Knicks · Herring: Knicks Shock the NBA With Their Sudden Win Now Approach (page 1)

By CHRIS HERRING
July 1, 2016 6:07 p.m. ET
0 COMMENTS
Considering their prolonged history of eyebrow-raising hirings, spur-of-the-moment firings, lopsided trades and questionable signings, there’s very little the Knicks can do to surprise people anymore.

And yet, here we are. The Knicks’ off-season thus far—which has included an uncharacteristic trade for former MVP Derrick Rose and now an apparent agreement on a sizable multiyear deal with free-agent center Joakim Noah—has flipped the script, with the franchise pivoting from a gradual rebuild around Carmelo Anthony and Kristaps Porzingis to a win-now approach.

What prompted the Knicks to shift gears so aggressively and focus on the coming year? According to two people familiar with the matter, it was a confluence of several recent events.

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Perhaps the two biggest catalysts were Phil Jackson’s reversal on his feelings about the point-guard position and the hiring of coach Jeff Hornacek, who, with his three-year deal, has every motivation to see a capable guard running his offense from the outset.

Back in March, Jackson said he wasn’t inclined to move heaven and Earth to upgrade the team’s lackluster point-guard play. “The idea of chasing a point guard to where it becomes an obsession isn’t necessary,” said Jackson, explaining that he wanted to use the rest of the season, and then part of this summer, to see what he had in youngsters Jerian Grant and Tony Wroten. “We can play the game without that.”

The Knicks preferred to avoid this summer’s free-agent point-guard crop, which is shallow and might prompt teams to overpay for middling talent. Instead, they hoped Grant could tide them over until next summer. But Jackson and his executives concluded that expecting Grant to become a key starter by next season was asking too much, so he was sent packing in the trade for Rose.

Hornacek and his desire for a starting-caliber guard to run his hybrid offense only solidified that notion, leading New York, a team that drove less than any other club in the NBA last season, to explore trades for a guard who could get to the basket with regularity.

Around that same time, Anthony, after weeks of comments about the Knicks’ coaching search and his cloudy status with the team, endeared himself to the front office by saying during an event in Brooklyn that he’d “absolutely” be in a Knicks uniform next season.

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‘The best way for him to learn is to be on a winning team. If you put him in a losing situation, you run the risk of him developing the wrong sorts of habits.’
—NBA source on Kristaps Porzingis
Anthony’s renewed commitment prompted the Knicks to start thinking about how they could best “maximize Carmelo without sacrificing KP to do it,” according to one person familiar with the Knicks’ thinking. The trade for the injury-prone Rose—an accomplished player whom Anthony clearly respects, but also an attainable one with just one year left on his Bulls contract—checked those boxes.

As such, the Knicks made the surprising choice to part with their two best assets (center Robin Lopez and Grant) to get the trade done, while maintaining some future flexibility. Now they’ve taken another step in that direction by targeting the 31-year-old Noah and making him their top free-agent priority despite concerns about his durability. But it’s fair to wonder whether adding win-now pieces, as opposed to finding up-and-coming players who better fit Porzingis’s timeline, might actually stunt Porzingis’s growth.

The Knicks are finally in a place where they own all their first-round draft picks going forward, so as much as they want to win, losing wouldn’t be nearly as fruitless as it has been in the past. In fact, losing would be the cheapest way to acquire young talent to pair with Porzingis via the draft lottery. Importing expensive veterans with long injury reports could leave the Knicks in the middle of the standings—perhaps the worst place to be in the NBA.

Moreover, Porzingis could go from being the team’s second scoring option to the fourth if the Knicks sign free-agent Eric Gordon at shooting guard—something that could be seen as good or bad, depending on what one considers the best way to develop young talent.

The Knicks’ brass feels that Porzingis is better served by playing with talented, established players as opposed to young ones who may not pan out. And they would prefer to have him playing in games that matter as opposed to ones that don’t.

“The best way for him to learn is to be on a winning team,” the source said. “If you put him in a losing situation, you run the risk of him developing the wrong sorts of habits.”

The Knicks have flipped a very big switch to shoot for glory now. Time will tell whether it’s possible to do that while successfully reloading around Porzingis with players closer to his age once this experiment runs its course.

Write to Chris Herring at chris.herring@wsj.com

Perhaps the two biggest catalysts were Phil Jackson’s reversal on his feelings about the point-guard position and the hiring of coach Jeff Hornacek, who, with his three-year deal, has every motivation to see a capable guard running his offense from the outset.

Now, we're just like we were before Phil got here, where everything was about Win Now at any and all costs.

And we're going to still play the triangle at all costs.

