Knicks · Is it Time for Hernangomez to get Starter's Minutes? (page 1)

Not saying he should be "starting" at this point (though maybe he should), but the 28 minutes he got vs Denver should be the norm unless Noah starts to turn his game around. Doesn't really matter who is on the floor for the opening tip, I just want the better players getting the most time. If Willy has a problem in a particular game, adjust down and coach him about what he was not doing, but if Willy is playing well he should get the kind of minutes he got in Denver.

Noah seems to be better suited to the offense we ran last year...I think it would have made better use of his passing ability, and the fact that he has a limited J. I don't really see much of the Triangle this year, and I think Noah might suffer for it, as well as the fact that his athleticism has fallen off, for whatever the reason.

Willy is always moving on offense, and I think his midrange J will come around with more playing time. He is willing to bang down low, has a nice touch with either hand, and despite being a below the basket player, he picks up rebounds. He sometimes forces passes, but he does look for teammates and has made a few good dishes.

Normally you would say that Noah's D might separate him from Willy, but Noah is not the same defender he once was at this point in the season, and if you adjust for minutes played, he and Willy are similar RE shot blocking. Willy has a pretty good wingspan, and he's surprised me at times with his ability to challenge, alter, and block shots. His footwork on D is better than I expected, and as he learns about opponent tendencies I think he will be able to compensate for any deficiencies he shows right now. He will never be Noah in his prime, but I now feel he has enough ability to hold his own at the 5 position.

Most significant thing is that the guy does not seem overwhelmed- I really believe playing that extra year on a very good Spanish team, and his work with their National team made a big difference... the guy just looks like he belongs in this league.

There are always issues when a coach makes this kind of move, especially when it concerns a player like Noah, but it would be foolish to keep a better player on the bench.

So far Hornacek has done a good job of easing Willy into a more prominent role, but at some point soon he and Phil have to come to an agreement on playing time for Willy, Noah, and KOQ, and right now, Willy and KOQ seem to be trending. I would make Noah earn more playing time...and if he doesn't play well, his minutes should be cut.

Just a thought.

Willy has certainly played well enough to earn a starting slot or starter's minutes..But the problem with this team isn't offense..It's defense...The coach need to bring a more defensive mindset to the team and to games..It's a bit surprising because Hornacek was a decent defensive player...The Knicks won't make the next step until they focus on defense...

KOQ and Willy are posting identical numbers in identical minutes. KOQ seems to be making a bigger impact right now, but he has more experience. Willy has more upside. Both need to see a big increase in minutes.

holfresh wrote:Willy has certainly played well enough to earn a starting slot or starter's minutes..But the problem with this team isn't offense..It's defense...The coach need to bring a more defensive mindset to the team and to games..It's a bit surprising because Hornacek was a decent defensive player...The Knicks won't make the next step until they focus on defense...

100% agree our defense has taken a huge step back esp in the 3 game losing streak ...consistency starts with defense, Jeff and Kurt need to get this group playing defense. If we can start playing great defense this team will be hard to beat. Until then it's a coin flip with any team in this league weather we win or lose .

fitzfarm wrote:

holfresh wrote:Willy has certainly played well enough to earn a starting slot or starter's minutes..But the problem with this team isn't offense..It's defense...The coach need to bring a more defensive mindset to the team and to games..It's a bit surprising because Hornacek was a decent defensive player...The Knicks won't make the next step until they focus on defense...

100% agree our defense has taken a huge step back esp in the 3 game losing streak ...consistency starts with defense, Jeff and Kurt need to get this group playing defense. If we can start playing great defense this team will be hard to beat. Until then it's a coin flip with any team in this league weather we win or lose .

Defense has been an issue at times.

To much penetration against our D. Denver and GS games were terrible in this way, and Bledsoe did what he wanted to in the Suns' game. Guys like McGee and Faried usually have the type of games they had vs us because of guard play. I get annoyed with KP for paying too much attention to the paint when he is on D and having problems when he has to come back out to challenge his man shooting from 3, but much of this comes from the need to protect the middle because our guards have issues on the perimeter.

With that said...if Noah does not give us the D we expected from him...why not give KOQ and Willy extended minutes? You can agree that the issue is D, but for the most part, Noah has been so-so on D, and what he DOES gives you on D doesn't outweigh his lack of production on the offensive side.

Noah should probably only be playing 12-15 mins for change-of-pace, but even with that, his impact can still be felt off the floor. His presence in practice, film, locker room, etc is still of high value to this team, so he is not a waste by any means.

No. I think you develop Willy this year but play KOQ enough minutes where maybe we can flip him for a decnt pick in the offseason and then turn the role over to him next year

Can't overreact every time someone has a good game.

However, I do agree that I would like to see both Kuz and Willy get more minutes and see less of Noah (not sure where Kuz's minutes would come from).

