some of those folks can outline the great success the Knicks had in the 7-8 year before Melo got here? Does that period have relevance in the discussion? Why would any great player come play for an organization with a history of terrible management when they know THEY will be blamed if the ship sinks?
Melo WANTS to be here. He's one of the more respected players around the league. Kick him to the curb and just watch the elite talent lining up to come here. Phil's promise was to change the culture for the players, so guys want to come here.
fishmike wrote:arkrud wrote:fishmike wrote:arkrud wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Jmpasq wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
He would of never signed without the NTC. He knows we would of shipped him somewhere awful. We should of lowered our offer once he demanded that. Honestly I think Phil believed Melo would see the light and he would be able to trade him. He underestimated his stubbornness
You could offer him 4 yrs, 96 mil with a no trade clause or 5/124 without it. Both beat any offer other teams can make. If he'd rather take an inferior offer elsewhere, then he doesn't want to be here. We've been a bad lottery team with him anyway since the signing (40 wins, 97 losses) - so I don't care if he signed elsewhere. To be clear, I would have traded him well before he became an FA but that's ancient history.
No one will give him NTC nut MSG.
NTC is something Melo want to fight for on behalf of the players.
This in his mind is his future legacy as players representative.
Unfortunately to players and fortunately for the game of basketball he himself is an example of everything wrong with NTC.
actually its everything right with the NTC. The players value is capped. Guys like Melo sacrfice money so the NBA's middle class can get paid. So the NTC at least gives the player some control over his career once they sign. Its funny.. money makes it all better right? Imagine your company tells you that you need to move to Clev or Phili because they pay you well and suck it up. Its for the best of the company. Sorry those cities suck to live and you need to move your family. These guys are humans and deserve to make the money they can earn and live where they want to live. If you have earned the right for more control than you have earned the right to exercise that control. Knicks traded an unprotected pick for Bargs. Knicks are probably in the lottery this year and imagine they win and miss on Ben Simmons. Thats Knick's front office management. However somehow this responsibility is on Melo to "do the right thing" and let the Knicks trade him so they can restock the cupboard after years of poor management while this player carried the load night after night. That strikes you as fair? Reasonable? But its sports and Melo isnt winning here and its OUR team so he should "do the right thing" or face the venom of fans.
I find that thinking incredibly narrow minded, selfish, and having no basis in reality. Might even call it un-American.
NTC will be dual-edge sword. Using is owners will able to negotiate the players contract length and salaries down.
The players protection should be handles using insurance policy not player contracts.
Why fans need to pay with watching crappy product because of some unfortunate player health or personal issues?
America is the country of opportunity but it always was a country of accountability.
Not much later and that's why we as a country start sucking.
Everyone wants entitlements but no one want to be accountable for laziness and selfishness.
Time to stop handing free lunches for those who can use their hands and brains to earn it.
Time to stop the corruption of the minds of American people.
America is NOT a land of accountability. I love my country but it's government and economy are run by people without any accountability, only blame. Do you know why we are trillions in debt, why banks were bailed out at the same time their execs were making millions and even the ones that lost jobs had massive golden parachutes? Do you know why none of those execs has been held accountable? Because the politicians made the laws that facilitated all of it. You go after execs you go after the law makers that made it possible. You know... the ones who need millions in campaign funds (where do those come from again?) to get elected. This is why not a single politician has attacked rich and powerful for lack of accountability, they are floating the bill. The closest we can get are liberals who threaten higher taxes on the wealthy.Easy to say "this isnt working" with Melo and suggest we need to move on. What I find laughable are the folks that suggest this is his duty. Maybe some of those folks can outline the great success the Knicks had in the 7-8 year before Melo got here? Does that period have relevance in the discussion? Why would any great player come play for an organization with a history of terrible management when they know THEY will be blamed if the ship sinks?
Melo WANTS to be here. He's one of the more respected players around the league. Kick him to the curb and just watch the elite talent lining up to come here. Phil's promise was to change the culture for the players, so guys want to come here.
one of the weirdest posts ive seen on here
fishmike wrote:arkrud wrote:fishmike wrote:arkrud wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Jmpasq wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Yeah, this was another case of bidding against ourselves. Giving him $30 mil more than any other team wasn't enough?! We had to include the NTC too. Jeez.
