Knicks · The Knicks have the full package (page 1)

We don't need to guess or hope anymore... what we see is what we get with this team. We have a very good team right now. Forget what the record says or what's being said. The truth is this is a new group from management to coaches to players and to fans that have been tainted throughout the years...

We have a young franchise player in KP. However you want to describe him he is that guy.

Melo is Melo. Stop trying to destroy the guy. He's gotten better but he is who he is. He's a scorer. He's slowly getting back to that closer role due to the quality of players around him.

Rose can't be stopped getting into the paint. He can't be stopped pushing the ball. He's not MVP Rose... but his strengths are his strengths. He's shown supreme poise in clutch situations. That's all we need from him.

Lee is a plus player. He's going to hit threes, he's going to play defense, he's going to make the smart basketball play. He's not going to hurt you making mistakes.

We have a very good bench. KOQ is in shape and focused. Kuz is cold blooded and makes the correct basketball play every time. Holiday is emerging as a legit nba reserve that you have to key on.

Every other player that I haven't mentioned is of high charecter and always ready to play. We are missing Lance and Noah but then again the poise and professionalism of the rest of the bench makes up for their injuries. It's a long season so they will have their moment.

Our coaching staff has done a great job. Everyone complains about the triangle and how they play better when they do pick and rolls.... well the team is prepared every night to do both. What does that say? I have no issue with Hornacek and his game management. The defense has gotten better ever since Rambis supposedly took over.

How good is this team? I say damn good.

Shout out to Jennings and Willy just for the people that are going to complain I didn't mention them. It goes without saying what Jennings means to the orange and blue blood. Willy is just chilly.

It's felt like a long long time since we were last able to drink the kool aid at this point in the season. Hope it continues- it's nice to follow the team and not be beset with feelings of depression or indifference, for a change!

I believe this team should only get better. They should progressively gain more chemistry and have less lengthy periods of bad play. With each game you can see these players getting more confidence and I suspect that will only continue. On top of that is having Jeff Hornacek as coach. He's making a difference and finally we have a lot more quality depth. This is pretty much what I was hoping for from this team but they've got a lot of work to do. This league is really tough now. So many quality teams in the East.

smackeddog wrote:It's felt like a long long time since we were last able to drink the kool aid at this point in the season. Hope it continues- it's nice to follow the team and not be beset with feelings of depression or indifference, for a change!

We are only one game better than at this point last season. But I agree, I'm more encouraged this year than at this point last year.

man I hope so. I do believe we have some nice things working. The depth is looking better and better as well. Any night Kuz, BJ, Holiday, Willy, KOQ can have an impact, give you 15 points, be a spark... I think we are getting a taste of how this talent can play with a little chemistry. I also like the coach errs on the side of giving the player too much time to turn it around. He doesnt yank guys in or out. If you are a bench guy you go in you know your going to get some burn so go play your game. The value here cant be undersold. We saw Kuz last week miss every FG but was a spark otherwise and JH stuck with him when he could have easily given Holiday a shot and see if his shot is falling. Kuz like the high IQ player he is did his best to impact the game in other ways. Its was the Cha game we won. Kuz shot 0-6, but got 28 minutes and Knicks were +13. Kuz chipped in for 4 rebs, 2 assists and a steal. I think we are starting to see some nice patterns starting with quality bench play.

People cry about Noah's contract and maybe he is a one in every 3 games worth it type of guy, but at the end of the day I feel pretty good about KOQ, Willy or Noah having an impact on the game. When you have that 4th guy it makes the Rose/Melo/KP trio even that much tougher.

We have some firepower and depth. Some size and speed. Some uptempo, some half court. Will we defend nightly? Can we move the ball enough to take advantage of the talent we have 5-5?

I think this group has healthy pressure. Sounds like JH wants to give guys enough rope to hang themselves then real them in a bit in the direction he wants them. I like that after we stink we see a superior effort. We have been very tough after losses. Seems like there is some good chemistry as well. Fingers crossed. This could be a nice stretch to get some road wins and pump up the win total a bit. There are some games we dont have to be perfect in to win, but can still grow from (see Wolves H&H)

The bench is an incredible difference this year, what just happened with the Sactown game, bench scored 50 points?. By the way, all these kill Phil posts that are popping up [it's a pretty predictable cycle, when Melo's playing his azz off, the haters sublimate with Phil hate], who got us this bench full of deranged, upside Euro yoots peppered with BJ and LT? Must be Steve Mills or Clarence Clemons, right?

