Knicks · Rumor: Courtney Lee to Detroit for #12 (page 2)
BRIGGS wrote:TripleThreat wrote:smackeddog wrote:Coaches tend to prefer two way vets than middle-ish 1st round rookies...Stan Van Gundy the coach would like a ready now player
Stan Van Gundy the personnel guy and decision maker would like the guy with the most overall utility and upside potential.
If the Knicks had the 12th pick, would anyone here want them to trade it for Courtney Lee?Then why would the Pistons?
Trade rumors like this usually operate from the team on the non leverage side ( the Knicks) trying to create a new market for a player they want to trade. So another team will say "I'm getting a player that could have been traded for the 12th pick and it only cost me the 26th pick, I got a bargain!" Except the reality is the team making the trade was the only option in the first place.
It's limited gamesmanship built off of due diligence. The Knicks have to put this out there, even if they know the market for Courtney Lee can't be manipulated in their favor by doing this.
Triple threat according to you no team can ever make a trade. You've been consistently wrong gauging what teams will or will not take. I tend to think this is possible. Charlotte traded for bellineli for the 22 pick last year and Lee IMHO is the superior player and Detroit does not have a signed two guard at the moment They might not want to pay an under whelming kcp 20 mm
But the rumor out of Detroit is that they're gonna match whatever offer a team gives to KCP so i can't see why they'd give up a lottery pick for a SG if they already have their starting SG. Unless they've changed their minds on KCP or are just looking around to see what they can do if they decide not to stay with KCP.
EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.
The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
newyorker4ever wrote:I think it would be hard to find many positives in the Tyson, Rose, and JR/Shump trades. When Phil has been done with an asset, he has made it known and given it away for pennies on the dollar. Maybe he will change his approach but he seems to be following that pattern with Melo.EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
CrushAlot wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:I think it would be hard to find many positives in the Tyson, Rose, and JR/Shump trades. When Phil has been done with an asset, he has made it known and given it away for pennies on the dollar. Maybe he will change his approach but he seems to be following that pattern with Melo.EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
And then there are those that would push their negativity no mayer what.
meloshouldgo wrote:CrushAlot wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:I think it would be hard to find many positives in the Tyson, Rose, and JR/Shump trades. When Phil has been done with an asset, he has made it known and given it away for pennies on the dollar. Maybe he will change his approach but he seems to be following that pattern with Melo.EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
And then there are those that would push their negativity no mayer what.
Feel free to point out the positives.
newyorker4ever wrote:EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
That's what we do in message boards. Toss ideas around and shoot the breeze. Im not here to pull my nails out over everything bad that goes wrong. If i wanted to be stressed I'd just ask my wife what she wants for dinner
CrushAlot wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:I think it would be hard to find many positives in the Tyson, Rose, and JR/Shump trades. When Phil has been done with an asset, he has made it known and given it away for pennies on the dollar. Maybe he will change his approach but he seems to be following that pattern with Melo.EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
Are you forgetting that JR and Tyson had no value at the times they were traded?? When you don't have much value, if any value to other teams then you're not gonna get much in return for that player no matter who the GM making the trade is. I love how people forget about all the talk at those times about how the Knicks will never find anyone to take on JR or Tyson.
EnySpree wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
That's what we do in message boards. Toss ideas around and shoot the breeze. Im not here to pull my nails out over everything bad that goes wrong. If i wanted to be stressed I'd just ask my wife what she wants for dinner
Or you could come up with trade scenarios that are actually realistic.....unless that's not what you're supposed to do on message boards.
newyorker4ever wrote:CrushAlot wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:I think it would be hard to find many positives in the Tyson, Rose, and JR/Shump trades. When Phil has been done with an asset, he has made it known and given it away for pennies on the dollar. Maybe he will change his approach but he seems to be following that pattern with Melo.EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
Are you forgetting that JR and Tyson had no value at the times they were traded?? When you don't have much value, if any value to other teams then you're not gonna get much in return for that player no matter who the GM making the trade is. I love how people forget about all the talk at those times about how the Knicks will never find anyone to take on JR or Tyson.
That's not true in regards to Tyson. Cuban openly talked about how not resigning Tyson was a mistape and how they needed a player like him. With JR it was a suposedly culture change but that does not mean you tie him into a deal just to get rid of him because it lower the value of the asset(shump) you have. Dion Waiters is/was terrible and everyone knew Cleveland wanted to get rid of him but yet they still got a 1st even though he was the 3rd worst guard on the court in the whole deal.
