Knicks · Heat got it right....... (page 1)
I get Wade's frustration, but reality is he choose winning over money while father time kept ticking.
When it got to be what he thought was his turn, he is 35 years old, wanting multiple years and elite money.
Yes, he earned it. So did Kobe. But the Lakers postponed the evitable for the final farewell and while it was nice, it was not what was best for the franchise.
Would Kobe have moved to another team? Would that really taint his Laker Legacy? Babe Ruth didn't finish with the Yankees, Jordan retired a Wizard, Namath a Ram, Montana a Chief, etc etc.
Heat needed to deal with Tyler Johnson, wanted Wade to wait, and likely wanted him to take a discount. If he wanted to retire a "Heat" (that's silly, "A HEAT), then he would have had to give in. He did so to bring Lebron and keep Bosh.
When we consider Ewings contract in todays dollars and a harder cap, you realize a bad contract is damaging. To enter into a bad contract, that's another thing than having one on the books.
This is Aronson's call BTW as he is the majority owner. IN a league that is driven by players now it seems a bit cold but its not like Wade was denied. Bulls are willing and able to do this. Not sure why they feel the need to starphuch with wade when they looked to get younger, but I suppose the FAITH that wade is healthy, and Hoilberg can work him in, is what they are after.
Or..............
What if Whiteside rescinds? What if he goes to Dallas? Dallas doe not take Bogut, and Durant can't go to GSW? IS Lebron the puppet master behind all this?
Egos, money, respect and an owner that perhaps knows whats best for his franchise. Wade is a hell of a player but its been a few years since his star was max money right and Riles has to think that carrying Wade and Bosh on the books eating about $50 million is not good for the franchise. Can't say I blame him.
That org is obviously focused on investing for the long haul unlike Jax who felt the pressure to win more today. Look for the Heat now to match Nets offer sheet for Tyler Johnson. Many here thought that deal was ludicrous but I would have signed that talented kid with a high ceiling over a steady but average Lee who will be 35 at contract end. The more I look at our off season, the more I realize that the shuttling and signings while boosting our win total by 10-12 games in the near future will need a much better reset sooner than later. Without importing young established talent ( Wily and Mily are bench filers) to star with KP ,this team is nothing more than a big market pretender with some fanciful names whose best chapter has passed . This team will win 42-44 games and make playoffs which will help the euphoria linger until the reality sets in that the team will be nothing more without adding a young impact player like Westbrook or the Freak
Nalod wrote:If your trying to move the franchise forward.
I get Wade's frustration, but reality is he choose winning over money while father time kept ticking.
When it got to be what he thought was his turn, he is 35 years old, wanting multiple years and elite money.
Yes, he earned it. So did Kobe. But the Lakers postponed the evitable for the final farewell and while it was nice, it was not what was best for the franchise.
Would Kobe have moved to another team? Would that really taint his Laker Legacy? Babe Ruth didn't finish with the Yankees, Jordan retired a Wizard, Namath a Ram, Montana a Chief, etc etc.Heat needed to deal with Tyler Johnson, wanted Wade to wait, and likely wanted him to take a discount. If he wanted to retire a "Heat" (that's silly, "A HEAT), then he would have had to give in. He did so to bring Lebron and keep Bosh.
When we consider Ewings contract in todays dollars and a harder cap, you realize a bad contract is damaging. To enter into a bad contract, that's another thing than having one on the books.
This is Aronson's call BTW as he is the majority owner. IN a league that is driven by players now it seems a bit cold but its not like Wade was denied. Bulls are willing and able to do this. Not sure why they feel the need to starphuch with wade when they looked to get younger, but I suppose the FAITH that wade is healthy, and Hoilberg can work him in, is what they are after.
Or..............
What if Whiteside rescinds? What if he goes to Dallas? Dallas doe not take Bogut, and Durant can't go to GSW? IS Lebron the puppet master behind all this?
Egos, money, respect and an owner that perhaps knows whats best for his franchise. Wade is a hell of a player but its been a few years since his star was max money right and Riles has to think that carrying Wade and Bosh on the books eating about $50 million is not good for the franchise. Can't say I blame him.
Not that i give two popcorn farts about Wade or the RileyRat or the Heat, but don't you think Jordan blowing dunks and looking fairly stupid in a Wiz uniform damaged his legacy slightly? I know, I know everything NBA has been a business since the 90's, but playing beyond the usability point for pointless points always smelled to me slightly of George McGinnis padding his rebounding numbers in the ABA by tapping the ball off the boards to himself a few times before hitting a breakaway layup.