He would of never signed without the NTC. He knows we would of shipped him somewhere awful. We should of lowered our offer once he demanded that. Honestly I think Phil believed Melo would see the light and he would be able to trade him. He underestimated his stubbornness
You could offer him 4 yrs, 96 mil with a no trade clause or 5/124 without it. Both beat any offer other teams can make. If he'd rather take an inferior offer elsewhere, then he doesn't want to be here. We've been a bad lottery team with him anyway since the signing (40 wins, 97 losses) - so I don't care if he signed elsewhere. To be clear, I would have traded him well before he became an FA but that's ancient history.
No one will give him NTC nut MSG.
NTC is something Melo want to fight for on behalf of the players.
This in his mind is his future legacy as players representative.
Unfortunately to players and fortunately for the game of basketball he himself is an example of everything wrong with NTC.
actually its everything right with the NTC. The players value is capped. Guys like Melo sacrfice money so the NBA's middle class can get paid. So the NTC at least gives the player some control over his career once they sign. Its funny.. money makes it all better right? Imagine your company tells you that you need to move to Clev or Phili because they pay you well and suck it up. Its for the best of the company. Sorry those cities suck to live and you need to move your family. These guys are humans and deserve to make the money they can earn and live where they want to live. If you have earned the right for more control than you have earned the right to exercise that control. Knicks traded an unprotected pick for Bargs. Knicks are probably in the lottery this year and imagine they win and miss on Ben Simmons. Thats Knick's front office management. However somehow this responsibility is on Melo to "do the right thing" and let the Knicks trade him so they can restock the cupboard after years of poor management while this player carried the load night after night. That strikes you as fair? Reasonable? But its sports and Melo isnt winning here and its OUR team so he should "do the right thing" or face the venom of fans.
I find that thinking incredibly narrow minded, selfish, and having no basis in reality. Might even call it un-American.
NTC will be dual-edge sword. Using is owners will able to negotiate the players contract length and salaries down.
The players protection should be handles using insurance policy not player contracts.
Why fans need to pay with watching crappy product because of some unfortunate player health or personal issues?
America is the country of opportunity but it always was a country of accountability.
Not much later and that's why we as a country start sucking.
Everyone wants entitlements but no one want to be accountable for laziness and selfishness.
Time to stop handing free lunches for those who can use their hands and brains to earn it.
Time to stop the corruption of the minds of American people.
America is NOT a land of accountability. I love my country but it's government and economy are run by people without any accountability, only blame. Do you know why we are trillions in debt, why banks were bailed out at the same time their execs were making millions and even the ones that lost jobs had massive golden parachutes? Do you know why none of those execs has been held accountable? Because the politicians made the laws that facilitated all of it. You go after execs you go after the law makers that made it possible. You know... the ones who need millions in campaign funds (where do those come from again?) to get elected. This is why not a single politician has attacked rich and powerful for lack of accountability, they are floating the bill. The closest we can get are liberals who threaten higher taxes on the wealthy.Easy to say "this isnt working" with Melo and suggest we need to move on. What I find laughable are the folks that suggest this is his duty. Maybe some of those folks can outline the great success the Knicks had in the 7-8 year before Melo got here? Does that period have relevance in the discussion? Why would any great player come play for an organization with a history of terrible management when they know THEY will be blamed if the ship sinks?
Melo WANTS to be here. He's one of the more respected players around the league. Kick him to the curb and just watch the elite talent lining up to come here. Phil's promise was to change the culture for the players, so guys want to come here.
I am totally agree with you on luck of accountability for politicians and establishment alike.
This is a part of the culture. Those who lead society are not coming from Mars.
They are a reflection of the society. We lost our way collectively and they represent this fact perfectly.
The only way to move society forward is working hard to earn your leaving and ask same from others.
This how America was build. This how things in America are still getting done by Middle class, by those who create wealth not by those who consume it.
I am not blaming Melo for anything. He is working hard. He earned the money he get paid.
The MSG management is not. They made bad decisions and they are the once to take the blame and work on reversing the trend.
