Knicks · Orlando Summer League Schedule (page 13)

WaltLongmire wrote:

joec32033 wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

TPercy wrote:When was the last time y'all watched JJ Reduce? A lot more than just catch and shoot nowadays.

That Simmons Kid is one ridiculous passer

He is a great passer...the guy really sees the floor, but once again, from watching his last game I cannot see any change in his jump shooting, and in the Utah game he was only 2/6 from the FT line, a place where he has to shoot 70+%, IMO.

Utah was also letting him get a head of steam and do his Lebron "get out of my way I getting to the hoop" imitation, where he would usually end up passing off (almost always to an open man).

You can also see how much weight he gained, which is impressive.

Should be an interesting game for Simmons tonight as he faces Ingram, Russell, and the Lakers.

Kid got talent but damn, he looks skinnier than an anorexic Garnett his rookie year.

Simmons or Ingram? Simmons put on 20 lbs, at least, according to what I heard...Ingram has had trouble gaining weight so far.

Crap. I meant Ingram. For some reason after i finished the post i saw his name and i was thinking of him.

blkexec wrote:I missed the game today, but I think Baker has the potential to be better than JJ Redick, because he's a two way player, who can do more than just shoot. In any other system, Baker would be an attractive asset to have. But in the triangle system, it's always hard to not over think....Which leads to robotic movements. I think he's catching on fairly well so far.

But they also know they only have a few games to shine, and the knicks have plenty of spots to fill. I'm sure somebody also told him to be aggressive on offense and shoot when open, instead of over passing or playing unselfish.

Funny thing is that when we drafted Grant, I remember his ND coach, when asked how Grant would do in the Triangle, saying that Grant would be teaching the offense to other players because he would pick it up so quickly. As we now know, learning the Triangle was a slow process for him, and I'm not sure that he did learn it.

Galloway picked up the offense quickly a couple of years ago, but at times he still had the robotic movement you refer to, as if he was going through the paces. Baker did a very good job of picking up the Hornacek version, and was less robotic than Galloway, IMO.

Sasha might actually be the most fluid Triangle player left in the NBA, another reason why Phil would want him on the team, I expect.

http://email.fansided.com/c/eJx1TluOhCAQ...

Kris Dunn looks like a foundational nba all star type draft pick Also thon maker is a whole lot better than what he was given credit for why her he's 19 or 22 he's still 7-1 athletic and skilled

BRIGGS wrote:Kris Dunn looks like a foundational nba all star type draft pick Also thon maker is a whole lot better than what he was given credit for why her he's 19 or 22 he's still 7-1 athletic and skilled

Did not see Dunn play...is he hitting any Js?

Are there actual theories that Maker is older than 19?...have not seen any, but would believe it in an instant. If he's only 22, that is not a big issue.

BRIGGS wrote:Kris Dunn looks like a foundational nba all star type draft pick Also thon maker is a whole lot better than what he was given credit for why her he's 19 or 22 he's still 7-1 athletic and skilled

If Westbook doesn't come here next year, I'd sooo take Rubio.

Dude can pass and play d. He'll be like Kidd. That shot will come around even at an advanced age. And they dude will only be 26. He's going to be a very nice player for 5-7 years.

Wow...did not know about some of the Thon Maker "birther" stuff out there. Might actually be 23/24, Briggs.
This is the link for the first article.

I apologize if the images are so large on your computer.
http://www.opencourt-basketball.com/thon...

opencourt-basketball.com
Thon Maker is probably far older than 19
by Lenny Carlos · 27. June 2016

The following is from a reddit-thread, word by word:

On draft night, a reddit user produced a compelling photo of a yearbook which suggested Thon Maker was far older than 19. However, the snapshot was vague and couldn’t conclusively support these accusations. People remained unconvinced, arguing that all the students could’ve been listed alphabetically regardless of grade or were just members of a particular club.

When the Bucks drafted him with the 10th pick the debate about his age continued amongst our fanbase. Apologists were vehement that these were all just rumors from other teams trying to crash his draft stock. One user on realgm was able to locate a former student of his old high school who had the actual yearbook and he was kind enough to submit more conclusive photos showing Thon graduated in 2010.
Hist photo is found in the lower right hand side of the picture.

Thon Maker is enrolled in Aranmore Catholic College, a high school in Perth. He was part of the 2010 graduating class.

