Great article on a legendary coaches son becoming a legendary scout.
http://nypost.com/2017/05/27/meet-phil-jacksons-knicks-draft-guru-a-respected-odd-duck/
Maybe he should be the gm...
No doubt he will be one day.
Good people are good in all they do and booms are booms in everything.
If we dont trade picks and have a guy with a brain drafting every year it's a start.
Love that despite Jackson's leaving, Gaines remains an advisor to Mills. Saw him with Mills in the SL games.
He knows talent.
He found Langston Galloway out of the D league. Langston now has a 25 million dollar contract.
Just shows he doesn't just find players that have obvious lottery talent like KP.
He finds players like Gallo, who are borderline in making in the NBA based on talent, and knows they can stick in the league.
For whatever it's worth, I'm pretty sure Gaines is the main reason the franchise drafted Ntilikina over Smith or Monk. Now whether Ntili develops like we want him to, who knows.
fishmike wrote:If we dont trade picks and have a guy with a brain drafting every year it's a start.
IMO it's the most important part of building a contender. After you establish the core talent and identity of your team the final moves to sign a top FA are made so much easier. The most important hire Phil made was his top scout and no matter what people say Phil did what he said he would when it came to building a Future Component to this team and established a foundation to build on.
Gaines staying on should give every fan some comfort.
The only way I see Mills turning this fiasco into a positive is if Gaines is allowed to be the GM. Would feel like we have a mimbo as GM if Houston is hired.
nixluva wrote:fishmike wrote:If we dont trade picks and have a guy with a brain drafting every year it's a start.
IMO it's the most important part of building a contender. After you establish the core talent and identity of your team the final moves to sign a top FA are made so much easier. The most important hire Phil made was his top scout and no matter what people say Phil did what he said he would when it came to building a Future Component to this team and established a foundation to build on.
Gaines staying on should give every fan some comfort.
This roster is prime for another Melo type of trade. Seeing is believing. If Mill's focus is to build a young roster great. If they value the draft and work that every year great. If they work the overseas market even better.
Who in this organization is the key talent evaluator? Who is the key roster builder? Who decided that Hardaway is a sensible $18mm a year gamble? (he probably is)
fishmike wrote:nixluva wrote:fishmike wrote:If we dont trade picks and have a guy with a brain drafting every year it's a start.
IMO it's the most important part of building a contender. After you establish the core talent and identity of your team the final moves to sign a top FA are made so much easier. The most important hire Phil made was his top scout and no matter what people say Phil did what he said he would when it came to building a Future Component to this team and established a foundation to build on.
Gaines staying on should give every fan some comfort.
This roster is prime for another Melo type of trade. Seeing is believing. If Mill's focus is to build a young roster great. If they value the draft and work that every year great. If they work the overseas market even better.Who in this organization is the key talent evaluator? Who is the key roster builder? Who decided that Hardaway is a sensible $18mm a year gamble? (he probably is)
I think as a group the Knicks have enough guys who have good basketball minds. They all gave opinions to Phil on what should be done and I'm sure Mills is executing what he feels was the best of those suggestions.
Phil did in fact nurture this Front Office whether people like it or not. These guys have his plans as well their own ideas. The guys that are left all have some experience in the room on these decisions. They've been together for years now.
nixluva wrote:fishmike wrote:nixluva wrote:fishmike wrote:If we dont trade picks and have a guy with a brain drafting every year it's a start.
IMO it's the most important part of building a contender. After you establish the core talent and identity of your team the final moves to sign a top FA are made so much easier. The most important hire Phil made was his top scout and no matter what people say Phil did what he said he would when it came to building a Future Component to this team and established a foundation to build on.
Gaines staying on should give every fan some comfort.
This roster is prime for another Melo type of trade. Seeing is believing. If Mill's focus is to build a young roster great. If they value the draft and work that every year great. If they work the overseas market even better.Who in this organization is the key talent evaluator? Who is the key roster builder? Who decided that Hardaway is a sensible $18mm a year gamble? (he probably is)
I think as a group the Knicks have enough guys who have good basketball minds. They all gave opinions to Phil on what should be done and I'm sure Mills is executing what he feels was the best of those suggestions.
Phil did in fact nurture this Front Office whether people like it or not. These guys have his plans as well their own ideas. The guys that are left all have some experience in the room on these decisions. They've been together for years now.
