Knicks · Time to Build around KP... Bye Melo (page 2)

Knixkik wrote:

EnySpree wrote:

Knixkik wrote:Melo isn't waiving his NTC. He's staying. And that's fine. We can build around KP with Melo here. Someone else will need to score the ball. The minute melo leaves you are asking KP to put up Anthony Davis numbers. It will kill him. I appreciates melo's loyalty to the knicks despite the way he's treated. I don't understand the melo trade speculation that goes with every losing streak. It just baffles me.

Well it's not with every losing streak with me. Knicks are at a crossroads. They could turn it around or bury themselves.

Melo isn't leaving. He's said that. KP needs Melo.... but the Knicks need to improve this club. Do we have to wait till KP is 25 years old before we start to try and build around him? Then turn him into Melo when the franchise all hasn't built around him properly? Then crucify KP like we did to Ewing?

No, I agree. We start building now. Draft the right players, look for young underrated players and find the right PG. Every move should be made with KP in mind.

pipe dream, thats like a shot in the dark

KP4Life wrote:Isn't our greatest need a pg though? All the best pgs in the drsft are in the top ten. The teens are forwards mostly right? I mean the expected draft numbers. If we tank this is the year to do it. Just like the year we got KP. It doesn't even have to be a big tank. Just enough to get a frank N. He's perfect for this team. Rose is not staying. Maybe we could try to trade to draft lower if we end up in teens to get a pg?

Imo this year is a stealth tank. Phil knew it could all blow up anyway with the dudes he signed.

PG and a combo forward who is a defensive ace are the 2 biggest needs. Both cam be found this drsft. But if we miss out on the PG this draft, there is always next year. As long as we fill a whole each year and get a quality player. Rome wasn't built in a day. I don't think resigning Jennings as a stopgap plus baker is the worst thing as long as it's not forever.

Knixkik wrote:

KP4Life wrote:Isn't our greatest need a pg though? All the best pgs in the drsft are in the top ten. The teens are forwards mostly right? I mean the expected draft numbers. If we tank this is the year to do it. Just like the year we got KP. It doesn't even have to be a big tank. Just enough to get a frank N. He's perfect for this team. Rose is not staying. Maybe we could try to trade to draft lower if we end up in teens to get a pg?

Imo this year is a stealth tank. Phil knew it could all blow up anyway with the dudes he signed.

PG and a combo forward who is a defensive ace are the 2 biggest needs. Both cam be found this drsft. But if we miss out on the PG this draft, there is always next year. As long as we fill a whole each year and get a quality player. Rome wasn't built in a day. I don't think resigning Jennings as a stopgap plus baker is the worst thing as long as it's not forever.

That's why I like the idea of trading with Boston. I think Brown is going to be a good two way player. As far as the jersey pick, I really like that UCLA kid Ball

EnySpree wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

KP4Life wrote:Isn't our greatest need a pg though? All the best pgs in the drsft are in the top ten. The teens are forwards mostly right? I mean the expected draft numbers. If we tank this is the year to do it. Just like the year we got KP. It doesn't even have to be a big tank. Just enough to get a frank N. He's perfect for this team. Rose is not staying. Maybe we could try to trade to draft lower if we end up in teens to get a pg?

Imo this year is a stealth tank. Phil knew it could all blow up anyway with the dudes he signed.

PG and a combo forward who is a defensive ace are the 2 biggest needs. Both cam be found this drsft. But if we miss out on the PG this draft, there is always next year. As long as we fill a whole each year and get a quality player. Rome wasn't built in a day. I don't think resigning Jennings as a stopgap plus baker is the worst thing as long as it's not forever.

That's why I like the idea of trading with Boston. I think Brown is going to be a good two way player. As far as the jersey pick, I really like that UCLA kid Ball

That would make sense but I don't think we get that pick for Melo even if he agreed to a trade. If we miss out on a PG in this draft, either OG Anunoby or Miles Bridges would be great for this team.