2010-2011

During this time he was discovered by Edmund Smith, an extremely shady talent scout who worked mainly with Sudanese kids and had a reputation for being controlling. He saw Thon’s size, athleticism and potential but also knew it would never work with him being 18 already and still so raw and skinny.

2011

In early 2011, Thon Maker resurfaced as a 14 year old prodigy in Sydney where he joined the local club, St George Saints, an U/16 Division 2 squad. He didn’t attend school at this time and just played basketball, away from anyone who had previously known him and was a way to build credibility around his age. I suspect his age was somehow changed in the transition from Perth to Sydney.

Late 2011-2012

He had gone to camps in the US by this time and the highlight reels of the amazing “8th grader” had started to emerge.

2012-2015

Maker began 8th grade in the 2011-2012 season. Afterwards he was bounced around various schools, at least 3 in the US and a couple as well in Canada.

2016

Edmund Smith’s plan had succeeded and this was the first of his projects to get him a cut of NBA salary.

After hearing John Hammond’s responses on the radio I suspect he knew or suspected Thon was older, he just didn’t care. He connected personally with Thon and was willing to invest in his strong intangibles and it was an age range he could work with. Only time will tell if he made the right move. Obviously, being a raw 21-23 year old is completely different from being raw at 19.

TLDR: Thon Maker graduated high school in 2010 in Australia and 6 years later was drafted fresh out of high school. We have a 2010 yearbook photo showing him in 12th grade and a 2007 photo showing him in 9th grade. Evidence pretty strong now to suggest he could be as old as 23.

edit: bonus anecdotal evidence found on the web, some from years back which support these claims

This is an archived item from 2007 from the school he was attending...

Now, there’s an archived Aranmore school newsletter from 2007 that lists Maker as a freshman, which would be consistent with the 2010 graduation timeline.

WaltLongmire wrote:

blkexec wrote:I missed the game today, but I think Baker has the potential to be better than JJ Redick, because he's a two way player, who can do more than just shoot. In any other system, Baker would be an attractive asset to have. But in the triangle system, it's always hard to not over think....Which leads to robotic movements. I think he's catching on fairly well so far.

But they also know they only have a few games to shine, and the knicks have plenty of spots to fill. I'm sure somebody also told him to be aggressive on offense and shoot when open, instead of over passing or playing unselfish.

Funny thing is that when we drafted Grant, I remember his ND coach, when asked how Grant would do in the Triangle, saying that Grant would be teaching the offense to other players because he would pick it up so quickly. As we now know, learning the Triangle was a slow process for him, and I'm not sure that he did learn it.

Galloway picked up the offense quickly a couple of years ago, but at times he still had the robotic movement you refer to, as if he was going through the paces. Baker did a very good job of picking up the Hornacek version, and was less robotic than Galloway, IMO.

Sasha might actually be the most fluid Triangle player left in the NBA, another reason why Phil would want him on the team, I expect.

From my brief look at Grant in SL this summer, he looked his same tentative self on offense. I saw a few opportunities to take it to the rim and he passed them up for his trademark off balance,falling away 3. Looks like Grant needs to develop a good stutter step to get to the rim.

GustavBahler wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

blkexec wrote:I missed the game today, but I think Baker has the potential to be better than JJ Redick, because he's a two way player, who can do more than just shoot. In any other system, Baker would be an attractive asset to have. But in the triangle system, it's always hard to not over think....Which leads to robotic movements. I think he's catching on fairly well so far.

But they also know they only have a few games to shine, and the knicks have plenty of spots to fill. I'm sure somebody also told him to be aggressive on offense and shoot when open, instead of over passing or playing unselfish.

Funny thing is that when we drafted Grant, I remember his ND coach, when asked how Grant would do in the Triangle, saying that Grant would be teaching the offense to other players because he would pick it up so quickly. As we now know, learning the Triangle was a slow process for him, and I'm not sure that he did learn it.

Galloway picked up the offense quickly a couple of years ago, but at times he still had the robotic movement you refer to, as if he was going through the paces. Baker did a very good job of picking up the Hornacek version, and was less robotic than Galloway, IMO.

Sasha might actually be the most fluid Triangle player left in the NBA, another reason why Phil would want him on the team, I expect.