Bosh is done, and you're right, Wade's a shadow of his former self. Riles is doing the tear down. Guess they should have done this two years ago; did Wade or Bosh have a NTC?
jrodmc wrote:Nalod wrote:If your trying to move the franchise forward.
I get Wade's frustration, but reality is he choose winning over money while father time kept ticking.
When it got to be what he thought was his turn, he is 35 years old, wanting multiple years and elite money.
Yes, he earned it. So did Kobe. But the Lakers postponed the evitable for the final farewell and while it was nice, it was not what was best for the franchise.
Would Kobe have moved to another team? Would that really taint his Laker Legacy? Babe Ruth didn't finish with the Yankees, Jordan retired a Wizard, Namath a Ram, Montana a Chief, etc etc.Heat needed to deal with Tyler Johnson, wanted Wade to wait, and likely wanted him to take a discount. If he wanted to retire a "Heat" (that's silly, "A HEAT), then he would have had to give in. He did so to bring Lebron and keep Bosh.
When we consider Ewings contract in todays dollars and a harder cap, you realize a bad contract is damaging. To enter into a bad contract, that's another thing than having one on the books.
This is Aronson's call BTW as he is the majority owner. IN a league that is driven by players now it seems a bit cold but its not like Wade was denied. Bulls are willing and able to do this. Not sure why they feel the need to starphuch with wade when they looked to get younger, but I suppose the FAITH that wade is healthy, and Hoilberg can work him in, is what they are after.
Or..............
What if Whiteside rescinds? What if he goes to Dallas? Dallas doe not take Bogut, and Durant can't go to GSW? IS Lebron the puppet master behind all this?
Egos, money, respect and an owner that perhaps knows whats best for his franchise. Wade is a hell of a player but its been a few years since his star was max money right and Riles has to think that carrying Wade and Bosh on the books eating about $50 million is not good for the franchise. Can't say I blame him.Not that i give two popcorn farts about Wade or the RileyRat or the Heat, but don't you think Jordan blowing dunks and looking fairly stupid in a Wiz uniform damaged his legacy slightly? I know, I know everything NBA has been a business since the 90's, but playing beyond the usability point for pointless points always smelled to me slightly of George McGinnis padding his rebounding numbers in the ABA by tapping the ball off the boards to himself a few times before hitting a breakaway layup.
Bosh is done, and you're right, Wade's a shadow of his former self. Riles is doing the tear down. Guess they should have done this two years ago; did Wade or Bosh have a NTC?
Riley signed Bosh to a max 2 years ago.
Wade went above or beyond for the Heat on the court, and off the court, as a shadow GM who brought their big 3 together.
Sorry, he deserved to be treated a little differently by Riley. Loyalty works both ways, but then we already know about Riley.
WaltLongmire wrote:You reward loyalty and sacrifice...Bosh and Whiteside get rewarded, but Wade does not??Wade went above or beyond for the Heat on the court, and off the court, as a shadow GM who brought their big 3 together.
Sorry, he deserved to be treated a little differently by Riley. Loyalty works both ways, but then we already know about Riley.
Yeah. I agree with those saying - this is not a good look by Riles. I think there will be some FA hesitation in going to Miami. Also, what kind of team would a FA even be going to in Miami?
Riles should've given Wade a one and one. Let Wade opt out again next year. It's not like the Heat are doing a damn thing this year.
Dirk stays and has taken discounts to do so. Timmy the same thing. Wade has two more rings to his legacy because he took less and wanted to attract players. Was he promised out right that "he'd be taken care of"? If so, when?
Is Wade felling disrespected and hurt? of course he is, these diva players have huge egos and it drives them to great heights.
Does this hurt Heat going forward? If a player is thinking about his NEXT contract with the heat and wonders if ownership will keep the franchise down keep an aging veteran around for old time sakes and pay a premium then the answer simple. OWnership won't. At the same time Wade has flirted before with leaving, he has considered leaving and concluded that STAYING WAS WHAT WAS BEST FOR HIM AND WHAT HE WANTED!! Wining chips added to his huge endorsement deals at the time. A few years ago he was huge in the endorsement arena.
Lebron, Pau, Durant, Wilt, Kareem, Oscar, and many greats moved because of money, winning, or hated player where they were. Was Wade lied to? Or has his feelings been hurt?