I am just at the tipping point of being so done with this franchise.

We made a trade for Rose that needed to be made. We weren't going to sign a point guard better than Rose. We signed top nba center in Noah to replace Rolo.

Nothing to see here... Knicks have more undrafted rookies and free agent youngins to sort through in summer league. They also still have alot of money to spend. Just enjoy the ride

EnySpree wrote:What did we change exactly? The goal is to get better. Make new York attractive to free agents. Get back to building from within. We are still doing that. We have Kristaps who was drafted #4 by us... we have alot of our draft picks and undrafted free agents all with the club. We have all our 1st round draft picks going forward.

We made a trade for Rose that needed to be made. We weren't going to sign a point guard better than Rose. We signed top nba center in Noah to replace Rolo.

Nothing to see here... Knicks have more undrafted rookies and free agent youngins to sort through in summer league. They also still have alot of money to spend. Just enjoy the ride

We traded Grant who showed signs of becoming the PG we wanted, that Phil wanted.

We traded youth for age.

We replaced a steadfast, workman like center who played every game on a crazy cheap deal by today's standards for a 31 year old, coming off an injury filled season who's always hurt anyway on a deal that pays him big dollars until he's 35.

So yes, we exactly did change. We went from building for the future to win now and gamble at all costs.

Yes, we didn't trade any future first round picks, but wait until the trade deadline and when we're just under 500 you'll read the articles in the press about how we don't see value in mid range picks, and heaven forbid KP have any sophomore struggles or you'll hear the rumors about him being sent out for a win now veteran.

I guess nothing's really changed. The knicks are still the demented plaything of Dolan.

franco12 wrote:

EnySpree wrote:What did we change exactly? The goal is to get better. Make new York attractive to free agents. Get back to building from within. We are still doing that. We have Kristaps who was drafted #4 by us... we have alot of our draft picks and undrafted free agents all with the club. We have all our 1st round draft picks going forward.

We made a trade for Rose that needed to be made. We weren't going to sign a point guard better than Rose. We signed top nba center in Noah to replace Rolo.

Nothing to see here... Knicks have more undrafted rookies and free agent youngins to sort through in summer league. They also still have alot of money to spend. Just enjoy the ride

We traded Grant who showed signs of becoming the PG we wanted, that Phil wanted.

We traded youth for age.

We replaced a steadfast, workman like center who played every game on a crazy cheap deal by today's standards for a 31 year old, coming off an injury filled season who's always hurt anyway on a deal that pays him big dollars until he's 35.

So yes, we exactly did change. We went from building for the future to win now and gamble at all costs.

Yes, we didn't trade any future first round picks, but wait until the trade deadline and when we're just under 500 you'll read the articles in the press about how we don't see value in mid range picks, and heaven forbid KP have any sophomore struggles or you'll hear the rumors about him being sent out for a win now veteran.

I guess nothing's really changed. The knicks are still the demented plaything of Dolan.

You can spin it your way and I can spun it my way. My was is positive and your way is negative.

You can counter me by saying you are being realistic and brutally honest. I will counter with a gift card to home Depot to get you some sandpaper

EnySpree wrote:

franco12 wrote:

EnySpree wrote:What did we change exactly? The goal is to get better. Make new York attractive to free agents. Get back to building from within. We are still doing that. We have Kristaps who was drafted #4 by us... we have alot of our draft picks and undrafted free agents all with the club. We have all our 1st round draft picks going forward.

We made a trade for Rose that needed to be made. We weren't going to sign a point guard better than Rose. We signed top nba center in Noah to replace Rolo.

Nothing to see here... Knicks have more undrafted rookies and free agent youngins to sort through in summer league. They also still have alot of money to spend. Just enjoy the ride

We traded Grant who showed signs of becoming the PG we wanted, that Phil wanted.

We traded youth for age.

We replaced a steadfast, workman like center who played every game on a crazy cheap deal by today's standards for a 31 year old, coming off an injury filled season who's always hurt anyway on a deal that pays him big dollars until he's 35.

So yes, we exactly did change. We went from building for the future to win now and gamble at all costs.

Yes, we didn't trade any future first round picks, but wait until the trade deadline and when we're just under 500 you'll read the articles in the press about how we don't see value in mid range picks, and heaven forbid KP have any sophomore struggles or you'll hear the rumors about him being sent out for a win now veteran.

I guess nothing's really changed. The knicks are still the demented plaything of Dolan.

You can spin it your way and I can spun it my way. My was is positive and your way is negative.