And it's nice that anything positive anyone says about Noah's impact on them while he's suhucking, from KP to Kyle O'Quinn can just be written off as pure BS.
$72 mil for a kick azz defensive mentor for a group of yoots and bench bigs that need exactly that.

Stay tuned for another long series of rants about how everything in NYC is overpriced [low grade Phil hate].

It's looking like there's a good Chance KP is at least a regular all-star if not franchise player. A lot of what Phil has done I haven't been behind but having a star on a rookie contract is phenomenal value and is enough for me to keep an open mind for the remainder of Phil's time here.

I think this team generally likes each other and you can see and feel the chemistry really growing with them. The depth has been a pleasant surprise for me, that was a concern. At the beginning of the season, it was possible that only Jennings and Thomas were quality rotation players. But O'Quinn has really stepped up, Willy is better than expected, Kuz is proving himself, and Holiday has been awesome. I think we have 6 quality bench players. It's possible to continue to grow with this roster of players without making any major changes in the offseason because of developing chemistry and the continued improvements of KP and Willy. Adding a couple rookies and keeping essentially the exact same roster this summer is a high possibility if this team continues in a positive direction. I hope it works out well, because i would enjoy the roster continuity instead of another major overhaul for once.

Bonn1997 wrote:It's looking like there's a good Chance KP is at least a regular all-star if not franchise player. A lot of what Phil has done I haven't been behind but having a star on a rookie contract is phenomenal value and is enough for me to keep an open mind for the remainder of Phil's time here.

I would also add having Hermangomez, Kuz and O'Quinn on very cheap deals is also good work. Also his refusal to trade anymore 1st rounders is also a plus.

Really enjoying this team and I have hope but...

Defense is still awful.

I'll have to see some solid defense against some good clubs and better play on the road before I drink the cool aide.

Phil, unfortunately paid the sins of previous GM's and was stripped of valuable first round picks. But, he was able to add Kuz, Willy and use THJ effectively to bring in better players.

O'Quinn has earned the right to start. Noah isn't producing and we could use his energy off the bench. It would make for a great second unit with Jennings and Lee.

Rose
Holiday
Melo
O'Quinn
KP

Jennings
Lee
Thomas
Willy
Noah

EnySpree wrote:We don't need to guess or hope anymore... what we see is what we get with this team. We have a very good team right now. Forget what the record says or what's being said. The truth is this is a new group from management to coaches to players and to fans that have been tainted throughout the years...

We have a young franchise player in KP. However you want to describe him he is that guy.

Melo is Melo. Stop trying to destroy the guy. He's gotten better but he is who he is. He's a scorer. He's slowly getting back to that closer role due to the quality of players around him.

Rose can't be stopped getting into the paint. He can't be stopped pushing the ball. He's not MVP Rose... but his strengths are his strengths. He's shown supreme poise in clutch situations. That's all we need from him.

Lee is a plus player. He's going to hit threes, he's going to play defense, he's going to make the smart basketball play. He's not going to hurt you making mistakes.

We have a very good bench. KOQ is in shape and focused. Kuz is cold blooded and makes the correct basketball play every time. Holiday is emerging as a legit nba reserve that you have to key on.

Every other player that I haven't mentioned is of high charecter and always ready to play. We are missing Lance and Noah but then again the poise and professionalism of the rest of the bench makes up for their injuries. It's a long season so they will have their moment.

Our coaching staff has done a great job. Everyone complains about the triangle and how they play better when they do pick and rolls.... well the team is prepared every night to do both. What does that say? I have no issue with Hornacek and his game management. The defense has gotten better ever since Rambis supposedly took over.

How good is this team? I say damn good.

Shout out to Jennings and Willy just for the people that are going to complain I didn't mention them. It goes without saying what Jennings means to the orange and blue blood. Willy is just chilly.

I still think we have some work to do and don't think we can beat any of the good teams in a series and our defense still has a ways to go but we seem to be getting better with every game. Even Rose said after the game last night that they still have a ways to go.

jrodmc wrote:The bench is an incredible difference this year, what just happened with the Sactown game, bench scored 50 points?. By the way, all these kill Phil posts that are popping up [it's a pretty predictable cycle, when Melo's playing his azz off, the haters sublimate with Phil hate], who got us this bench full of deranged, upside Euro yoots peppered with BJ and LT? Must be Steve Mills or Clarence Clemons, right?