Regarding Jordan, He is considered by many the golden GOAT, so how has his Wiz days tainted his legacy?
Also, why didn't Riles sign and trade Bosh? I suppose that's damaging to do in the first year of a contract, but the last two years Bosh clots make him untouchable. Riley thinks wade at 35 is not a max player.
No divorce is easy. They got 13 years and 3 chips from Wade. He could stay and have a lessor role, or the system allows him to chase a bigger paycheck. Aging men hate losing there relevance. He can now be loved and desired in his "Hometown". Its cold in the winter. Not sure the Bulls really thought this one out either.
crzymdups wrote:WaltLongmire wrote:You reward loyalty and sacrifice...Bosh and Whiteside get rewarded, but Wade does not??Wade went above or beyond for the Heat on the court, and off the court, as a shadow GM who brought their big 3 together.
Sorry, he deserved to be treated a little differently by Riley. Loyalty works both ways, but then we already know about Riley.
Yeah. I agree with those saying - this is not a good look by Riles. I think there will be some FA hesitation in going to Miami. Also, what kind of team would a FA even be going to in Miami?
Riles should've given Wade a one and one. Let Wade opt out again next year. It's not like the Heat are doing a damn thing this year.
Riley is a scumbag.
Knixkik wrote:If 'moving the franchise forward' doesn't include signing any major free agents in the future, that's fine. But the major drawback of disrespecting Wade is understanding that no top free agent will want to sign there for many years. To me, that's just not the way to go about things. Miami exposed themselves as a low-class franchise.
I agree that this is not going to help them recruit. Its a short sighted decision that is being sold as a long term plan. The only way Riley is going to get a superstar like Wade to go Miami is if he drafts him. They also blow the opportunity to bring Wade into the organization, help recruit and mentor players, marketing opportunities. I believe Riley is going to be surprised by how fast Miami fans will tune out the Heat if they hit a rough patch, now that Wade is gone.
crzymdups wrote:I agree with all of this but I don't know if not signing Wade impacts free agency in the future. I was sure Morey would struggle to make trades after he did the two poison pill deals. Other than being loathed by his peers it seems to have had no impact.WaltLongmire wrote:You reward loyalty and sacrifice...Bosh and Whiteside get rewarded, but Wade does not??Wade went above or beyond for the Heat on the court, and off the court, as a shadow GM who brought their big 3 together.
Sorry, he deserved to be treated a little differently by Riley. Loyalty works both ways, but then we already know about Riley.
Yeah. I agree with those saying - this is not a good look by Riles. I think there will be some FA hesitation in going to Miami. Also, what kind of team would a FA even be going to in Miami?
Riles should've given Wade a one and one. Let Wade opt out again next year. It's not like the Heat are doing a damn thing this year.
Riley has been successful getting guys to go to the Heat for years. He has built a great organization. This isn't a good look but I think he will still get players. Hahn tweeted something about the Knicks odds of getting Westbrook going down because Riley would now have the cap space to go after him.
Nalod wrote:If your trying to move the franchise forward.Here is the x-factor in all of this. 1) Did Riley promise to take care of Wade later for helping the Heat? 2) Did the Heat really initially offer Wade $10 million?
I get Wade's frustration, but reality is he choose winning over money while father time kept ticking.
When it got to be what he thought was his turn, he is 35 years old, wanting multiple years and elite money.
Yes, he earned it. So did Kobe. But the Lakers postponed the evitable for the final farewell and while it was nice, it was not what was best for the franchise.
Would Kobe have moved to another team? Would that really taint his Laker Legacy? Babe Ruth didn't finish with the Yankees, Jordan retired a Wizard, Namath a Ram, Montana a Chief, etc etc.Heat needed to deal with Tyler Johnson, wanted Wade to wait, and likely wanted him to take a discount. If he wanted to retire a "Heat" (that's silly, "A HEAT), then he would have had to give in. He did so to bring Lebron and keep Bosh.
When we consider Ewings contract in todays dollars and a harder cap, you realize a bad contract is damaging. To enter into a bad contract, that's another thing than having one on the books.
This is Aronson's call BTW as he is the majority owner. IN a league that is driven by players now it seems a bit cold but its not like Wade was denied. Bulls are willing and able to do this. Not sure why they feel the need to starphuch with wade when they looked to get younger, but I suppose the FAITH that wade is healthy, and Hoilberg can work him in, is what they are after.