You can counter me by saying you are being realistic and brutally honest. I will counter with a gift card to home Depot to get you some sandpaper

franco12 wrote:

EnySpree wrote:What did we change exactly? The goal is to get better. Make new York attractive to free agents. Get back to building from within. We are still doing that. We have Kristaps who was drafted #4 by us... we have alot of our draft picks and undrafted free agents all with the club. We have all our 1st round draft picks going forward.

We made a trade for Rose that needed to be made. We weren't going to sign a point guard better than Rose. We signed top nba center in Noah to replace Rolo.

Nothing to see here... Knicks have more undrafted rookies and free agent youngins to sort through in summer league. They also still have alot of money to spend. Just enjoy the ride

We traded Grant who showed signs of becoming the PG we wanted, that Phil wanted.

See...now you're just lying to yourself.

And Rose is 27y/o. A year younger than ROLO and 7 years younger than Calderon.

So far, the way money is being handed out, it proves that this was the right trade to make. We needed an upgrade at PG and were NOT going to get it through free agency.

Bonn1997 wrote:

EnySpree wrote:

franco12 wrote:

EnySpree wrote:What did we change exactly? The goal is to get better. Make new York attractive to free agents. Get back to building from within. We are still doing that. We have Kristaps who was drafted #4 by us... we have alot of our draft picks and undrafted free agents all with the club. We have all our 1st round draft picks going forward.

We made a trade for Rose that needed to be made. We weren't going to sign a point guard better than Rose. We signed top nba center in Noah to replace Rolo.

Nothing to see here... Knicks have more undrafted rookies and free agent youngins to sort through in summer league. They also still have alot of money to spend. Just enjoy the ride

We traded Grant who showed signs of becoming the PG we wanted, that Phil wanted.

We traded youth for age.

We replaced a steadfast, workman like center who played every game on a crazy cheap deal by today's standards for a 31 year old, coming off an injury filled season who's always hurt anyway on a deal that pays him big dollars until he's 35.

So yes, we exactly did change. We went from building for the future to win now and gamble at all costs.

Yes, we didn't trade any future first round picks, but wait until the trade deadline and when we're just under 500 you'll read the articles in the press about how we don't see value in mid range picks, and heaven forbid KP have any sophomore struggles or you'll hear the rumors about him being sent out for a win now veteran.

I guess nothing's really changed. The knicks are still the demented plaything of Dolan.

You can spin it your way and I can spun it my way. My was is positive and your way is negative.

You can counter me by saying you are being realistic and brutally honest. I will counter with a gift card to home Depot to get you some sandpaper

That doesn't mean all opinions are equally valid. It's very hard to deny that we lost younger, healthier players for players who have more upside but are a combination of older, more injury prone, and/or on a downward trajectory. You can say that's not a change of direction but it sounds like it is to me.

But it is a change of direction.... but is it a shock or a change to a win now approach? No it isn't. Phil tried to get free agents last summer but nobody wanted our players. The Knicks couldn't even make a trade. This year we have players to move. That's about it.

We're still looking at young players. Wroten was given a look. We Got Kristaps. We probably bring back Galloway, we sign Hernangomez. We're looking at a lot of promising young guys in summer league. Thanasis is so around, so is Early... the Knicks are looking at Austin Rivers in free agency. The Knicks are still building from within and looking at the future, while getting veterans that can actually play today.

franco12 wrote:Look, I criticized Phil for wanting to run the triangle at all costs, but I appreciated what I thought was a methodical effort to build a team that played a system.

Now, we're just like we were before Phil got here, where everything was about Win Now at any and all costs.

And we're going to still play the triangle at all costs.

I am just at the tipping point of being so done with this franchise.

2012 band-aid team all over again. Don't we ever learn team growth has to be organic!

rose is a player of questionable point guard skills and questionable character playing on questionable knees, but he's one one-year audition deal. he is ranked 39th on defense in drpm for point guards who play over 24 minutes a game, well BEHIND calderon! c-minus

noah is being paid a shocking amount of money for a shockingly long contract. but he has elite passing skills, is a terrific defender, possesses great character, and has a NY background. he will be a great person to have around kp6 the next several years, even in street clothes 50% of the time. a-minus

if the knicks acquire gordon that would be a mistake, courtney lee less so.... unless it's crazy money for either.

Bonn1997 wrote:

EnySpree wrote:

franco12 wrote:

EnySpree wrote:What did we change exactly? The goal is to get better. Make new York attractive to free agents. Get back to building from within. We are still doing that. We have Kristaps who was drafted #4 by us... we have alot of our draft picks and undrafted free agents all with the club. We have all our 1st round draft picks going forward.

We made a trade for Rose that needed to be made. We weren't going to sign a point guard better than Rose. We signed top nba center in Noah to replace Rolo.