Welpee wrote:Can't overreact every time someone has a good game.

However, I do agree that I would like to see both Kuz and Willy get more minutes and see less of Noah (not sure where Kuz's minutes would come from).

Also, Willy is still a rookie. He's more experienced than most, but he's still new to the league. I'm sure Jeff has his reasons for why he's easing Willy in. We have enough depth that we don't have to immediately feed Hernangomez to the wolves.

Welpee wrote:Can't overreact every time someone has a good game.

However, I do agree that I would like to see both Kuz and Willy get more minutes and see less of Noah (not sure where Kuz's minutes would come from).

True, but his numbers have improved with the playing time... I'm not reacting to a single game, that would be foolish. Look at the games where he plays 20 or more minutes...he's putting up solid numbers.

Right now, you are looking to divide 48 minutes among Willy, KOQ, and Noah...and it seems that KOQ and Willy are making arguments for being on the floor more than Noah.

I would prefer seeing Noah play like he used to and getting a majority of the minutes while Willy sits and learns, but I feel much better about the Knicks when KOQ and Willy are on the floor at this point.

In my opinion, Koq should start, he's proven in that starting role already this season. First off the bench should be Willy, he's proven to have some real potential as a good quality player for the future. In limited minutes at least for the time being should be Noah, something's off there, I think he may be nursing something we don't know about and he isn't even looking at the rim to shoot anymore. He's the guy you bring in to fire things up, bring same intensity and leadership to the team when they are in a hole. The contract is upsetting however, I do wish we could move it elsewhere but I'm not sure that until he proves he can be a quality bench player and lead a second unit many will not want him. We have to use of what he has right now, now what he doesn't. Make use of the passing and rebounding when we need that on court.

BigDaddyG wrote:

Welpee wrote:Can't overreact every time someone has a good game.

However, I do agree that I would like to see both Kuz and Willy get more minutes and see less of Noah (not sure where Kuz's minutes would come from).

Also, Willy is still a rookie. He's more experienced than most, but he's still new to the league. I'm sure Jeff has his reasons for why he's easing Willy in. We have enough depth that we don't have to immediately feed Hernangomez to the wolves.

Jeff is looking to give Willy a chance to prove to the rest of the team that he deserves more playing time. You have egos to deal with, and Noah is a team leader...I understand that this is an issue that has to be handled gradually, which is what Hornacek seems to be doing.

WaltLongmire wrote:

fitzfarm wrote:

holfresh wrote:Willy has certainly played well enough to earn a starting slot or starter's minutes..But the problem with this team isn't offense..It's defense...The coach need to bring a more defensive mindset to the team and to games..It's a bit surprising because Hornacek was a decent defensive player...The Knicks won't make the next step until they focus on defense...

100% agree our defense has taken a huge step back esp in the 3 game losing streak ...consistency starts with defense, Jeff and Kurt need to get this group playing defense. If we can start playing great defense this team will be hard to beat. Until then it's a coin flip with any team in this league weather we win or lose .

Defense has been an issue at times.

To much penetration against our D. Denver and GS games were terrible in this way, and Bledsoe did what he wanted to in the Suns' game. Guys like McGee and Faried usually have the type of games they had vs us because of guard play. I get annoyed with KP for paying too much attention to the paint when he is on D and having problems when he has to come back out to challenge his man shooting from 3, but much of this comes from the need to protect the middle because our guards have issues on the perimeter.

With that said...if Noah does not give us the D we expected from him...why not give KOQ and Willy extended minutes? You can agree that the issue is D, but for the most part, Noah has been so-so on D, and what he DOES gives you on D doesn't outweigh his lack of production on the offensive side.

The defense has been terrible all year..Noah is our best big defender and our best big perimeter defender..I'm not sure what his deal is, whether he isn't in shape yet or injured...When Rose gets back, we will have enough offense..We need better defense on the interior and even on the perimeter from our bigs..

WaltLongmire wrote:

Welpee wrote:Can't overreact every time someone has a good game.

However, I do agree that I would like to see both Kuz and Willy get more minutes and see less of Noah (not sure where Kuz's minutes would come from).

True, but his numbers have improved with the playing time... I'm not reacting to a single game, that would be foolish. Look at the games where he plays 20 or more minutes...he's putting up solid numbers.

Right now, you are looking to divide 48 minutes among Willy, KOQ, and Noah...and it seems that KOQ and Willy are making arguments for being on the floor more than Noah.

I would prefer seeing Noah play like he used to and getting a majority of the minutes while Willy sits and learns, but I feel much better about the Knicks when KOQ and Willy are on the floor at this point.

Yeah, but I think except for the Laker game we were down a substantial amount of points in those games. I guess my position is if Noah isn't going to make an impact on defense we might as well play O'Quinn and Willy more minutes. At least they're not liabilities on offense.

