Afflalo off the bench is a winner or a weiner?
mreinman wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:mreinman wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:mreinman wrote:dwil has definitely exceeded my expectations of him. Afflalo's stinkyness can't really be hidden but if we have to have him here then hiding him on the bench is better than having him stink up the starting rotation.
Going off your win shares comments before, I'm wondering how much you think Afflalo should be paid.
lol
3 million
That's pretty generous actually since we were saying that an average contract (not a good contract) for an average win shares player (which AA isn't) would be $4 mil.
what would you pay him?
Vet min. I'm sure someone else would pay more, though. So he'd never be on a roster I created unless he took a big discount.
Bonn1997 wrote:mreinman wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:mreinman wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:mreinman wrote:dwil has definitely exceeded my expectations of him. Afflalo's stinkyness can't really be hidden but if we have to have him here then hiding him on the bench is better than having him stink up the starting rotation.
Going off your win shares comments before, I'm wondering how much you think Afflalo should be paid.
lol
3 million
That's pretty generous actually since we were saying that an average contract (not a good contract) for an average win shares player (which AA isn't) would be $4 mil.
what would you pay him?
Vet min. I'm sure someone else would pay more, though. So he'd never be on a roster I created unless he took a big discount.
Agreed, he's nothing more than a non partying JR Smith. Defense grossly overrated and streaky with his shot.
Ive made it no secret im not a fan of afflalo. Him opting out is probably a good thing for us
Knixkik wrote:wh4t wrote:I always liked him coming off the bench. If he opt's in for next year i wouldn't mind phil looking for a starting SG like Evan Turner
Turner is more fittings as a 6th man as well. He doesn't shoot well enough or defend well enough to be an upgrade for us at SG.
Turner does two things Afflalo doesn't: defense and playmaking passes. Triangle demands good passers and any playoff team needs average or above average starters. He is absolutely an upgrade for the Knicks.
dk7th wrote:Knixkik wrote:wh4t wrote:I always liked him coming off the bench. If he opt's in for next year i wouldn't mind phil looking for a starting SG like Evan Turner
Turner is more fittings as a 6th man as well. He doesn't shoot well enough or defend well enough to be an upgrade for us at SG.
Turner does two things Afflalo doesn't: defense and playmaking passes. Triangle demands good passers and any playoff team needs average or above average starters. He is absolutely an upgrade for the Knicks.
Turner is a bench player, primarily why Boston plays him there, INdy did as well, and the majority of his career has been one. Sure, he is an upgrade to the Knicks, we don't have good guards, but this notion that Turner is good is false. He has been a below average player his entire career. promoting him as a full-time starter provides a mediocre at best backcourt, and that's assuming he is truly a guard.
He isn't. He's a SF
Afflalo $8 million is reasonable going forward yet Batum despite being around Afflalos age is better fit and should start. Batum would probably run a max contract. Again, despite Batum's passing skills, I like 23 year old Fournier if we can secure his services. Do either Batum or Fournier play D?
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/sports/orlando-magic/os-orlando-magic-news-1119-20151118-story.html
Seems that Skiles likes Fourniers D.
GustavBahler wrote:I would prefer it if AA left. Most of his game is built on athleticism. At his age we are in diminishing returns territory. I have nothing against bringing in vets, but I would rather get two way players.
To much money for a 6th man
Jmpasq wrote:GustavBahler wrote:I would prefer it if AA left. Most of his game is built on athleticism. At his age we are in diminishing returns territory. I have nothing against bringing in vets, but I would rather get two way players.
To much money for a 6th man
I think Afflalo and his agent will have an idea what his market value is. If he can't get better than 8 mil or something close to 8 mil with more years then he will opt in.
CrushAlot wrote:Jmpasq wrote:GustavBahler wrote:I would prefer it if AA left. Most of his game is built on athleticism. At his age we are in diminishing returns territory. I have nothing against bringing in vets, but I would rather get two way players.