Time to Build around KP... Bye Melo

KP has a looonnng way to go, im just starting to see some major flaws in his game, and defensively, aside for a few blocks here and there, he is really really bad..

It wouldn't be so bad if they all communicated, but KP loses his man on d like A LOT. When his man goes out to the perimeter, he is so busy fixated on the ball handler, he completely forgets he's actually gaurding someone.

I have spent the last two game watching him on defense, and betwwen the philosophy and his overall defensive IQ, it's no wonder were one of the worst.

I think people are so in awe by his offensive skills for his size, and the fact that he blocks a shot sometimes, that they don't see how bad his man to man defense is..yeeooo.. Its brutally bad, and when you lose your man it has a domino effect

Oh wait did melo waive his no trade clause?!?!?!???

knicks1248 wrote:Time to Build around KP... Bye Melo

KP has a looonnng way to go, im just starting to see some major flaws in his game, and defensively, aside for a few blocks here and there, he is really really bad..

It wouldn't be so bad if they all communicated, but KP loses his man on d like A LOT. When his man goes out to the perimeter, he is so busy fixated on the ball handler, he completely forgets he's actually gaurding someone.

I have spent the last two game watching him on defense, and betwwen the philosophy and his overall defensive IQ, it's no wonder were one of the worst.

I think people are so in awe by his offnesive skill for his size, and the fact that he blocks a shot sometimes, that they don't see how bad his man to man defense is. Its brutally bad

Porzingis is playing out of position. He should be guarding centers. His strength will be an issue for a little bit but his length makes up for it. And there aren't a lot of bulky centers. Most guys who are playing the wrong position will struggle on defense. KP is not an exception.

Knixkik wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Time to Build around KP... Bye Melo

KP has a looonnng way to go, im just starting to see some major flaws in his game, and defensively, aside for a few blocks here and there, he is really really bad..

It wouldn't be so bad if they all communicated, but KP loses his man on d like A LOT. When his man goes out to the perimeter, he is so busy fixated on the ball handler, he completely forgets he's actually gaurding someone.

I have spent the last two game watching him on defense, and betwwen the philosophy and his overall defensive IQ, it's no wonder were one of the worst.

I think people are so in awe by his offnesive skill for his size, and the fact that he blocks a shot sometimes, that they don't see how bad his man to man defense is. Its brutally bad

Porzingis is playing out of position. He should be guarding centers. His strength will be an issue for a little bit but his length makes up for it. And there aren't a lot of bulky centers. Most guys who are playing the wrong position will struggle on defense. KP is not an exception.

I count a minimum of nine centers off the top of my head KP couldn't handle defensively. I totally disagree that KP is currently playing the wrong position. That makes no sense to me, just sounds like an excuse from the "KP can do no wrong" crowd.

Welpee wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Time to Build around KP... Bye Melo

KP has a looonnng way to go, im just starting to see some major flaws in his game, and defensively, aside for a few blocks here and there, he is really really bad..

It wouldn't be so bad if they all communicated, but KP loses his man on d like A LOT. When his man goes out to the perimeter, he is so busy fixated on the ball handler, he completely forgets he's actually gaurding someone.

I have spent the last two game watching him on defense, and betwwen the philosophy and his overall defensive IQ, it's no wonder were one of the worst.

I think people are so in awe by his offnesive skill for his size, and the fact that he blocks a shot sometimes, that they don't see how bad his man to man defense is. Its brutally bad

Porzingis is playing out of position. He should be guarding centers. His strength will be an issue for a little bit but his length makes up for it. And there aren't a lot of bulky centers. Most guys who are playing the wrong position will struggle on defense. KP is not an exception.

I count a minimum of nine centers off the top of my head KP couldn't handle defensively. I totally disagree that KP is currently playing the wrong position. That makes no sense to me, just sounds like an excuse from the "KP can do no wrong" crowd.

Like 70% of centers and fwds in the league are perimeter players, if you can't come out and guard them you toast every night.