Time for KOQ to get an extended look, and Willy to be the first off the bench. Noah was hitting the gym after the last game. Give him the time to get in the best shape possible for the second half of the season, and hopefully the playoffs.

I think Jeff is handling the minutes very well. He got KOQ back on track, is developing Willy and is dealing with something we are not privy to with Noah.
I like the way they are keeping KP from getting two banged up in the paint.
We have the benefit of hindsight.

Nalod wrote:I think Jeff is handling the minutes very well. He got KOQ back on track, is developing Willy and is dealing with something we are not privy to with Noah.
I like the way they are keeping KP from getting two banged up in the paint.
We have the benefit of hindsight.

been thinking along those lines for a while now

martin wrote:

Nalod wrote:I think Jeff is handling the minutes very well. He got KOQ back on track, is developing Willy and is dealing with something we are not privy to with Noah.
I like the way they are keeping KP from getting two banged up in the paint.
We have the benefit of hindsight.

been thinking along those lines for a while now

I agree. I think the biggest acquisition in the off-season has been Hornacek. Dude can coach and is a very good manager.

In my opinion we should be playing Willy much more and same with Kuz. These guys are more skilled and talented than Noah and Thomas respectively. I really liked when we ran some Hernangomez/KP/Kuz lineups earlier in the season. Since Lance has come back it's not been the case.

We need to work on both trying to win this year but also develop players who will be back next year. Noah is who he is and he is regressing. There's just no hiding it anymore.

I think Hernangomez's main problem is defense. He's a rookie. And often makes defensive mistakes. Noah is a veteran and known for his defensive awareness. My counter argument is that our defense is pretty bad most nights with the starters anyway. We're giving up almost 108 a night. We might as well try to score 110 a night with stronger scoring lineups. I'm interested to see what our scoring output would be without Noah.

holfresh wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

fitzfarm wrote:

holfresh wrote:Willy has certainly played well enough to earn a starting slot or starter's minutes..But the problem with this team isn't offense..It's defense...The coach need to bring a more defensive mindset to the team and to games..It's a bit surprising because Hornacek was a decent defensive player...The Knicks won't make the next step until they focus on defense...

100% agree our defense has taken a huge step back esp in the 3 game losing streak ...consistency starts with defense, Jeff and Kurt need to get this group playing defense. If we can start playing great defense this team will be hard to beat. Until then it's a coin flip with any team in this league weather we win or lose .

Defense has been an issue at times.

To much penetration against our D. Denver and GS games were terrible in this way, and Bledsoe did what he wanted to in the Suns' game. Guys like McGee and Faried usually have the type of games they had vs us because of guard play. I get annoyed with KP for paying too much attention to the paint when he is on D and having problems when he has to come back out to challenge his man shooting from 3, but much of this comes from the need to protect the middle because our guards have issues on the perimeter.

With that said...if Noah does not give us the D we expected from him...why not give KOQ and Willy extended minutes? You can agree that the issue is D, but for the most part, Noah has been so-so on D, and what he DOES gives you on D doesn't outweigh his lack of production on the offensive side.

The defense has been terrible all year..Noah is our best big defender and our best big perimeter defender..I'm not sure what his deal is, whether he isn't in shape yet or injured...When Rose gets back, we will have enough offense..We need better defense on the interior and even on the perimeter from our bigs..

Would love to know what his weight is now, and what it was 2 years ago...I think he added weight-bulked up. You can see him struggling out there.

I just don't see his defensive presence as that much different from Willy or KOQ at this point, and because of his offensive deficiencies, he must be MUCH better on D to justify a spot on the floor.

I'm rooting hard for Noah...if he can return to 90% of what he was a couple of years ago, he makes a BIG difference for the team. Just have not seen much improvement, and if he is not the great defender he once was, there is not much reason to give him starter minutes over KOQ and Willy.

For me the perimeter D issues are mostly on the guards. There are many instances when our bigs have to cover the paint to compensate for our guards, then run back to get their man after the ball is kicked out only to get beat when their man decided to penetrate while they are running out to cover the 3.

Knicks67 wrote:In my opinion, Koq should start, he's proven in that starting role already this season. First off the bench should be Willy, he's proven to have some real potential as a good quality player for the future. In limited minutes at least for the time being should be Noah, something's off there, I think he may be nursing something we don't know about and he isn't even looking at the rim to shoot anymore. He's the guy you bring in to fire things up, bring same intensity and leadership to the team when they are in a hole. The contract is upsetting however, I do wish we could move it elsewhere but I'm not sure that until he proves he can be a quality bench player and lead a second unit many will not want him. We have to use of what he has right now, now what he doesn't. Make use of the passing and rebounding when we need that on court.

KOQ doesn't defend either, if defense is the problem Noah is still better bet. Willy starting maybe to soon, but he has looked good in what I have seen. To me the important thing is whoever starts needs to play good defense.