Knicks · BREAKING: Woj: Knicks/Bulls advanced talks for Rose (page 8)

Finestrg wrote:

VCoug wrote:Fucking terrible trade. How do you give up a good center on a GREAT contract and a decent young PG on his rookie deal for Rose? A guy who hasn't made a single positive contribution on the court since 2011?!?! If we were that desperate for cap space next summer we couldn't have found some team to trade Lopez to where'd we get actual assets back? Or, why didn't we just not sign him last year? What the fuck are we doing? Is there any semblance of a plan?

It's a strange move, no doubt. I can't say I'm not thinking some of the same things. It comes off to me like Phil placated Melo with this move, is trying to get the team back to the playoffs next season but is coveting the future cap space more than anything with this move.

no way this was driven by cap space. That was secondary.

If it was driven by cap space, Rolo could have been flipped for picks -- zero doubt (Grant cost nothing; and Jose would be gone by then)

this to me had to be an upside/downside risk analysis. If Rose plays great, we look like geniuses and are in the best position to assess how good he was, healthy he is, and I believe can pay him more than anyone if we wanted to go there. If he doesn't, the downside risk is cap space

Long way of saying, cap space played into it, but didn't drive this deal. Or if it did, then that was stupid

nychamp wrote:Don't mind giving up Grant, but I was a fan of Lopez. I suppose the thinking is that he has limited versatility and it's perhaps easier to find a decent rebounding big who can also shoot more from outside. I hope Hernangomez can pick up some slack because I'm not convinced about OQuinn or Seraphim.

Also don't mind that it's a one year trial basically, though it seems we gave up lots of value for a very appealing salary dump for the Bulls. I have no real confidence left in Rose's game or certainly his durability. They must have expectations for Wroten.

But point taken that Rose is still the best player in the trade with something to play for next year, that aspect combined with tons of money next offseason with those players coming out puts us in great position. Maybe they can make some noise this year and make the Knicks more attractive for top FAs next time around.

Overall: low risk trade, with great future set up for moves for the team, some possibility to make some noise this season with good health. Price paid by Knicks was a bit high.

Yes much greater long term upside than adding bandaids to Lopez and the rest of those teams as presently constituted to maybe squeeze in the playoffs. No it's a win win.

Miss the playoffs no problem. We have our lottery pick + KP.
Rose plays well it doesn't have to be Westbrook or bust.
Ample capspace to build a team that will contend for a decade.

CrushAlot wrote:

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and The Cavs win a championship with big guy sitting on a bench

Malcolm wrote:

anrst wrote:Does Rose know the Triangle?

no. this all makes no sense. it's a bad dream.

Thibs used elements of the triangle in Chicago, so there's that. I guess Rose will be comfortable in the offense for the 40 games he plays for us this yeat.

SocraticBallin22 wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

SocraticBallin22 wrote:The only positive of this deal is the tremendous cap flexibility it brings us for 2017.

Think about it: Rose's 20 million off the books. Rolo's 13 million off the books next year, which was a long contract. Calderon off the books. The real free agent class is in 2017. Phil has set us up in that regard. Give him credit for that. I still don't like giving up on Grant but I see the forward thinking in that.

All he has to do is put up mediocre numbers, not get hurt, and watch Rose get a long term deal.

Like that Phil is looking long term and not being short-sighted--something all our previous GM's have done. Our cap space and flexibility in 2017 will be tremendous.

Plus Rose has incentive to have monster season on the last year of his contract to try to get another max contract (although don't think Knicks should give it to him).

Yes contrary to knee jerk belief is move is a very anti-Knick like move and that's a beautiful thing. This move wont comeback to haunt us for years like the Bargnani, Amare, Curry & Dice moves.

Contrarily this is an Anti-Isiah deal

StarksEwing1 wrote:We should have at least gotten a future 1st in this deal. Lopez has 3 years left on a great contract. Grant is a first round pick who has 3 years on a rookie contract.

If Grant does not work on his shot, he'll be out of the NBA before that rookie contract ends. I fully expect him to get waived on draft night.

CrushAlot wrote:

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Cute but shows is a lot less informed than some of the other guys tweeting

Nalod wrote:Ok, look at the last 3rd of last season and take a deep breath.
Then consider that there would be some due diligence on Rose health and potential going forward.
Not every deal is Dice. If so, we only have him for a one year rental. Ropez was a free agent, a good one, and we have cap space if we let Rose go. Not like Amare where we have 100mil on the line.
Basically Rose and Holliday are better than Grant and Jose. A lot better!!!! Rose is only 4 years older than Grant. I like grant. Sorry to see him go.
He is only 27 and has had a few years to heal. This happens.
Chicago can move forward beyond Pao and Noah. Makes sense for them too, and they have Ropez.
Its starphuch for sure.