Thats not even all on KP either, i just think we have the same silly defensive philosophy we had when rambis took over

knicks1248 wrote:Time to Build around KP... Bye Melo

KP has a looonnng way to go, im just starting to see some major flaws in his game, and defensively, aside for a few blocks here and there, he is really really bad..

It wouldn't be so bad if they all communicated, but KP loses his man on d like A LOT. When his man goes out to the perimeter, he is so busy fixated on the ball handler, he completely forgets he's actually gaurding someone.

I have spent the last two game watching him on defense, and betwwen the philosophy and his overall defensive IQ, it's no wonder were one of the worst.

I think people are so in awe by his offensive skills for his size, and the fact that he blocks a shot sometimes, that they don't see how bad his man to man defense is..yeeooo.. Its brutally bad, and when you lose your man it has a domino effect

+1 - Thankfully somebody pointed this out other than me so I don't have to be that guy. Can't really elaborate on your brrakdown. It's spot on across the board.

Welpee wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Time to Build around KP... Bye Melo

KP has a looonnng way to go, im just starting to see some major flaws in his game, and defensively, aside for a few blocks here and there, he is really really bad..

It wouldn't be so bad if they all communicated, but KP loses his man on d like A LOT. When his man goes out to the perimeter, he is so busy fixated on the ball handler, he completely forgets he's actually gaurding someone.

I have spent the last two game watching him on defense, and betwwen the philosophy and his overall defensive IQ, it's no wonder were one of the worst.

I think people are so in awe by his offnesive skill for his size, and the fact that he blocks a shot sometimes, that they don't see how bad his man to man defense is. Its brutally bad

Porzingis is playing out of position. He should be guarding centers. His strength will be an issue for a little bit but his length makes up for it. And there aren't a lot of bulky centers. Most guys who are playing the wrong position will struggle on defense. KP is not an exception.

I count a minimum of nine centers off the top of my head KP couldn't handle defensively. I totally disagree that KP is currently playing the wrong position. That makes no sense to me, just sounds like an excuse from the "KP can do no wrong" crowd.

How many people taller than 7'0 aren't playing center in the league right now? He's 7'3. I don't care if he shoots 3s. He's a center. He has a long ways like any 21 year old, but if you are telling me he's better off guarding 4s than he is 5s, you are kidding yourself. There's plenty of centers he can't guard yet. But he's one of the league leaders in opponent fg% at the rim. He belongs at center.

Knixkik wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Time to Build around KP... Bye Melo

KP has a looonnng way to go, im just starting to see some major flaws in his game, and defensively, aside for a few blocks here and there, he is really really bad..

It wouldn't be so bad if they all communicated, but KP loses his man on d like A LOT. When his man goes out to the perimeter, he is so busy fixated on the ball handler, he completely forgets he's actually gaurding someone.

I have spent the last two game watching him on defense, and betwwen the philosophy and his overall defensive IQ, it's no wonder were one of the worst.

I think people are so in awe by his offnesive skill for his size, and the fact that he blocks a shot sometimes, that they don't see how bad his man to man defense is. Its brutally bad

Porzingis is playing out of position. He should be guarding centers. His strength will be an issue for a little bit but his length makes up for it. And there aren't a lot of bulky centers. Most guys who are playing the wrong position will struggle on defense. KP is not an exception.

I count a minimum of nine centers off the top of my head KP couldn't handle defensively. I totally disagree that KP is currently playing the wrong position. That makes no sense to me, just sounds like an excuse from the "KP can do no wrong" crowd.

How many people taller than 7'0 aren't playing center in the league right now? He's 7'3. I don't care if he shoots 3s. He's a center. He has a long ways like any 21 year old, but if you are telling me he's better off guarding 4s than he is 5s, you are kidding yourself. There's plenty of centers he can't guard yet. But he's one of the league leaders in opponent fg% at the rim. He belongs at center.