From my brief look at Grant in SL this summer, he looked his same tentative self on offense. I saw a few opportunities to take it to the rim and he passed them up for his trademark off balance,falling away 3. Looks like Grant needs to develop a good stutter step to get to the rim.

Have seen him play a few times, and looked at his stats...did have 8 assists tonight(0 turnovers), but shot poorly...0/7 from 3, 3/14 total.

Looks like he might be 3rd on the Bulls PG depth chart behind Rondo and Valentine, as Jerian might not have shown he is more ready than Valentine to get backup minutes. Bulls could also sign a veteran PG and push Grant down the bench even further.

Not sure this is the best team for him to be on the next two years in terms of getting playing time. You could see him getting some time in the DL.

WaltLongmire wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

blkexec wrote:I missed the game today, but I think Baker has the potential to be better than JJ Redick, because he's a two way player, who can do more than just shoot. In any other system, Baker would be an attractive asset to have. But in the triangle system, it's always hard to not over think....Which leads to robotic movements. I think he's catching on fairly well so far.

But they also know they only have a few games to shine, and the knicks have plenty of spots to fill. I'm sure somebody also told him to be aggressive on offense and shoot when open, instead of over passing or playing unselfish.

Funny thing is that when we drafted Grant, I remember his ND coach, when asked how Grant would do in the Triangle, saying that Grant would be teaching the offense to other players because he would pick it up so quickly. As we now know, learning the Triangle was a slow process for him, and I'm not sure that he did learn it.

Galloway picked up the offense quickly a couple of years ago, but at times he still had the robotic movement you refer to, as if he was going through the paces. Baker did a very good job of picking up the Hornacek version, and was less robotic than Galloway, IMO.

Sasha might actually be the most fluid Triangle player left in the NBA, another reason why Phil would want him on the team, I expect.

From my brief look at Grant in SL this summer, he looked his same tentative self on offense. I saw a few opportunities to take it to the rim and he passed them up for his trademark off balance,falling away 3. Looks like Grant needs to develop a good stutter step to get to the rim.

Have seen him play a few times, and looked at his stats...did have 8 assists tonight(0 turnovers), but shot poorly...0/7 from 3, 3/14 total.

Looks like he might be 3rd on the Bulls PG depth chart behind Rondo and Valentine, as Jerian might not have shown he is more ready than Valentine to get backup minutes. Bulls could also sign a veteran PG and push Grant down the bench even further.

Not sure this is the best team for him to be on the next two years in terms of getting playing time. You could see him getting some time in the DL.

I agree. A rebuilding team would probably be a better fit. When Grant has his mojo, he looks like a different player. Probably wont happen, but a year or two playing in Europe might be good for him. Wont have as much pressure being the son of a former player.

GustavBahler wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

blkexec wrote:I missed the game today, but I think Baker has the potential to be better than JJ Redick, because he's a two way player, who can do more than just shoot. In any other system, Baker would be an attractive asset to have. But in the triangle system, it's always hard to not over think....Which leads to robotic movements. I think he's catching on fairly well so far.

But they also know they only have a few games to shine, and the knicks have plenty of spots to fill. I'm sure somebody also told him to be aggressive on offense and shoot when open, instead of over passing or playing unselfish.

Funny thing is that when we drafted Grant, I remember his ND coach, when asked how Grant would do in the Triangle, saying that Grant would be teaching the offense to other players because he would pick it up so quickly. As we now know, learning the Triangle was a slow process for him, and I'm not sure that he did learn it.

Galloway picked up the offense quickly a couple of years ago, but at times he still had the robotic movement you refer to, as if he was going through the paces. Baker did a very good job of picking up the Hornacek version, and was less robotic than Galloway, IMO.

Sasha might actually be the most fluid Triangle player left in the NBA, another reason why Phil would want him on the team, I expect.

From my brief look at Grant in SL this summer, he looked his same tentative self on offense. I saw a few opportunities to take it to the rim and he passed them up for his trademark off balance,falling away 3. Looks like Grant needs to develop a good stutter step to get to the rim.

Have seen him play a few times, and looked at his stats...did have 8 assists tonight(0 turnovers), but shot poorly...0/7 from 3, 3/14 total.

