Knicks · Looks like Willy and KP are nice a tandum (page 1)

One can protect the rim. The other has a big body.
KP is long. Willy is quick.
Willy is great scorer in the paint. KP has fantastic range.
They are 21/22 years old.

Phil has drafted well here. Probably too much to ask but another draft like the KP/Willy/Grant draft would really move the rebuild needle.

It takes time. We have some building blocks. We need more.

I'm not sure I agree on KP/Willy being a nice tandem because neither can play the 4 defensively and Willy is a poor defender and rim protector at the 5.

I think KP future near term has to be at the 5 and given the fact we already have Noah/KOQ/Plumlee as reserve centers -- I think that makes Willy H expendable in the right deal.

LivingLegend wrote:I'm not sure I agree on KP/Willy being a nice tandem because neither can play the 4 defensively and Willy is a poor defender and rim protector at the 5.

I think KP future near term has to be at the 5 and given the fact we already have Noah/KOQ/Plumlee as reserve centers -- I think that makes Willy H expendable in the right deal.

He has excellent chemistry with KP and they are close friends. KOQ is the expandable one. Willy is the ideal backup center right now. Noah and Plumlee are situational reserves. KOQ is probably gone.

Willy has quick feet for a guy his size. He certainly has more range laterally than KOQ. We have to stop making assumptions based on the most recent loss. Not every team has a mobile and explosive PF like Blake Griffin. Some nights it will be bigger PF's and some nights really small PF's. The real issue is that KP and Willy often get caught trying to help Rose slow down opposing PG's and that creates problems for them. When we improve the PG, SG and SF spots with better defenders that will make things so much better for this team.

Oh yeah a 14 foot, 2 inch tandem with 0 blocks last night.
Yeah, the HOF twin tower rim protectors of the future...

Never thought I would ever miss Robin Lopez this much...

LivingLegend wrote:I'm not sure I agree on KP/Willy being a nice tandem because neither can play the 4 defensively and Willy is a poor defender and rim protector at the 5.

I think KP future near term has to be at the 5 and given the fact we already have Noah/KOQ/Plumlee as reserve centers -- I think that makes Willy H expendable in the right deal.

how do you know? They are 21 and 22. Nobody that age struggled defensively than came around? And watching KP vs. 4s its not an issue of cant, its an issue of how. He gets constantly caught out of position and looks bad trying to adjust. He does remain a top flight rim protector. No need to make excuses. I called KP out early in the season for being a big problem with the team defense. He cant get better?

jrodmc wrote:Oh yeah a 14 foot, 2 inch tandem with 0 blocks last night.
Yeah, the HOF twin tower rim protectors of the future...

Never thought I would ever miss Robin Lopez this much...

This is a bit much. I think you have to at least recognize that this is all new for them. They've started just 7 games together! Also it will make a huge difference when we can replace Rose with a good defensive PG as well as Melo with a good defensive SF. Right now they get caught helping too much.

nixluva wrote:

jrodmc wrote:Oh yeah a 14 foot, 2 inch tandem with 0 blocks last night.
Yeah, the HOF twin tower rim protectors of the future...

Never thought I would ever miss Robin Lopez this much...

This is a bit much. I think you have to at least recognize that this is all new for them. They've started just 7 games together! Also it will make a huge difference when we can replace Rose with a good defensive PG as well as Melo with a good defensive SF. Right now they get caught helping too much.

That dude is melos number 1 fan so anytime we praise other players we have he feels its a knock against his boy

Oh the Melo fans are so salty, it's unreal.
Give them a chance, maybe say like 40 games next year.
Get some young athletic wings/guards around them. Stress ball movement, player movement, defensive intensity.

If the team sucks, and Willy/KP get exposed, you move KP to 5 and Willy to 6th man role. Now you know for sure. You end up with a lottery pick again in 2018. But the right move is to try and to trade the current core away so that KP/Willy and the 2017 lottery pick can start together fresh next season.

This is easily what we can do to accomplish time for Willy/KP together and also apart.

Take Willy out at the 6 minute mark, and bring him back in when KP sits.
Take KP out at the 9-10 minute mark, and bring Willy back in.
Around the 4 min mark of the 2nd Q take Willy back out and KP back in.
You can do the opposite and take KP out first as well. Same design.

They basically would play 12 minutes together, and wouldn't close a half unless they played well together as starters. Willy would still get minutes around 26 minutes for sure, and KP would get 34,

Something like

Hernangomez/Porzingis
Porzingis/Thomas
SF/Holiday
SG/Lee
PG/Baker

Extra Depth: Noah, Kuzminskas, Randle

Need 3 new starters in this scenario.

Means Melo/O'Quinn trade bait. Rose is let go. With Melo/O'Quinn should be able to get a starter back. Get a starter with letting Rose walk, use capspace on starter that fits. And draft a player at 5/6/7 wherever we are in the draft, to start.

Give it a look see what happens, maybe Willy/KP can play or maybe they can't. Maybe KP is in over his head as the man, and maybe our 2017 pick will not be ready to start and win games. We don't really lose, because the worse we are, the higher we pick in 2018. The better we are, the more it means that KP/Willy/2017 pick can be winning players worth inveesting in longterm.

let them get exposed... thats how young players grow. Willy/KP are blue collar workers and both play hard on defense. They just arent good at it yet.

jrodmc wrote:Oh yeah a 14 foot, 2 inch tandem with 0 blocks last night.
Yeah, the HOF twin tower rim protectors of the future...