I agree. Most 4s are actually 3s. A 7'3 can't guard a sf. Let's think in term of offense/defense balance. I think KP would defend better strong centers with his lenght than the big centers would be able to defend him. Double team exists.
Melo at the 4 and KP at the 5 and it's not even that much of small ball because Melo is a tall sf. I don't believe in the argument that it would be a wearing for them.

Knixkik wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Time to Build around KP... Bye Melo

KP has a looonnng way to go, im just starting to see some major flaws in his game, and defensively, aside for a few blocks here and there, he is really really bad..

It wouldn't be so bad if they all communicated, but KP loses his man on d like A LOT. When his man goes out to the perimeter, he is so busy fixated on the ball handler, he completely forgets he's actually gaurding someone.

I have spent the last two game watching him on defense, and betwwen the philosophy and his overall defensive IQ, it's no wonder were one of the worst.

I think people are so in awe by his offnesive skill for his size, and the fact that he blocks a shot sometimes, that they don't see how bad his man to man defense is. Its brutally bad

Porzingis is playing out of position. He should be guarding centers. His strength will be an issue for a little bit but his length makes up for it. And there aren't a lot of bulky centers. Most guys who are playing the wrong position will struggle on defense. KP is not an exception.

I count a minimum of nine centers off the top of my head KP couldn't handle defensively. I totally disagree that KP is currently playing the wrong position. That makes no sense to me, just sounds like an excuse from the "KP can do no wrong" crowd.

How many people taller than 7'0 aren't playing center in the league right now? He's 7'3. I don't care if he shoots 3s. He's a center. He has a long ways like any 21 year old, but if you are telling me he's better off guarding 4s than he is 5s, you are kidding yourself. There's plenty of centers he can't guard yet. But he's one of the league leaders in opponent fg% at the rim. He belongs at center.

So Dirk and Giannis should be centers too simply based on height? Yes, he should be guarding 4s. He's 21 years old, very athletic, not very strong and just beginning to build up his core. He's not ready to play the 5, he'd be in foul trouble in the first 5 minutes of the game every night.

KP gets exposed when Melo doesn't play and he's asked to carry the team. He'd get exposed if he were asked to play center on a full time basis. Let the guy develop naturally and stop trying to rush it! He'll probably become a center down the road, but now is not the time.

One of the few things the Knicks are doing correctly is how they're handling KP. His current role is what he would be playing.

Welpee wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Time to Build around KP... Bye Melo

KP has a looonnng way to go, im just starting to see some major flaws in his game, and defensively, aside for a few blocks here and there, he is really really bad..

It wouldn't be so bad if they all communicated, but KP loses his man on d like A LOT. When his man goes out to the perimeter, he is so busy fixated on the ball handler, he completely forgets he's actually gaurding someone.

I have spent the last two game watching him on defense, and betwwen the philosophy and his overall defensive IQ, it's no wonder were one of the worst.

I think people are so in awe by his offnesive skill for his size, and the fact that he blocks a shot sometimes, that they don't see how bad his man to man defense is. Its brutally bad

Porzingis is playing out of position. He should be guarding centers. His strength will be an issue for a little bit but his length makes up for it. And there aren't a lot of bulky centers. Most guys who are playing the wrong position will struggle on defense. KP is not an exception.

I count a minimum of nine centers off the top of my head KP couldn't handle defensively. I totally disagree that KP is currently playing the wrong position. That makes no sense to me, just sounds like an excuse from the "KP can do no wrong" crowd.

How many people taller than 7'0 aren't playing center in the league right now? He's 7'3. I don't care if he shoots 3s. He's a center. He has a long ways like any 21 year old, but if you are telling me he's better off guarding 4s than he is 5s, you are kidding yourself. There's plenty of centers he can't guard yet. But he's one of the league leaders in opponent fg% at the rim. He belongs at center.

So Dirk and Giannis should be centers too simply based on height? Yes, he should be guarding 4s. He's 21 years old, very athletic, not very strong and just beginning to build up his core. He's not ready to play the 5, he'd be in foul trouble in the first 5 minutes of the game every night.

