Knicks · Memphis coach Dave Joerger also fired. Begley says he's a "candidate" for Knicks job (page 2)

newyorker4ever wrote:If Phil wants Vogel i would think he could easily have him and the only other team i could see him chosing over the Knicks job would be the Houston job since they already have a good team and a owner that will spend money.

But you're asking the right general question: What teams are more attractive than the Knicks (?)

Houston (?) No.
Sacramento (?) No.
Indiana (?) No.
Minnesota (?) Maybe (talent).
Phoenix (?) No.

Malcolm wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:If Phil wants Vogel i would think he could easily have him and the only other team i could see him chosing over the Knicks job would be the Houston job since they already have a good team and a owner that will spend money.

Not sure I see that Houston is such a great destination. Howard and Harden are both problematic.

But you're asking the right general question: What teams are more attractive than the Knicks (?)

Houston (?) No.
Sacramento (?) No.
Indiana (?) No.
Minnesota (?) Maybe (talent).
Phoenix (?) No.

CrushAlot wrote:

Malcolm wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:If Phil wants Vogel i would think he could easily have him and the only other team i could see him chosing over the Knicks job would be the Houston job since they already have a good team and a owner that will spend money.

Not sure I see that Houston is such a great destination. Howard and Harden are both problematic.

But you're asking the right general question: What teams are more attractive than the Knicks (?)

Houston (?) No.
Sacramento (?) No.
Indiana (?) No.
Minnesota (?) Maybe (talent).
Phoenix (?) No.

I think the only question would be how much autonomy does the next coach have. That could impact the attractiveness of the job but generally I agree.

The way I see it any prospective coach comes in knowing Phil runs the show for now. They know the offense he's looking to run. If they can live with those 2 caveats then I think it's gonna be fine. Blatt and Vogel both seem like great fits in this regard. Neither is dead set on any one offensive system. They focus on D and in game coaching.

wargames wrote:Here is another twist the Grizzlies GM asked to be allowed to interview for the Sacremento GM job (under vlade) prior to firing Joerger..... It looks like everyone is jumping ship in Memphis.

Something ain't right in Memphis. I think Conley leaves too.

newyorker4ever wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Javascript is not enabled or there was problem with the URL: https://twitter.com/WojVerticalNBA/status/728955809250430978

Click here to view the Tweet

This would infuriate me.

I was going to say I could see Memphis snapping up Vogel- I think that's where he'll end up and it would be a nice fit for him.

Every team without a head coach is gonna have F.Vogel at the top of their list so seeing that Memphis will be interested is just what i expected when i saw they fired Joerger. If Phil wants Vogel i would think he could easily have him and the only other team i could see him chosing over the Knicks job would be the Houston job since they already have a good team and a owner that will spend money.

Vogel to houston? funny

mreinman wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Javascript is not enabled or there was problem with the URL: https://twitter.com/WojVerticalNBA/status/728955809250430978

Click here to view the Tweet

This would infuriate me.

I was going to say I could see Memphis snapping up Vogel- I think that's where he'll end up and it would be a nice fit for him.

Every team without a head coach is gonna have F.Vogel at the top of their list so seeing that Memphis will be interested is just what i expected when i saw they fired Joerger. If Phil wants Vogel i would think he could easily have him and the only other team i could see him chosing over the Knicks job would be the Houston job since they already have a good team and a owner that will spend money.

Vogel to houston? funny

CrushAlot wrote:

mreinman wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Javascript is not enabled or there was problem with the URL: https://twitter.com/WojVerticalNBA/status/728955809250430978

Click here to view the Tweet

This would infuriate me.

I was going to say I could see Memphis snapping up Vogel- I think that's where he'll end up and it would be a nice fit for him.

Every team without a head coach is gonna have F.Vogel at the top of their list so seeing that Memphis will be interested is just what i expected when i saw they fired Joerger. If Phil wants Vogel i would think he could easily have him and the only other team i could see him chosing over the Knicks job would be the Houston job since they already have a good team and a owner that will spend money.

Vogel to houston? funny

I think D'Antoni to Houston would be funnier.

I don't think that is funny at all. Howard would obviously have to be shipped out and that is a good thing anyway cause he is the softest player in the league.

Vogel has no chance to go there.

mreinman wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

mreinman wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Javascript is not enabled or there was problem with the URL: https://twitter.com/WojVerticalNBA/status/728955809250430978

Click here to view the Tweet

This would infuriate me.

I was going to say I could see Memphis snapping up Vogel- I think that's where he'll end up and it would be a nice fit for him.

Every team without a head coach is gonna have F.Vogel at the top of their list so seeing that Memphis will be interested is just what i expected when i saw they fired Joerger. If Phil wants Vogel i would think he could easily have him and the only other team i could see him chosing over the Knicks job would be the Houston job since they already have a good team and a owner that will spend money.

Vogel to houston? funny

I think D'Antoni to Houston would be funnier.

I don't think that is funny at all. Howard would obviously have to be shipped out and that is a good thing anyway cause he is the softest player in the league.

Vogel has no chance to go there.