Looks like he might be 3rd on the Bulls PG depth chart behind Rondo and Valentine, as Jerian might not have shown he is more ready than Valentine to get backup minutes. Bulls could also sign a veteran PG and push Grant down the bench even further.

Not sure this is the best team for him to be on the next two years in terms of getting playing time. You could see him getting some time in the DL.

I agree. A rebuilding team would probably be a better fit. When Grant has his mojo, he looks like a different player. Probably wont happen, but a year or two playing in Europe might be good for him. Wont have as much pressure being the son of a former player.

Quite a fall for Grant.

Many around here last year were touting the trade for Grant as having made up for the terrible selection of KP. I figured Grant might be more NBA ready than Porzingis until I saw them both in SL last year.

Hopefully he finds a comfort zone as a player at some point in the future, but it will be hard for him to earn significant minutes with the Bulls, IMO.

Been watching a repeat of the Suns in SL, Hernagomez's brother can really ball, wow. All over the place on both ends of the court, great footwork for a big man. Hope his brother is as aggressive in the NBA. Also a Jimmer sighting!

GustavBahler wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

blkexec wrote:I missed the game today, but I think Baker has the potential to be better than JJ Redick, because he's a two way player, who can do more than just shoot. In any other system, Baker would be an attractive asset to have. But in the triangle system, it's always hard to not over think....Which leads to robotic movements. I think he's catching on fairly well so far.

But they also know they only have a few games to shine, and the knicks have plenty of spots to fill. I'm sure somebody also told him to be aggressive on offense and shoot when open, instead of over passing or playing unselfish.

Funny thing is that when we drafted Grant, I remember his ND coach, when asked how Grant would do in the Triangle, saying that Grant would be teaching the offense to other players because he would pick it up so quickly. As we now know, learning the Triangle was a slow process for him, and I'm not sure that he did learn it.

Galloway picked up the offense quickly a couple of years ago, but at times he still had the robotic movement you refer to, as if he was going through the paces. Baker did a very good job of picking up the Hornacek version, and was less robotic than Galloway, IMO.

Sasha might actually be the most fluid Triangle player left in the NBA, another reason why Phil would want him on the team, I expect.

From my brief look at Grant in SL this summer, he looked his same tentative self on offense. I saw a few opportunities to take it to the rim and he passed them up for his trademark off balance,falling away 3. Looks like Grant needs to develop a good stutter step to get to the rim.

Have seen him play a few times, and looked at his stats...did have 8 assists tonight(0 turnovers), but shot poorly...0/7 from 3, 3/14 total.

Looks like he might be 3rd on the Bulls PG depth chart behind Rondo and Valentine, as Jerian might not have shown he is more ready than Valentine to get backup minutes. Bulls could also sign a veteran PG and push Grant down the bench even further.

Not sure this is the best team for him to be on the next two years in terms of getting playing time. You could see him getting some time in the DL.

I agree. A rebuilding team would probably be a better fit. When Grant has his mojo, he looks like a different player. Probably wont happen, but a year or two playing in Europe might be good for him. Wont have as much pressure being the son of a former player.

ha ha ha ...Grant playing in Europe ha ha ha
The chicago Bulls SL team are being lead by Jerian Grant to Wells or Portis scoring are undefeated.
Grant's talent may look fuddy-duddy at times but when Grants on the court the team turn-over ratio decrease plus whomever is moving without the ball gets the ball to score

Lets be real .. Phil Jackson helped-out big to get the Cleveland Cavs go to the FINALS, now Phil is helping his ex-team Bulls go to the Finals ... The Lopez/Grant trade will turn out worst than the Tyson Chandler trade for the Knicks.

GustavBahler wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

blkexec wrote:I missed the game today, but I think Baker has the potential to be better than JJ Redick, because he's a two way player, who can do more than just shoot. In any other system, Baker would be an attractive asset to have. But in the triangle system, it's always hard to not over think....Which leads to robotic movements. I think he's catching on fairly well so far.

But they also know they only have a few games to shine, and the knicks have plenty of spots to fill. I'm sure somebody also told him to be aggressive on offense and shoot when open, instead of over passing or playing unselfish.

Funny thing is that when we drafted Grant, I remember his ND coach, when asked how Grant would do in the Triangle, saying that Grant would be teaching the offense to other players because he would pick it up so quickly. As we now know, learning the Triangle was a slow process for him, and I'm not sure that he did learn it.