KP gets exposed when Melo doesn't play and he's asked to carry the team. He'd get exposed if he were asked to play center on a full time basis. Let the guy develop naturally and stop trying to rush it! He'll probably become a center down the road, but now is not the time.

One of the few things the Knicks are doing correctly is how they're handling KP. His current role is what he would be playing.

Giannis is not 7'3, he's 6'11. And dirk is playing center right now. But again, he's 7'0, not 7'3. Again, how many guys in the league OVER 7'0 aren't playing center? Even Anthony Davis is. League has changed and we need to catch up. We can play small ball without being small. The sooner KP learns on the job in his correct position, the better. You have a 7'3 guy chasing around a bunch of perimeter players. Most are SFs who made the move to PF.

shinmen wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Time to Build around KP... Bye Melo

KP has a looonnng way to go, im just starting to see some major flaws in his game, and defensively, aside for a few blocks here and there, he is really really bad..

It wouldn't be so bad if they all communicated, but KP loses his man on d like A LOT. When his man goes out to the perimeter, he is so busy fixated on the ball handler, he completely forgets he's actually gaurding someone.

I have spent the last two game watching him on defense, and betwwen the philosophy and his overall defensive IQ, it's no wonder were one of the worst.

I think people are so in awe by his offnesive skill for his size, and the fact that he blocks a shot sometimes, that they don't see how bad his man to man defense is. Its brutally bad

Porzingis is playing out of position. He should be guarding centers. His strength will be an issue for a little bit but his length makes up for it. And there aren't a lot of bulky centers. Most guys who are playing the wrong position will struggle on defense. KP is not an exception.

I count a minimum of nine centers off the top of my head KP couldn't handle defensively. I totally disagree that KP is currently playing the wrong position. That makes no sense to me, just sounds like an excuse from the "KP can do no wrong" crowd.

How many people taller than 7'0 aren't playing center in the league right now? He's 7'3. I don't care if he shoots 3s. He's a center. He has a long ways like any 21 year old, but if you are telling me he's better off guarding 4s than he is 5s, you are kidding yourself. There's plenty of centers he can't guard yet. But he's one of the league leaders in opponent fg% at the rim. He belongs at center.

I agree. Most 4s are actually 3s. A 7'3 can't guard a sf. Let's think in term of offense/defense balance. I think KP would defend better strong centers with his lenght than the big centers would be able to defend him. Double team exists.
Melo at the 4 and KP at the 5 and it's not even that much of small ball because Melo is a tall sf. I don't believe in the argument that it would be a wearing for them.

+1

They might agree to a swap of picks, without Melo its still a lottery pick for Boston.

Knixkik wrote:

EnySpree wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

KP4Life wrote:Isn't our greatest need a pg though? All the best pgs in the drsft are in the top ten. The teens are forwards mostly right? I mean the expected draft numbers. If we tank this is the year to do it. Just like the year we got KP. It doesn't even have to be a big tank. Just enough to get a frank N. He's perfect for this team. Rose is not staying. Maybe we could try to trade to draft lower if we end up in teens to get a pg?

Imo this year is a stealth tank. Phil knew it could all blow up anyway with the dudes he signed.

PG and a combo forward who is a defensive ace are the 2 biggest needs. Both cam be found this drsft. But if we miss out on the PG this draft, there is always next year. As long as we fill a whole each year and get a quality player. Rome wasn't built in a day. I don't think resigning Jennings as a stopgap plus baker is the worst thing as long as it's not forever.

That's why I like the idea of trading with Boston. I think Brown is going to be a good two way player. As far as the jersey pick, I really like that UCLA kid Ball

That would make sense but I don't think we get that pick for Melo even if he agreed to a trade. If we miss out on a PG in this draft, either OG Anunoby or Miles Bridges would be great for this team.

callmened wrote:Oh wait did melo waive his no trade clause?!?!?!???

Of course not. A trade hasn't even been agreed to yet. He'd have to know what the trade would be before he waived it.