newyorker4ever wrote:Yes i agree Tyson and JR Smith didn't have bigtime value BUT I still think we should have gotten more than we got. I think Phil even admitted he screwed up on the Tyson trade when he said no to CrowderCrushAlot wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:I think it would be hard to find many positives in the Tyson, Rose, and JR/Shump trades. When Phil has been done with an asset, he has made it known and given it away for pennies on the dollar. Maybe he will change his approach but he seems to be following that pattern with Melo.EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
Are you forgetting that JR and Tyson had no value at the times they were traded?? When you don't have much value, if any value to other teams then you're not gonna get much in return for that player no matter who the GM making the trade is. I love how people forget about all the talk at those times about how the Knicks will never find anyone to take on JR or Tyson.
newyorker4ever wrote:CrushAlot wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:I think it would be hard to find many positives in the Tyson, Rose, and JR/Shump trades. When Phil has been done with an asset, he has made it known and given it away for pennies on the dollar. Maybe he will change his approach but he seems to be following that pattern with Melo.EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
Are you forgetting that JR and Tyson had no value at the times they were traded?? When you don't have much value, if any value to other teams then you're not gonna get much in return for that player no matter who the GM making the trade is. I love how people forget about all the talk at those times about how the Knicks will never find anyone to take on JR or Tyson.
Those people were idiots though.
But what does it say about our "system" and culture, when we can't use players that become key to a contending team? People forget but the Mavs were 1st in the West for a minute before that Rondo deal destroyed team chemistry. Clearly, a Tyson Chandler had value in this league.
newyorker4ever wrote:EnySpree wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
That's what we do in message boards. Toss ideas around and shoot the breeze. Im not here to pull my nails out over everything bad that goes wrong. If i wanted to be stressed I'd just ask my wife what she wants for dinner
Or you could come up with trade scenarios that are actually realistic.....unless that's not what you're supposed to do on message boards.
Yeah why in the world would the Pistons do this Lee isnt that good
yellowboy90 wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:CrushAlot wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:I think it would be hard to find many positives in the Tyson, Rose, and JR/Shump trades. When Phil has been done with an asset, he has made it known and given it away for pennies on the dollar. Maybe he will change his approach but he seems to be following that pattern with Melo.EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
Are you forgetting that JR and Tyson had no value at the times they were traded?? When you don't have much value, if any value to other teams then you're not gonna get much in return for that player no matter who the GM making the trade is. I love how people forget about all the talk at those times about how the Knicks will never find anyone to take on JR or Tyson.
That's not true in regards to Tyson. Cuban openly talked about how not resigning Tyson was a mistape and how they needed a player like him. With JR it was a suposedly culture change but that does not mean you tie him into a deal just to get rid of him because it lower the value of the asset(shump) you have. Dion Waiters is/was terrible and everyone knew Cleveland wanted to get rid of him but yet they still got a 1st even though he was the 3rd worst guard on the court in the whole deal.
You're wrong, All that was being said around that time was they had no trade value and it was gonna be hard for the Knicks to find any takers. With Tyson it was his contract and with JR............well we all know his problems on and off the court.
StarksEwing1 wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:Yes i agree Tyson and JR Smith didn't have bigtime value BUT I still think we should have gotten more than we got. I think Phil even admitted he screwed up on the Tyson trade when he said no to CrowderCrushAlot wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:I think it would be hard to find many positives in the Tyson, Rose, and JR/Shump trades. When Phil has been done with an asset, he has made it known and given it away for pennies on the dollar. Maybe he will change his approach but he seems to be following that pattern with Melo.EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
Are you forgetting that JR and Tyson had no value at the times they were traded?? When you don't have much value, if any value to other teams then you're not gonna get much in return for that player no matter who the GM making the trade is. I love how people forget about all the talk at those times about how the Knicks will never find anyone to take on JR or Tyson.
He said he screwed up by not getting Crowder but Crowder wasn't the Crowder he is now at that time which is why he could of got him included in the deal.
newyorker4ever wrote:EnySpree wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
That's what we do in message boards. Toss ideas around and shoot the breeze. Im not here to pull my nails out over everything bad that goes wrong. If i wanted to be stressed I'd just ask my wife what she wants for dinner
Or you could come up with trade scenarios that are actually realistic.....unless that's not what you're supposed to do on message boards.
Well i was passing on the rumor. So put some Preparation H on those hemorrhoids
NardDogNation wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:CrushAlot wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:I think it would be hard to find many positives in the Tyson, Rose, and JR/Shump trades. When Phil has been done with an asset, he has made it known and given it away for pennies on the dollar. Maybe he will change his approach but he seems to be following that pattern with Melo.EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
Are you forgetting that JR and Tyson had no value at the times they were traded?? When you don't have much value, if any value to other teams then you're not gonna get much in return for that player no matter who the GM making the trade is. I love how people forget about all the talk at those times about how the Knicks will never find anyone to take on JR or Tyson.
Those people were idiots though.
But what does it say about our "system" and culture, when we can't use players that become key to a contending team? People forget but the Mavs were 1st in the West for a minute before that Rondo deal destroyed team chemistry. Clearly, a Tyson Chandler had value in this league.