Galloway picked up the offense quickly a couple of years ago, but at times he still had the robotic movement you refer to, as if he was going through the paces. Baker did a very good job of picking up the Hornacek version, and was less robotic than Galloway, IMO.

Sasha might actually be the most fluid Triangle player left in the NBA, another reason why Phil would want him on the team, I expect.

From my brief look at Grant in SL this summer, he looked his same tentative self on offense. I saw a few opportunities to take it to the rim and he passed them up for his trademark off balance,falling away 3. Looks like Grant needs to develop a good stutter step to get to the rim.

Have seen him play a few times, and looked at his stats...did have 8 assists tonight(0 turnovers), but shot poorly...0/7 from 3, 3/14 total.

Looks like he might be 3rd on the Bulls PG depth chart behind Rondo and Valentine, as Jerian might not have shown he is more ready than Valentine to get backup minutes. Bulls could also sign a veteran PG and push Grant down the bench even further.

Not sure this is the best team for him to be on the next two years in terms of getting playing time. You could see him getting some time in the DL.

I agree. A rebuilding team would probably be a better fit. When Grant has his mojo, he looks like a different player. Probably wont happen, but a year or two playing in Europe might be good for him. Wont have as much pressure being the son of a former player.

ha ha ha ...Grant playing in Europe ha ha ha
The chicago Bulls SL team are being lead by Jerian Grant to Wells or Portis scoring are undefeated.
Grant's talent may look fuddy-duddy at times but when Grants on the court the team turn-over ratio decrease plus whomever is moving without the ball gets the ball to score

Lets be real .. Phil Jackson helped-out big to get the Cleveland Cavs go to the FINALS, now Phil is helping his ex-team Bulls go to the Finals ... The Lopez/Grant trade will turn out worst than the Tyson Chandler trade for the Knicks.

Kemet wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

blkexec wrote:I missed the game today, but I think Baker has the potential to be better than JJ Redick, because he's a two way player, who can do more than just shoot. In any other system, Baker would be an attractive asset to have. But in the triangle system, it's always hard to not over think....Which leads to robotic movements. I think he's catching on fairly well so far.

But they also know they only have a few games to shine, and the knicks have plenty of spots to fill. I'm sure somebody also told him to be aggressive on offense and shoot when open, instead of over passing or playing unselfish.

Funny thing is that when we drafted Grant, I remember his ND coach, when asked how Grant would do in the Triangle, saying that Grant would be teaching the offense to other players because he would pick it up so quickly. As we now know, learning the Triangle was a slow process for him, and I'm not sure that he did learn it.

Galloway picked up the offense quickly a couple of years ago, but at times he still had the robotic movement you refer to, as if he was going through the paces. Baker did a very good job of picking up the Hornacek version, and was less robotic than Galloway, IMO.

Sasha might actually be the most fluid Triangle player left in the NBA, another reason why Phil would want him on the team, I expect.

From my brief look at Grant in SL this summer, he looked his same tentative self on offense. I saw a few opportunities to take it to the rim and he passed them up for his trademark off balance,falling away 3. Looks like Grant needs to develop a good stutter step to get to the rim.

Have seen him play a few times, and looked at his stats...did have 8 assists tonight(0 turnovers), but shot poorly...0/7 from 3, 3/14 total.

Looks like he might be 3rd on the Bulls PG depth chart behind Rondo and Valentine, as Jerian might not have shown he is more ready than Valentine to get backup minutes. Bulls could also sign a veteran PG and push Grant down the bench even further.

Not sure this is the best team for him to be on the next two years in terms of getting playing time. You could see him getting some time in the DL.

I agree. A rebuilding team would probably be a better fit. When Grant has his mojo, he looks like a different player. Probably wont happen, but a year or two playing in Europe might be good for him. Wont have as much pressure being the son of a former player.

ha ha ha ...Grant playing in Europe ha ha ha
The chicago Bulls SL team are being lead by Jerian Grant to Wells or Portis scoring are undefeated.
Grant's talent may look fuddy-duddy at times but when Grants on the court the team turn-over ratio decrease plus whomever is moving without the ball gets the ball to score

Lets be real .. Phil Jackson helped-out big to get the Cleveland Cavs go to the FINALS, now Phil is helping his ex-team Bulls go to the Finals ... The Lopez/Grant trade will turn out worst than the Tyson Chandler trade for the Knicks.