A healthy Rose is a very good Triangle player. This is about him finding a fresh place with Zen, Horny along with Melo and KP. This has the potential to be huge.
Can he play healthy this year? If so, do we risk losing him?

Now, if your Durant, this might change the equation. Basically, if all goes well, you have three studs to play with.

This is the chance we've had at making noise in the playoffs this year or in the foreseeable future since we signed Kidd that year

The knicks lost a promising rookie and will miss terribly Lopez. He was the best screen setter of the team, he blocked on rebounds, provided good defense and proved he could score a bit.
He helped KP a lot.

At best, Rose will break down in January and we will be a lottery team with a pick.
At worst, he'll be healthy, command a max and break down the day after. Amare all over again.

We got bamboozled AGAIN.

gunsnewing wrote:

SocraticBallin22 wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

SocraticBallin22 wrote:The only positive of this deal is the tremendous cap flexibility it brings us for 2017.

Think about it: Rose's 20 million off the books. Rolo's 13 million off the books next year, which was a long contract. Calderon off the books. The real free agent class is in 2017. Phil has set us up in that regard. Give him credit for that. I still don't like giving up on Grant but I see the forward thinking in that.

All he has to do is put up mediocre numbers, not get hurt, and watch Rose get a long term deal.

Like that Phil is looking long term and not being short-sighted--something all our previous GM's have done. Our cap space and flexibility in 2017 will be tremendous.

Plus Rose has incentive to have monster season on the last year of his contract to try to get another max contract (although don't think Knicks should give it to him).

Yes contrary to knee jerk belief is move is a very anti-Knick like move and that's a beautiful thing. This move wont comeback to haunt us for years like the Bargnani, Amare, Curry & Dice moves.

Contrarily this is an Anti-Isiah deal

What do all those players have in common with Rose? No, possibly signing someone long term who has only played in 39 percent of his games over the last 4 years is an Isiah move. He's a lousy teammate to boot. Its like talking to a Moonie.

Cartman718 wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:We should have at least gotten a future 1st in this deal. Lopez has 3 years left on a great contract. Grant is a first round pick who has 3 years on a rookie contract.

If Grant does not work on his shot, he'll be out of the NBA before that rookie contract ends. I fully expect him to get waived on draft night.

Tomorrow???

Cartman718 wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

SupremeCommander wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:I liked Robin: capable and durable, and was getting the system. I wonder what that means for the future of triangle culture.

Does our Spanish stash pick Willie get slotted in for big minutes at center now? He is coming over this year, right?

I hope so.. that said a friend did just text me though and said that he saw some tweet about how Noah will follow Rose because they all get along with Melo

Noah or Pau??

Which is better for the team and KP's development if we can only sign one of them?

Pau. Would be a coach on the floor for KP and teach KP some much needed post moves at the same time.

Pau by a mile... Noah gets tech fouls and can't shoot. Pau does a little bit of everything.

Yea I'd prefer Pau but would be ok with Noah. Either guy will help us lock up a playoff seed.

Jordan Hill is another one to look at if those guys fall through

BigDaddyG wrote:

Malcolm wrote:

anrst wrote:Does Rose know the Triangle?

no. this all makes no sense. it's a bad dream.

Thibs used elements of the triangle in Chicago, so there's that. I guess Rose will be comfortable in the offense for the 40 games he plays for us this yeat.

gunsnewing wrote:

Cartman718 wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

SupremeCommander wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:I liked Robin: capable and durable, and was getting the system. I wonder what that means for the future of triangle culture.

Does our Spanish stash pick Willie get slotted in for big minutes at center now? He is coming over this year, right?

I hope so.. that said a friend did just text me though and said that he saw some tweet about how Noah will follow Rose because they all get along with Melo

Noah or Pau??

Which is better for the team and KP's development if we can only sign one of them?

Pau. Would be a coach on the floor for KP and teach KP some much needed post moves at the same time.

Pau by a mile... Noah gets tech fouls and can't shoot. Pau does a little bit of everything.

Yea I'd prefer Pau but would be ok with Noah. Either guy will help us lock up a playoff seed.

Jordan Hill is another one to look at if those guys fall through

Jordan Hill??? The infamous right after Curry pick? Hell to the No.

RonRon wrote:would taken Spencer Dwinwiddie to buy low
I dont think Rose will ever be the player he once was but hopefully I am wrong

I do not believe Robin Lopez, KP, CA FIT TOGETHER either

Exactly. Last years record already established that they didn't fit together

Nalod wrote:Can't wait to see Steven A.'s head explode. Does he love the deal, or hate it with a passion of epic proportions?
No shrugging the shoulders for him!!!!

I'm sure he loves it for all the wrong starphuch reasons

Gudris wrote:I like this trade, all he have to do is a pass a ball to KP and we are in playoffs :)