And it's nice that anything positive anyone says about Noah's impact on them while he's suhucking, from KP to Kyle O'Quinn can just be written off as pure BS.
$72 mil for a kick azz defensive mentor for a group of yoots and bench bigs that need exactly that.

Stay tuned for another long series of rants about how everything in NYC is overpriced [low grade Phil hate].

Things can be going great for us and we could be on a 10 game winning streak and there's still those certain people that will find something to complain about on here.

EnySpree wrote:We don't need to guess or hope anymore... what we see is what we get with this team. We have a very good team right now. Forget what the record says or what's being said. The truth is this is a new group from management to coaches to players and to fans that have been tainted throughout the years...
We have a young franchise player in KP. However you want to describe him he is that guy.
Melo is Melo. Stop trying to destroy the guy. He's gotten better but he is who he is. He's a scorer. He's slowly getting back to that closer role due to the quality of players around him.
Rose can't be stopped getting into the paint. He can't be stopped pushing the ball. He's not MVP Rose... but his strengths are his strengths. He's shown supreme poise in clutch situations. That's all we need from him.
Lee is a plus player. He's going to hit threes, he's going to play defense, he's going to make the smart basketball play. He's not going to hurt you making mistakes.
We have a very good bench. KOQ is in shape and focused. Kuz is cold blooded and makes the correct basketball play every time. Holiday is emerging as a legit nba reserve that you have to key on.
Every other player that I haven't mentioned is of high charecter and always ready to play. We are missing Lance and Noah but then again the poise and professionalism of the rest of the bench makes up for their injuries. It's a long season so they will have their moment.
Our coaching staff has done a great job. Everyone complains about the triangle and how they play better when they do pick and rolls.... well the team is prepared every night to do both. What does that say? I have no issue with Hornacek and his game management. The defense has gotten better ever since Rambis supposedly took over.
How good is this team? I say damn good.
Shout out to Jennings and Willy just for the people that are going to complain I didn't mention them. It goes without saying what Jennings means to the orange and blue blood. Willy is just chilly.

great analysis of the season so far....i like how we are overcoming injuries with our bench guys stepping up everytime..

we should all be thrilled that the triangle is really not being mentioned much and we rarely see it in game anymore as we use a lot of high pick and roll instead which is easier for our players to understand with the everchanging roster.

Hornacek has been great so far- trsuting guys in certain situations whilst also benching players who arent producing whoever it may be

1 concern for us now is Noah!! we dont expect much from (although we should cause of contract)but if he can give us a good 25 minutes with double digits rebounding and some kind of points then we should be good but he should be benched when playing against smaller teams

Only players that havent impressed much are Ndour, Baker and Plumlee. I would like to see one of them dropped, ideally Baker, for Chasson Randle as he seems legit and might be more of a difference maker than Baker

Jeff had a tough job of blending new players and a new system to him and the players. The fact that he didn't have Rose and Noah in the critical training period also slowed down precious development time. Some injury is always going to be an issue but despite all this he's done a great job of trying to keep the team moving.

THey still use some Triangle principles but not the entire system. It's getting better in terms of the balance of spread, PnR and Triangle looks. I felt from the start that Jeff was smart enough to eventually figure out what works best and that process is still ongoing.

I like Jeff's work with the guards so far. I like how he's coached up the younger guys and allowed them to play thru mistakes and gain confidence.

A word about Rambis. A lot of people poo pooed the notion that he would be any good as the Defensive coach, but they have actually improved since he took over. It's a job he's had before and been successful at. Hopefully this team continues to make progress on D.

nixluva wrote:Jeff had a tough job of blending new players and a new system to him and the players. The fact that he didn't have Rose and Noah in the critical training period also slowed down precious development time. Some injury is always going to be an issue but despite all this he's done a great job of trying to keep the team moving.

THey still use some Triangle principles but not the entire system. It's getting better in terms of the balance of spread, PnR and Triangle looks. I felt from the start that Jeff was smart enough to eventually figure out what works best and that process is still ongoing.

I like Jeff's work with the guards so far. I like how he's coached up the younger guys and allowed them to play thru mistakes and gain confidence.

A word about Rambis. A lot of people poo pooed the notion that he would be any good as the Defensive coach, but they have actually improved since he took over. It's a job he's had before and been successful at. Hopefully this team continues to make progress on D.

yeah man that whole thing of DRose missing out the whole preseason mustve been tough on the whole team but there were going to be growing pains with this team.