CrushAlot wrote:

mreinman wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

mreinman wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Javascript is not enabled or there was problem with the URL: https://twitter.com/WojVerticalNBA/status/728955809250430978

Click here to view the Tweet

This would infuriate me.

I was going to say I could see Memphis snapping up Vogel- I think that's where he'll end up and it would be a nice fit for him.

Every team without a head coach is gonna have F.Vogel at the top of their list so seeing that Memphis will be interested is just what i expected when i saw they fired Joerger. If Phil wants Vogel i would think he could easily have him and the only other team i could see him chosing over the Knicks job would be the Houston job since they already have a good team and a owner that will spend money.

Vogel to houston? funny

I think D'Antoni to Houston would be funnier.

I don't think that is funny at all. Howard would obviously have to be shipped out and that is a good thing anyway cause he is the softest player in the league.

Vogel has no chance to go there.

Brewer gets waived because he won't get playing time and Beverly gets traded for a second round pick.

and you find that funny?

Malcolm wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:If Phil wants Vogel i would think he could easily have him and the only other team i could see him chosing over the Knicks job would be the Houston job since they already have a good team and a owner that will spend money.

Not sure I see that Houston is such a great destination. Howard and Harden are both problematic.

But you're asking the right general question: What teams are more attractive than the Knicks (?)

Houston (?) No.
Sacramento (?) No.
Indiana (?) No.
Minnesota (?) Maybe (talent).
Phoenix (?) No.

I'm sure Vogel would enjoy coaching this:

Also part of the issue with Bird was that he wanted Vogel to play more like the Rockets do

smackeddog wrote:

Malcolm wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:If Phil wants Vogel i would think he could easily have him and the only other team i could see him chosing over the Knicks job would be the Houston job since they already have a good team and a owner that will spend money.

Not sure I see that Houston is such a great destination. Howard and Harden are both problematic.

But you're asking the right general question: What teams are more attractive than the Knicks (?)

Houston (?) No.
Sacramento (?) No.
Indiana (?) No.
Minnesota (?) Maybe (talent).
Phoenix (?) No.

I'm sure Vogel would enjoy coaching this:

Also part of the issue with Bird was that he wanted Vogel to play more like the Rockets do

Why would Bird want the pacers to play more like the rockets do?

crzymdups wrote:

wargames wrote:Here is another twist the Grizzlies GM asked to be allowed to interview for the Sacremento GM job (under vlade) prior to firing Joerger..... It looks like everyone is jumping ship in Memphis.

Something ain't right in Memphis. I think Conley leaves too.

This has tear-down rebuild written all over it. I suspect Conley got wind of it

This all the in season FA coments even after recruiting M Gasol

I predict we'll start hearing about player availability including Zachary and Gasol for picks.

I agree with Nixluva's sentiment above and also believe that most consistently successful sports organizations have had "simpatico" between front office, back office, coaching, scout etc.

Chandler wrote:
Does anyone else find it a little funny that with all of this turnover Fisher's name has not come up once

I agree with Nixluva's sentiment above and also believe that most consistently successful sports organizations have had "simpatico" between front office, back office, coaching, scout etc.

Agreed. Not sure why this is often times brought up with bad slant optics, as if it was suddenly invented by Phil and an oddball thing

martin wrote:

Chandler wrote:
Does anyone else find it a little funny that with all of this turnover Fisher's name has not come up once

I agree with Nixluva's sentiment above and also believe that most consistently successful sports organizations have had "simpatico" between front office, back office, coaching, scout etc.

Agreed. Not sure why this is often times brought up with bad slant optics, as if it was suddenly invented by Phil and an oddball thing

The criteria shouldn’t be the triangle, or if the coach is simpatico with Phil. The Knicks should look for the best coach, hire him and leave him alone. Of course, they may all be gone by the time Jackson ends his vacation.

nixluva wrote:

martin wrote:

Chandler wrote:
Does anyone else find it a little funny that with all of this turnover Fisher's name has not come up once

I agree with Nixluva's sentiment above and also believe that most consistently successful sports organizations have had "simpatico" between front office, back office, coaching, scout etc.

Agreed. Not sure why this is often times brought up with bad slant optics, as if it was suddenly invented by Phil and an oddball thing

Just read yet another article suggesting Phil hire the best coach and get out of the way! Which begs the question what's the criteria for "best coach available"? Does FIT for your team not factor into it? Why did Riley get rid of SVG? He was certainly better than Spoelstra as a young coach.

The criteria shouldn’t be the triangle, or if the coach is simpatico with Phil. The Knicks should look for the best coach, hire him and leave him alone. Of course, they may all be gone by the time Jackson ends his vacation.

http://www.northjersey.com/sports/basket...

That's a huge indictment of the Grizzlies ownership, I'd say.

Anyway, we'll see what happens.

I hope this gives us a crack at Conley.

If Phil gives us Conley and Vogel this off-season, I will admit to feeling silly about all my criticisms of him.

Though if you put a gun to my head, I'd still predict Rambis is who Phil signs to be head coach.

crzymdups wrote:According to Berman and the Vertical (Woj), Joerger is headed to Sacramento and Grizzlies GM Chris Wallace may aim to join him there.