Never thought I would ever miss Robin Lopez this much...

KP is 5th in the NBA in blocks. But hey I hear you.. watching Melo this year has me feeling the same. I never thought I would miss Al Harrington so much. Melo with another 6-14 last night! Oh Al! Where are you!?!?!?!

fishmike wrote:

jrodmc wrote:Oh yeah a 14 foot, 2 inch tandem with 0 blocks last night.
Yeah, the HOF twin tower rim protectors of the future...

Never thought I would ever miss Robin Lopez this much...

KP is 5th in the NBA in blocks. But hey I hear you.. watching Melo this year has me feeling the same. I never thought I would miss Al Harrington so much. Melo with another 6-14 last night! Oh Al! Where are you!?!?!?!

I think Al Harrington once cost the Knicks two separate games against the Clippers by getting rim hanging techs in the final minute of one point games. Good memory.

jrodmc wrote:Oh yeah a 14 foot, 2 inch tandem with 0 blocks last night.
Yeah, the HOF twin tower rim protectors of the future...

Never thought I would ever miss Robin Lopez this much...

KP is averaging 2 bpg this season. Seems pretty good to me.

fishmike wrote:

jrodmc wrote:Oh yeah a 14 foot, 2 inch tandem with 0 blocks last night.
Yeah, the HOF twin tower rim protectors of the future...

Never thought I would ever miss Robin Lopez this much...

KP is 5th in the NBA in blocks. But hey I hear you.. watching Melo this year has me feeling the same. I never thought I would miss Al Harrington so much. Melo with another 6-14 last night! Oh Al! Where are you!?!?!?!

thats why i dont take that dude seriously. Its fine that he loves melo but he has to be a little fair. KP is one of the best blockers

Moonangie wrote:

jrodmc wrote:Oh yeah a 14 foot, 2 inch tandem with 0 blocks last night.
Yeah, the HOF twin tower rim protectors of the future...

Never thought I would ever miss Robin Lopez this much...

KP is averaging 2 bpg this season. Seems pretty good to me.

and Willy's per 36 say he gets some as well.

WIlly played 14 games last year for Real Madrid. avg 11 minutes.
Willy sat for half this season. Play him and its like "Whoa, we been holding him back!" Not really, he needed time to acclimate.
His defensive footwork gets him in trouble.
Play him a lot and he is exposed "Whoa, he is not a great player yet!!!".
By any measure how is this kid a dissapointment and if rebuilding is being patient while we develop a kid, this is what its like. THEY GET OUTPLAYED!!!!
Impatient fans with instant gradification and hyper post fingers don't see it.
We are tanking. Melo has checked out. Rose is playing for his supper, and the kids are betting experience.
All this while having only one 1st round pick in three years.
Nalod sees these guys as assets. I have mentioned Willy before as trade bait to which horror is struck. I like Willy, and its just a concept.
A second round pick that is a top 5 rookie prospect on a rookie deal. What can that return? Not sure, but if you trade willy and say our no. 6 pick to get that no. 1 over all pick on a kid we see as a future star with KP, do you do it? THink about it? Maybe.
for now, Willy looks great with KP, and an L in the column puts us that much closer to a better pick.

Seems like we are losing just fine with Melo and Rose playing.

crzymdups wrote:

fishmike wrote:

jrodmc wrote:Oh yeah a 14 foot, 2 inch tandem with 0 blocks last night.
Yeah, the HOF twin tower rim protectors of the future...

Never thought I would ever miss Robin Lopez this much...

KP is 5th in the NBA in blocks. But hey I hear you.. watching Melo this year has me feeling the same. I never thought I would miss Al Harrington so much. Melo with another 6-14 last night! Oh Al! Where are you!?!?!?!

I think Al Harrington once cost the Knicks two separate games against the Clippers by getting rim hanging techs in the final minute of one point games. Good memory.

I haven't seen anyone get called for hanging on the rim since then, ironically I was thinking about that last night

I would dangle some picks and Willy to the pacers for Paul george

KP
Melo
Paul

that's the better front court, more mobile, and can enter change, more flex on defense

knicks1248 wrote:I would dangle some picks and Willy to the pacers for Paul george

KP
Melo
Paul

that's the better front court, more mobile, and can enter change, more flex on defense

SMH. Price for PG STARTS with KP and this year's #1 and I suspect Bird still tells you to bugger off

fishmike wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:I would dangle some picks and Willy to the pacers for Paul george

KP
Melo
Paul

that's the better front court, more mobile, and can enter change, more flex on defense

SMH. Price for PG STARTS with KP and this year's #1 and I suspect Bird still tells you to bugger off

If they think there's a chance PG is gone, i bet they would trade him straight up for KP. KP has crazy value around the league i'm sure. I wouldn't do it though.

knicks1248 wrote:I would dangle some picks and Willy to the pacers for Paul george

KP
Melo
Paul

that's the better front court, more mobile, and can enter change, more flex on defense

That's a nice looking trio but I think we're well past trying to make a suitable lineup with Melo at the heart of it. I could be wrong but the sense I'm getting is that the Knicks are going to change from a Vet Centric roster to a more youthful KP, Willy and 2017 Draft Pick Centric roster.