Nothing to see here... Knicks have more undrafted rookies and free agent youngins to sort through in summer league. They also still have alot of money to spend. Just enjoy the ride

We traded Grant who showed signs of becoming the PG we wanted, that Phil wanted.

We traded youth for age.

We replaced a steadfast, workman like center who played every game on a crazy cheap deal by today's standards for a 31 year old, coming off an injury filled season who's always hurt anyway on a deal that pays him big dollars until he's 35.

So yes, we exactly did change. We went from building for the future to win now and gamble at all costs.

Yes, we didn't trade any future first round picks, but wait until the trade deadline and when we're just under 500 you'll read the articles in the press about how we don't see value in mid range picks, and heaven forbid KP have any sophomore struggles or you'll hear the rumors about him being sent out for a win now veteran.

I guess nothing's really changed. The knicks are still the demented plaything of Dolan.

You can spin it your way and I can spun it my way. My was is positive and your way is negative.

You can counter me by saying you are being realistic and brutally honest. I will counter with a gift card to home Depot to get you some sandpaper

That doesn't mean all opinions are equally valid. It's very hard to deny that we lost younger, healthier players for players who have more upside but are a combination of older, more injury prone, and/or on a downward trajectory. You can say that's not a change of direction but it sounds like it is to me.

What would you have done? Rolo is 3 years younger than Noah. Not exactly giving away our young stud. Noah's injury, some may argue, did not involve any serious leg injuries. Noah adds another big that can defend PnR and stay on floor with smaller oposing line ups, something Rolo did not do. And Grant while young was in no position to lead or even back up a NBA playoff team. Think the article stated it well. We are relevant again but with some risks. But if you look at the recent signings, you can make a case for most of them having risks.

We have all our picks going forward and alot of young players in the organization.... what more do you want? We are building from within and signing guys to play now.... what is there to complain about? This is the best situation we've been in for 15 years

Everything that's happened this off season has been a deliberate, pragmatic solution to the question of "what next" in building a championship team. There's nothing sudden here - Phil is precisely back on track despite a disappointing non-playoff season.

Acquiring Rose is a calculated risk but it must have been obvious from recent practices and Hornacek's feedback that Wroten and Grant were years away from solving the obvious PG weakness of the team. And in speaking with player agents it must have become obvious that the FA market would not necessarily be kind or inexpensive for acquiring talent at that position. Given those factors, the Rose trade is inspired.

Grant is a replaceable PG prospect (is Baker less likely to succeed?) and Rolo was a necessary asset to sacrifice. Rose's health risk is a concern but in all sports, any athlete at any time can be injured suddenly and unfairly. Trading for a healthy or more risk prone athlete only minimizes risk so far.

The unexpected bonus was the bond of friendship of Noah to Rose that attracted Noah to join the Knicks. Again, for all the predictable criticism, signing Noah was and is a no-brainer FA move. Both Rose and Noah represent reasonable contracts when compared to the regrettably obscene contracts being dispensed like candy this FA season. Contrary to the idea that Rose or Noah's contracts being unmovable impediments, they will be quite tradable in pretty short order as the rest of the league wakes up to their own self-immolation.

And contrary to the meme that the Knicks are sacrificing youth, they still have some very nice pieces in Porzingus, Galloway (still a sophomore), Thomas, and whoever returns from last year's squad as well as room to add a few more. Its hard to understand where they've somehow crippled their ability to play or add youth.

So there's nothing shocking about this continuous improvement in the Knicks. Its the media's own bias that is finally being exposed and they're trying to justify that bias as if this were all a big surprise to them. Their narrative that Phil would leave a team inn shambles, was a lousy GM, hat the triangle was a dead weight, and so on is crumbling so they're jumping on the passing Knicks bandwagon.

EnySpree wrote:The funniest thing about this argument is if the Knicks do end up losing.... everyone will be calling for Phil to get fired and calling him an idiot and inexperienced.... yet you guys want the Knicks to build "organically"... how does one do that without losing at a ridiculous rate?

We have all our picks going forward and alot of young players in the organization.... what more do you want? We are building from within and signing guys to play now.... what is there to complain about? This is the best situation we've been in for 15 years

+1

blkexec wrote:

EnySpree wrote:The funniest thing about this argument is if the Knicks do end up losing.... everyone will be calling for Phil to get fired and calling him an idiot and inexperienced.... yet you guys want the Knicks to build "organically"... how does one do that without losing at a ridiculous rate?