To much money for a 6th man
I think Afflalo and his agent will have an idea what his market value is. If he can't get better than 8 mil or something close to 8 mil with more years then he will opt in.
i doubt he opts in which is a blessing for us
CrushAlot wrote:Jmpasq wrote:GustavBahler wrote:I would prefer it if AA left. Most of his game is built on athleticism. At his age we are in diminishing returns territory. I have nothing against bringing in vets, but I would rather get two way players.
To much money for a 6th man
I think Afflalo and his agent will have an idea what his market value is. If he can't get better than 8 mil or something close to 8 mil with more years then he will opt in.
A player cant scout the market, then decide they want to opt in. That has to be done prior to free agency. I think he opts out primarily knowing the team plans to place him on the bench. I've maintained awhile he's similar to JR Smith, he doesn't know what's best for a team or even himself.
knickscity wrote:dk7th wrote:Knixkik wrote:wh4t wrote:I always liked him coming off the bench. If he opt's in for next year i wouldn't mind phil looking for a starting SG like Evan Turner
Turner is more fittings as a 6th man as well. He doesn't shoot well enough or defend well enough to be an upgrade for us at SG.
Turner does two things Afflalo doesn't: defense and playmaking passes. Triangle demands good passers and any playoff team needs average or above average starters. He is absolutely an upgrade for the Knicks.
Turner is a bench player, primarily why Boston plays him there, INdy did as well, and the majority of his career has been one. Sure, he is an upgrade to the Knicks, we don't have good guards, but this notion that Turner is good is false. He has been a below average player his entire career. promoting him as a full-time starter provides a mediocre at best backcourt, and that's assuming he is truly a guard.
He isn't. He's a SF
He's a swingman. Knicks can't do much of anything this summer but a relatively inexpensive upgrade over Afflalo would be one of the few ways to upgrade with an eye to getting to. 500 as well as getting younger since Afflalo is old and Turner young. Jackson will have his big opportunity in the summer of 2017.
knickscity wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Jmpasq wrote:GustavBahler wrote:I would prefer it if AA left. Most of his game is built on athleticism. At his age we are in diminishing returns territory. I have nothing against bringing in vets, but I would rather get two way players.
To much money for a 6th man
I think Afflalo and his agent will have an idea what his market value is. If he can't get better than 8 mil or something close to 8 mil with more years then he will opt in.
A player cant scout the market, then decide they want to opt in. That has to be done prior to free agency. I think he opts out primarily knowing the team plans to place him on the bench. I've maintained awhile he's similar to JR Smith, he doesn't know what's best for a team or even himself.
I would think his agent would be able to have an idea what his value is and if there are teams willing to pay/start him.
CrushAlot wrote:knickscity wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Jmpasq wrote:GustavBahler wrote:I would prefer it if AA left. Most of his game is built on athleticism. At his age we are in diminishing returns territory. I have nothing against bringing in vets, but I would rather get two way players.
To much money for a 6th man
I think Afflalo and his agent will have an idea what his market value is. If he can't get better than 8 mil or something close to 8 mil with more years then he will opt in.
A player cant scout the market, then decide they want to opt in. That has to be done prior to free agency. I think he opts out primarily knowing the team plans to place him on the bench. I've maintained awhile he's similar to JR Smith, he doesn't know what's best for a team or even himself.
I would think his agent would be able to have an idea what his value is and if there are teams willing to pay/start him.
Not before he opts out, if that were the case many teams would be in trouble with several violations. Players opt out quite often only to have to settle for something they wasnt looking for. Those agents didn't fail them, they just cant predict the market in advance. Agents cant gauge market value prior to free agency like that.
Paris907 wrote:Afflalo $8 million is reasonable going forward yet Batum despite being around Afflalos age is better fit and should start. Batum would probably run a max contract. Again, despite Batum's passing skills, I like 23 year old Fournier if we can secure his services. Do either Batum or Fournier play D?
I think there is a difference between 27 and 30 years old for professional athletes.
martin wrote:Paris907 wrote:Afflalo $8 million is reasonable going forward yet Batum despite being around Afflalos age is better fit and should start. Batum would probably run a max contract. Again, despite Batum's passing skills, I like 23 year old Fournier if we can secure his services. Do either Batum or Fournier play D?
I think there is a difference between 27 and 30 years old for professional athletes.