The thing i like the most about hornacek is that he doesnt seem to be that stubborn and likes to listen to players and adjust. all coaches are stubborn of course but hes a bit more flexible than most
Also, i love listening to his postgame interviews - he always has smth funny or cool to say as opposed to our previous coach Fisher! that DFish was probably one of the most boring interviewees u can find

newyorker4ever wrote:

jrodmc wrote:The bench is an incredible difference this year, what just happened with the Sactown game, bench scored 50 points?. By the way, all these kill Phil posts that are popping up [it's a pretty predictable cycle, when Melo's playing his azz off, the haters sublimate with Phil hate], who got us this bench full of deranged, upside Euro yoots peppered with BJ and LT? Must be Steve Mills or Clarence Clemons, right?

And it's nice that anything positive anyone says about Noah's impact on them while he's suhucking, from KP to Kyle O'Quinn can just be written off as pure BS.
$72 mil for a kick azz defensive mentor for a group of yoots and bench bigs that need exactly that.

Stay tuned for another long series of rants about how everything in NYC is overpriced [low grade Phil hate].

Things can be going great for us and we could be on a 10 game winning streak and there's still those certain people that will find something to complain about on here.

When has that happened?
Regardless, the goal needs to be competing for a champion not getting a 10 game win streak. That big a win streak would still be nice though. I'm sure I'd still have some skepticism if they had that kind of win streak. Maybe you'd call that complaining...

Bonn1997 wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

jrodmc wrote:The bench is an incredible difference this year, what just happened with the Sactown game, bench scored 50 points?. By the way, all these kill Phil posts that are popping up [it's a pretty predictable cycle, when Melo's playing his azz off, the haters sublimate with Phil hate], who got us this bench full of deranged, upside Euro yoots peppered with BJ and LT? Must be Steve Mills or Clarence Clemons, right?

And it's nice that anything positive anyone says about Noah's impact on them while he's suhucking, from KP to Kyle O'Quinn can just be written off as pure BS.
$72 mil for a kick azz defensive mentor for a group of yoots and bench bigs that need exactly that.

Stay tuned for another long series of rants about how everything in NYC is overpriced [low grade Phil hate].

Things can be going great for us and we could be on a 10 game winning streak and there's still those certain people that will find something to complain about on here.

When has that happened?
Regardless, the goal needs to be competing for a champion not getting a 10 game win streak. That big a win streak would still be nice though. I'm sure I'd still have some skepticism if they had that kind of win streak. Maybe you'd call that complaining...

When the Knicks won 54 in 12-13 it was happening. The phrase I remember being used was 'fools gold'.

CrushAlot wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

jrodmc wrote:The bench is an incredible difference this year, what just happened with the Sactown game, bench scored 50 points?. By the way, all these kill Phil posts that are popping up [it's a pretty predictable cycle, when Melo's playing his azz off, the haters sublimate with Phil hate], who got us this bench full of deranged, upside Euro yoots peppered with BJ and LT? Must be Steve Mills or Clarence Clemons, right?

And it's nice that anything positive anyone says about Noah's impact on them while he's suhucking, from KP to Kyle O'Quinn can just be written off as pure BS.
$72 mil for a kick azz defensive mentor for a group of yoots and bench bigs that need exactly that.

Stay tuned for another long series of rants about how everything in NYC is overpriced [low grade Phil hate].

Things can be going great for us and we could be on a 10 game winning streak and there's still those certain people that will find something to complain about on here.

When has that happened?
Regardless, the goal needs to be competing for a champion not getting a 10 game win streak. That big a win streak would still be nice though. I'm sure I'd still have some skepticism if they had that kind of win streak. Maybe you'd call that complaining...

When the Knicks won 54 in 12-13 it was happening. The phrase I remember being used was 'fools gold'.

Yeah that's what I meant by skepticism. Those were comments by people who want championship contention and (rightly) believed we were not on path for it. And I say that even though I wasn't one of the people using the phrase.

This team is a refreshing change in that we have a roster that MAKES SENSE. We have all positions covered and roles are more clearly defined. It's a fairly flexible roster as well. This bench is so much fun to watch as they continue to improve. On top of that the coaching is much more capable.

WIth all of that we still haven't seen the best of this team yet IMO. I still think this team is on the rise and has a bit more to go before they peak. Especially when it comes to the younger players.

While they're not glamour guys, IMO the team will be noticeably improved when we get Lance Thomas and Courtney Lee back and comfortable with their roles.