We have all our picks going forward and alot of young players in the organization.... what more do you want? We are building from within and signing guys to play now.... what is there to complain about? This is the best situation we've been in for 15 years

+1

×2

joec32033 wrote:

blkexec wrote:

EnySpree wrote:The funniest thing about this argument is if the Knicks do end up losing.... everyone will be calling for Phil to get fired and calling him an idiot and inexperienced.... yet you guys want the Knicks to build "organically"... how does one do that without losing at a ridiculous rate?

We have all our picks going forward and alot of young players in the organization.... what more do you want? We are building from within and signing guys to play now.... what is there to complain about? This is the best situation we've been in for 15 years

+1

×2

There was nothing wrong with trading Lopez but there is something wrong with getting back subpar value for him and then to include Grant on top of that is laughable. You just have away depth and potential to move Calderon, a player who could have been waived.

I ask again who else was going after Rose that the Knicks couldn't play hard ball. Oh wait, they needed Rose immediately to change the perception of Durant. Lol.

Hey, lest trade Tyson and get back crap

Lest trade Shump/JR and get back 3 players who you cut

Prigs was a great trade

Lets trade THJr for a pick - fantastic

Lets include that player in a trade to dump the pg we got in the 1st trade for an off injured big name who plays like carp all across the board. Oh speaking of the 1st trade did I mentioned how being injured was a big reason why I moved Tyson Chandler.

Trade for Willy is incomplete, it maybe a great move or not.

yellowboy90 wrote:

joec32033 wrote:

blkexec wrote:

EnySpree wrote:The funniest thing about this argument is if the Knicks do end up losing.... everyone will be calling for Phil to get fired and calling him an idiot and inexperienced.... yet you guys want the Knicks to build "organically"... how does one do that without losing at a ridiculous rate?

We have all our picks going forward and alot of young players in the organization.... what more do you want? We are building from within and signing guys to play now.... what is there to complain about? This is the best situation we've been in for 15 years

+1

×2

If people can not see the difference in a FO that out together win now teams but loose and FOs that put together short cap flexible deals there is a problem.

There was nothing wrong with trading Lopez but there is something wrong with getting back subpar value for him and then to include Grant on top of that is laughable. You just have away depth and potential to move Calderon, a player who could have been waived.

I ask again who else was going after Rose that the Knicks couldn't play hard ball. Oh wait, they needed Rose immediately to change the perception of Durant. Lol.

Hey, lest trade Tyson and get back crap

Lest trade Shump/JR and get back 3 players who you cut

Prigs was a great trade

Lets trade THJr for a pick - fantastic

Lets include that player in a trade to dump the pg we got in the 1st trade for an off injured big name who plays like carp all across the board. Oh speaking of the 1st trade did I mentioned how being injured was a big reason why I moved Tyson Chandler.

Trade for Willy is incomplete, it maybe a great move or not.

Point by point...

Jackson had to build out of a hole JUST to get to ground zero, remember? In case you havent noticed this roster is financially flexible after the year.

Who was going after Rose? No idea, but Grant was nothing close to special for me so while including him was an overpay for me it wasnt a dealbreaker. I think he has the same chance as Holiday to succeed. I said before Rose for Calderon and O Quinn was my ideal deal. Lopez may or may not repeat his production. But to point out something everyone is ignoring, He did this on a 32 win team. He may do it again on a Bulls team probably in the lotto. The better teams Lopez was on, he was much more of a role player than a main player.

Tyson-I hear this all the time. I LOVED Chandler but does anyone remember what he was when he got traded? He was speaking out against the coach, just got killed by Hibbert in the playoffs, the freaking flu was knocking him out for weeks on end. And everyone compares it to the Moz deal. Moz was youngern had potential untapped and most of all, Lebron wanted him.

Jr and Shump look better because they are in different roles. The less they play the better they look. And didnt that deal net us Lance Thomas?

What exactly has THJR done yet other than get sent to the D league?

Your last point circles back to my first point about Grant.

EnySpree wrote:The funniest thing about this argument is if the Knicks do end up losing.... everyone will be calling for Phil to get fired and calling him an idiot and inexperienced.... yet you guys want the Knicks to build "organically"... how does one do that without losing at a ridiculous rate?

We have all our picks going forward and alot of young players in the organization.... what more do you want? We are building from within and signing guys to play now.... what is there to complain about? This is the best situation we've been in for 15 years

who are the alot of young players in the organization? KP and ?.

Cleanthony Early - released, but invited to summer league. There is clearly not a commitment on our part to keep him, and I applaud the move. I don't see him playing for an NBA team.

Galloway?

Justin Holiday?

KOQ
Seraphin? Is he even back?

Who is this youth I'm missing?