Ummm... what was the problem with the Tyson Chandler trade exactly?

Minnesota is turning into a scary young team. They might have the best post player in the NBA at 20 years old--they are absolutely stacked with tremendous young guard talent--they have a high quality 6th man--a quality defensive 4 who can also score some. Id probably play a lot of 3 guard sets--maybe even 4 guards with KT in the middle. They need a little age and some intangible players bt they are in an incredible position. Give Flip Saunders a whole lot of credit--just incredibly sad that hes not here to see his creation.

About damn time.

Not sure picking at the top of the lottery EVERY year is deserving of a lot of praise.

Knickoftime wrote:About damn time.

Not sure picking at the top of the lottery EVERY year is deserving of a lot of praise.

Theyve made some good moves. The only high draft picks on the team are Rubio and Towns. They traded for Wiggins. And I think they may have got a really nice player this year. Its a process for a team in Minnesota--I mean look at the Knicks--15 years of crp right? Who are we to talk about other teams moves--we spent the most for the least amount of wins in sports history.

Great great game--very entertaining. That was as much fun as watching any regular season game. The NBA does a fantastic job with the SL especially in Las Vegas. The Knicks should always go to LV.

You know Valentine played PG this year and its an adjustment going to 2 guard. I dont think thats his best spot but over time he should be one heckuva glue guy. Portis has a chance to be a serious NBA player.

Kemet wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

blkexec wrote:I missed the game today, but I think Baker has the potential to be better than JJ Redick, because he's a two way player, who can do more than just shoot. In any other system, Baker would be an attractive asset to have. But in the triangle system, it's always hard to not over think....Which leads to robotic movements. I think he's catching on fairly well so far.

But they also know they only have a few games to shine, and the knicks have plenty of spots to fill. I'm sure somebody also told him to be aggressive on offense and shoot when open, instead of over passing or playing unselfish.

Funny thing is that when we drafted Grant, I remember his ND coach, when asked how Grant would do in the Triangle, saying that Grant would be teaching the offense to other players because he would pick it up so quickly. As we now know, learning the Triangle was a slow process for him, and I'm not sure that he did learn it.

Galloway picked up the offense quickly a couple of years ago, but at times he still had the robotic movement you refer to, as if he was going through the paces. Baker did a very good job of picking up the Hornacek version, and was less robotic than Galloway, IMO.

Sasha might actually be the most fluid Triangle player left in the NBA, another reason why Phil would want him on the team, I expect.

From my brief look at Grant in SL this summer, he looked his same tentative self on offense. I saw a few opportunities to take it to the rim and he passed them up for his trademark off balance,falling away 3. Looks like Grant needs to develop a good stutter step to get to the rim.

Have seen him play a few times, and looked at his stats...did have 8 assists tonight(0 turnovers), but shot poorly...0/7 from 3, 3/14 total.

Looks like he might be 3rd on the Bulls PG depth chart behind Rondo and Valentine, as Jerian might not have shown he is more ready than Valentine to get backup minutes. Bulls could also sign a veteran PG and push Grant down the bench even further.

Not sure this is the best team for him to be on the next two years in terms of getting playing time. You could see him getting some time in the DL.

I agree. A rebuilding team would probably be a better fit. When Grant has his mojo, he looks like a different player. Probably wont happen, but a year or two playing in Europe might be good for him. Wont have as much pressure being the son of a former player.

ha ha ha ...Grant playing in Europe ha ha ha
The chicago Bulls SL team are being lead by Jerian Grant to Wells or Portis scoring are undefeated.
Grant's talent may look fuddy-duddy at times but when Grants on the court the team turn-over ratio decrease plus whomever is moving without the ball gets the ball to score

Lets be real .. Phil Jackson helped-out big to get the Cleveland Cavs go to the FINALS, now Phil is helping his ex-team Bulls go to the Finals ... The Lopez/Grant trade will turn out worst than the Tyson Chandler trade for the Knicks.

Hey chucklehead, Grant hasn't played well enough to be a lock for the backup PG spot. Valentine will most likely get the nod. No one was trashing him, been saying mostly positive things about him since he was drafted. And I didn't want Lopez traded either.