And in those years, they put up the worst record in franchise history...
nixluva wrote:fishmike wrote:nixluva wrote:fishmike wrote:If we dont trade picks and have a guy with a brain drafting every year it's a start.
IMO it's the most important part of building a contender. After you establish the core talent and identity of your team the final moves to sign a top FA are made so much easier. The most important hire Phil made was his top scout and no matter what people say Phil did what he said he would when it came to building a Future Component to this team and established a foundation to build on.
Gaines staying on should give every fan some comfort.
This roster is prime for another Melo type of trade. Seeing is believing. If Mill's focus is to build a young roster great. If they value the draft and work that every year great. If they work the overseas market even better.Who in this organization is the key talent evaluator? Who is the key roster builder? Who decided that Hardaway is a sensible $18mm a year gamble? (he probably is)
I think as a group the Knicks have enough guys who have good basketball minds. They all gave opinions to Phil on what should be done and I'm sure Mills is executing what he feels was the best of those suggestions.
Phil did in fact nurture this Front Office whether people like it or not. These guys have his plans as well their own ideas. The guys that are left all have some experience in the room on these decisions. They've been together for years now.
He was the only guy that was ever given the power to change the front office. He knew exactly what he wanted to do with the coaching staff. It would have been interesting if Kerr took the job in NY. His strength eas being a coach. it is too bad that he didn't have an effective front office guy in his inner circle. I don't think he nurtured the front office. His trades and signings generally were bad. You could make a case that he emphasized scouting but that was also present with Grunwald ( Cope, Prigs, Moz).
CrushAlot wrote:nixluva wrote:fishmike wrote:nixluva wrote:fishmike wrote:If we dont trade picks and have a guy with a brain drafting every year it's a start.
IMO it's the most important part of building a contender. After you establish the core talent and identity of your team the final moves to sign a top FA are made so much easier. The most important hire Phil made was his top scout and no matter what people say Phil did what he said he would when it came to building a Future Component to this team and established a foundation to build on.
Gaines staying on should give every fan some comfort.
This roster is prime for another Melo type of trade. Seeing is believing. If Mill's focus is to build a young roster great. If they value the draft and work that every year great. If they work the overseas market even better.Who in this organization is the key talent evaluator? Who is the key roster builder? Who decided that Hardaway is a sensible $18mm a year gamble? (he probably is)
I think as a group the Knicks have enough guys who have good basketball minds. They all gave opinions to Phil on what should be done and I'm sure Mills is executing what he feels was the best of those suggestions.
Phil did in fact nurture this Front Office whether people like it or not. These guys have his plans as well their own ideas. The guys that are left all have some experience in the room on these decisions. They've been together for years now.
He was the only guy that was ever given the power to change the front office. He knew exactly what he wanted to do with the coaching staff. It would have been interesting if Kerr took the job in NY. His strength eas being a coach. it is too bad that he didn't have an effective front office guy in his inner circle. I don't think he nurtured the front office. His trades and signings generally were bad. You could make a case that he emphasized scouting but that was also present with Grunwald ( Cope, Prigs, Moz).
I think any team given enough picks can draft well and bring in young talent.
The thing with Jackson, he was the only one with the stature to allow for it to happen on his watch without getting thrown out the room.
Right before Jackson came to the Knicks, they had just traded away two draft picks.
There has been a clear philosiphy change by Mills since the Jackson era.
I think he made a big impact on how they look at players and how they want to build a team.
If he hadn't made it a pissing contest with Melo, and he hadn't tried to publicly respond to KP's action, I think he still has a job. No owner wants to have a president that somehow finds a way to get into a pissing contest with BOTH of his stars. They are literally doing exactly what was planned and they let him make the draft choices. If they thought he couldn't make sound decisions or his plans were all wrong, they would have cleaned house on coaching, and removed Gaines and not let Phil draft this year. To me this was all done to appease two things. One to get Melo to sign off on a trade. So Melo doesn't look like he lost to Phil. Now Melo's just moving on. Totally different story and Melo seems far more cooperative without Phil. Second to appease KP's camp. They clearly had an issue with Jackson as well.
KP was highly rated so Gaines didn't find him. Everybody except ignorant fans knew about him.
nyknickzingis wrote:CrushAlot wrote:nixluva wrote:fishmike wrote:nixluva wrote:fishmike wrote:If we dont trade picks and have a guy with a brain drafting every year it's a start.