That's a huge indictment of the Grizzlies ownership, I'd say.

Anyway, we'll see what happens.

I hope this gives us a crack at Conley.

If Phil gives us Conley and Vogel this off-season, I will admit to feeling silly about all my criticisms of him.

Though if you put a gun to my head, I'd still predict Rambis is who Phil signs to be head coach.

I read an article that Joerger supposedly was quasi-secretly checking his options last season too (and this) and that was a reason he was relieved (i.e., for whatever reason he didn't want to be there); The Wallace stuff too was a big surprise.

I am not a fan of Conley but still see this as opportunity because if Sacremento gets Conley, then some other Sac guards might be options for us (not a fan of Rondo either)

One thing this all reminded me of was Jerry West: Grizz got really good because of him and then he left and ....; and then he went to GS and made them even better

In each case, West did not transform team over night. If we use him as an example we'd be more patient with Phil

Chandler wrote:

crzymdups wrote:According to Berman and the Vertical (Woj), Joerger is headed to Sacramento and Grizzlies GM Chris Wallace may aim to join him there.

That's a huge indictment of the Grizzlies ownership, I'd say.

Anyway, we'll see what happens.

I hope this gives us a crack at Conley.

If Phil gives us Conley and Vogel this off-season, I will admit to feeling silly about all my criticisms of him.

Though if you put a gun to my head, I'd still predict Rambis is who Phil signs to be head coach.

I read an article that Joerger supposedly was quasi-secretly checking his options last season too (and this) and that was a reason he was relieved (i.e., for whatever reason he didn't want to be there); The Wallace stuff too was a big surprise.

I am not a fan of Conley but still see this as opportunity because if Sacremento gets Conley, then some other Sac guards might be options for us (not a fan of Rondo either)

One thing this all reminded me of was Jerry West: Grizz got really good because of him and then he left and ....; and then he went to GS and made them even better

In each case, West did not transform team over night. If we use him as an example we'd be more patient with Phil

Yes, Jerry West also got Shaq and Kobe Bryant for the Lakers. He has a track record as a brilliant talent evaluator and front office guy. He also built the Showtime Lakers in the 80s.

Phil does not have that track record yet.

You can't compare Phil to Jerry West, who is one of the best talent evaluators in the history of the game and basically the main reason Phil was able to win his second five rings in LA.

It should be noted that Jerry West was a mediocre coach - 140-100 or so in three seasons as Lakers coach. BECAUSE BEING A FRONT OFFICE EXECUTIVE AND COACH ARE TWO COMPLETELY DIFFERENT JOBS.

He became Lakers GM in 1982 or something and was one of the best executives ever. NOT A GREAT COACH.

So, why is it that people think Phil, a truly GREAT coach, can also be a great executive? Riley is one of the few who was able to do it. Don Nelson, maybe, in Dallas, too. But the list is not too long of guys who have excelled in both roles.

knickscity wrote:

nixluva wrote:

martin wrote:

Chandler wrote:
Does anyone else find it a little funny that with all of this turnover Fisher's name has not come up once

I agree with Nixluva's sentiment above and also believe that most consistently successful sports organizations have had "simpatico" between front office, back office, coaching, scout etc.

Agreed. Not sure why this is often times brought up with bad slant optics, as if it was suddenly invented by Phil and an oddball thing

Just read yet another article suggesting Phil hire the best coach and get out of the way! Which begs the question what's the criteria for "best coach available"? Does FIT for your team not factor into it? Why did Riley get rid of SVG? He was certainly better than Spoelstra as a young coach.

The criteria shouldn’t be the triangle, or if the coach is simpatico with Phil. The Knicks should look for the best coach, hire him and leave him alone. Of course, they may all be gone by the time Jackson ends his vacation.

http://www.northjersey.com/sports/basket...

Firstly, Riley didn't get of Stan for Spo, no idea how you tied those two together. All of the options out there presently are some pretty good ones, but if running the triangle is a true criteria, then all may decline. I don't think it is personally, but Phil has presented things to make it seem so.

I wasn't saying it was a direct from SVG to Spoelstra! The point was SVG is a quality head coach but Riley eventually went with Spoelstra. my point was WHY SPOELSTRA? Clearly it gave Riley more control and that's no different than what Phil is doing.

People criticize Phil for trying to do the same thing Riley did with the Heat. Riley came back and coached but Phil can't but instead gave Fish then Rambis a shot. Riley wanted to get more hands on:

Heat coach Van Gundy resigns; Riley returns

Dec 16, 2005

MIAMI -- Pat Riley and Stan Van Gundy walked off the dais
together Monday, then went in opposite directions.

Riley packed his tailored suits and headed back to the NBA
sidelines, looking to add another entry to his long and glowing
coaching resume. Van Gundy simply went home.

Months after he said he wanted to reclaim more of a hands-on
role with the team -- a comment that prompted rampant speculation he
was about to fire his former protege -- Riley returned to the
business of coaching. Van Gundy quit to spend more time with his
family, and will stay with the team in a limited capacity.