Ummmmm you do know they have Lebron James right?? Oh and they have K.Irving and K.Love so it's not hard to put players around players like that. We had Melo and.......................
newyorker4ever wrote:yellowboy90 wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:CrushAlot wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:I think it would be hard to find many positives in the Tyson, Rose, and JR/Shump trades. When Phil has been done with an asset, he has made it known and given it away for pennies on the dollar. Maybe he will change his approach but he seems to be following that pattern with Melo.EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
Are you forgetting that JR and Tyson had no value at the times they were traded?? When you don't have much value, if any value to other teams then you're not gonna get much in return for that player no matter who the GM making the trade is. I love how people forget about all the talk at those times about how the Knicks will never find anyone to take on JR or Tyson.
That's not true in regards to Tyson. Cuban openly talked about how not resigning Tyson was a mistape and how they needed a player like him. With JR it was a suposedly culture change but that does not mean you tie him into a deal just to get rid of him because it lower the value of the asset(shump) you have. Dion Waiters is/was terrible and everyone knew Cleveland wanted to get rid of him but yet they still got a 1st even though he was the 3rd worst guard on the court in the whole deal.
You're wrong, All that was being said around that time was they had no trade value and it was gonna be hard for the Knicks to find any takers. With Tyson it was his contract and with JR............well we all know his problems on and off the court.
This is the first time that I have heard anything to suggest that Tyson Chandler's contract was an issue. I think it ranged between $14-$16 million per year and he was entering the final year of his contract when he was finally traded. That, for a guy who could anchor your team defensively AND had none of the traditional liabilities of a rim protector (i.e. completely useless on offense or a piss-poor free throw shooter), had significant value in this league. Just as a point of comparison, Omer Asik- a disgruntled backup big man- fetched a first round pick with no incoming salary for the Rockets that same offseason. You're telling me that Tyson Chandler couldn't have gotten better?
newyorker4ever wrote:NardDogNation wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:CrushAlot wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:I think it would be hard to find many positives in the Tyson, Rose, and JR/Shump trades. When Phil has been done with an asset, he has made it known and given it away for pennies on the dollar. Maybe he will change his approach but he seems to be following that pattern with Melo.EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
Are you forgetting that JR and Tyson had no value at the times they were traded?? When you don't have much value, if any value to other teams then you're not gonna get much in return for that player no matter who the GM making the trade is. I love how people forget about all the talk at those times about how the Knicks will never find anyone to take on JR or Tyson.
Those people were idiots though.
But what does it say about our "system" and culture, when we can't use players that become key to a contending team? People forget but the Mavs were 1st in the West for a minute before that Rondo deal destroyed team chemistry. Clearly, a Tyson Chandler had value in this league.
Ummmmm you do know they have Lebron James right?? Oh and they have K.Irving and K.Love so it's not hard to put players around players like that. We had Melo and.......................
Kyrie Irving and Kevin Love as "franchise players" captained lottery teams before LeBron. I think Kevin Love was the real deal but Kyrie Irving was and still is nothing more than an "And 1" mixtape player. So I'll respect your point about the influence of LeBron on winning but what does LeBron have to do with Tyson Chandler's impact with the Mavs?
Jmpasq wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:EnySpree wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:EnySpree wrote:Makes sense for Detroit.... Makes sense for the Knicks.The reason why Knicks fans are always let down with whatever trade the Knicks make is because we come on here months before the draft coming up with trade scenarios we'd like the Knicks to do and every trade that's come up with on here is favoring the Knicks so much that any realistic trade never comes off looking good to Knicks fans.
That's what we do in message boards. Toss ideas around and shoot the breeze. Im not here to pull my nails out over everything bad that goes wrong. If i wanted to be stressed I'd just ask my wife what she wants for dinner
Or you could come up with trade scenarios that are actually realistic.....unless that's not what you're supposed to do on message boards.
Yeah why in the world would the Pistons do this Lee isnt that good
Lee is a two way player, was one of the best 3pt shooters in the league, on a reasonable contract. Van Gundy is going to be on the hot seat if he doesnt start making the playoffs. Would be a good time to make an offer of some kind.
fishmike wrote:lets look at the reverse. If you need a guy who shoots the 3 with the best in the league, is a solid defender, has a history of making teams better he's traded too, good lockerroom guy, moves the ball, plays mistake free basketball... I mean if you need a vet and your Det who do you target? Afflalo? A guy like Evan Turner? Allan Crabbe? Those guys make Lee's deal look awesome. Look at this draft... who in the #12 range is going to help them right away? Lee may not be a star but he's a very good NBA player.
You overrate Lee. He makes teams better yet gets traded by every team he plays for almost. He shoots the 3 great but doesn't shoot it enough. His defense is getting worse and he doesn't get close defensive possessions with steals or rebounds. Lee is a mediocre aging vet that teams date but never fall in loves with.