I'd like to hear the difference. Both at those ages would be looking for a similar deal if they have the same talents.
knickscity wrote:martin wrote:Paris907 wrote:Afflalo $8 million is reasonable going forward yet Batum despite being around Afflalos age is better fit and should start. Batum would probably run a max contract. Again, despite Batum's passing skills, I like 23 year old Fournier if we can secure his services. Do either Batum or Fournier play D?
I think there is a difference between 27 and 30 years old for professional athletes.
I'd like to hear the difference. Both at those ages would be looking for a similar deal if they have the same talents.
On a 4 to 5 year deal one of those players would be at major risk of decline in athletisism at the backend of the contract. See Jose Calderon and a whole list of guards in that same situation.
martin wrote:knickscity wrote:martin wrote:Paris907 wrote:Afflalo $8 million is reasonable going forward yet Batum despite being around Afflalos age is better fit and should start. Batum would probably run a max contract. Again, despite Batum's passing skills, I like 23 year old Fournier if we can secure his services. Do either Batum or Fournier play D?
I think there is a difference between 27 and 30 years old for professional athletes.
I'd like to hear the difference. Both at those ages would be looking for a similar deal if they have the same talents.
On a 4 to 5 year deal one of those players would be at major risk of decline in athletisism at the backend of the contract. See Jose Calderon and a whole list of guards in that same situation.
Calderon wasnt 30 and his talent shouldnt have warranted a 4 year deal anyway. Dallas recognized that mistake immediately. lets use an actual example....LMA, Marc Gasol, or perhaps Melo. Sure risk of decline is there, but good with above talents teams will take that chance on a 30 years just like they would on a 27 year old as they are in the same range...prime.
knickscity wrote:martin wrote:knickscity wrote:martin wrote:Paris907 wrote:Afflalo $8 million is reasonable going forward yet Batum despite being around Afflalos age is better fit and should start. Batum would probably run a max contract. Again, despite Batum's passing skills, I like 23 year old Fournier if we can secure his services. Do either Batum or Fournier play D?
I think there is a difference between 27 and 30 years old for professional athletes.
I'd like to hear the difference. Both at those ages would be looking for a similar deal if they have the same talents.
On a 4 to 5 year deal one of those players would be at major risk of decline in athletisism at the backend of the contract. See Jose Calderon and a whole list of guards in that same situation.
Calderon wasnt 30 and his talent shouldnt have warranted a 4 year deal anyway. Dallas recognized that mistake immediately. lets use an actual example....LMA, Marc Gasol, or perhaps Melo. Sure risk of decline is there, but good with above talents teams will take that chance on a 30 years just like they would on a 27 year old as they are in the same range...prime.
For me guards and big men in different category insofar as age goes. And with all things being equal, there are just many more upside aspects of taking a 27 year old.
martin wrote:knickscity wrote:martin wrote:knickscity wrote:martin wrote:Paris907 wrote:Afflalo $8 million is reasonable going forward yet Batum despite being around Afflalos age is better fit and should start. Batum would probably run a max contract. Again, despite Batum's passing skills, I like 23 year old Fournier if we can secure his services. Do either Batum or Fournier play D?
I think there is a difference between 27 and 30 years old for professional athletes.
I'd like to hear the difference. Both at those ages would be looking for a similar deal if they have the same talents.
On a 4 to 5 year deal one of those players would be at major risk of decline in athletisism at the backend of the contract. See Jose Calderon and a whole list of guards in that same situation.
Calderon wasnt 30 and his talent shouldnt have warranted a 4 year deal anyway. Dallas recognized that mistake immediately. lets use an actual example....LMA, Marc Gasol, or perhaps Melo. Sure risk of decline is there, but good with above talents teams will take that chance on a 30 years just like they would on a 27 year old as they are in the same range...prime.
For me guards and big men in different category insofar as age goes. And with all things being equal, there are just many more upside aspects of taking a 27 year old.
idk, prime is prime to me. I've yet to see a top talent get less money because they 30 vs similar talent being 27. The upside at most is being more prime years naturally, but the contracts still wind up being quite similar.
I've given examples of recent ones in my post.