Or..............
What if Whiteside rescinds? What if he goes to Dallas? Dallas doe not take Bogut, and Durant can't go to GSW? IS Lebron the puppet master behind all this?
Egos, money, respect and an owner that perhaps knows whats best for his franchise. Wade is a hell of a player but its been a few years since his star was max money right and Riles has to think that carrying Wade and Bosh on the books eating about $50 million is not good for the franchise. Can't say I blame him.
No fault of their own, but Bosh will be a weight around their neck. Their starting small forward (I assume it is Winslow)is a limited offensive player...Whiteside, despite his strengths, has never been known as a team player on the court (his lack of passing is always being noted), and it looks like Riley will miss out on adding a top FA from another team to the Heat roster this year.
I might be missing something, but it does not seem as if the Heat "got it right" if you look at the big picture.
meloanyk wrote:Not sure how athletes get taxed as far as states. I think Riley and Wade would have come together if they were on step of chip. Maybe the owner should have guaranteed a lucrative front office position
You pay state income taxes for every state you play a game in.
So heat players pay no state tax for 41 games. No state tax in the 3 games they play in the state of Texas, but tax for every game they play in NY, Illinois, etc.
Knickoftime wrote:meloanyk wrote:Not sure how athletes get taxed as far as states. I think Riley and Wade would have come together if they were on step of chip. Maybe the owner should have guaranteed a lucrative front office positionYou pay state income taxes for every state you play a game in.
So heat players pay no state tax for 41 games. No state tax in the 3 games they play in the state of Texas, but tax for every game they play in NY, Illinois, etc.
So any free agent's potential contract is worth more to them in Miami than in states that have state tax. I'd say that consideration would trump any "they didn't do right by Wade in the end" sentiment.
markvmc wrote:Knickoftime wrote:meloanyk wrote:Not sure how athletes get taxed as far as states. I think Riley and Wade would have come together if they were on step of chip. Maybe the owner should have guaranteed a lucrative front office positionYou pay state income taxes for every state you play a game in.
So heat players pay no state tax for 41 games. No state tax in the 3 games they play in the state of Texas, but tax for every game they play in NY, Illinois, etc.
So any free agent's potential contract is worth more to them in Miami than in states that have state tax. I'd say that consideration would trump any "they didn't do right by Wade in the end" sentiment.
Yes, but probably much less than people imagine.
Knickoftime wrote:meloanyk wrote:Not sure how athletes get taxed as far as states. I think Riley and Wade would have come together if they were on step of chip. Maybe the owner should have guaranteed a lucrative front office positionYou pay state income taxes for every state you play a game in.
So heat players pay no state tax for 41 games. No state tax in the 3 games they play in the state of Texas, but tax for every game they play in NY, Illinois, etc.
Thx. I would think that and being in South Beach will always help. Since this post began, saw a Riley text that was rather cold imo. according to one reporter, he and Wade have not always been in sync over the years
Clean wrote:I disagree, this is more than just about basketball. You take care of those who take care of you. Wade was the reason Lebron and Wade came to the heat. He took less money for the better of the franchise multple times. How in the world was wade never the top earner for the heat. The Heat can't have it both ways. They portrayed themselves to be a top level franchise that took care of players during the big 3 era. Now we see that it was all about PR and was never a reality. They will take care of you until you are no longer useful to them. If they are this cut throat to a Heat lifer(until now) guess how little they are about other players.its funny.. people calling Wade greedy in the other thread. How is asking to be paid market value greedy? When Wade took less money it helped get Bosh/Lebron in there. That financial sacrifice directly contributed to Wade's work environment and therefore life improving. So what is Wade's motivation for taking less than his worth this time?
WaltLongmire wrote:If the Heat match Johnson's offer from the Nets, they'll have a number of PGs, but no true SG from what I can see.No fault of their own, but Bosh will be a weight around their neck. Their starting small forward (I assume it is Winslow)is a limited offensive player...Whiteside, despite his strengths, has never been known as a team player on the court (his lack of passing is always being noted), and it looks like Riley will miss out on adding a top FA from another team to the Heat roster this year.
I might be missing something, but it does not seem as if the Heat "got it right" if you look at the big picture.
I think we have legit chance at Westbrook but also think other teams like Miami and Chicago are lining up to pursue. Riley likes stars especially ones who are athletic and in their prime. Think he may be putting together a young athletic group to sell to Westbrooka and maybe Ibaka