IMO it's the most important part of building a contender. After you establish the core talent and identity of your team the final moves to sign a top FA are made so much easier. The most important hire Phil made was his top scout and no matter what people say Phil did what he said he would when it came to building a Future Component to this team and established a foundation to build on.
Gaines staying on should give every fan some comfort.
This roster is prime for another Melo type of trade. Seeing is believing. If Mill's focus is to build a young roster great. If they value the draft and work that every year great. If they work the overseas market even better.Who in this organization is the key talent evaluator? Who is the key roster builder? Who decided that Hardaway is a sensible $18mm a year gamble? (he probably is)
I think as a group the Knicks have enough guys who have good basketball minds. They all gave opinions to Phil on what should be done and I'm sure Mills is executing what he feels was the best of those suggestions.
Phil did in fact nurture this Front Office whether people like it or not. These guys have his plans as well their own ideas. The guys that are left all have some experience in the room on these decisions. They've been together for years now.
He was the only guy that was ever given the power to change the front office. He knew exactly what he wanted to do with the coaching staff. It would have been interesting if Kerr took the job in NY. His strength eas being a coach. it is too bad that he didn't have an effective front office guy in his inner circle. I don't think he nurtured the front office. His trades and signings generally were bad. You could make a case that he emphasized scouting but that was also present with Grunwald ( Cope, Prigs, Moz).
I think any team given enough picks can draft well and bring in young talent.
The thing with Jackson, he was the only one with the stature to allow for it to happen on his watch without getting thrown out the room.
Right before Jackson came to the Knicks, they had just traded away two draft picks.
There has been a clear philosiphy change by Mills since the Jackson era.
I think he made a big impact on how they look at players and how they want to build a team.If he hadn't made it a pissing contest with Melo, and he hadn't tried to publicly respond to KP's action, I think he still has a job. No owner wants to have a president that somehow finds a way to get into a pissing contest with BOTH of his stars. They are literally doing exactly what was planned and they let him make the draft choices. If they thought he couldn't make sound decisions or his plans were all wrong, they would have cleaned house on coaching, and removed Gaines and not let Phil draft this year. To me this was all done to appease two things. One to get Melo to sign off on a trade. So Melo doesn't look like he lost to Phil. Now Melo's just moving on. Totally different story and Melo seems far more cooperative without Phil. Second to appease KP's camp. They clearly had an issue with Jackson as well.
Not sure what picks they traded right befor Phil came ( Bargs?). They passed on trading the 2018 pick for Lowry. My point was Phil didn't bring in his own front office staff like Griffin wanted to. He chose Mills to be his GM. All of the old front office staff members were kept in place. Phil did clean house with the coaching staff. If he had cleaned house with the front office and hired a more competent gm he probably still is the prez.
There is no finding a player most are presented to teams. But where he scouts earn their living is if the player is worthy of being picked. Gaines did the research and it was good work done.
reub wrote:KP was highly rated so Gaines didn't find him. Everybody except ignorant fans knew about him.
Gaines apparently wanted KP over Okafor (who Phil wanted) so I guess that would include Phil.
GustavBahler wrote:reub wrote:KP was highly rated so Gaines didn't find him. Everybody except ignorant fans knew about him.
Gaines apparently wanted KP over Okafor (who Phil wanted) so I guess that would include Phil.
Guess he didn't want Okafor enough though, right?
And reub, it's not so much that no one knew about him, it was that he was picked over other options.
martin wrote:GustavBahler wrote:reub wrote:KP was highly rated so Gaines didn't find him. Everybody except ignorant fans knew about him.
Gaines apparently wanted KP over Okafor (who Phil wanted) so I guess that would include Phil.
Guess he didn't want Okafor enough though, right?
And reub, it's not so much that no one knew about him, it was that he was picked over other options.
Exactly. Do we have to go back and revisit the uproar about taking KP over more known and supposedly more NBA ready NCAA players?
GustavBahler wrote:reub wrote:KP was highly rated so Gaines didn't find him. Everybody except ignorant fans knew about him.
Gaines apparently wanted KP over Okafor (who Phil wanted) so I guess that would include Phil.
Wait are you trying to take away Phil's glowing achievement of drafting KP? How dare you sir. How dare you? Take it back or else!!!
On another note: I wonder how much Gaines talks to SAS since they have known each other for so long? Gaines Sr was one of SAS" mentors.
